garkle Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The real problem with all MMO's since WOW is that they are all exactly the same. The MMO experience is a "one-shot-deal": after you have seriously played one of them, you really have played played all of them. Sure, each one comes coated with a "new" flavor, but when you bite into the burger it always tastes the same. And it tastes the same because it IS the same. Eight years beyond WOW's Thanksgiving 2004 launch, MMO's have absolutely nothing new to offer. This game is no exception. It's not the fault of the developers, it's the problem with the genre. Few among us except perhaps the most seriously obsessive-compulsive can long-play a game like this without being affected by the persistent and nagging understanding that this is not life, it is not living, it doesn't solve real problems, it doesn't substitute for joy or adventure or breathing fresh air or having real human interactions. In the end, we are little tiny creatures who dare not sacrifice our precious time on this Earth for petty distractions lest we never live at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiroLM Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3. </thread> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kclemens Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The real problem with all MMO's since WOW is that they are all exactly the same. The MMO experience is a "one-shot-deal": after you have seriously played one of them, you really have played played all of them. Sure, each one comes coated with a "new" flavor, but when you bite into the burger it always tastes the same. And it tastes the same because it IS the same. Eight years beyond WOW's Thanksgiving 2004 launch, MMO's have absolutely nothing new to offer. This game is no exception. It's not the fault of the developers, it's the problem with the genre. Few among us except perhaps the most seriously obsessive-compulsive can long-play a game like this without being affected by the persistent and nagging understanding that this is not life, it is not living, it doesn't solve real problems, it doesn't substitute for joy or adventure or breathing fresh air or having real human interactions. In the end, we are little tiny creatures who dare not sacrifice our precious time on this Earth for petty distractions lest we never live at all. I would agree with you on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krisslanza Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The reason why MMOs are like that is because WoW has ruined the MMO genre. People expect everything to play like WoW but be "better". Fact of the matter is, you can't do this because they think WoW is some kind of magical perfection of MMO-playing and you can't ever be "better" then it. Despite the fact WoW isn't really that good at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunabaguna Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Perhaps your problem is that you're trying to find a substitute for living life? For some of us this is just a game.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arodin Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3. </thread> Yeah... FPS games are all the same. Racing games are all the same. Etc. Game mechanics being familiar isn't necessarily bad. Could be that you're bored of that style of gameplay just as I'm bored of FPS games. That's fine, it's not for you. But that doesn't mean it's a problem for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bdatik Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 8 years + 2004 = 2012 Just thought I would point that out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silkforcalde Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The reason why MMOs are like that is because WoW has ruined the MMO genre. People expect everything to play like WoW but be "better". Fact of the matter is, you can't do this because they think WoW is some kind of magical perfection of MMO-playing and you can't ever be "better" then it. Despite the fact WoW isn't really that good at all. It's wonderful. This game has the potential to be as good as WoW in a couple years, but WoW is still the king of the roost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garkle Posted December 24, 2011 Author Share Posted December 24, 2011 Ouch! Touche! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tekkoclarky Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The real problem here is no paragraphs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garkle Posted December 24, 2011 Author Share Posted December 24, 2011 Yeah... FPS games are all the same. Racing games are all the same. Etc. Game mechanics being familiar isn't necessarily bad. Could be that you're bored of that style of gameplay just as I'm bored of FPS games. That's fine, it's not for you. But that doesn't mean it's a problem for everyone. Good point. Perhaps the truth is that all games are but distractions. Perhaps this is bad, perhaps it is good, perhaps it is value-neutral. As you pointed out, I speak only for myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albinosmurf Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I tend to agree with the wow in space crowd. The story asect is new but it isn't ground breaking and it has serious flaws that detract from gameplay. That being said the mmo genre hasn't changed much but thats why its a genre. Every game has the same problem. FPS have the same structure since jurassic park in arcades... you seem to severely undervalue the little favors which make a huge difference in gameplay. The genre has advanced and evolved but its not a problem that they are similiar. The same reason Wendys Mcdonalds and Burger King are all the same with different names. Because it works. Why would a company make an inferior game just to be different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemmar Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 It's wonderful. This game has the potential to be as good as WoW in a couple years, but WoW is still the king of the roost. Not... at all... Its not even comparable. The only thing that WoW is better at this point than SWTOR is that it has less bugs. In a few weeks, it wont even have that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HelluvaJedi Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 This thread changed my life. Thank you, OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garkle