Dont add PvE to galactic starfighter!

[Talahar]

Well, I'd rather they did a space expansion >right< instead of this pvp-only thing, but at least i won't have to pay for it.

Probably because they know they couldn't sell it to enough folks, and it would just split up the player base otherwise...

 

But I also believe that this horse has been flogged to death so hard all is left is just a smear on the pavement.

 

They make a space combat minigame. It seems it wasn't what many players wanted.

They make another space combat minigame. It seems it's also what many players didn't want,

but probably not all the same players that didn't want the first space combat minigame.

At any rate, BiowarEA seems to have their finger on the pulse of the playerbase,

and they're pressing harder and harder, until they stop the blood flow.

Edited October 26, 2013 by Talahar

[Aestel]

I'm sorry, but that is retarded. If the majority prefers something, it makes zero sense for a company reliant on a user base to do the opposite.

 

Most people would prefer it over not having it but that isn't the choice the company is making they've said its low down on their wall of crazy which implies that they see people would rather have it than not but that they see lots of other things they could add to the game instead. For me I'd prefer they added more ground content like skirmishes, PvE team vs team races and some 24man single encounters.

[Icestar]

They know already people want pve for this

 

Yep, I want it

[MaximilianPower]

Well, I think this thread is a prefect example of Nagus and his grandstanding. He is not interested in a serious discussion. Not really. This is the Nagus show. He wants to be visible and uses threads to become visible. It is NOT about making the devs aware. And btw, these forums are the fodder for his blog.

 

Nah, a few of us have him pegged. Others can disagree, but don't be fooled. I contributed to this thread just to point it out for those that may not see it. Look at his history on this issue alone. You will see what I mean. Look at his announcement about the BW/MMORPG Q and A. Funny... how that Q and A announcement did not come from Eric or Courtney. And maybe it will, but not before Nagus stole the show.

 

Sorry Nagus. You are the Emperor and you are wearing no clothes.

 

This post, and the one it was in reply to (Arkerus), are both pretty insightful. Thank you for expressing exactly what I've been thinking.

 

These whiny Nagus threads have gone way past simply "tiresome" and are definitely bordering on "trolling". Enough is enough; we get it. I realize that merely replying adds fuel to the fire; I just wanted to voice yet another anti-Nagus-space-pve-thread opinion.

[The_Grand_Nagus]

No one is going to force me into anything I don't want to do. No body. I'd quit this crap before someone would force me to play the game in a way I don't desire. I have no intention of even trying that space pvp. I have *zero* interest in any pvp activity.

 

That is why I play on a pve server.

 

My statement was conditional. I said that *IF* you want to play the new free flight space system, then you will be forced to PvP. You have no other option that lets you play free flight space without PvPing.

 

I'm sorry, but that is retarded. If the majority prefers something, it makes zero sense for a company reliant on a user base to do the opposite.

 

Bioware is a professional game company. Do you really think they would force people to PvP to if they want to play free flight space if they didnt know it was a good business decision?

[AlexDougherty]

No! You're wrong! They should bring in an intern this weekend to knock that out. Cut+Paste and reskin some models, right?

 

Please don't ever try to adapt a programme, please just don't.

[AlexDougherty]

I'm sorry, but that is retarded. If the majority prefers something, it makes zero sense for a company reliant on a user base to do the opposite.

 

There are technical issues, which the Devs have shared with the forums, sadly some people don't believe them.

[Rasen]

There are technical issues, which the Devs have shared with the forums, sadly some people don't believe them.

 

This ^ I want PvE in the new space game, but since it isn't here now I'll wait. We all know(or at least reasonable people know) that they will add PvE in the future. Nonetheless the focus of this game should always be on the ground game first. That is what will keep people playing. Galactic Starfighter is just another one of many features that augment the main game.

[AlexDougherty]

Again the only thing I don´t like is that space is now "a warzone"

 

ok fine they can´t do NPC AI in space, no problem

ok fine they can´t let more players into one instance than 24, no problem

 

 

BUT they could add 100 sectors to roam around freely

BUT they could add mining asteroids

BUT they could add stations to land on seamlessly in space

BUT they could add trading, and cargo transporting, and guild ships

BUT they could add player driven economy and even territory warfare

BUT they could add something like the Death Star with one side playing Republic and the other side playing Imperial

and recreate the Death Star Attack

 

nothing of that requires NPC AI or letting more players than 24 into a single instance

 

A fan of Elite???

