Cherokeewill Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 This idea that seems hinted at by BW and expressly stated by trolls on this post that "they're Jedi and following the code" is nerf $#!T. As soon as Ashara or Jaesa join you they begin a killing spree of republic personnel that leaves no trace of doubt about their allegiance. Heck, Ashara helped me take out Jedi in her very first quest line with me. If these are the actions of persons trying to redeem me or of true patriots to the Republic then the Empire has already won. It's complete nonsense logically and only detracts from the immersion experience. They should either walk away at odd moments during combat or stop telling us how torn they are. They are Sith no matter how you choose to define it. Both are my toon's dark minions to do my bidding whether I choose to be a scalpel or a bulldozer on the battlefield or treat NPCs with dignity or contempt in conversation. The trolls can't have it both ways. They cannot say that the lack of interaction is because of some code that the has no consequence in the game and then hide behind consequences of decisions as the reason we should be ignored or belittled for our requests to break said code. In the end it comes down to a puerile notion of sex=bad? Why? This is a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. Original Sin hasn't been invented yet. Companion realignment, long conversation tree seduction, companion betrayal, jealousy and same sex relations must be a part of this universe as long as companions play such an integral role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kraeius Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 /signed I agree completely with OP. Logically, if normal Jedi players can romance, she could have do the same. Also as many others said, she leaves Jedi Order and now she is an apprentice of a Sith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaede Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 The romance options and general impact of decisions on companions is one area BW dropped the ball on the role play side of this game. Kudos to BW for the Companion system but no same sex relationships or really ability to romance who you want and be able to have slightly greater choice in which companions you keep is a little sad. I hate some of my companions on some of my toons yet I have to keep them even though RP wise I would probably space them (anyone who has played Republic and has C2-N2 knows what I mean here). /signed, make LS Jaesa romanceable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiar Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Am I the only one playing the dark side here for purposes playing on the dark side? While I understand the pretense of a light side Jaesa when you work up the light side - but your playing as Sith - if you want light side role a Jedi. I would think that dark side sith warriors couldn't care less about this, since they can already romance Dark jaesa. Also, not every sith wants to destroy everything. Half the time you get lightside points for taking the options that seem to fit into the story better. Here are some examples: Korriban- Low level quest where you decide the fate of three prisoneers. You get commended for taking the light option and letting the failed assassin live. Black Talon- Grand Moff Kilran commends you for taking the General alive, which you get light side points for doing so. Balmorra- When you spar the Jedi Investigator and get light-side points, Baras actually gives you props for your forward-thinking. He can now interigate her for more info. Nar Shadda- If you spare Lord Ratharri instead of killing him, he shows up at the end of your class questline to vouche for you in front of the Dark Council. Some people want to play a Jedi that isn't bound by the rules of keeping your emotions in check. Some people want to play a Sith who is loyal to the empire, but can see the advantage of treating people with respect to ensure their continued loyalty. To simple say "Go play a jedi if you want light side" is a bit narrow-minded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berronaxftw Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 IMHO Light-Side jaesa should be same-sex romance and dark-side shes straight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hakon Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I am very much in agreement the Jaena when Lightsided should have a romance option, many people are bypassing this by spamming flashpoints to go evil, pick her up as a dark girl, then going back light and ruining the story just in order to romance the girl. Bioware need to make a decision, will they implement a light side romance, and how will they do it, will they give people the opportuity to reset Jaena or will people need to re-roll their characters. People want to know, the sooner bioware can clarify weather or not you will need to re-roll your character if a patch with romancing becomes available the sooner people will stop debating this. So Bioware can you please tell us if Jaena will be able to be reset if her romance options change in the future, or if we need to pick light and dark now and hope you make a light romance later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leoroc Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Shame SWTOR didn't follow in DA2's footsteps and have Rivalry/Friendship instead of simply affection. Would make romances much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyliine Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I am very much in agreement the Jaena when Lightsided should have a romance option, many people are bypassing this by spamming flashpoints to go evil, pick her up as a dark girl, then going back light and ruining the story just in order to romance the girl. Bioware need to make a decision, will they implement a light side romance, and how will they do it, will they give people the opportuity to reset Jaena or will people need to re-roll their characters. People want to know, the sooner bioware can clarify weather or not you will need to re-roll your character if a patch with romancing becomes available the sooner people will stop debating this. So Bioware can you please tell us if Jaena will be able to be reset if her romance options change in the future, or if we need to pick light and dark now and hope you make a light romance later. They're not going to answer. This debate has been going on since beta, and still no response.... I like how they boast about listening to the players and all, but never actually give feedback to the players..