Useless Strike....

[Andryah]

Infernixx nailed it. This is correct.

 

^^ beat me to it E_o_L.

[Reno_Tarshil]

One more example of you not knowing anything about the subject.

 

A healing spec merc can aoe, but a op can't? Get off your high horse. OS was no more an I win button that any other AOE. It had a longer cooldown, and it took longer for all the damage to hit. Not to mention it's a level 48 ability, and everyone else has a hard hitting AOE much earlier.

 

You're just not worth reading. All you bring is hyperbole, and fanboyisms. /ignore welcome to the club.

 

The only AOE that can be compared as OP as OS would be Force Storm and even then OS is way better than every AOE in game. It getting nerfed is eventually expected.

 

Also really ignoring someone for bringing up a valid point about healer's dpsing? Tsk, tsk.

[chad_longshot]

Healers are not always in a group. Sometimes, they just run with their companion and do missions solo. That is a viable option.

 

And for those Operatives, this change has made OS fairly useless. I generate enough aggro with healing - using an AOE that doesn't kill trash mobs is not of any use to me. I don't need more reason for mobs that now have more hit points to all attack me. That's dumb - why would any healer want that? I am better off with me and my tank or DPS companion using other tactics that generate less aggro on me.

 

This isn't about my DPS numbers getting cut, this is about an AOE actually making threat management more difficult than it is worth when using an ability. A level 48 ability, no less. After testing it, I actually find it is more advantageous to take down trash mobs one at a time than use OS, and further I find OS to only be something I pull out in boss fights when I am sure I won't generate enough aggro or need to take aggro off my companion for a bit anyway.

 

They wanted it to still be a great AOE, and it is absolutely not for my operative. It is okay occasionally with single targets, though.

Edited February 7, 2014 by chad_longshot

[Hambunctious]

Healers are not always in a group. Sometimes, they just run with their companion and do missions solo. That is a viable option.

 

And for those Operatives, this change has made OS fairly useless. I generate enough aggro with healing - using an AOE that doesn't kill trash mobs is not of any use to me. I don't need more reason for mobs that now have more hit points to all attack me. That's dumb - why would any healer want that? I am better of with me and my tank or DPS companion using other tactics that generate less aggro on me.

 

This isn't about my DPS numbers getting cut, this is about an AOE actually making threat management more difficult than it is worth when using an ability. A level 48 ability, no less. After testing it, I actually find it is more advantageous to take down trash mobs one at a time than use OS, and further I find OS to only be something I pull out in boss fights when I am sure I won't generate enough aggro or need to take aggro off my companion for a bit anyway.

 

They wanted it to still be a great AOE, and it is absolutely not for my operative. It is okay occasionally with single targets, though.

 

Yay! Someone who has a brain, and can understand a point is so refreshing on these forums.

[BadOrb]

It's fine , I just made my Sniper a hybrid to counteract this nerf and I do by 10% extra damage on my OS.

 

So choose marksmanship , choose all apart from 3 skills , Ballistic dampeners , imperial demarcation , Take cover.

Then choose 4 skills from engineering , Energy tanks , Gearhead , Vitality serum , Explosive engineering.

 

So all that gives you a lot , 10 energy , 9% extra cunning , 4% extra endurance and 15% extra damage on many skills including orbital strike and frag grenades. Sounds like a perfect hybrid to me.

 

Just to note on the new flashpoint I was indeed killing on first strike and /or half killing the mobs

 

Enjoy !

 

BadOrb.

[Exly]

They should rename the ability, because any Orbital Strike in the military is going to do ALOT of damage, and this does not do that anymore. It takes far too long to cast to use for such a low amount of damage now. It should be like Force Storm and hit as soon as you click.

 

Maybe they should rename it Orbital Psych.

[Jamalzero]

To the comment about Death From Above vs Orbital Uselessness the HUGE difference between the two abilities is one is instant and the other takes 5 seconds to do any damage what so ever... death from above youre going to get 2-3 missile attacks off all the time depending on when people move out of it... Orbital strike on the other hand no one in thier right mind would sit in that...

 

2nd, doing dailies on a single target Death from above on melee for example: Jet boost > while they are slowed and advancing Death from above....BOOM DfA in your rotation and huge damage done...

 

Orbital strike on the other hand i can sit there and place OS on me and let the melee attack me and i have to wait 5 sec before the damage even starts.... and when it starts it just tickles the target...

