So tired of people who don't know how to price things on the GTN

[PlasmaJohn]

I've stepped out of markets before because people were pricing themselves to the floor, and I didn't like the profit margins. I moved on and looked for another market that was more favorable. Magenta crystals I stepped away from selling for a long time because there were too many sellers. I've only recently started selling some again since I've seen less people listing them.

Heh... talk about a market that's so not worth the effort. Making my first two or three was cool the first time but holy heck, those just don't move.

[Grayseven]

Players get to determine what price they want to sell an item at. If in your opinion that price is too low, you can buy it and resell it at the price you think it should be, but you have no right to tell someone else what the value of an item they own should be.

 

I have a few items that I sell on a regular basis. Regardless of what others are selling those items at, I have set prices that I will list those items at, even if my prices are thousands of credits higher than what other players are posting at.

 

Guess what? My items still sell. Oh, it might take a day or two, but eventually my items sell at the price I've determined is of fair value for the time and cost I've put into the items. If they don't sell, I just re-list them because eventually I will get my price for those items.

 

I could play the undercut game, but why bother when I know I will get my price eventually. I'll take the trade off of more credits in the future than less credits right now, but I will never deride someone for going for the quick credits considering I can and will buy up ridiculously low prices and resell at my higher price.

[PlasmaJohn]

I especially love, though, the people who post Bio-Mechanical Interface Chips for 100 credits per unit. Straight to the vendor, baby!

Yes! Keeping the GTN tidy for fun and profit.

[Ifolad]

I don't sell anything on GTN. Generally, I craft for me and my guild, and destroy cartel equipment that neither of those want. If that stuff could be sold to NPCs for, say, 1 credit, I'd do that instead.

 

+1 /5chars

[Defecter]

I don't mind. Bought 2 lvl 10 +41 power Hawkeye crystals for less then 100k and resold them the same day for ~500k a pop.

 

<3 stupid and lazy people when it comes to the GTN. Saves me the trouble of buying stuff off the CM. In a sense, they're basically paying me real money by being like that.

[ViciousFett]

To the OP:

 

If you're trying to unload things as soon as the items become unbound you're just as stupid as all the other people you're criticizing. It's simple economics, supply and demand. I generally don't spend much on cc packs, but I always buy up cheap items idiots like you sell on the first week, then sell them months later for upwards of ten times what I payed.

[Bethmora]

I do undercut with my cybertech items as long as I'm still making profit. There are many crafted items that will sell for less then the mats used. At that time I just don't list things until they are off the GTN. I have also bought items and resold them for a lot more, so that shows some people have no idea how to price stuff.

[CommanderKeeva]

Most of these posts only consider the seller's perspectives. Looking at it from the buyers' viewpoint, it's actually really good that sellers undercut each other so much in the first few hours, because we have a chance to buy most of the stuff we need at relatively low prices. For example, I was able to purchase pretty much everything I wanted from thew new pack (including all emotes, pets, toys and speeders) for a total of 8 million credits. Considering that I make roughly around 1 million a day from crafting and doing daily quests, it's about a week's revenue lost, quickly recovered by the time the next pack hits the CM.

 

I never buy cartel packs, I use my cartel coins to unlock the underpriced items I buy in the first few hours. May this trend continue forever because these people are saving me real money.

Edited January 17, 2014 by CommanderKeeva

[MillionsKNives]

Price has no bearing on the supply/demand ratio. The only time anything is getting snapped up "because its price is low" is when its price is so far below market value that market players are willing to speculate on it.

 

When someone wants an item, they will go to the GTN and pay the price for the item. If there are items on the GTN, it doesn't mean they're over-priced. It means that nobody wants one just yet.

 

You can see this over and over and over again. I do with Advanced * Augment 28's. I watch people post them as low as 110k. Then I wait. Then all of a sudden, every once in a while, there aren't any posted and I post mine for 207k. More often than not, mine sell.

 

I'm not entirely sure what that has to do with me or what I said.

 

You so obviously missed the point of my post.

