EzioMessi Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) BRB, i have a mount to get with 46 blues!! LOL, yes sure. The gear will totally make up for your complete lack of experience with PvP, and carry you against waves of players who've been PvPing all their in-game lives. I dare you. Try and get that rating. P.S. Please tell me the names of the chars you're PvPing with so I can rub it in your face when you haven't reached 1500 by April 5 Edited February 20, 2014 by EzioMessi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 LOL, yes sure. The gear will totally make up for your complete lack of experience with PvP, and carry you against waves of players who've been PvPing all their in-ge lives. I dare you. Try and get that rating. Fu, now he's going to be on my *** all the time for help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technohic Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 BRB, i have a mount to get with 46 blues!! Be sure to post a video and whine about being focused when you're done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EzioMessi Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Be sure to post a video and whine about being focused when you're done. Why is my tank not grabbing all the aggro? Shouldn't taunt make the enemy attack the tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technohic Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Why is my tank not grabbing all the aggro? Shouldn't taunt make the enemy attack the tank? It actually was kind of more direct for the person I am saying it to. I remember them and would have let it go if they weren't here trying to troll people. They basically posted a video some time ago claiming to be harrassed because they were focused so much. Watch the video, and they were an operative healer trying to cap VS in the middle of a scrum repeatedly, and yet had 2 deaths. Oh the horror. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EzioMessi Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 It actually was kind of more direct for the person I am saying it to. I remember them and would have let it go if they weren't here trying to troll people. They basically posted a video some time ago claiming to be harrassed because they were focused so much. Watch the video, and they were an operative healer trying to cap VS in the middle of a scrum repeatedly, and yet had 2 deaths. Oh the horror. LOL, I think I remember the thread now. I didn't see the video, but the whines were hilarious to read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafy_Bug Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Fu, now he's going to be on my *** all the time for help LAWL . L2play evo! When i was beating Warmongers in RWZ you were a lowbie !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaitWatson Posted February 20, 2014 Author Share Posted February 20, 2014 Hello everyone! I sent the information posted by L-RANDLE to the combat team to have them take a look, and wanted to post and let you all know what’s going on. One of the first things we found when looking at the numbers is that tooltips are not matching what the back-end math says should be going on at all. Turns out, weapon damage attacks aren’t properly updating when we bolster weapon damage values up. That is going to cause players with lower weapon mods (hilts/barrels, specifically) to have their “white damage” abilities really off-base on the tooltip. We have informed the engineering team so that they can take a look and see what’s going on. The second thing we did was “dissect” the numbers we got from L-RANDLE, specifically when it came to the Ravage numbers provided. For a bit of background, here is how Ravage damage is calculated: Ravage Hit 1 and 2: 92.5% of Weapon Damage 13.9% of Base Level 55 Ability Damage (Max Base Damage is 2685 at 55) 1.39x Bonus Damage Stat So using L-RANDLE’s provided information, here is what we got: Obroan: Max Weapon Range: 668 (Bolstered to 863) Bonus Damage: 834.2 1st and 2nd Ravage Hits: 798 + 373 + 1159 3rd Ravage Hit: 1597 + 746 + 2319 Total Damage (before Skills/Armor/etc): 9322 L-RANDLE’s Personal Setup: Max Weapon Range: 651 (Bolstered to 863) Bonus Damage: 856.7 1st and 2nd Ravage Hits: 798 + 373 + 1190 3rd Ravage Hit: 1597 + 746 + 2454 Total Damage (before Skills/Armor/etc): 9447 Blue Mods: Max Weapon Range: 651 (Bolstered to 863) Bonus Damage: 882.6 1st and 2nd Ravage Hits: 798 + 373 + 1227 3rd Ravage Hit: 1597 + 746 + 2454 Total Damage (before Skills/Armor/etc): 9593 As you can see (and as many of you have reported), the blue mods are scaling much better than Obroan. We will be looking at Bolster and making adjustments to work towards correcting this issue, particularly as we get towards 2.7 and a new set of PvP gear. -tw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evuo Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) Hello everyone! I sent the information posted by L-RANDLE to the combat team to have them take a look, and wanted to post and let you all know what’s going on. One of the first things we found when looking at the numbers is that tooltips are not matching what the back-end math says should be going on at all. Turns out, weapon damage attacks aren’t properly updating when we bolster weapon damage values up. That is going to cause players with lower weapon mods (hilts/barrels, specifically) to have their “white damage” abilities really off-base on the tooltip. We have informed the engineering team so that they can take a look and see