[The_Grand_Nagus]

There are technical issues, which the Devs have shared with the forums, sadly some people don't believe them.

 

Oh, I completely believe them. They didnt say it wasnt possible, they said it would be hard. And we all know it isnt fun to do hard things, so why bother? People have have only waited 2 years for a free flight space system with PvE and PvP, so rather than make that a priority they should keep making more ground operations and stuff. If people want to do free flight, just force them to PvP. Problem solved

Edited October 26, 2013 by The_Grand_Nagus

[AlexDougherty]

Oh, I completely believe them. They didnt say it wasnt possible, they said it would be hard. And we all know it isnt fun to do hard things, so why bother? People have have only waited 2 years for a free flight space system with PvE and PvP, so rather than make that a priority they should keep making more ground operations and stuff. If people want to do free flight, just force them to PvP. Problem solved

 

Well, without knowing how hard I find it hard to criticise.

 

Yes, they should do some hard things, but if it would take the entire programming staff say six months during which time nothing else could be done or changed, would that be worth it? As I say, without knowing exactly how hard it is, I won't complain.

[Eillack]

Wow, fallen to Troll status now OP?

[ajmhornet]

Sure, the majority of players prefer PvE. Sure, the majority of players want PvE added to galactic starfighter. But who says the majority know best? If people want to enjoy the new free-flight space system, then FORCE them to PvP!

Besides, its just way too hard designing AI that can fly in space, and doing hard things isnt fun. So why bother? Dont add PvE to Galactic Starfighter!!!

 

 

I choose to spend my money playing this game. I like the story and PvE part of the game. Try and FORCE me to do something I don't like, then I'll choose to spend my money elsewhere. Simples!

 

While the majority may not know best ( in your opinion), the majority pay the bills. Upset the people who pay the bills and pretty soon there will be no game left to play.

[The_Grand_Nagus]

Well, without knowing how hard I find it hard to criticise.

 

Yes, they should do some hard things, but if it would take the entire programming staff say six months during which time nothing else could be done or changed, would that be worth it? As I say, without knowing exactly how hard it is, I won't complain.

 

Hey, youre preaching to the choir buddy. Dont worry with that hard stuff people have been asking for for 2 years and just keep pumping out more of the same. And if people want do be able to steer their ship in space, force them to PvP. Sounds like a winning strategy

[OddballEasyEight]

Hey, youre preaching to the choir buddy. Dont worry with that hard stuff people have been asking for for 2 years and just keep pumping out more of the same. And if people want do be able to steer their ship in space, force them to PvP. Sounds like a winning strategy

 

You said it brother! I mean, it's not like people here on the forums don't know exactly how easy it is to program full 3d space combat AI.

After all, we are all pretty well versed in programming after playing games all this time right?

And since we are such great experts in the subject we also know that his is not at all as hard as they say, surely it could be put together by a 2-3 man crew in a week or two.

Its just lazy from the developers side.

I swear, if they just let us we could program this game better and faster than they can.

I bet if you and me got together we would have a fully fledged 3D space sim done within the month!

I mean, who are they kidding?

[The_Grand_Nagus]

Its just lazy from the developers side.

 

Sorry, but I cant agree with your insulting the devs like that. These are hard working men and women, and I dont want them having to worry with making something they said is hard, because work is supposed to be fun. Who cares if people have been asking for it for 2 years? If people want to do free flight space, just force them to PvP

Edited October 26, 2013 by The_Grand_Nagus

[Darkdoe]

If it's way to hard to program AI for space how was SWG able to do it oh so many years ago?

 

This comment has nothing to do with how "good" or "bad" of a game SWG was, just pointing out they had AI space flight.

[Hambunctious]

I'll give them the full benefit of doubt. There's no way the ground AI is anywhere near as complex as a full 3D environment AI that has to have fixed forward guns, ship control, and decent aiming. There's almost no skill involved in ground play anyway, much less the AI. Blaster bolts track, and follow the target in the ground game. They can't do that in space, and have it still resemble a skill based sim.

 

Edit: A 3D space AI wouldn't have to deal as much with pathing, however.

 

It can be done, but the question is will it be done. Only they know.

Edited October 26, 2013 by Hambunctious

[Vandicus]

If it's way to hard to program AI for space how was SWG able to do it oh so many years ago?

