Can we get a developer dialogue going on why class stories are not in the cards?

[ZionHalcyon]

The short answer is no. The long answer is No, Too Expensive.

 

The short answer is you aren't a bioware dev. The long answer is read the whole thread. Your comment has already been covered.

[Clarian]

(Did you know that if you solo the False Emperor, you get a few tidbits of unique dialogue with Malgus? It felt incredibly epic and completely appropriate for my SW to take him on with only Quinn for backup.)

 

I've heard that...haven't got that far myself yet, but someday! But yeah, it's cool they put stuff like that in for people who run stuff solo.

[Mamerica]

And I am also guessing that there isn't much of a chance of a developer commenting on way or another? I suppose that if they said there would be no more class stories a whole lot of people would unsub.

[RaiderMid]

As much as I would like to have class stories continued, quite frankly, there is nothing to talk about. They have made their intentions pretty clear and to be honest they owe no one any explanations. Does it mean it is set in stone that class stories will not go on? No, never say never but I wouldn't hold my breath and if class stories is the only reason to hang around, then you are better off just finding another game.

[ZionHalcyon]

As much as I would like to have class stories continued, quite frankly, there is nothing to talk about. They have made their intentions pretty clear and to be honest they owe no one any explanations. Does it mean it is set in stone that class stories will not go on? No, never say never but I wouldn't hold my breath and if class stories is the only reason to hang around, then you are better off just finding another game.

 

Maybe for you, but for many of us, there is a lot to talk about, much of what I outlined.

[Lord-Aleph]

More and more as I think about it, I feel like Makeb actually wasn't all that bad in terms of continuing with the storyline of each class. However, as I've said before, more companion interaction would go a long way with this kind of thing, so I would kinda like a dev response on that to get an idea of what they plan to do in the future with that.

[Kalli]

I'm hoping that when we get another expansion, and hopefully a large one, that class stories are put back into game rather than just world arcs. Sure the world arcs can be interesting, but let's face it there are a lot of loose ends that need to be tied up in all of the stories. It would be nice to at least get a yes or no on the subject so we know what to expect.

[jstankaroslo]

Hi, voice from Europe here (pardon my bad English).

I feel the same as the OP and majority of you. I love the game, and am half way through (4 characters to go). I've been playing it for a year now, and I generally don't do group content.

People yelling SPACEBAR (which totally ruins my rp experience), and lack of my own decision making is the reason. I also love the fact that Heroics 2+ and Heroics 4 are totally optional -they do not impact my story.

I was disappointed a bit with Makeb, as the story went forward (the Malgus arc), and I was unable as solo player to experience this. I mean -there was no impact of freeing Revan, or Cademimu -this was additional experience like Heroics are. But playing Makeb I realised that a bit of a story was taken from me, as False Emperor is a group content (it is possible on lvl 55 but you get that AFTER Makeb).

I think that devs going for group content is a mistake. Sure the pvp/group content community is the most vocal one, because that is what they are -they sort of like interacting with people (including devs on the forums), but what about the quiet solo players like myself?

Bioware games were always about story content and that (apart from Star Wars universe) is what makes me play this game. When I finish my 8th character it may be the sad moment to leave the game.

I think they could prepare solid Chapter 4. I mean, it could be even on existing planets, just new areas. Should be cheaper as general design for Alderaan or Balmorra or even Tython has been already done. We could explore another continent or zone, similar to but larger than Section X or Black Hole (as separate areas of the same design as planets).

I would really appreciate some feedback from developers on this, cause I don't want to leave this game in a few months, but I'll have to after I've finished all storylines as I have no interest in gearing up for dailies and doing just them.

[Lunafox]

Class-specific quests are not anywhere near the same as a 'Yo! I heard about you, dude! You're the winner of the Great Hunt! Epic! I need you to do this generic task that I could have a Sith or agent do. Later!" "Class-based content" in planetary questlines is quarter-a**ed. Not even half-a**ed. It's cheaper for sure, and the quality of the experience reflects that.