 

Yesterday I went to the GTN and saw WidgetX posted for 110k. By your theory, that means that since it's sitting there on GTN, it's worth less than 110k.

 

But today I went to GTN and saw no WIdgetX's posted, so I posted 3 for 207k. They sold within 2 hours.

 

Well, what does that mean? Certainly the assumption that they're worth less than 110k doesn't hold up, does it? They're clearly worth 207k or more.

 

Sure, affordability is a factor. But not for the vast majority of things on the market.

 

For the vast majority of things on the market, it's about being the lowest available price at the time that someone wants to buy. You can be lowest by 1 credit or 10,000 credits or 50,000 credits. But in all cases but 1 credit, you're leaving credits laying on the table.

 

I have to disagree here. An item is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. There is a ratio of cost to the amount of people that are willing to buy it. If you had instead put that augment up for 2 million, what do you think the chances are of someone buying? How about 500k? Maybe you'll find a buyer, but how many would you sell at that price. Would you sell (and make more profit) if you lowered the price? If people don't think it's worth what you're listing it for then they will not buy it. Therefore it's possible to make more money buy selling more items at lower prices than selling one item at a ridiculous price.

 

In my own experience, at one point I was selling my magenta crystals at around 500k a piece, but only rarely sold any even though I was the only one selling. Through competition I ended up bringing my price down to 100k and I was moving enough that I had to spend a good amount of time farming mats just to keep up. In a few months I had made around 20 million on those alone, significantly more than the few million I had made otherwise. So which is it worth 500k, or 100k? I've sold some at 500k so some people think it's worth that much, but I've sold even more at 100k.

 

For myself as a buyer, I don't purchase items unless I think the item justifies the price. Just because an item is listed for 100k, and others buy it at 100k that doesn't mean that I am willing to. If it doesn't reach my price point then I don't buy it. I will most certainly "snap it up" if it reaches my price and I know that it won't last, even if I don't plan on selling it.

[TheSupaCoopa]

Duran'del here:

 

The reason the prices are so low/high is because this stuff is new. Any time a new Cartel Pack comes out, people will price it for absurd prices. It all eventually evens out, though.

[DarthTHC]

I'm not entirely sure what that has to do with me or what I said.

 

I have to disagree here. An item is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. There is a ratio of cost to the amount of people that are willing to buy it. If you had instead put that augment up for 2 million, what do you think the chances are of someone buying? How about 500k? Maybe you'll find a buyer, but how many would you sell at that price. Would you sell (and make more profit) if you lowered the price? If people don't think it's worth what you're listing it for then they will not buy it. Therefore it's possible to make more money buy selling more items at lower prices than selling one item at a ridiculous price.

 

In my own experience, at one point I was selling my magenta crystals at around 500k a piece, but only rarely sold any even though I was the only one selling. Through competition I ended up bringing my price down to 100k and I was moving enough that I had to spend a good amount of time farming mats just to keep up. In a few months I had made around 20 million on those alone, significantly more than the few million I had made otherwise. So which is it worth 500k, or 100k? I've sold some at 500k so some people think it's worth that much, but I've sold even more at 100k.

 

For myself as a buyer, I don't purchase items unless I think the item justifies the price. Just because an item is listed for 100k, and others buy it at 100k that doesn't mean that I am willing to. If it doesn't reach my price point then I don't buy it. I will most certainly "snap it up" if it reaches my price and I know that it won't last, even if I don't plan on selling it.

 

Your 2 million & 500k price points are hypothetical and irrelevant and you still missed the point.

 

Yesterday they were on GTN for 110k. Might have sold, might not have, I don't know because they weren't mine.

 

Today I put mine on GTN for 207k and sold out quickly.

 

I don't care if you will buy at my price. I only care that enough people will buy at my price that I have to keep making items about as quickly as I mission up the raw materials.

 

What I find interesting, though, is that with a market obviously willing to pay twice as much for things as they are often posted for, why people post so low and undercut so dramatically. It's like they want to put credits into my account instead of theirs.

