Idea to make Tanks viable in pvp

[Shraydin]

With the way that tank stats are calculated in pvp they are all but useless. As a result Tanks in pvp tend to run a hybrid spec and/or stack dps stats. My proposal is that an additional effect is added to the fifth or sixth tier of the talent tree that converts defensive stats to pvp damage reduction.

 

something along the lines of (defense chance + absorb amt) * shield chance

 

for example if you have 20% defense and 40% absorb and 20% shield chance you would get

.60 * .20 = .12 or 12% additional pvp damage reduction

 

the same stats with 40% shield chance would yield

.60 * .40 = .24 or 24% additional pvp damage reduction

 

keeping it high in the talent tree would keep dps hybrids from being able to get to it and make tanking stats worthwhile.

 

the additional reduction in damage taken would come at the cost of lower damage output (from having far less dps stats) making pvp tanking more similar to pve tanking where your job is to protect your group not to kill stuff.

[Draqsko]

No, because it would be impossible for 8 people to kill me on my guardian tank with a healer in my pocket. I can already do that to 6 people for half a match, basically keep them from capping a node while my team grabs the other two.

 

Maybe vanguard and shadow tanks need a little something, but guardian tanks are just fine in tank gear.

[chosonman]

No, because it would be impossible for 8 people to kill me on my guardian tank with a healer in my pocket. I can already do that to 6 people for half a match, basically keep them from capping a node while my team grabs the other two.

 

Maybe vanguard and shadow tanks need a little something, but guardian tanks are just fine in tank gear.

 

Yea I hate games that have tank healer handcuffs. This is just stupid. There's no way a 2 players should be able to guard a node again an entire team the whole game. Makes me want to uninstall this game.

[Draqsko]

Yea I hate games that have tank healer handcuffs. This is just stupid. There's no way a 2 players should be able to guard a node again an entire team the whole game. Makes me want to uninstall this game.

 

You can kill them easily with the right tactics, just how to do it escapes most people. Here's a hint, seperate and stun, otherwise you are just beating your head against a wall.

[chosonman]

You can kill them easily with the right tactics, just how to do it escapes most people. Here's a hint, seperate and stun, otherwise you are just beating your head against a wall.

 

So 6 players should work collectively to separate and kill 2 players meanwhile what about the other 6 players on the other team? God forbid they have 2 pairs of Tank Healers.

[Ghost_Spectre]

God forbid they have 2 pairs of Tank Healers.

 

As it should be.

[Ghost_Spectre]

With the way that tank stats are calculated in pvp they are all but useless. As a result Tanks in pvp tend to run a hybrid spec and/or stack dps stats. My proposal is that an additional effect is added to the fifth or sixth tier of the talent tree that converts defensive stats to pvp damage reduction.

 

something along the lines of (defense chance + absorb amt) * shield chance

 

for example if you have 20% defense and 40% absorb and 20% shield chance you would get

.60 * .20 = .12 or 12% additional pvp damage reduction

 

the same stats with 40% shield chance would yield

.60 * .40 = .24 or 24% additional pvp damage reduction

 

keeping it high in the talent tree would keep dps hybrids from being able to get to it and make tanking stats worthwhile.

 

the additional reduction in damage taken would come at the cost of lower damage output (from having far less dps stats) making pvp tanking more similar to pve tanking where your job is to protect your group not to kill stuff.

 

I like this. It makes us less dependent on healers and they can concentrate on the team more. Combined with ED, this would make the tank be what it supposed to be...a damage sponge that defends the team.

[Shraydin]

So 6 players should work collectively to separate and kill 2 players meanwhile what about the other 6 players on the other team? God forbid they have 2 pairs of Tank Healers.

 

obviously it doesn't have to take 6 players to separate a tank and his healer. That is an obvious exaggeration. Two or three coordinated players could do it easily enough and I've seen it done by one skilled player.

[Zoom_VI]

obviously it doesn't have to take 6 players to separate a tank and his healer. That is an obvious exaggeration. Two or three coordinated players could do it easily enough and I've seen it done by one skilled player.

 

^^this.

 

However if you want to do so you need to learn how to pull more than 400 dps.

[masih_ad_dajjal]

3 dps should be able to tank tunnel fairly well especially if keeping healer stunned. But even without stuns it should not be too hard especially if no one else is around to interfere...which is what you made the scenario sound like.

 

If 6 people couldn't do that it meant 4 of them were prob crap or 2 were healers and 1 was crap, etc, etc, etc.

[scylence]

tank healer combo is just too good.

 

 

You won't see anything buffed tank related until you see healing and guard nerfs, or harder counters to healing and/or guard.

 

(like making crippling throw do 60% healing debuff) or a debuff that causes damage everytime an ability is casted.. or something that backlashes a tank if they are guarding your target.

