Hacking

[Squatdog_nz]

Speed is the one thing that is so noticable in GSF.

 

Ships that never seem to to run out of engine power , zipping all over the map ,yes there are crew abilities and power ups, but then not every ship can everything at once can it......

 

Bklaclbolt/Novadive with Booster Recharge.

[Squatdog_nz]

Just got this result 10 minutes ago playing as Sting:

 

http://s3.photobucket.com/user/Squatdog/media/swtorgfsrape_zpszp7dquyn.jpg.html

 

I'm a terribad failscrub!

Edited March 8, 2015 by Squatdog_nz

[Buggleslor]

Just got this result 10 minutes ago playing as Sting:

 

http://s3.photobucket.com/user/Squatdog/media/swtorgfsrape_zpszp7dquyn.jpg.html

 

I'm a terribad failscrub!

 

Congrats, you can farm food to scrape out some kills in a drastic loss. Ten whole kills for five deaths. Wowee. Truly, your amazing skill is so great as to bend the very fabric of reality and change the fundamental rules of accuracy and evasion that this game mode is built on. Probably the only possible way someone could overcome your blinding greatness is by hacking.

 

You're getting all caught up on the talk about ranges because Ramalina (misguidedly) wanted to help you be better rather than simply calling you a moron for thinking the only way you could lose was hacks. You've consistently been ignoring the fact that you have 0% buffs to accuracy and a well-geared opponent will have up to +30% (plus, in effect, an extra 5% from the dispel effect). You complain your DF "didn't have an effect" despite the widespread availability and use of these abilities that completely negate it. All the while, you've been consistently neglecting the fact that you are not using any of them, making their DF extremely effective.

 

Once again. With feeling. Your chances to hit another sting if they have DF on and you don't have any accuracy buffs are TINY. Another sting's chances to hit you if you have DF and they have TT/wingman are SIGNIFICANT. The difference between "my shields are gone and my hull is hurt and his shields are barely hurt" can literally be caused by him landing two shots and you landing one (again, sting shields are 1400 or less, which is less than two BLC shots). That's ENTIRELY CONSISTENT with a 35% difference in hit rate, and that's assuming you're landing every shot--which, given the fact that you posted the linked screenshot as an attempt to brag, is unlikely. On top of all of that, you ***** over and over about how 3 games is this impossibly huge sample size when we're talking about maybe 30 BLC shots total between you. Flip a coin 30 times and see if it's exactly 50/50--make sure you go crying about HACKS after you find that it isn't. Given that the "coin" in your games could have been weighted by up to a third... and there's literally nothing noteworthy about your experience.

 

Even when it is 50/50, I've found in my long experience in jousting other well-built, high-skill sting/flashfire pilots that, given that we both have DF up and accuracy buffs, any of the following outcomes can easily happen: I kill them but take no damage, they kill me but take no damage, we both make it out with no shields and heavy damage, we both survive unscathed. All have happened to me, sometimes 2-3 in a row. Since you're talking about two ships that will die in 4 hits for sure, 3 hits probably and are exchanging hits that have a low chance to connect, the results are extremely variable... and that's without the heavy weighting that your build provides.

 

Once again, this wasn't begun to put your build on trial (even though it's bad). It wasn't even done to put your MAD L33T SKILLZ on trial (even though they're nothing to to write home about). It was to point out that the things you observed are 100% clearly explicable using (what should be) completely common game knowledge, and (as with 99% of posts in "omg hax" threads) do not provide any convincing evidence of the existence of hacks.

 

In that vein, at the end of the day, we have two options for explaining that you were gibbed.

 

1) Your opponent used the components well-known for making it possible to insta-gib other stings and extremely common in builds as a result

 

2) Your opponent has discovered a way to fudge numbers that, to all appearances (due to observable latency issues) are calculated serverside. They did this using some kind of advanced hacking that you have no other evidence of whatsoever.