 

This comment has nothing to do with how "good" or "bad" of a game SWG was, just pointing out they had AI space flight.

 

Its not just about having AI, its about having good AI. If a game is sufficiently complex, say like Dota 2, the bots even on their highest difficulty setting aren't worth a damn for practice. Then there's the potential problem of AI that is too good, such as being simultaneously aware of everything around it. Your average person can't react the instant someone appears behind them on the minimap but an AI potentially can if programmed too. Then there's always the cop out method. Combine weak AI with cheating. The AI in wacraft 3 scaled difficulty based on how much they used quick build and free resources cheats. The AI couldn't actually create effective armies, but it would follow a set pattern unless something was triggered(like raiding them would send them into a frenzy of fast building and attacking the player base). As a result, strategies against players were often ineffective against AI and vice versa, and playing against the AI was done most effectively by turtling early then coming out with a better balanced army.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

Sorry, but I cant agree with your insulting the devs like that. These are hard working men and women, and I dont want them having to worry with making something they said is hard, because work is supposed to be fun. Who cares if people have been asking for it for 2 years? If people want to do free flight space, just force them to PvP

 

 

I'm glad they don't force me to do PvE against half baked robot AI, like Tie Fighters flying around headless chickens or attacking in the same pattern over and over and over again.

PvE is even dumber than usual if the AI is not well programmed, in GS at least you get human "I" to play against.

[The_Grand_Nagus]

If it's way to hard to program AI for space how was SWG able to do it oh so many years ago?

 

This comment has nothing to do with how "good" or "bad" of a game SWG was, just pointing out they had AI space flight.

 

There have been many space games with PvE over the years, and many people have enjoyed them. Even in BF2, which is the go to game many people talk about when discussing Galactic Starfighter, you could play a space map that included enemy NPC ships(on normal or hard modes) which were still fun to shoot and avoid. However, despite what has been done many times before, the devs for this game have said it would be really hard to do, so its probably best if they just forget it all together and focus on what is easiest

Edited October 26, 2013 by The_Grand_Nagus

[OddballEasyEight]

If it's way to hard to program AI for space how was SWG able to do it oh so many years ago?

 

This comment has nothing to do with how "good" or "bad" of a game SWG was, just pointing out they had AI space flight.

 

First off, they spent at least 3 years developing that. It was announced back in 2001 (as a "yet unnamed expansion").

They never said it was impossible, just that it was hard.

And SWG used a completely different engine that may well have been easier to program this kind of thing in.

Not to mention that they might have hired people to program the AI specifically for that expansion, seeing as it was planned before the launch of the game even.

 

I am pretty sure that if GS becomes a success, they might just hire an experienced flight AI programmer to help make some PvE version of it.

But as it stands, it is much more economically sound to make a PvP version.

Especially since what most people talk about when they mention games like Jump to Lightspeed (ok, expansion) and X-wing vs. TIE fighter, is the multiplayer aspects of them. Playing against other players was always what was most talked about.

[The_Grand_Nagus]

First off, they spent at least 3 years developing that. It was announced back in 2001 (as a "yet unnamed expansion").

 

For the record, SWG came out in 6/26/03. JTL then came out 10/27/04. Thanks wiki

[CommanderKeeva]

People want a lot of things. But they already said it would be too hard to do AI in space. So if people want to enjoy the new free flight space system, then they should be forced to PvP. Dont you think?

 

If they're being *forced* to *enjoy* anything, they're obviously not going to enjoy it. If they don't like ground-based PvP, they're not going to like space PvP either. Besides, everyone already knows that GS is not launching with PvE missions, so creating a third thread about this is a pointless waste of space.

[OddballEasyEight]

For the record, SWG came out in 6/26/03. JTL then came out 10/27/04. Thanks wiki

 

And the first expansion for the game was announced way back in 2001 during the beta tests...

"On 17 May 2001, even before the game went into public beta testing, the first expansion's development was announced.[11] The yet unnamed add-on, which was expected to be available six months after the initial product release, would be a space simulation and enable players to own and fly starships which would allow interplanetary travel and space combat."

Thanx wiki

 

(Oh and since it was expected to be released six months after release, but actually was released 16 months after release, apparantly it was a bit harder to make than they initially thought)

Edited October 26, 2013 by OddballEasyEight