Posted December 24, 2011 Author Share Posted December 24, 2011 I tend to agree with the wow in space crowd. The story asect is new but it isn't ground breaking and it has serious flaws that detract from gameplay. That being said the mmo genre hasn't changed much but thats why its a genre. Every game has the same problem. FPS have the same structure since jurassic park in arcades... you seem to severely undervalue the little favors which make a huge difference in gameplay. The genre has advanced and evolved but its not a problem that they are similiar. The same reason Wendys Mcdonalds and Burger King are all the same with different names. Because it works. Why would a company make an inferior game just to be different? No company should. Companies exist to make money for their shareholders. That is a separate issue though. I gave up fast food long ago. Maybe I should do the same with online games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangbot Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Problem is the community, everyone is a troll and they try and do everything they can to try harrass someone who maybe doesnt know something and a simple answer will do. It is a form of cyber bullying because they find that they are behind a pc in the parents dungeon they are safe. The community will kill this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiroLM Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Problem is the community, everyone is a troll and they try and do everything they can to try harrass someone who maybe doesnt know something and a simple answer will do. It is a form of cyber bullying because they find that they are behind a pc in the parents dungeon they are safe. The community will kill this game. Grow up, carebear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lycrates Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) The MMO experience is a "one-shot-deal": after you have seriously played one of them, you really have played played all of them. Sure, each one comes coated with a "new" flavor, but when you bite into the burger it always tastes the same. And it tastes the same because it IS the same. Eight years beyond WOW's Thanksgiving 2004 launch, MMO's have absolutely nothing new to offer. This game is no exception. It's not the fault of the developers, it's the problem with the genre. The OP is totally wrong. There is plenty of room for MMOs to evolve. MMO Developers just copy WoW because they think its safe and dont trust themselves to make a decent game. Let me give you some examples: You could have an MMO like Skyrim. In fact, there is one like that in development right now called Tera, (but it has a much smaller budget so i dont expect it to be amazing). You could have an MMO that plays like Diablo. There are dozens of other ways where you can have MMOs that are completely different than WoW and its clone SWTOR. How about MMOs that has a lot of endgame world content and there are more things to do other than Raids, Instances and PvP. The possibilities are endless. Edited December 24, 2011 by lycrates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lycrates Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 this is not life, it is not living, it doesn't solve real problems, it doesn't substitute for joy or adventure or breathing fresh air or having real human interactions. In the end, we are little tiny creatures who dare not sacrifice our precious time on this Earth for petty distractions lest we never live at all. Sadly, life itself is an illusion. We live and we die and then it is like we never existed. One advice I will give: do things in your life that you enjoy, if that is playing MMOs then do that, if it is traveling, then do that, if it is spending your time with other people, then do that. Personally, I have done everything to a very extreme level and I have to say they are all pretty much the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmace Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The real problem with all MMO's since WOW is that they are all exactly the same. The MMO experience is a "one-shot-deal": after you have seriously played one of them, you really have played played all of them. Sure, each one comes coated with a "new" flavor, but when you bite into the burger it always tastes the same. And it tastes the same because it IS the same. Eight years beyond WOW's Thanksgiving 2004 launch, MMO's have absolutely nothing new to offer. This game is no exception. It's not the fault of the developers, it's the problem with the genre. Few among us except perhaps the most seriously obsessive-compulsive can long-play a game like this without being affected by the persistent and nagging understanding that this is not life, it is not living, it doesn't solve real problems, it doesn't substitute for joy or adventure or breathing fresh air or having real human interactions. In the end, we are little tiny creatures who dare not sacrifice our precious time on this Earth for petty distractions lest we never live at all. I agree, but alot of these issues of "games being all the same" is due to the market becoming mainstream, and mmos getting a "standardized" formula which companies want to follow so they can have a product that at least produces some money. The real issue is the games are no longer about "exploring what does and doesnt work" in making them, and more about "repeating one thing they know makes money, because people are stupid sheep and will pay and play them over and over". Me, I like some of the class storylines here, but truth be told once that's over with ill probably just quit and play something else unless something worthwhile gets added, because swtor is basically just wow with voiceovers in space, anyone who tells you different is most likely a fanboy of either swtor or just hating on wow in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garkle Posted December 24, 2011 Author Share Posted December 24, 2011 Sadly, life itself is an illusion. We live and we die and then it is like we never existed. One advice I will give: do things in your life that you enjoy, if that is playing MMOs then do that, if it is traveling, then do that, if it is spending your time with other people, then do that. Personally, I have done everything to a very extreme level and I have to say they are all pretty much the same. For us death is nothing. When we are, death is not. When death is, we are