[MillionsKNives]

Your 2 million & 500k price points are hypothetical and irrelevant and you still missed the point.

 

Yesterday they were on GTN for 110k. Might have sold, might not have, I don't know because they weren't mine.

 

Today I put mine on GTN for 207k and sold out quickly.

 

I don't care if you will buy at my price. I only care that enough people will buy at my price that I have to keep making items about as quickly as I mission up the raw materials.

 

What I find interesting, though, is that with a market obviously willing to pay twice as much for things as they are often posted for, why people post so low and undercut so dramatically. It's like they want to put credits into my account instead of theirs.

 

And how about the non-hypothetical prices?

 

You asserted that price has no bearing, if they want it they buy it. Me and the other poster said otherwise for ourselves. I've also given my own example both hypothetical and real of the difference price makes on sales.

 

In your situation price did not have a (visible) bearing on sales, but that doesn't mean that no such interaction exists. One point does not a line make. In your example it's possible that the market was under priced, which could be due to a number of factors: too much supply, change in demand, bad guesses, price momentum (i.e., "it's always that price"), etc. In that case your theory mostly holds. However there is the other end of the spectrum where you over price your goods, where you can drive out potential sales by pricing too high.

[Knorlac]

Duran'del here:

 

The reason the prices are so low/high is because this stuff is new. Any time a new Cartel Pack comes out, people will price it for absurd prices. It all eventually evens out, though.

 

Sure it evens out eventually, but I still have to question some people...

 

I was selling the new dogfighter packs for 750.000 which I know is pretty steep, but there was no competition atm and people started buying them. Then some guy comes around and undercuts me, which is fine as it always happens eventually, but instead of setting the price just below mine, he prized the packs at 360.000 when they were going for over 700.000 just moments before that.

 

I'd not even complain if it was about crafted or looted stuff, but the packs were obviously bought with real currency and I'd think that people wanted to get the most out of their RM investments. Some seem to be too rich to care or something...

[RaptorClown]

 

I was selling the new dogfighter packs for 750.000 which I know is pretty steep, but there was no competition atm and people started buying them. Then some guy comes around and undercuts me, which is fine as it always happens eventually, but instead of setting the price just below mine, he prized the packs at 360.000 when they were going for over 700.000 just moments before that.

:

 

yeah thats annoying lol. but eventually ull have your time again

[HelinCarnate]

Also there seems to be a trend in people thinking that if you have 50 of something, you should be able to charge 2 or 3 times as much per item than if you were selling 2. Their stuff sits there for days and then gets relisted when the sale expires. I really wish there was a consequence for that type of idiocy like 10% of the listed price if no one buys it as a "restocking fee"

[TominatorBriss]

In the last 2 weeks i made over 10 mill profit just from buying cheap mounts, gear and packs

 

i give you 1 example: someone was selling a morlinger Raptor for 1.5 mill i brought it and sold it for 4.5 mill another example was alot of people were selling cartel packs for 200k - 250k so i brought alot and resold them and 390k each i made over 2 mill profit on those packs alone.

 

By the time i was done doing this tatic i made over 10 mill then brought a cheap hypercrate at 5 mill with still over 5 mill left to spair on what ever I fancied.

 

I then sold 10 of those packs and made 4 mill so really i only payed 1 mill for 14 cartel packs

 

My advice to those people selling cheap items is this:

 

1) if people are going to list stuff on the GTN so high, do the same dont justsell it cheap

2) all the time people list stuff so cheap you are giving me and others a time of our life getting rich - im not complaining but come on guys use your heads.

 

Also id like to ask this question - does anyone Remember the days top mounts and gear used to be under 3 mill???

 

dont know about anyone else but the fun of bargan hunting has gone out of the window some mounts and gear are now 7 -10 mill when its clearly chaper just to buy that many cartel packs off the GTN to get the item you want plus a few goodies to either sell or keep.

 

However i do think it would be a good idea for bioware to change the top pricing of the GTN for a max of 4 mill otherwise they may aswell just hand out the wealthy title.

