MotorCityMan Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 (edited) If there was no gear grind, pvp would be a useless venture since commendations wouldn't do anything. Not everyone finds enjoyment in the sheer aspect of pvp, there needs to be a reason to do it. Without it, pvp probably wouldn't exist. Well except for the fact that lots of games like GW2 and LoL have no gear grind, and they have much larger pvp populations than SWTOR. So that kinda shoots that theory eh? Edited December 8, 2013 by MotorCityMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidichIorian Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 (edited) Well except for the fact that lots of games like GW2 and LoL have no gear grind, and they have much larger pvp populations than SWTOR. So that kinda shoots that theory eh?By using a game or franchse that suits your opinion you're able to twist that in any way you like. COD is for instance bigger than Halo ever was. The good Halos, 1-3, didnt have the perks and other progressional crap COD has and while they were popular they werent as popular as the most recent six or so COD games. Halo was clearly more competitive and basically the reason to why MLG exists today. Sum that up and it will come down to swtor being a worse game, period. I personally like the combat in swtor but the devs have obviously never seen its potential so few things have been done to keep exisiting players and attracting new ones. I don't for a second believe Arena attracted more new players then the amount of players they lost when they got rid of 8 vs 8 and/or declared that the "big PvP update" was Arena, which is manifested by how ranked Arena is more or less dead on all servers (give or take a handful teams on PvP servers) Few were those who promoted Arena in the swtor community and you would more or less never come across a "We want Arena" thread or the even more rare, a well recieved "We want Arena"-thread. So gear grind or not, swtor would still not be a contender because they, BW, havent taken care of the PvP aspect of their product. Edited December 8, 2013 by MidichIorian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brunner_Venda Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 It's amazing what I and everyone else will do in this game for a 5% edge in PVP. Without the Obroan grind, I would play a lot less, and probably stick around for fewer beatings just to grind out a daily. Fewer players, less PVP, more quitters, and longer queue times. This on top of the fact that without PVP gear, your top raiding PVE-tards would be the most powerful players in the game. All that for running garbage PVE operations. You might as well stab what's left of PVP in this game and kill it. I definitely wouldn't play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorojus Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 Why do you even play video games? or breath? im deadly serious here as well, what your saying is you spend your spare time and money on something you don't enjoy just to get a sense of superiority and accomplishment, i got news for you buddy, getting geared in video games is no accomplishment by anyone's standards in any context at all its not even a reward its just a hurdle, an inconvenience and i feel deeply sorry for you if that's what your life has been reduced to, i for one would like think the majority of players play PVP for the enjoyment of facing off against players and mastering their class over others. What you have just typed demonstrates that people are coming into PVP, waiting in line till their geared, and expecting to have their happy meal-free kill served to them. that's not PVP bro, that's grind vs grind your not even being rewarded with anything other than playing more OFTEN than others, you would think that actual personal experience would give enough advantage but i know that's living in dream world every time i see 55s with high valor rushing the far node on novara coast instead of attacking healers but that another gripe altogether. +1 I have never agreed more with someone on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzingFridge Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 If PvP is a "grind" for you, you shouldn't even be queuing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 I really don't get how you came to that conclusion. The "competitive" part of the community has had every chance to be competitive and it has failed due to the lacking population. You don't honestly think that people who can't endure 1 weeks worth of a gear grind all of a sudden would become super hardcord competitive and join the ranked scene? All that would happen is that: A. Less people would play, because the game isnt good enough to stand on its own. Or make that; the game doesnt have the content to keep you entertained for long. With 10 different 8 vs 8 warzones and a promise of more on the way it might have been a different story. B.A lot of the players who actually play a fair amount, myself included, would probably play less. I have , on several occassions, played an extra 1-2 games just to get a piece of gear when I, in a game with no gear, would have quit for the day. I was speaking from the root of the idea. No, I don't think actually enforcing it into the game would do any good right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feztonio Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 agree, its totally brainless to make us pvpers grind for this ****. just give pvp gear for free that is on par with stats of best pve gear + has the expertise bonus. leave the grinding to the roleplayers who actually enjoy it. plus don't forget how they design the game and classes to need to stack