 

My issue is with the damage out put of it now not when its viable (which is never now...not even in raids i use it anymore because its just pointless) the ability conumes too much energy for just a 4k hit..................my ambush does 10k in 1 shot and thats a 2 sec channel.... matter of fact i can get 2 or 3 of those off before OS is off CD

[agamemnon-]

From the most recent thread about the Dark Ward changes:

 

We should all remember what the ultimate (and scary) issue is:

 

Someone at Bioware thought this was a good idea.

 

Makes you wonder about the thought processes of the guy who proposed it, the guy who did the actual change, and the guy who approved it.

 

If you are going to do something this drastic and heavy handed, what hope is there for rational decisions in the future?

[dermitni]

I'm sure you're absolutely right. The problem is that a game needs to be about more than just metrics. It' needs to be fun. Hence the emotional responses.

 

Players don't have access to the metrics that the devs do and the majority don't want to stare at spreadsheets anyway. Even those who do want to examine the figures are reliant on 3rd party logging tools and usually only test in controlled and objective situations (raid bosses, target dummies etc).

 

But what players do have is a FEEL for the game. They instinctively know when things aren't working smoothly, aren't fun, aren't balanced. They know when an ability is or isn't worth using compared to what else is available to their class, or to other classes (most players now have multiple alts).

 

Yes the devs can't pander fully to these emotional responses or the game would become a mess of overpowered abilities. But they do need to at least listen to them and get their noses out of their spreadsheets, perhaps actually PLAY their own game and ask themselves "is it FUN?".

An excellent posting, thank you!

 

I'm a pure PVE'er and "in the old days" I used "Orbital Strike" with my Sniper as an AOE to kill mobs (as I thought this was its intended use?) while I concentrated my single target fire on the boss. To use it against single PVE bosses didn't make sense since most of them couldn't be startled by it anyways, so I can only imagine that the cry out for a nerf came from the PVP player base. If that is the case -- then why not just treat PVP "Orbital Strike" different than the PVE version? Have it need much higher Expertise or something?

 

As the ability is now, I stopped using "Flour Bomb Strike" and switched to spamming my only other remaining AOE ability in order to keep mobs down, but now I alsohave to single-handedly snipe each and every foe of the mob as well afterwards, since I have no other AOE left to kill any non-gray mob.

 

So yes, I have to agree that this nerf was a really stupid idea by Bioware. As it is, they could just be honest about it and either rename this now all but useless ability or simply remove it.

 

Just my 2 credits,

Niko

[CommanderKeeva]

/Agree. And, sometimes a dev team makes corrections, and sometimes they don't. Nothing any of us can do about it except adapt or quit. They may be guilty of poor explanations in this case, but it's in no way an overnerf to either main class. I'm not even sure it's an overnerf to the specific skills... but I guess if that was a players bread and butter skill...perhaps.. but that brings us back to ---> adapt, persevere, overcome.

 

Then again.. I have not seen very much in the way of proper cases being made. This thread for example.. launches immediately into "useless"... which is inaccurate and full of hyperbole.

 

I don't agree that this isn't an overnerf. This affects both Operative/Scoundrel and Sniper/Gunslinger DPS on so many levels and even Operative Healers to some extent.

 

In my opinion and experience, while Orbital Strike isn't exactly useless, it's a lot less useful in most situations than it used to be before. It was designed and intended to be the most powerful AoE attack for Smugglers/Agents and it was well suited for that role mechanics-wise, graphically and from a lore standpoint. That is no longer the case.

 

Ostensibly, Bioware decided to nerf this ability in this way, so that people would be discouraged from using OS in single target rotations, while leaving overall DPS largely untouched and the ability useful for taking out multiple targets. But in fact, they could not have accomplished exactly the opposite of what they had supposedly wanted to achieve more perfectly. The current version of Orbital Strike fails spectacularly badly on multiple accounts:

 

1. Bioware stated on multiple occasions, if I remember correctly, that they wanted Orbital Strike as an ability strictly used against multiple targets, i.e. removing it from single target rotations. But the 2/3s damage nerf was simply so high that Orbital Strike is not an effective AoE ability anymore. I witnessed it first hand when weak mobs with 4-5k HP were left with a sliver of health on Oricon.

 

In many cases, Orbital Strike is just not worth using against multiple targets, especially packs of strong or elite adds during bossfights. In fact, Suppressive Fire/Sweeping Gunfire does more damage, despite having a higher cost and only doing white damage. Orbital Strike might still be worth considering for its knockdown effect (e.g. rats on Dash'roode), but in most other cases I find myself using Sweeping Gunfire or at least combining the two attacks. As such, Orbital Strike has lost its main purpose as an effective AoE attack.