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanmoryn Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 They're not going to answer. This debate has been going on since beta, and still no response.... I like how they boast about listening to the players and all, but never actually give feedback to the players..... Most likely it is way to difficult to re-write the content, bring in the voice actors, etc. Perhaps an expansion down the road will add more companions and they can address this - male SI's have it worse Lan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalsaDMA Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 IMHO Light-Side jaesa should be same-sex romance and dark-side shes straight ? That makes no sense. If anything, the dark side version should be more flamboyant than the lightside version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyliine Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Most likely it is way to difficult to re-write the content, bring in the voice actors, etc. Perhaps an expansion down the road will add more companions and they can address this - male SI's have it worse Lan It's actually not. VA are contracted to come back when they are needed like they where in DA and in ME. BW isnt the only game developer that contacts VA's like this. Remember the drama with the VA of Niko Bellec in GTAIV? They do this for the exact reason you made, expansions. Also, this is an MMO, that means pretty much a never ending game. Why would they contract VA's for only a certain amount of time if they had already planned to add to the stories? What happens to all the current companions and the voice or your char? Do they just disappear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akingza Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 So lame. I just finished this part of my class quest and i was thrilled to have Jaesa by my side and i was already anticipating making her my wife, but i wanted her to stay light even though im dark just to bring some balance lol. But then i found out i cant romance her i instantly lost interest in my character.. As stupid as this sounds 1 little thing can ruin everything. They should've at least added some kind of warning when choosing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TekaruPrime Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I'll sign. It's actually was really frustrating to discover that. After all the effort to get her, after story being focused on her. And nothing warns you about this outcome during your progress and there is no logic in that. Jedi or not -- it doesn't matter, jedi allowed to romance, to break their annoying codex. Besides, she's not a jedi anymore anyway. It's almost story breaker tbh, i'm not sure if i want to go on with sith warrior... prolly not. Not like Vette is not good or something, just it's very different story wise and it feels very different. Bleh. How disappointing and totally uncalled for. Only hope is that BW will fix it in some later patch. This sums up how I feel. /sign Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NasherUK Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) She is dark side and won't like you if you go light, pretty simple. Also light side sith are not really good guys. It just means you murder/torture less people. Edited February 4, 2012 by NasherUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiskyTimePanda Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Light side Jaesa should be a love interest. Dark side sith want light side lovin' too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiar Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Most likely it is way to difficult to re-write the content, bring in the voice actors, etc. Perhaps an expansion down the road will add more companions and they can address this - male SI's have it worse Lan I would settle for a new voice actor for Jaesa tbh... Her current voice actor makes me want to kick a puppy sometimes. Half the time, it sounds like she's reading from a q-card, and badly at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaGame Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 man you ppl are wierd, you want a game of the story and lore of star wars, and when their give it to you, you complain that you cant do what you want, even when what you want is against the lore? Pure lightside jedi dont do love, and that is what you turn Jeasa in to if you make her lightside. AS someone els said "You convince her to help you change the Empire to a just government from within." she is still jedi on a mission with at lightside sith to change the empire. Jedies dont gain lightside by romance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibmachine Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 man you ppl are wierd, you want a game of the story and lore of star wars, and when their give it to you, you complain that you cant do what you want, even when what you want is against the lore? Pure lightside jedi dont do love, and that is what you turn Jeasa in to if you make her lightside. AS someone els said "You convince her to help you change the Empire to a just government from within." she is still jedi on a mission with at lightside sith to change the empire. Jedies dont gain lightside by romance Except there is no talk about changing the Empire. When she joins you as LS she says that it's "your pure nature that gives power" or something along the lines of that. It's not until you talk to her on the ship that you learn that apparently you're on some big quest to take control of the empire and turn into more centralized republic. Not to mention that it doesn't make any sense that a Jedi joins a Sith as his apprentice. What's more, she sees that Jedi are hypocrites and yet she follows the code and is all goody goody. No sense at all tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belarrasus Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 Make this thread the: "Make Light Side Jaesa Willsaam Pragmatic" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlanon Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 One of the last things she