 

It's not an Avenger-style set up. It's a WoW style set up - you're a generic hero of the Republic/Empire off doing the same damn thing as every other class. Your role in the conflict has been reduced to generic grunt.

 

Whereas I had been looking forward to playing this game going forward, seeing what else was coming, how the stories played out, at this point I'm doing a lot of looking around at what else is out there, where my friends are going (cause they're leaving by the boatload lately), and generally making plans for gaming after swtor.

 

Reason I'm still here? A couple classes I have left, a small handful of things I wanted to get done in terms of ops, and a few friends who are still here. Get that? One of the things keeping me here, keeping money going to BW, is the class quests, and with those I'll be going to 50 and stopping because really I don't need to see Makeb yet again.

 

It would suck if you left, I enjoy your presence on the forums and in the community story forums too. But isn't that the truth though, its hard to keep interest up, and justifying blowing all this cash, when they care so little about what we want, and what truly defines this game as unique above all others. Without class and companion story continuations, this game is dull

[ERenfield]

I think the least we can do is keep this thread on the first page. If Magnus got his Revan set changed, who knows?

[Kendaric]

As with many others, the class stories are the main reason for me to play. I have zero interest in PvP or raiding, so without further class stories, there is extremely little for me to do aside from running dailies (which I utterly despise due to their horrific and uninspired design).

Planet stories like Makeb are well and good, but they lack replayability in the way they are currently done.

[Benfynyn]

Then let them say that.

 

This. People are always telling others what the Devs intended or what the Devs aren't willing to do. Let them say something definitive that's not open to any other interpretation.

[ZionHalcyon]

This. People are always telling others what the Devs intended or what the Devs aren't willing to do. Let them say something definitive that's not open to any other interpretation.

 

Precisely.

[Delta_V]

Personally, I'd like to see the class stories continued, but I'd like to see them more tied together as well. More like the "Avengers-style story" the devs have claimed Makeb to be.

 

The problem is Makeb isn't anything like the Avengers. In the Avengers, each of the characters is working towards the same goal and participate in the same battles, but each one does something different and has a unique role to play. In Makeb, each class does the exact same things, talk to the same people, and kill the same enemies. For me, and many others I have talked to, this repetition makes it difficult to play through Makeb with multiple characters.

 

If Makeb was truly like the Avengers, then we'd still have unique class stories. All of the Republic stories would be working towards the same goal of evacuating the citizens of Makeb, but each class would do something different to help achieve that goal. Same thing for the 4 Imperial classes - all 4 have the same final objective, but each contributes in their own way.

[Mercurial_Harpy]

I think that devs going for group content is a mistake. Sure the pvp/group content community is the most vocal one, because that is what they are -they sort of like interacting with people (including devs on the forums), but what about the quiet solo players like myself?

 

I would really appreciate some feedback from developers on this, cause I don't want to leave this game in a few months, but I'll have to after I've finished all storylines as I have no interest in gearing up for dailies and doing just them.

 

I seriously doubt that Developers actually polled a bunch of players and they said "Oh, class stories? YUCK. Get rid of them! We want generic missions fighting as a faceless Imperial/Republic hero, all with identical dialogue!"

 

Really? No, I think not.

 

A "State of the Game" is quite a bit overdue from Daniel Erickson, plus they should be discussing Fall/Winter content (*cough cough*), and I mean more than leaving the forum cleanup to the moderators. Again. I'm in agreement with ZH that this is a big issue and deserves a comment from the Devs either way.

 

If EA/Bioware ~was~ looking to throw us a bone, I think they could conceivably stick a story quest or two in the upcoming content pushes. We know they have it. Or give us a plausible explanation as to why they're letting class stories die out.

* * *

[Cernow]

Well I'd like to hear a clear statement from the devs on this - whether there will ever be any more class story content, or if they're done and the future is only combined story arcs.

 

The problem with combined story arcs is there's little incentive to repeat them on alts. Makeb gets very tedious after the first play through per faction because there's no story variation and the content is designed to slow the player down (to cover up for a lack of story).