 

2. Orbital Strike could always function as a ground DoT against bosses and many players exploited this to its fullest potential. While I would agree that AoE abilties don't necessarily have to be part of single target rotations (though skills like Smash, Death Field and Corrosive Grenade belie this statement), they went about the nerf the exact opposite way they should have. Because of its reduced cooldown, channel and energy costs (it essentially costs nothing now), it is an extremely efficient filler ability, particularly in Marksmanship/Sharpshooter.

 

When you compare Orbital Strike to Snipe/Charged burst, you'll notice that they have the same cast time, do roughly the same damage but Orbital Strike costs less Energy. It also has 3 separate chances to crit, which means that if even one tick crits, the damage will exceed that of Snipe. Essentially, we only stand to gain damage if we replace Snipe with Orbital Strike as often as possible and with its cooldown reduced to 30 secs, it will happen many times during the fight. Bioware basically ensured that MM/SS Snipers/Slingers now use Orbital Strike on CD in single target rotations MORE OFTEN THAN EVER BEFORE, since the ability lost its primary function as an effective add killer and hence there is no need to save it to deal with them.

 

3. If they wanted to reduce the effectiveness of the hybrid spec, which generally seems to be the case, again they picked worst possible way to do it. A general damage nerf that affects all specs across the board is not going to make hybrid not viable. Most of the damage of hybrid comes from the DoTs and Cull/Wounding Shots, so a general damage nerf is the worst way to go about making one spec not viable. Besides, how is it okay to roll in place in Engineering/Saboteur, wallbang the dummy with Scatter Bombs for 4,4-4,5k DPS in parses and use Covered Escape as an offensive ability? This is clearly a larger misuse of intended mechanics than using Orbital Strike on single targets. Yet Bioware is seemingly okay with that.

 

4. This nerf hit Operatives and Scoundrels as well, whose damage wasn't overpowered, even with Orbital Strike factored in. Now they have lost the only way they can effectively deal AoE damage. Carbine Burst is point-blank, does low damage and it might not even be available on demand because it requires Tactical Advantage. No thought was given to how this nerf would affect Operative/Scoundrel DPS and their ability to deal with adds. Additionally, Operative healers would call in Orbital Strikes in damage-intensive situations (NiM Dread Guards, HM Dread Masters etc.) to help pad overall damage, but even that is adversely affected now.

 

I could go on listing points but I think I've made myself clear and nobody enjoys reading walls of text, anyways. Besides, I think all of these points have already been mentioned either here or in the class forums.

 

TL;DR: I don't agree that this is not an overnerf. This is an unreasonably large nerf to both class' signature ability that fails to accomplish any of its intended effects, has no sense whatsoever and directly contradicts the developers intentions.

Edited February 10, 2014 by CommanderKeeva

[Khaleijo]

Can't speak for operative DPS as we don't have one as main character in our ops group or guild, but as a healer i use OS more often now because of the low energy costs. Before i had to be more careful deciding when to use OS in a boss fight, as it took out a big chunk of my ressource, so if i knew "there is a phase of intense healing ahead", i rarely used OS even if i had time to cast it. Now i just use it as filler whenever i have time without any recognizable impact on my energy management.

 

For soloplay it is much more effective for me to let my companion kill stuff while throwing grenades and use sweeping fire to help than to cast OS and keep mobs in its area. In questing groups i used it more often out of boredom and its cool look, not because it was really necessary as most stuff was already dead before OS started hitting.

 

Our snipers lost some DPS with 2.6, but they are adapting to new rotations and are still to be counted in for the competition for top DPS, their loss is so small that some other raid members still have no chance to beat them any time soon no matter what fight. Their DPS still is in top positions.

There may be reason to adapt some strategies here and there, but if there are really that many ops groups who can't kill bosses now, they used to kill with the help of pre 2.6 OS before, the change was really needed, as it isn't good class balance to need a certain class in every case to beat enrage timers for example.

Maybe there even was another hidden reason to the changes, that adds should not be killed only by multiple OS and everyone else just ignoring them most of the time. Possibly the devs nerfed OS also to force players into other strategies regarding adds.

 

Compared to other aoe abilities OS still has two big advantage, one, you have an on demand burst on adds by pre casting OS and then throwing your other aoe skills on the mobs too. We agents have more aoe abilities than most of the other classes, all agents have three, skilled even more, instead of the two most other classes have, grenades, suppressive fire, plasma probe... in addition to OS.