said to me was that she's looking forward to raising children and hopes that I'll be around for it. That seemingly innocent one-liner has quite a bit of implication. She's finally beginning to let go of all the Jedi dogma and traditionalism that she'd been clinging to for much of the story. I think, at this point, LS Jaesa is more or less Neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalsaDMA Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 man you ppl are wierd, you want a game of the story and lore of star wars, and when their give it to you, you complain that you cant do what you want, even when what you want is against the lore? Pure lightside jedi dont do love, and that is what you turn Jeasa in to if you make her lightside. AS someone els said "You convince her to help you change the Empire to a just government from within." she is still jedi on a mission with at lightside sith to change the empire. Jedies dont gain lightside by romance I disagree. you are mistaking jedi teachings with light side teachings, they ar enot the same; just like sith teachings aren't dark side teachings. Otherwise darkside jedi and light side sith wouldn't have been possible inthe first place. The jedi in ToR abscorn emotions of any kind. Basicly they do this because they are afraid of acknowledging any emotion will leave a backdoor for the dark side to 'blackmail' into them. In this way, it's kind of ironic that jedi teachings suffer from fear in its indoctrination while trying to combat fear. There are nothing dark side about being in love, for example. It's how you respond to that love that defines it. As many people are weak when love is involved, the jedi tries to skirt around the issue by forbidding love altogether, rather than accept that any positive emotion can be used for something negative if abused. The sith, on the other hand, revel in their emotions. At the far ends of the spectrums you have the darkside sith that murders everyone because he can if the impulse strikes him, or the lightside that tries to do the best he can in making the world become an ultimately better placem including the ability to feel positive emotions. For a lightside sith, jedis would (in my opinion) look like a combination of emotionless robots, or plain hypocrites. Neither aspect being very positive, and having started up a jedi consular just to see that aspect of the story, it does seem to be enforced that the jedi in ToR are less concerned about positive results as they are about 'doing things the correct emotionless robotic way'. That having been said, I will state that I think it only natural for a lightside Sith to follow a line of reasoning that the empire needs to change. It only takes one glance at the kind of quests you are asked to perform all the time, as well as the persecution of light side followers by the top in the empire to realize that a lightside follower can't be happy with things as they are. After all, who in their right mind would be happy with being a persecuted person in their own 'home' ? I see the lightside Sith as being the 'true paragons' of the ToR world. They aim to do good and don't ignore or try to supress their positive emotions, and are accepting of all virtues in others, while maintaining a strong focus themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diresith Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) Salsa pretty much hit the nail on the head. There is a very good reason that the New Jedi Order (what Luke Skywalker founds for those of you not familiar with the EU) is fully ok with jedi getting married. Half the masters are married, including 2 married couples sitting on the council. Also correct me if I am wrong, but I had HEARD, heard being the key word, that the same sex relationships got the X cause it would have bumped the rating up to M. Edited February 6, 2012 by Diresith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kheldor Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I disagree. you are mistaking jedi teachings with light side teachings, they ar enot the same; just like sith teachings aren't dark side teachings. Otherwise darkside jedi and light side sith wouldn't have been possible inthe first place. The jedi in ToR abscorn emotions of any kind. Basicly they do this because they are afraid of acknowledging any emotion will leave a backdoor for the dark side to 'blackmail' into them. In this way, it's kind of ironic that jedi teachings suffer from fear in its indoctrination while trying to combat fear. There are nothing dark side about being in love, for example. It's how you respond to that love that defines it. As many people are weak when love is involved, the jedi tries to skirt around the issue by forbidding love altogether, rather than accept that any positive emotion can be used for something negative if abused. The sith, on the other hand, revel in their emotions. At the far ends of the spectrums you have the darkside sith that murders everyone because he can if the impulse strikes him, or the lightside that tries to do the best he can in making the world become an ultimately better placem including the ability to feel positive emotions. For a lightside sith, jedis would (in my opinion) look like a combination of emotionless robots, or plain hypocrites. Neither aspect being very positive, and having started up a jedi consular just to see that aspect of the story, it does seem to be enforced that the jedi in ToR are less concerned about positive results as they are about 'doing things the correct emotionless robotic way'. That having been said, I will state that I think it only natural for a lightside Sith to follow a line of reasoning that the empire needs to change. It only takes one glance at the kind of quests you are asked to perform all the time, as well as the persecution of light side followers by the top in the empire to realize that a lightside follower can't be happy with things as they are. After all, who in their right mind would be happy with being a persecuted person in their own 'home' ? I see the lightside Sith as being the 'true paragons' of the ToR world. They aim to do good and don't ignore or try to supress their positive emotions, and are accepting of all virtues in others, while maintaining a strong focus themselves. Outstanding post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiar Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Come