 

Class stories are Swtor's main unique selling point. Without them this is a pretty mediocre MMO. It's the class content, the voice acting, the unique and interwoven storylines which breath life and immersion into the game.

 

If the class content has hit the end of the road, then the devs will really have to pull their socks up with all the other aspects of the game (flashpoints, raids, PvP, space etc) to keep the game compelling. This is unlikely to happen if recent content is anything to go by.

 

The current strategy for player retention seems to be a steady stream of new reputation grinds and a constant churn of recycled or hastily thrown together junk via the Cartel Market and a cynical use of gambling packs. But there's only so much mileage in this approach, eventually even the most gullible will grow tired of it and without any meaningful character and story progression will walk away.

 

To kill off class stories would send a message that essentially the game is dead and exists only as a vehicle to milk players via the Cartel Market.

[RaiderMid]

This. People are always telling others what the Devs intended or what the Devs aren't willing to do. Let them say something definitive that's not open to any other interpretation.

 

Good luck with that. They are not going to come out and give a concrete no answer. That would be bad for business.

[Tatile]

Good luck with that. They are not going to come out and give a concrete no answer. That would be bad for business.

 

No, I think Mr. Boyd was pretty blatant with his meaning when he said "Sorry, still no plans for more class-specific storylines, though we'll still have class-based content in our shared storylines"

 

- that, to me, says that Bioware don't understand that people enjoy the class story content more than the - or as much as, dependant on the player - "shared" story content. It's not as if the shared story content is inherently easier to multi-play, either, as if you have a specific goal in mind (say, the romances on Makeb), you must engage in the conversations (i.e. the story) outside of a party, lest another person's decision trump your own. That isn't an issue in class story conversations.

[ZionHalcyon]

No, I think Mr. Boyd was pretty blatant with his meaning when he said "Sorry, still no plans for more class-specific storylines, though we'll still have class-based content in our shared storylines"

 

- that, to me, says that Bioware don't understand that people enjoy the class story content more than the - or as much as, dependant on the player - "shared" story content. It's not as if the shared story content is inherently easier to multi-play, either, as if you have a specific goal in mind (say, the romances on Makeb), you must engage in the conversations (i.e. the story) outside of a party, lest another person's decision trump your own. That isn't an issue in class story conversations.

 

See, that right there, his statement, makes it sound like something more along the lines of my idea #2 - but its not 100% clear.

 

And devs since then have kind of went away from this.

 

More direct clarification would really help here.

[ERenfield]

A "State of the Game" is quite a bit overdue from Daniel Erickson

 

That would be interesting, seeing as Daniel Erickson unceremoniously left the company during the F2P switch.

 

Indeed, my pet conspiracy theory about class stories is that the big attitude shift against them had a lot to do with them being Erickson's (and only Erickson's) project, like Legacy, such that without him no one particularly cares.

 

 

Or more realistically, no one is particularly interested in dealing with the complexity James Ohlen warned against.

 

"'Don't be scared about adding voice over and cool cinematic content,' he advised his audience, 'but do be careful about adding lots of choice with consequence because that adds to QA cost and development cost and makes it hard to design everything.'" Perhaps a cost Erickson was willing to risk, but Ohlen, Hickman, Schubert et al are not?

 

Don't get me wrong, Schubert in particular saved this game, which I certainly appreciate. But it's telling that a) Erickson's departure wasn't even officially acknowledged, and b) to my knowledge, he was also never replaced.

 

Who is the creative director of SWTOR right now? This I'd give a few cartel packs to know.

Edited August 30, 2013 by ERenfield

[Grayseven]

I doubt we will see another "clear statement" about any part of this game ever again.

 

"Clear statements" are the type of things that cause the most anger in players when there is a change (unforeseen or no).

 

If we get a statement that unequivocally states that there will be no further class story lines from this point forward, it might chase some players off (I don't know why, but we all know it might). On the other hand, if we get a statement that they plan to expand class story lines then they get to deal with the constant harping from people wanting to know when (and we all know how true that is, we read it every day on these forums).