Two, no other class can do two things at the same time regarding aoe, they all have one abiltiy at the time. No other class has an aoe ability that hits targets independant of the toon actions once it started doing damage. Everyone else is only able to shot/hit adds OR do something else, smugglers/agents can do adds AND something else at the same time. In fact, counting plasma probe, snipers have even two such abilities. (with prepartion aka casttime but still used with the correct timing and placing OS+other agent aoe ability is more effective than other classes aoe).

Yes, in a way dotspecs can do two things at the same time too by multidotting, but that takes more time or resources to apply and keep up. It is not really viable to deal with adds while doing something totally different somewhere else as there is always a tradeoff, the strong dots have cd and can't be applied to multiple targets at once.

 

Of course a loss of DPS is always something players feel negative about, but do all these yelling and crying snipers really think that the situation pre 2.6 was all good and fair, that even within the sniper class the aoe specialised spec engineering had less use of this big hitting aoe ability, than the single target specs like MM?

Was the OS really that important for operative DPS and was it good for the gameplay of this class that it had this importance? Why do we have all the other aoe abilities if they were never to be used because OS was always better? Be honest somthing had to be changed.

 

Agents/smugglers are still in a very good position for DPS, if time tells that the nerf was too harsh, there will be changes again. There may have been better ways to change things and we can discuss them again and again, but in the end the devs decide and we have to accept and adapt or reroll/leave.

 

For my part i prefer that my skilled spec determines my important abilities, that the final talent is what brings the feeling of my class/spec while playing and not a standard class ability that everyone has, even if it looks as cool as OS. It had way too much importance and all the other multiple target abilitys were just rubbish in comparison, not even talking about the use in single target rotation. Now we have to decide which one of the multiple aoe abilities is the best in a certain situation and/or combine them. Much more interesting and much more fun.

[Pistols]

Just another garbage change from combat guy, who has no idea what he's doing.

 

[dermitni]

Much more interesting and much more fun.

Nope, much more tedious to kill each and every mob foe with single shots now since the only real AOE killer has been made useless. Where you see the fun in that is beyond me; snipers have no real AOE ability any more, only things to distract enemies while they have to shoot them down one by one. That is a much too drastic change in my opinion and the exact opposite of fun.

 

Just another garbage change from combat guy, who has no idea what he's doing.

 

Yes, I have to admit, this thought occured to me as well.

 

"Never fix something that doesn't need fixing" is a golden rule in software development. Too bad Bioware doesn't heed that rule more often...

Edited February 10, 2014 by dermitni

[Blackardin]

It was an "I win" ability, you were able to deal near 10k in elemental damage, if you check my posts on the PTS when this was announced, I actually never agreed with the nerf (and I still do). But this sort of complaint is counter productive. Regardless of how it was used, it still has an intended role which is an AOE role, it is still an energy effective AOE ability.

 

 

Edit: I need to expand more on this.

The problem that I see it with a lot of "this nerf was not warranted" populous is that they are approaching this issue from the wrong direction.

First of all, BW has a certain vision on the role of every spec and how every ability should be used. Whether you agree or not with this vision on its premise is irrelevant. However, feedback and opinion are important because it can help refine the experience. But arguing against the premise is a fallacy (I am not saying you as Beslley are doing that) and it will lead you no where, and the door of communication you hoped to open with the devs is now gone.

 

Second of all, a lot of the objections are emotion based and if you and I have learned anything that BW has grew a thick skin against this specially after how they reacted when they first launched the game (one could argue they even went too far in the other direction). Now whether you agree on the accuracy or not, but BW have tools and metrics that can measure the "performance" of abilities and specs in this game, and they feel they can trust these tools when making any modifications. When you argue against a modification, you need to play by the rules the devs have in place otherwise they will refuse to listen. Just look on how KBN managed to convince the combat team to buff the Assassin Tanks (I am not arguing if that buff was warranted or not, or anything else), he played by their rules and avoided the "emotional" side of the argument and was able to get what he requested. Again, try to look on the answers they devs gave to the Sorc representative and you see my point clear as the sky.

 

 

If you want to argue with the dev team, you have to play by their rules and nothing else.

 

It was not an "I" win ability, not even close and your argument, to this indivdiual that has played a sniper in all aspects of the game, as well as 5 other classes, is limited at best. You are attempting to compare only dps, and only dps in a given situation without encompassing the myriad of other factors in the game such as utility, mobility, variable functionality etc.