certain stats.. ie accuracy, power, surge, defense, etc... and then the gear you spend weeks and months grinding are intentionally designed and optimized to have terrible stats - all the alacrity on the tank stuff for example - so even after you grind for months to get to top tier, then you have to grind weeks and weeks more to optimize min/max your gear; to strip the mod from this piece or the enhancement from that piece so you can add it to your gloves or helm replacing the terribly optimized gear you already earned. it's like a grind within a grind if you don't want to have a tank that has 8% defense but 900+ alacrity, or a dps with +119% accuracy but only 59% surge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PloGreen Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 Please give me nightmare level gear then so I can step into pve content nightmare mode without actually having to do any pve, It's such a grind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feztonio Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 Please give me nightmare level gear then so I can step into pve content nightmare mode without actually having to do any pve, It's such a grind. that's 2 different things though. you do NiM because you're cutting edge guild and want the challenge of progression. we pvp because we want the challenge of playing against other players. raiding is months of progression... pvp shouldn't be. pvp is all about competing against live people and playing as a team. it's not about progressing until you have a raid instance on farm mode and then gearing your guild as pve is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alericus Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 ^ agreed why do I have to work for pve gear? why do I have to level my toon? why do I have to quest? why doesn't Bioware give me a lvl 55 toon with all top level gear at the start. ...hey wait im bored...I want another game to play now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PloGreen Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 that's 2 different things though. you do NiM because you're cutting edge guild and want the challenge of progression. we pvp because we want the challenge of playing against other players. raiding is months of progression... pvp shouldn't be. pvp is all about competing against live people and playing as a team. it's not about progressing until you have a raid instance on farm mode and then gearing your guild as pve is. I guess we disagree. I kind of like min maxing etc. but each to their own I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campaigner Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 Personally, I don't need a grind in order to enjoy PvP. I spent many years PvPing in SWG where having gear was a basic prerequisite. The fun was in the PvP itself: the battles, the hunts, the last stands. The problem is SWTOR only has instanced, small-scale PvP which isn't so open-ended and diverse. I guess with such a limited take on PvP they needed a grind to preoccupy the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashogy_reborn Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 Personally, I don't need a grind in order to enjoy PvP. I spent many years PvPing in SWG where having gear was a basic prerequisite. The fun was in the PvP itself: the battles, the hunts, the last stands. The problem is SWTOR only has instanced, small-scale PvP which isn't so open-ended and diverse. I guess with such a limited take on PvP they needed a grind to preoccupy the players. Well said, and the bolded is a huge problem in this game. owPvP is discouragingly hard to participate in, and WZs are remarkably uninspired and the mechanics are not all that fun (game modes that make 1 person potentially sit and do nothing the entire WZ.....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoFo Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 Because they want people who focus on PvP be allowed to gain all their gear through PvP gameplay and Vice-Versa. It would not be fair for someone who concentrates on PvP be forced to do PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideblaze Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 ^ agreed why do I have to work for pve gear? why do I have to level my toon? why do I have to quest? why doesn't Bioware give me a lvl 55 toon with all top level gear at the start. ...hey wait im bored...I want another game to play now Why do I have to put up with morons like this guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMaulUK Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 The problem is SWTOR only has instanced, small-scale PvP which isn't so open-ended and diverse. I guess with such a limited take on PvP they needed a grind to preoccupy the players. Nail on head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiminison Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 agree, its totally brainless to make us pvpers grind for this ****. just give pvp gear for free that is on par with stats of best pve gear + has the expertise bonus. leave the grinding to the roleplayers who actually enjoy it. GW2 is closer to what you would like.....You'll be back in a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiminison Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 If you get jumped in the open world you will be glad you grinded for that pvp gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiminison Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 It's not that big of a grind for every one I would under stand if you couldn't trade up with your comms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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