 

You can post as many screenshots of you getting trashed as you want, but at the end of the day the second will remain an incredible amount less likely than the first.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Buggleslor

[Squatdog_nz]

Congrats, you can farm food on the most OP ship in the game and scrape out some kills in a drastic loss. Ten whole kills for five deaths.

 

LOL...top damage and kills in a truely Godawful PUG, using a close-tange brawler Scout in a match type dominated by sniper Gunships and Bombers

 

If that's not good enough for you, here's another match from 10 minutes ago. This time I'll leave on the timestamp:

 

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/Squatdog/swtorgsf222_zpswomey2ut.jpg~original

 

You're getting all caught up on the talk about ranges because Ramalina (misguidedly) wanted to help you be better rather than simply calling you a moron for thinking the only way you could lose was hacks. You've consistently been ignoring the fact that you have 0% buffs to accuracy and a well-geared opponent will have up to +30% (plus, in effect, an extra 5% from the dispel effect).

 

Once again, your passive-aggressive diatribe presumes that I'm only firing one shot from extreme range, instead of using my 33% RoF bonus to fire multiple volleys in the narrow firing window.

[Buggleslor]

LOL...top damage and kills in a truely Godawful PUG, using a close-tange brawler Scout in a match type dominated by sniper Gunships and Bombers

 

If that's not good enough for you, here's another match from 10 minutes ago. This time I'll leave on the timestamp:

 

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/Squatdog/swtorgsf222_zpswomey2ut.jpg~original

 

OOOooooh so you can farm foodships in stomps FOR your team as well. Awesome, grand, surely you can never be wrong about basic math.

 

Once again, your passive-aggressive diatribe presumes that I'm only firing one shot from extreme range, instead of using my 33% RoF bonus to fire multiple volleys in the narrow firing window.

 

Ok, please explain to me how a 35% difference in hit rate (from TT and wingman, two abilities that any non-terribad sting interested in fighting other scouts runs--come to think of it, they could also have been running RI, which would still add up to a 30% difference total since they'd have 15 extra evasion) that is constant over all ranges (since you're approaching each other, you'll obviously have equal range bonuses at any given time) has no impact on the relative amounts you're likely to get hit.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Buggleslor

[Squatdog_nz]

OOOooooh so you can farm foodships in stomps FOR your team as well. Awesome, grand, surely you can never be wrong about basic math.

 

 

 

Ok, please explain to me how a 35% difference in hit rate (from TT and wingman, two abilities that any non-terribad sting interested in fighting other scouts runs) that is constant over all ranges (since you're approaching each other, you'll obviously have equal range bonuses at any given time) has no impact on the relative amounts you're likely to get hit.

 

Because a whole 35% extra chance to hit isn't the difference between insta-gibbing someone nearly every single time...while they can't drop your shields, even with RoF a third higher and greater raw damage output.

[Buggleslor]

Because a whole 35% extra chance to hit isn't the difference between insta-gibbing someone nearly every single time...while they can't drop your shields, even with RoF a third higher and greater raw damage output.

 

Did you bother to read the rest of my "passive-aggressive diatribe"? I don't know how much you've flown sting-on-sting, but every sting joust ends either with insta-gib or no damage. It's expected. We're talking about 3-4 shots. Max. "Raw damage output" means jack **** when you're unlikely to hit more than one of them. The difference between "shield damage" and "shields gone, hull damage" is one hit vs two. The difference between two hits out of three and one hit out of three is... 33%. Oh. OK, so your RoF gives you four chances, an extra 33% of shots. You have 0 additional accuracy, though, and you're up against a sting with DF that has 33% evasion naturally and popped DF for an additional 18%. Your extra shot is a coin flip, while theirs were 4/5. If they had RI instead of TT, then we're comparing you having 20% chance of hitting vs them having 60%. It's still pretty grim for you... and that's even assuming that the times work out perfectly for you to get the extra shot, or if the improved rate of fire just means you can fire again after you pass them sooner than they can.