 

The sniper, his role, emulated artillery, not infantry. One trick pony who's one trick is no longer entertaining or enjoyable....so yes, the nerf goes well deeper then numbers on a spread sheet. If you played one to their fullest potential, in the highest ends of the game you would better understand that.

 

No matter to me. Stopped playing because of work issues a month or so back. Came back to read up before looking to start in and unfortunately will not be doing so. Enjoy the game and my guild very much, but I've been playing these games since Meridian and

Ultima. Seen it, experienced it once too often I guess, and really not interested in going through yet another debacle with yet another class both misconstrued and rendered moot. Game is suppose to be fun, not frustrating. I'll check back in six months or so I guess.

 

Most unfortunate.

[Blackardin]

Just another garbage change from combat guy, who has no idea what he's doing.

 

 

Honestly, though I've refrained from making such comments over the years and always tried to look for the rationale, even if there was not one, I have to agree here. This implementation, to me, is akin to throwing a dart while blindfolded. Makes no sense at all.

[Blackardin]

I've seen a lot of nerfs in a lot of MMOs over the years and this has to be one of the most senseless ones. The change to Orbital Strike / Freighter Flyby doesn't address the core problem and instead renders the ability not suitable for the intended usage (i.e. AOE).

 

I realise there was an issue with it being used in single target rotations, particularly for certain builds. Fine. so address that. Don't break the ability beyond all usefulness for everyone. It no longer functions as a useful AOE for any situation or build. Ironically because of the lower cd and cost I hear it is still useful in certain single target fights when other abilities are on cd. But as an AOE it is now pointless. As a level 48 signature ability it is a joke.

 

Two prolems:

1) The AOE damage is extremely weak. It won't even kill a pack of weak mobs below your level, assuming they even stay in it long enough to get damaged.

2) The preparation time / delay until it does damage is way too slow. It was always too slow, but at least the damage was worth it before, now it no longer is.

 

Essentially this ability needs changing so it is on a par with the speed, utility and damage of other signature aoe attacks in the game, such as Death From Above ( I worry about mentioning that in case they decide instead to re-nerf DFA).

 

you've encompassed the entirety of the issue at hand in a single post. Lucid as it is astute, this is the very crux of the issue and a point that seems to be lost by programers and analysis nose deep in spread sheets and charts. They all speak of "balance", then fail to adjudicate properly when implementing such intense alterations to "main stay" abilities that can and often do alter (or eliminate) a defined role for a particular class.

 

They see that this particular car excels well past all others on the straightaways, but never look at how much it loses on the corners, how much longer its pit-stops take, thus rendering the inability to compete in the overall race.

 

That, in fact, is the issue, not the nerf per se.

[Sneekyblade]

Maybe there will be an Orbital Strike sold in the Cartel Market soon that people can buy that will be the same as the OS before.

[branmakmuffin]

So while OS is doing damage, you can't do anything else?

Maybe they like to stand and observe the awesomeness of the smoking corpses, which takes slightly more "work" now.

[Rasen]

So no desire to see if frag grenade and suppressive fire can fill in for aoe or stack along with OS? Really sad guys. You treat these things so seriously yet have no desire to modify your gameplay. This 'OS issue' is what is wrong with MMO gaming today. You all sign up for a constantly updating game and don't ever want it to update. No Gunslinger in my guild or friends list is hit hard by this change. None of you are legitimately being kicked from groups. None of you are wiping on adds. You just want your heavy hitter back because it trivialized content for you. And try and mask it with words like fun and reasonable.

 

My Juggernaut tank went through months of Crushing Blow being a worthless ability. They changed it to do AOE damage, but the damage was so forgettable that it was dropped off most Jugg tanks' quickbars. That's when members of the community got creative and suggested the hybrid spec and due to that we survived til our tank got fixed and made all better.

 

My Concealment Operative was massacred by the nerf nuke post launch and forced me to switch to heals. Two years later she's back and better than ever!

 

My Sentinel...oh wait. My Sentinel has always been awesome. Forget it!

 

Oh whatever! Keep groaning about it. I'm sure those extra changes will give you more laughable reasons to unsub. It is snowing outside for me now. I already told Bioware I'm unsubbing over that. I blame Hoth and their environment team. Good luck with your efforts!