Edited January 18, 2014 by TominatorBriss

[Omisri]

I've been burned and learned my lesson from undercutting an under-cutter. Half asleep i thought i was taking my own down from being listed where in fact i ended up buying the other persons... an item that cost over 4 mill ><

 

Never again

[zachass]

What's really amusing are the people who complain about items being way overpriced, but buying and reselling the über-cheap listings...

[AlexDougherty]

I've been burned and learned my lesson from undercutting an under-cutter. Half asleep i thought i was taking my own down from being listed where in fact i ended up buying the other persons... an item that cost over 4 mill ><

 

Never again

 

Not sure that's a less about undercutting, more like paying attention or not doing stuff while asleep.

[OddballEasyEight]

Not sure that's a less about undercutting, more like paying attention or not doing stuff while asleep.

 

Yup.

My general rule is to never do anything that could potentially be important when you are tired (unless you have to).

Things such as deleting files on the computer, emptying the trashcan on the computer, buying or selling things on the GTN, deleting or creating a character in the game and things like that.

 

I lost an entire chapter in one of my storyline videos because of that.

For some reason I had gotten it in my head that I had uploaded the tattooine storyline for Calhoone (a trooper) to youtube, but I hadn't.

Deleted the file, didn't notice until a week later and the file was too corrupted to restore.

 

Never ever do anything important if you are tired unless you can't avoid it.

[Tsillah]

I know that undercutting is part of MMO's, I've been playing them in one form or another for the past 6 years. That being said, TOR has to be one of the worse that I've ever played in terms of how dumb people are when it comes to economics. Take for example the release of a new cartel pack, like the Dogfighter/Wingman one. As soon as the packs unbind, everyone just spams the GTN as fast as they can to unload these products. In doing that, the gap between the lowest price and the highest price for a single item is absolutely comical. People spam refresh on a page to see if they have been undercut, and they in turn undercut, and round and round we go until a mount drops from 750k to 40k in the span of a couple hours. People may say " well the market balances out and items get sold for what they're truly worth ", but that's not really true most of the time. On my server, there are currently only about 9 tauntauns(the new one), and they started out this morning at 7 million, they're now being sold for 1.5 million. That's not really a fair price for an item that is quite rare. I opened up 4 hypercrates worth of packs, and only got one tauntaun, wouldn't you say that is rare? I am not entirely being selfish here, I am just stating that in general people need to slow down and price things properly. You end up screwing yourself over by undercutting so much that there's no point in even putting the item up for auction.

 

I ended up keeping a lot of my new merchandise in my cargoholds until things calm down and the market is less flooded with everyone dumping loot as fast as they can for as little profit as possible. Things do even out a bit with time, with less people buying the packs in the weeks to come. So please people, just think before you spam the GTN, it will help you in the long run.

 

You are so wrong about this, it's actually amazing. I don't even know where to begin.

 

1) Let's see...ok, you bought 4 hypercrates and you got 1 taun taun. But then someone else might've opened 5 packs and gotten 2 taun tauns. So your personal experience with RNG doesn't make a template for rarity. That's point one.

 

2) Rarity in a pack by itself doesn't make the item rare on the GTN. Aside from people throwing their stuff on the GTN right away, the demand is part of the rarity of an item. If nobody wanted the taun taun or isn't willing to pay lots of credits for it, the demand goes down as well as the price. Also as more people buy more cartel packs the amount of items that flood the GTN compared to the creds people has goes up,meaning that people have fewer credits to spend per cartel item. You may think that a taun taun is worth for example 6 million because of your perceived rarity but that this only the supply side as you perceive it. You have no idea how many crates/packs are bought and how many items the RNG has yielded and you completely forget about the demand. So you don't actually know how rare something is in an economic sense. That's point two.