 

Yeah, if you connected with your raw damage, they would be dead. Except realistically, even with the additional damage from BO, it's not jacked up enough to be a two-shot, you still need to land 3. If you land three, BO or not, they're dead. If you land two, BO or not, they're getting out. The extra damage is effectively useless, the only utility from it with BLCs is getting an extra miss in before you fly past. Sure, yeah, great, you do more damage vs a turret or a bomber who doesn't know how to evade. BO is not ideal vs high evasion targets.

 

Add this to the fact that you're talking about "nearly every single time" over a tiny, tiny sample size. Find a coin and flip it three times. If it's head 3 times in a row (an outcome which has a 1/8 chance of happening), is it hacks? If the RNG had been a tiny bit kinder to you that day you would never have posted here.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Buggleslor

[zaskar]

Come fly on Bastion or Pot5, like on the 14th of March, Pot5 has a STOCK night. Please.

[Squatdog_nz]

Did you bother to read the rest of my "passive-aggressive diatribe"? I don't know how much you've flown sting-on-sting, but every sting joust ends either with insta-gib or no damage. It's expected. We're talking about 3-4 shots.

 

I've played literally hundreds of matches with Blackbolt/Novadive/Sting/Flashfire and it is VERY, VERY rare that I've been insta-gibbed without the aid of power-ups.

 

The fact that this one guy somehow managed to do it 7-8 times in a row over the course of three matches struck me as somewhat odd.

 

Add this to the fact that you're talking about "nearly every single time" over a tiny, tiny sample size. Find a coin and flip it three times. If it's head 3 times in a row (an outcome which has a 1/8 chance of happening), is it hacks? If the RNG had been a tiny bit kinder to you that day you would never have posted here.

 

Once again, it was 7-8 times in a row over the course of three games.

 

What are the odds of flipping a coin and getting heads eight times in a row?

[Ramalina]

O.k. Things that I am sure of in this exchange.

 

Buggleslor could stand to be a lot more civil in the tone of posts. I could have too in some sections.

 

Squatdog_nz does not understand math models of game mechanics well enough for them to be of use to him.

 

Squatdog_nz is also clearly a better than average pilot, so isn't going to suffer horribly in GSF even if their piloting or build isn't optimized.

 

I presented all the info needed to understand that there was no evidence of hacking, and on how to improve both piloting skill and build on a Sting. If Squatdog_nz doesn't feel like believing or using that info, there's really no harm done, and it's not worth getting upset about.

 

Besides, I personally endorse the, "fly what you have fun with and screw the meta," philosophy of playing GSF.

 

 

So we might as well leave it be at this point.

 

 

 

As long as people are having fun playing GSF it's all working (more or less) as intended, right?

 

 

P.S. Trying to help people understand the mechanics better so that they can become better pilots is never misguided. Sometimes it's ineffectual, but that's not the same thing as misguided.

 

P.P.S. The odds are 0.3906 % IF you only flip the coin 8 times. Flip more times than that and eventually with enough flips the odds will approach 100%. However, that does not resemble your scenario at all. You were rolling dice weighted to land on threes, and your opponent was rolling dice weighted to land on sixes. I gave you instructions on how to move the weights on your dice, but you seem to be doing o.k. as things are, so you don't have to worry about it if you don't want to.

[Drakkolich]

Come fly on Bastion or Pot5, like on the 14th of March, Pot5 has a STOCK night. Please.

 

Sekpanthers is on Bastion, I've fought him plenty of times.

[ALaggyGrunt]

The other thing is ping time. If you live basically right next to the server, your shots go when and where they're supposed to a lot better than someone living, say, halfway around the world, and you get your missile lock warnings a lot earlier. Less lagspiking, too.

[Sylvidre]

The only questionable thing I have seen (and I still don't dare to call it a hack) are people getting very convenient "lag" as soon as they get under fire, and then miraculously losing when the danger is over.