[Beslley]

So no desire to see if frag grenade and suppressive fire can fill in for aoe or stack along with OS? Really sad guys. You treat these things so seriously yet have no desire to modify your gameplay. This 'OS issue' is what is wrong with MMO gaming today. You all sign up for a constantly updating game and don't ever want it to update. No Gunslinger in my guild or friends list is hit hard by this change. None of you are legitimately being kicked from groups. None of you are wiping on adds. You just want your heavy hitter back because it trivialized content for you. And try and mask it with words like fun and reasonable.

 

My Juggernaut tank went through months of Crushing Blow being a worthless ability. They changed it to do AOE damage, but the damage was so forgettable that it was dropped off most Jugg tanks' quickbars. That's when members of the community got creative and suggested the hybrid spec and due to that we survived til our tank got fixed and made all better.

 

My Concealment Operative was massacred by the nerf nuke post launch and forced me to switch to heals. Two years later she's back and better than ever!

 

My Sentinel...oh wait. My Sentinel has always been awesome. Forget it!

 

Oh whatever! Keep groaning about it. I'm sure those extra changes will give you more laughable reasons to unsub. It is snowing outside for me now. I already told Bioware I'm unsubbing over that. I blame Hoth and their environment team. Good luck with your efforts!

 

Oh, FFS. We aren't complaining about a playstyle change. We're complaining that

a) The nerf did not fix what BW intended it to, that is, to remove OS from single target rotation (Now EVERYONE is using it single-target as filler because of the low energy cost/faster cast)

b) The nerf basically neutered a high-level aoe ability (getting OS at 49 is now totally underwhelming)

 

I'd also like to point out that suppressive fire is a huge energy dump, which makes it impractical at best in a sustained fight (I use it on trash for the lol factor, but I am always out of energy at the end from spamming it). Grenade also takes a fair amount of energy so using grenade then suppressive fire would definitely leave you energy starved.

You'd be better off throwing grenade (and OS depending on the # of adds/depending on how long the adds will be up) and just single-targeting said adds down.

 

TL;DR the OS nerf has made everyone use it single target but has removed nearly all of its aoe utility.

 

If OS had been redesigned in a way that removed it from single-target rotation but kept its aoe capabilities, I wouldn't be complaining. I am well aware that it is really, really dumb to have to use an aoe on a single mob to boost my numbers. I would welcome a change that would remove OS from single-target rotations, but this nerf did not do that.

Edited February 10, 2014 by Beslley

[dermitni]

Maybe there will be an Orbital Strike sold in the Cartel Market soon that people can buy that will be the same as the OS before.

To be honest, I would not be surprised about that...

[dermitni]

If OS had been redesigned in a way that removed it from single-target rotation but kept its aoe capabilities, I wouldn't be complaining. I am well aware that it is really, really dumb to have to use an aoe on a single mob to boost my numbers. I would welcome a change that would remove OS from single-target rotations, but this nerf did not do that.

Exactly this! But as it is now, OS has been removed from my quick bar since all it's good for right now is taking up precious quick bar space that could be used better with abilities that actually still work.

[ivanhedgehog]

My goodness, HEALER 'DPS' is cut in half? You mean to tell me that characters specced for HEALING are having trouble DEALING DAMAGE?

 

My word, stop the presses, alert the media, GET THE PRESIDENT ON THE PHONE.

 

OS was never meant to be an 'I win' button, even for healer-specced characters. If you're a healer and you don't have a tank/DPS companion geared enough to deal with mobs in the open world, then you're doing something wrong.

when they make dailies that are based on healing targets you will be correct...until then, no

[robertthebard]

So while OS is doing damage, you can't do anything else?

 

Yeah, I just tap into my vast array of other "end game" skills, otherwise known as xxx grenade, that I get around lvl 4... After all, at 50, finishing up my GS's story, Flyby wouldn't even kill a small group of regular enemies as efficiently as my grenades did. Before the "just use the grenades" that inevitably follows, I did just that.

 

However, when they decide that all the end game AoEs on other classes are too OP to leave alone, I guess I can come back and point and laugh at those players, right?

[Sorei]

However, when they decide that all the end game AoEs on other classes are too OP to leave alone, I guess I can come back and point and laugh at those players, right?

 

Sadly, the other classes with good AOEs get those a lot earlier than Agents do... at level 10 for Bounty Hunters and a bit above level 30 for Sorcs...

 

I imagine if Death from Above got nerfed to this extend I would laugh at some players who claimed it was fine, but I don't want this to happen because I play all classes. I'd just end up even more frustrated about poor "balance" decisions.