what’s going on. The second thing we did was “dissect” the numbers we got from L-RANDLE, specifically when it came to the Ravage numbers provided. For a bit of background, here is how Ravage damage is calculated: Ravage Hit 1 and 2: 92.5% of Weapon Damage 13.9% of Base Level 55 Ability Damage (Max Base Damage is 2685 at 55) 1.39x Bonus Damage Stat So using L-RANDLE’s provided information, here is what we got: Obroan: Max Weapon Range: 668 (Bolstered to 863) Bonus Damage: 834.2 1st and 2nd Ravage Hits: 798 + 373 + 1159 3rd Ravage Hit: 1597 + 746 + 2319 Total Damage (before Skills/Armor/etc): 9322 L-RANDLE’s Personal Setup: Max Weapon Range: 651 (Bolstered to 863) Bonus Damage: 856.7 1st and 2nd Ravage Hits: 798 + 373 + 1190 3rd Ravage Hit: 1597 + 746 + 2454 Total Damage (before Skills/Armor/etc): 9447 Blue Mods: Max Weapon Range: 651 (Bolstered to 863) Bonus Damage: 882.6 1st and 2nd Ravage Hits: 798 + 373 + 1227 3rd Ravage Hit: 1597 + 746 + 2454 Total Damage (before Skills/Armor/etc): 9593 As you can see (and as many of you have reported), the blue mods are scaling much better than Obroan. We will be looking at Bolster and making adjustments to work towards correcting this issue, particularly as we get towards 2.7 and a new set of PvP gear. -tw Tait, Sorry I have no been able to contribute, the login service has been down the past couple of days. But I have some data of my own which might be of some use to the combat team as well. In addition to blue level 45 mods, the Microfilament implants and earpieces are also bolstering better than Obroan. 45s Offhand http://imgur.com/zvxCrLj on a tech attack http://imgur.com/jl9DiIu 2792 Endurance 1480 Bonus Damage 22.84% critical 75.13% surge 69, 63, 61 Offhand http://imgur.com/KXjTCLg on a tech attack tooltip http://imgur.com/drEP9Ki 2697 Endurance 1475 Bonus Damage 22.21% critical 75.26% surge Obroan http://imgur.com/8XWpmpt on a tech attack tooltip http://imgur.com/tp8nZuc 2722 Endurance 1465.6 Bonus Damage 22.19% critical 75.43% surge This results in the 45s modded offhand leading in endurance, bonus damage, and critical over both the 69/63/61 combo and the Obroan offhand. Implants Note: There is no Aim variant of the microfilament with power and surge as the secondary stats. Therefore I left out the surge and accuracy values as it is not a fair comparison between two unlike stats. However, I was simply looking for the bonus damage comparison. You can be assured that a power and surge variant of the microfilament will bolster better than Obroan (Warriors/Knights and Smugglers/Agents both have main stat variants with power and surge as the secondary stats). Microfilament http://imgur.com/DoZWFcb 2625 Endurance 897.2 Bonus Damage 18.99% crit Obroan http://imgur.com/v9kx5fG 2622 Endurance 895.3 Bonus Damage 18.93% crit So the Microfilament gains 3 endurance, 1.9 bonus damage, and 0.06% critical. That is a pure gain, no sacrifice of any kind just by buying a blue off the GTN. The Microfilament earpiece versus the Obroan one mimics this behavior albeit with different values. Edited February 20, 2014 by Evuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-RANDLE Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Tait, It's good they now see it isn't limited to crystals, but what about my real question? Last time bolster on PvE gear was increased to account for the PvP gear tier increase. Besides these pragmatic issues, even if they are fixed, we still have a problem. My Obroan gear will be obsolete because bolster will have to be increased on PvE gear to account for the PvP tier increase. Why not just eliminate PvP gearing or minimum rework it so it involves adding small amounts of EXP only? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K_osss Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Tait, Do these findings change the Bioware stance on whether blue mods are considered an exploit? it seems the tune of the developer team may have changed a bit between then and now. I will be pleased if PvP gear is made to be BIS in pvp in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Wait so theise blue things give you more white damage afterall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puissant Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) @Evuo expert experimental reflex enhancers are the implants I use and they bolster to 2018 along with pve weapons. http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/gear/50057-1012/expert-experimental-reflex-enhancer Edited February 20, 2014 by Puissant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evuo Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) @Evuo expert experimental reflex enhancers are the implants I use and they bolster to 2018 along with pve weapons. http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/gear/50057-1012/expert-experimental-reflex-enhancer Microfilaments (blue) bolster even better. Edited February 20, 2014 by Evuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puissant Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Microfilaments (blue) bolster better. Could be a difference in gear but my bonus dmg is 905.4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sangrar Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 hope this gets fixed before the end of season 1 I do not want to go out and get blue modded to be more competitive, meanwhile good to know in advance that a new pvp gear set is coming thanks for letting me know so I can start grinding in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technohic Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 and a new set of PvP gear. -tw Oh no; not again! http://lightsallaround.