I agree, and unfortunately on my server I see it often now, that's a pity (but very fun in domination or when you play bomber because turrets and drones are immune to that "hack" )

 

I call it a "hack" because this is obviously done on purpose (it's not hard to see the difference between that kind of very convenient lag and "regular" lag)

[Matt_Comtois]

No cool down & fast lock on time, hmmmm...what could that be?

Let's look at my lowbie...

Cluster Missiles Lock on time = 1.3 sec. with a reload time of 2.8 seconds.

Nope, that can't be it. How about...

Rocket Pods Lockon time = 0 sec. & no reload time.

Bingo!

You are naive if you think there are no hacks. There is a lock on hack that allows .1 second lock on time and allows a player to lock on while abilities like power-dive are being used. Before you open your mouth and try and look superior with your limited knowledge about this subject. You want to see hacks look at ***********.com

[Verain]

You are naive if you think there are no hacks. There is a lock on hack that allows .1 second lock on time

 

Ah, the old "seeker mine" hack. Where you lay down a seeker mine, and it blasts your enemies all the way to the forums to think they are being hacked.

 

and allows a player to lock on while abilities like power-dive are being used.

 

So, I don't think the game is in some great sense unhackable- but I would be shocked if this was possible. The missile lock logic being run on server is actually one of the great weaknesses of missiles- to make this hack technically impossible is why we have to put up with centered enemies dropping locks- on server you lost them in the circle, even if you didn't on client.

 

Before you open your mouth and try and look superior with your limited knowledge about this subject. You want to see hacks look at

 

While posting links to exploit sites wouldn't be wise, it seems to have been caught by the filter. In any event, I'm fairly certain that whatever you are trying to talk about doesn't exist.

 

Again- IF THESE HACKS WERE REAL, WE'D SEE FOOTAGE OF THEM. Claiming to see stuff and that's as far as it goes? There's more evidence for UFOs than that.

 

SWTOR does store some stuff client side that it shouldn't, but it's clearly not the major stuff. Position sort of is stored client side, but there's also server side checks on that. There's a few claims I've been waiting to hear that would make my ears perk up, but I just don't hear them.

 

The stuff I do hear is always "I don't understand mechanics" or "even laggers will try to fly evasively when attacked".

 

 

 

Post a video of this stuff happening. Even if some guy DID figure it out, implement it, and logs on and exploits occasionally, no one here has run into that guy. That's my real point: it's not some technically inconceivable thing, it's that, if this was a problem, we'd have seen it, flown against it, heard people bragging about it, found videos of it happening to people... this thread here would be lousy with that stuff. No one is dying to hackers. Sheesh.

[Bolo_Yeung]

Posted it once already, yet still its hilarious.

- while lagging is pretty common, sometimes we can see

a 'super lag'...

Edited March 18, 2015 by Bolo_Yeung

[Happy_Puppy]

I have to ask..I'm new to GSF and maybe I do not know the weapon. But what missile only give one beep then gets fired. This happened to me over and over by the same person. I would only get 1 audio warning beep then missile was launched warning. Even when I used cluster missiles as some here had said it was never that fast. As far as I know rocket pods do not give a warning when fired. So what missile were they using that would give only 1 lock on warning beep before launch?

[Drakkolich]

I have to ask..I'm new to GSF and maybe I do not know the weapon. But what missile only give one beep then gets fired. This happened to me over and over by the same person. I would only get 1 audio warning beep then missile was launched warning. Even when I used cluster missiles as some here had said it was never that fast. As far as I know rocket pods do not give a warning when fired. So what missile were they using that would give only 1 lock on warning beep before launch?

 

Missile Drones and Seeker mines give no warning until they are in the air. Once fired you get the normal missile approaching tone, but these don't give off any "lockon" tones as all other missiles normally do.

[Happy_Puppy]

Missile Drones and Seeker mines give no warning until they are in the air. Once fired you get the normal missile approaching tone, but these don't give off any "lockon" tones as all other missiles normally do.

 

Ok but then you wouldn't hear the lock on tone right?