 

3) People have different agenda's. Your agenda is to maximise your profit. Others may see cartel packs as a way to quickly make some cash. They don't particularly care about determining a value for it but rather just want to sell stuff to have some creds. People are emotional. You are asking people to not act like themselves. That's just not going to happen. So this is a variable that you must consider instead of senselessly fighting against it. It's easier to change the behaviour of one person than lots of people. You are that one person. It's easier and much more realistic if you adjust your methods. Just think of the creds you would've had if you'd sold those 4 crates as crates or individual packs. So you should change. The rest of the world won't. And that is point three.

 

4) And finally, you think that if everybody does like you do that things will be better. Well in the economy people make the most money when they do what others don't. Not everybody can be a millionaire. It's an economical reality that if you want to have great riches, there are many more people that won't because you have it. Why do you think that 1% of the world population holds over 40% of the world's riches and a billion people are suffering from hunger?

 

Really, you are just upset because people aren't allowing you to make your millions because they have different goals or ways of doing something. If they all waited a month like you...they would all post their stuff on the GTN in a month. What would happen is that the items would be unavailable in the mean time and therefore people might buy more packs because they have to wait for you because they cannot actually afford those expensive items with credits so they resort to real life cash. Therefore BW makes more and by the time you post your stuff nobody needs it anymore.

 

If anything, just remember this. It doesn't matter how rare something actually is if no one wants it or if no one is willing or able to pay your price.

Edited January 18, 2014 by Tsillah

[Rafaman]

I've been burned and learned my lesson from undercutting an under-cutter. Half asleep i thought i was taking my own down from being listed where in fact i ended up buying the other persons... an item that cost over 4 mill ><

 

Never again

 

Heh. I've done worse. After a long night of raiding, I decided to quickly post some stuff before I turned in to make sure I get the most creds given the demand. I knew if I waited a day the prices would bottom out and I wouldn't make as much as I could. I had one particularly rare piece of armor that I could get 500k for easily. (You know what is coming right?) So... in my tired stooper I posted and then went to bed.

 

The next day, I logged in to find tons of mail waiting. Always nice that the cred machine was working away over night. Yet, I felt that the cred output was low this time after collecting my earnings. So after checking some of the mails I realized that I listed my big cred armor for 500. 500 creds.... Lol! I didn't laugh about it then I assure you. And now, I don't post anything unless I'm wide awake and stimmed up with coffee.

[Tachenko_Yuri]

I opened up 4 hypercrates worth of packs, and only got one tauntaun, wouldn't you say that is rare? I am not entirely being selfish here, I am just stating that in general people need to slow down and price things properly. You end up screwing yourself over by undercutting so much that there's no point in even putting the item up for auction.

 

 

Overlooking the 4 hypercrates bit ( I'd talk to someone about this if I were u ), not sure if this is a case " special snowflake syndrome", "waa waa didn't get ( enough ) of the toys I wanted from the rng bag ", or just waa waa about not being able to sell his taun for the price YOU see fit.Sorry, the market isn't yours, mine or anyone else's, it's the community's. Since folks are screwing themselves as you're saying, why are you bothering? They buy the undercut tauns and remove them from the market, and once the undercut tauns are gone, just put yours, they don't expire or anything.

Edited January 18, 2014 by Tachenko_Yuri

[Storm-Cutter]

Every time a new pack comes out, people dump unwanted mats on the GTN. I hoover them up, bide my time (Or craft with them) then sell on when the price stabilises. -This has funded my stable of characters to the best part of 50-million, and I'm not even very serious about crafting or buying/selling. With 50-million I can buy almost anything I want....

 

Crafting isn't dead, you have to be canny. If mats are too cheap, buy it and re-list, or craft something people want.

I undercut mercilessly, but If someone is selling under cost to make, I buy their stuff and re-list, or wait.

 

If I could organise my guild, we could make a cartel, then you'd be buying basic mats for 500 times the price....Be thankful they're too lazy / not interested in making oodles of cash...

[Rafaman]

Yup^^.

 

And as has been said, this happens in RL to be honest. People that find good sources of goods resell and make a bundle. It is what it is. If under cutters want to get out of the market, let them. Lol. Let the price wars continue, just don't jump in too late or wait until things calm down and make a bundle.

Edited January 18, 2014 by Rafaman