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/hamster-gif.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evuo Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) Could be a difference in gear but my bonus dmg is 905.4. Grab a blue microfilament and compare the stat difference. Edited February 20, 2014 by Evuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-RANDLE Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 oh no; not again! http://lightsallaround.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/hamster-gif.gif qft.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanNV Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 As you can see (and as many of you have reported), the blue mods are scaling much better than Obroan. We will be looking at Bolster and making adjustments to work towards correcting this issue, particularly as we get towards 2.7 and a new set of PvP gear. -tw Tait, 1, thank you for posting. 2, This game does not need another tier of gear, anywhere. We want more content that we can run. Another tier of gear just means another grind of endless dailies, which once you get the new gear or now obsolete because they become so easy as to be boring. More content that actually works with the gear we have now would be infinitely more enjoyable and could be mixed in with the current content which means more content to play with. That would be a huge plus. More gear with new content to match just means there is actually less to spend time enjoying. Have the designers give that concept a thought. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParagonAX Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Please do not release a new tier of pvp gear.... no-one wants to grind again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerilas Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Hi Everyone, Over the past few weeks, we have been looking into your reports of lower level mods giving higher stats with bolster than Obroan gear. To test this, we checked the relative power of multiple gear sets against each other, which provides us with our “power differential” between players. We are currently shooting for about a 7% gap between bolstering and default Obroan mods, if you assume the same level of augments. That said, we tested with a Lethality Sniper and found that there is about a 5% differential between Obroan and the bolstered lower level blue mods. This is with default Obroan mods, so there is some customization potential in the PvP gear that would further improve the gap. Both gear sets included Augments and a Power Crystal. Your results may vary depending on your class and specialization. Bolster tends to favor pure power as a stat, so the lower blue mods WILL show higher bonus damage values vs default Obroan, which, in turn, grants slightly higher base damages on abilities at the sacrifice of other ratings and endurance. For example, with default Obroan, the Explosive Probe tooltip states it maxes at 3876 damage, while with the blue mods and bolster it tops out at 3915. However, Obroan has better alacrity (+0.06%), crit (+6.22%), and health (+343). In the end (and in a perfect rotation environment), the player wearing Obroan will win a duel. So what we’re seeing is that, yes, if you’re willing to sacrifice other stats for damage output, these mods can be optimal for your play style. This is not our final design implementation and we are going to continue looking at the balance between default Obroan and bolster. However, we are currently okay with where it is, even being a bit less than the target. Do note that we are aware of an issue regarding Main Hand and Off-Hand gear when it comes to Expertise crystals vs. stat crystals, and are working on a solution. I don’t currently have an ETA for you, but will update you as I know more. -tw My god you people at Bioware are absolutely *********** clueless AND useless. Your idea of these stats are completely wrong. Blue mods in MH and OH alone give you ~+2k hp, at least 50bonus damage, more bonus healing and 1%crit. There's NO stats that are lower than when you're full Obroan. Jesus Christ would you finally play your own game and understand it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sangrar Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Please do not release a new tier of pvp gear.... no-one wants to grind again. you cannot escape your destiny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puissant Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Grab a blue microfilament and compare the stat difference. Will do. Leveling another alt now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evuo Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) Will do. Leveling another alt now. Did it for you. Obroan: http://imgur.com/raeJBtC Experimental Purple 54: http://imgur.com/YL9LCvQ Microfilament Blue 53: http://imgur.com/XrKQLRF Like I mentioned in my original post the secondary stats may not match heres an idea of what you'd get with secondary stats by adding an Obroan implant w/ accuracy compared to this blue Microfilament. Obroan with accuracy for better comparison: http://imgur.com/3fc52J8 Thus microfilaments are BIS as long as the secondary stat is useful for you. Edited February 20, 2014 by Evuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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