[Jiminison]

Tanks that guard should shine. less people are pure tanks than any spec in this game (pvp wise) if we are mediocre for pvp then there is no reason to play one we are just a toon who puts out crap dps otherwise . Most people just want to steam roll everything and call it balance, We should slow the steam rollers , as a shadow tank I feel we need more deeps and ,or more midigation. Edited May 28, 2014 by Jiminison

[scylence]

Tanks that guard should shine. less people are pure tanks than any spec in this game (pvp wise) if we are mediocre for pvp then there is no reason to play one we are just a toon who puts out crap dps otherwise . Most people just want to steam roll everything and call it balance, We should slow the steam rollers , as a shadow tank I feel we need more deeps and ,or more midigation.

 

You get more deeps and run the risk of running DPS gear being too good or hybrid too good.

 

People should be able to steamroll in a sense. A Tank and healer should only be there to temporarily prolong the fight (in PVP) with varied tactics otherwise. However, it SHOULD be viable to be full blown tank (spec and gear) in pvp, but the guarding a target should be a lot more detrimental to the tank itself. Taunts in PVP should also be a tactical choice and not something to spam.

 

Hard part is finding a middle ground.

[masih_ad_dajjal]

any nerf to tanks or heals is unwarranted...

 

Honestly you think 2 dps should be able to steamroll a tank/heal combo? can 2 dps steamroll 2 other dps all things being equal? No, and a tank heal combo should be the same but even better because they are doing much less dmg.

 

3 dps should be able to beat a tank/heal with a little trouble and 3 dps should be able to steamroll 2 other dps.

 

4 dps should be able to steamroll a tank/heal and absolutely annihilate 2 other dps.

 

All this also assumes no one else is involved which many times there are and maybe you just didn't see them like a sniper perched, etc.

 

in regs heals generally get higher heals and they should cause there is only 1 or 2 of them most times and tbh op bar click healing is a lot easier than tgting.

 

But I've done over 1 mil dmg and average between 500k-900k depending on map and how it plays out.

 

I average 650k-1.2 mil heals same as above.

 

occasionally I'll do a bit more than those or a bit less....

 

and most tanks I see (I don't play one) average between 100k and 500k protection.

 

All that being said there really is not that big a difference between heals and dps.... the biggest difference is team synergy(combined skill), scenario, personal skill, gear, class...in about that order.

 

best way to overcome a tank/heal is through pure greater numbers.

 

Any nerf to tanks or heals in all honesty will just result in even less people playing them, and it's already low hence so many 4v4 dps ranked matches which are terrible imo.

Edited May 28, 2014 by masih_ad_dajjal

[Vodrin]

Tanks that guard should shine. less people are pure tanks than any spec in this game (pvp wise) if we are mediocre for pvp then there is no reason to play one we are just a toon who puts out crap dps otherwise . Most people just want to steam roll everything and call it balance, We should slow the steam rollers , as a shadow tank I feel we need more deeps and ,or more midigation.

 

Shadow tank in DPS gear puts out nice sustained DPS (with pretty poor burst) and sacrifices very little survivability over tank gear. All the spec really needs for PvP I think is a longer duration on harnessed shadows to allow more flexibility in the rotation (20 seconds should do).

[SilverMagnum]

obviously it doesn't have to take 6 players to separate a tank and his healer. That is an obvious exaggeration. Two or three coordinated players could do it easily enough and I've seen it done by one skilled player.

 

This pretty much. Because otherwise every single ranked group match (assuming your standard tank, heals 2 DPS comp) would always go to acid. Which of course is true.

 

And yes, beating a tank healer combo is doable with two or three (DF slinger is great for this IMO, dots on healer and tank + Cull burst = good pressure) and I've even done it by myself (granted it was due to the fact that the healer was bad. blew his breaker on spike, I combat stealthed, sapped him then blew up the tank). Point I'm making is that tank + healer combo is in a good place right now.

 

Sin tanks could use some beefiness but as others have said it would take some careful work to ensure that it wasn't making tank in DPS gear or tank hybrid too powerful.

[Aztian]

Idea to make Tanks viable in pvp

 

 

Is this a joke?--

[masih_ad_dajjal]

imo a good tank/heal combo should make the round/game last longer so that strat, personal skill, etc has more time to play out.

 

otherwise it end up like 4v4 dps where that poor merc/sorc/snipe get globalled and then the game is 3 v 4 in a matter of seconds...yep........ lot-o-skill in that bull.

[L-RANDLE]

Idea to make Tanks viable in pvp

 

 

Is this a joke?--

Um no. The OP is referencing stats. From a stats perspective they aren't viable. Maybe 10% more tankie, for losing 30%+ DPS. Tank capable DPS specs can perform two out of three main functions, and this is before you talk about hybrids and gearing.