to the dark side... we have sexual encounters with Jaesa... lol. lmao, best comment yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctified Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 (edited) I disagree. you are mistaking jedi teachings with light side teachings, they ar enot the same; just like sith teachings aren't dark side teachings. Otherwise darkside jedi and light side sith wouldn't have been possible inthe first place. Sith teachings were created by Dark jedi. Sith teachings are inherently dark sided. The vast majority of Sith who have embraced the teachings of their order have gone to the dark side. The only notable Sith Lord introduced in the game to have embraced the light has been dead for over a thousand years, is entombed in the dark temple, and has a collection of teachings so radically different from what the Sith learn, that it has been labled (and I quote): "Heresy." Dark Sided Jedi do not follow Jedi teachings. At all. A Dark Jedi is a person who used to be a Jedi Knight, and has become something else entirely. The term 'Dark Jedi' is for ease of labeling that lets us immediately identify what something is. "He's a Dark Jedi. He used to be a Jedi, be he went to the Dark Side. He's bad news." A Dark Jedi character in TOR is pretending to still be loyal to the order while bidding his time and waiting for an opportunity to seize power. The jedi in ToR abscorn emotions of any kind. Basicly they do this because they are afraid of acknowledging any emotion will leave a backdoor for the dark side to 'blackmail' into them. In this way, it's kind of ironic that jedi teachings suffer from fear in its indoctrination while trying to combat fear. Jedi do not scorn emotion. Their training is designed to control how they react to their emotions. The whole point is to keep from going overboard and making mistakes that can prove harmful to other people, not because they are scared to feel. A sith feels anger and then destroys what caused him to be angry. A Jedi feels anger, but refuses to let it affect his behavior, and moves on. In time, he'll transcend anger itself through training, and won't have to bother controlling his reaction because the anger itself won't be there to upset him or disturb his balance. There are nothing dark side about being in love, for example. It's how you respond to that love that defines it. As many people are weak when love is involved, the jedi tries to skirt around the issue by forbidding love altogether, rather than accept that any positive emotion can be used for something negative if abused. Again, for the Jedi it's about controlling their reaction to emotion, not about avoiding it altogether. Jedi are people. People feel love. Love is not negative in and of itself, but it leads inevitably to attachment. Jedi should not have attachments because a desire to have something leads to a fear of losing it. The more attached you are, the greater your fear. The greater your fear, the greater your chances of overreacting. The greater your overreaction, the more likely you go to the Dark Side. The sith, on the other hand, revel in their emotions. At the far ends of the spectrums you have the darkside sith that murders everyone because he can if the impulse strikes him, or the lightside that tries to do the best he can in making the world become an ultimately better placem including the ability to feel positive emotions. Light side Sith have transcended the teachings of their order and no longer obey them, or follow Sith culture. A light sided Sith is trying to subvert the Empire and 'change it from within.' A light Jedi is ultimately loyal to the Jedi order, and the Republic. What is a Light sith loyal to? Not to his order, and not to his Government. He's a traitor, no getting around it. The only logical thing to do at this point is to stop calling yourself a Sith and move on. The game just doesn't allow for it. Yet. For a lightside sith, jedis would (in my opinion) look like a combination of emotionless robots, or plain hypocrites. Neither aspect being very positive, and having started up a jedi consular just to see that aspect of the story, it does seem to be enforced that the jedi in ToR are less concerned about positive results as they are about 'doing things the correct emotionless robotic way'. It's a cultural difference, simple as that. Jedi take the long-view in everything they do. I'm not sure where you find hypocrisy in their actions, because 'positive results' can be very subjective. The Jedi buzz word is 'balance.' Where helping and influencing one person doesn't lead to the detriment of others. The Jedi defend the twi'lek settlement from flesh raiders. That's good. Why not just wipe out the flesh raiders and be done with it? Because then there would be an imbalance caused by the act that would have repercussions no one could see. The Jedi want to keep things in harmony. Sith, on the other hand do not care about harmony. They do not care about balance. In fact, they support any kind of imbalance that leads to them being on top. It's one of the reasons why being a Sith is so much fun. That having been said, I will state that I think it only natural for a lightside Sith to follow a line of reasoning that the empire needs to change. It only takes one glance at the kind of quests you are asked to perform all the time, as well as the persecution of light side followers by the top in the empire to realize that a lightside follower can't be happy with things as they are. After all, who in their right mind would be happy with being a persecuted person in their own 'home' ? I see the lightside Sith as being the 'true paragons' of the ToR world. They aim to do good and don't ignore or try to supress their positive emotions, and are accepting of all virtues in others, while maintaining a strong focus themselves. Jedi don't suppress their feelings, they control them. Light side Sith actively work to destabilize their own government. You can't maintain a strong focus on yourself and remain accepting of all others. Being accepting of all others inherently means removing your very 'self' from the equation. Anyone who can do this is a Saint. Since none of us are Saints, It'd be much more accurate to say "They try not to be judgmental." Edited February 7, 2012 by sanctified Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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