 

What was happening I would hear the tone that someone was locking on, it would beep or tone 1 time then get the missile launch warning. There were no defense turrets near by it was in a TDM match.

[Drakkolich]

Ok but then you wouldn't hear the lock on tone right?

 

What was happening I would hear the tone that someone was locking on, it would beep or tone 1 time then get the missile launch warning. There were no defense turrets near by it was in a TDM match.

 

Correct you would not hear a lock on tone from the Missile drone or Seeker mine. You could however hear the lock on tone from someone else locking a missile on you and then suddenly the Drone or Mine fires and it seems like that split lock on was a player targeting when it fact it wasn't. On top of that if said player was locking while that missile was in flight you might then have another split second lock on tone from that player as he finished his lock on.

 

To clarify I was not talking about Defense turrets at all, I was speaking of the Drones the Legion/Warcarrier drops that can fire Missiles.

[Happy_Puppy]

Correct you would not hear a lock on tone from the Missile drone or Seeker mine. You could however hear the lock on tone from someone else locking a missile on you and then suddenly the Drone or Mine fires and it seems like that split lock on was a player targeting when it fact it wasn't. On top of that if said player was locking while that missile was in flight you might then have another split second lock on tone from that player as he finished his lock on.

 

To clarify I was not talking about Defense turrets at all, I was speaking of the Drones the Legion/Warcarrier drops that can fire Missiles.

 

Oh I do not think any of them were near by.. If I recall it was myself on a scout and the other guy was in a scout or strike fighter. I know he came in really fast alone... at least the 1st time it happened. Then 2 other time's there were ships near by but they were like 10k out or so.

 

All I know is I wasn't getting the normal warning then a delay then launch warning. it was like right on top of each other it was warning tone, launch... sec later I was hit. I ended up trying to keep away from the guy by flying to the other side of the map.. I think he shot down 15 with like 60% acc.. way above anyone on my team. I was thinking how was I with basic ship ever going to level with that type of beat down. lol

[Ryuku-sama]

Oh I do not think any of them were near by.. If I recall it was myself on a scout and the other guy was in a scout or strike fighter. I know he came in really fast alone... at least the 1st time it happened. Then 2 other time's there were ships near by but they were like 10k out or so.

 

All I know is I wasn't getting the normal warning then a delay then launch warning. it was like right on top of each other it was warning tone, launch... sec later I was hit. I ended up trying to keep away from the guy by flying to the other side of the map.. I think he shot down 15 with like 60% acc.. way above anyone on my team. I was thinking how was I with basic ship ever going to level with that type of beat down. lol

 

That's just what cluster missiles in good hands look like. I once killed someone from beyond the grave with a split second cluster release... And about leveling. We all have been there, most of us have flown new ships a few times. You'll get there. Your KDR may not be as pretty as a ship maxed for the last 500 matches. But you'll get there.

[Amorianallund]

I love how someone necrod this thread with over a year in between posts and Bioware doesn't do anything about it.

 

Shows you how little they pay attention.

[Zharik]

I love how someone necrod this thread with over a year in between posts and Bioware doesn't do anything about it.

 

Doesn't do anything about what? You think that old threads should just get deleted after a certain amount of time? I find it funny that people with ***** when someone makes a new thread of a subject that has been hashed out before... but then will also ***** when someone "necros" a thread.

 

Not everyone has been here since day 1, and we *want* those new players to stay and enjoy themselves.. a healthy server population is a good thing for us all.

 

smh

[Imgawna]

I've seen scouts 1-shot fully upgraded ships through overcharged shields.

 

Repeatedly.

 

its mostly like not a "one-shot" but a battle scout with burst cannons and rocket pods in close can tear a gunship up quick. regardless of what shields they have

 

but too the original post mines and missle drones have instant lock ons. with the right person at offensive clusters have a super short lock on and reload. also the double missle strike fighter can shoot 1 missle and lock on with the next instantly. hope that helps

 

Fixentu / Idoth (pub) Imgawna (imp) shadowlands