not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishikur Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) Problem is the community, everyone is a troll and they try and do everything they can to try harrass someone who maybe doesnt know something and a simple answer will do. It is a form of cyber bullying because they find that they are behind a pc in the parents dungeon they are safe. The community will kill this game. I tend to disagree with you on that, league of legends has by far the worst gaming community of all games, and it has double wow's player base, yes its a f2p game, i dont care, fact is its the top dog period and the community sucks. People are drawn to drama like rubber necks are drawn to looking at cops on the side of the road. human nature is human. So keep the wow trolls coming, this game has potential! Edited December 24, 2011 by Ishikur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmace Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I tend to disagree with you on that, league of legends has by far the worst gaming community of all games, and it has double wow's player base, yes its a f2p game, i dont care, fact is its the top dog period and the community sucks. People are drawn to drama like rubber necks are drawn to looking at cops on the side of the road. human nature is human. So keep the wow trolls coming, this game has potential! If you think LoL has the worst community of "all games" then you must of missed HoN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghaiana Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The real problem on this forum is that I haven't seen a real problem yet. A lot of noise about the UI, LFG tools, queues, waiting times for early access, duals spec, nothing to do at 50 but nothing really game breaking. Which is good btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NephilimNexus Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The reason why MMOs are like that is because WoW has ruined the MMO genre. People expect everything to play like WoW but be "better". Fact of the matter is, you can't do this because they think WoW is some kind of magical perfection of MMO-playing and you can't ever be "better" then it. Despite the fact WoW isn't really that good at all. Nailed it right on the head, here. I, and I suspect many of you here, used to play SWG back before it got dumbed down into "WoW + lasers" and everyone quit overnight. I came here hoping to see a lot of those lost, original game elements brought back into a newer, modern form. The great elements like: No "iconic character class" bullcrap. No classes at all, in fact. There was just skill trees. If you wanted to learn a skill then you used that skill until the skill leveled up. Over 50 skill tress to choose from ensured that no two characters were alike. No character levels, just skills. This alone made PvP actually interesting, as you had no clue as to what the other guy was able to bring into the fight until he used it on you. And vice verse. The most amazingly detailed crafting system ever seen in any MMORPG. So detailed that half the skill trees were crafting themed, and many players had toons that were nothing but crafters. You could honestly make a name for yourself without ever picking up a blaster, so long as you knew how to make really, really good blasters to put on the market. Which brings me to: A real market and not just that crappy auction house routine that every game cuts & pastes from WoW. A market so detailed that players could place their own stores in the game world to showcase their wares. Which brings me to: Player housing, and not some "magic portal" private instance generator, either. No, housing was right there on the map. You opened the door and walked inside. There was no transition from one map to another. Your house was just like every other fully realized structure in the game, and you could decorate it. And I just don't mean stupid "achievement" trophies that could only go on "hooks" - anything you found in the game could me placed anywhere you want with a simple yet versatile system for moving objects around in your home. Which brings me to: Customization. For such an old engine they had a character creation & detail system worthy of "The Sims" - Height, weight, nose detail, eye detail, everything on adjustable sliders for precise control. None of that "Pick from our fine selection of five stock prefab heads and be happy" crap. Every character's appearance was just as distinct as their skill build, their homes, and their clothing. Oh yes, clothing was customized as well. It was the only game I ever saw besides "Matrix Online" where players RPed enough to give a crap about whether or not their outfits looked good > the stats slapped into those outfits. It was a beautiful direction for a MMORPG to head into - one where characters weren't defined by levels & "leet build" templates. If you wanted to be a Doctor who dabbled in Music on the side, so be it. If you wanted to be a Pilot who took a minor in Bioengineering, so be it. If you wanted to throw all your skill points into Dancing, Cooking and Droid Design, hey, nothing to stop you. It was, in other words, a true sandbox. You got to play the character you wanted to play. Then WoW came along and scooped the brains out of the entire MMORPG industry in under a decade. By the time they were done every game out there had magically turned into a cheap WoW clone, and SWG was no exception. Their NGE was the final blow, the final caving into being nothing more than yet another pathetic WoW clone and thus everyone left. We sat waiting for years upon years hoping someone would fix it, but it never happened. So when Bioware came along we thought, "Hey, maybe we'll finally see a MMORPG that isn't just a cheap WoW clone. If nothing else, they won't make the same mistakes that SWG did. They know better than to pigeonhole players into stupid 'iconic character classes,' tie us down to the same tired level system, or wipe out crafting in favor of loot drops, and they certainly won't stoop to WoW's mentality of hamster-wheel gameplay that revolves entirely around simply grinding to become yet another carbon copy of every other top level character whom has a virtually identical powers set at yourself & wonder why PvP got so boring so quickly." And then the curtain was finally drawn and what did we see? *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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