 

And the stance one month might be different the next when a new group of developers takes over and what was once true no longer is.

 

The only dialogue I foresee is a statement along the lines of "they aren't in the cards right now, but that doesn't preclude them being expanded in the future". It's called hedging and the development team would be fools to do anything else.

 

It isn't a black and white world, start loving the shades of gray.

[ZionHalcyon]

I doubt we will see another "clear statement" about any part of this game ever again.

 

"Clear statements" are the type of things that cause the most anger in players when there is a change (unforeseen or no).

 

If we get a statement that unequivocally states that there will be no further class story lines from this point forward, it might chase some players off (I don't know why, but we all know it might). On the other hand, if we get a statement that they plan to expand class story lines then they get to deal with the constant harping from people wanting to know when (and we all know how true that is, we read it every day on these forums).

 

And the stance one month might be different the next when a new group of developers takes over and what was once true no longer is.

 

The only dialogue I foresee is a statement along the lines of "they aren't in the cards right now, but that doesn't preclude them being expanded in the future". It's called hedging and the development team would be fools to do anything else.

 

It isn't a black and white world, start loving the shades of gray.

 

Then let the devs say that

[Mercurial_Harpy]

I doubt we will see another "clear statement" about any part of this game ever again.

 

"Clear statements" are the type of things that cause the most anger in players when there is a change (unforeseen or no).

 

Respectfully, I disagree. EA/Bioware seems to get into the most trouble when they remain vague and silent on an obvious issue. This qualifies in my mind as an "obvious" issue, as there are multiple threads about it.

 

There have been many instances (server transfer issues, Cartel Market story cubes, War Zone exploits, and the ever-popular graphics/clipping issues with CM gear) where Bioware was silent on the issue for a week or two, then the community pretty much forced them to address said issues. In fact, more than once in this game, both the devs and forum moderators have had to do a public "mea culpa" along the lines of "We're sorry we haven't been communicating properly or frequently; things will change going forward."

 

Also, if the forums posters are any indication, they've gotten an uptick in cancellations due to discontinuation of class story; that's sure to get their attention.

 

I think many of the players posting in this thread would be happy with "We hear you; we'll be clarifying our position on class story in upcoming announcements." Even if it is in the time frame of the dreaded EA/Bioware "Soon™" Even if that gets us "We aren't releasing story now, but we're re-visiting the possibility in future updates," I'd say that's a plus. Dialogue is important. They need to have it with the players for the game to continue successfully.

* * *

[SilentKitty]

I am here because my love of the story. But only having it move forward with my character and the companions remaining mute on the side is not an option for me. Have lvl:ed my Scoundrel through Makeb once and about halfway through with my Sith Warrior but it just such a disconnected feeling to have the story with my character only and her friends and lover as bystanders. Before this I never really guessed how important the companionship and connections to my characters friends and followers was to me. It is basically the reason why I spend my time re-playing DA:O-DAII, ME-ME3. Because no other game has given me a female character with the ability to develop strong relationships in this way. My JK who I play Ops and such content with is also about halfway through. No one of her friends speaks anymore so it is not so important to do story-missions. Quickly lvl:ed her on the side with dailies and heroics so that I can participate in guild-events.

 

There is still quite a few classes that I haven't played through. Trooper is on Alderaan, Sith Inq is on Dromund Kaas and the rest are still on their starter-world. If I space out companion convos so that they are still able to interact and speak while playing through the story of Makeb it might just work. What to do after that is very uncertain. Guess that it is a higher possibility of those who only wish to advance their own character to perhaps see something new in the game. I who derive my chief enjoyment from seeing my character interact with others is probably less lucky. Unsubbed for a short while but returned because there are still classes to explore and I would miss my guild. There is however a very clear clear exit-point for me, the day my last to level class has the last conversation with a friend on her ship. Oh well, I guess that they cannot please everyone, have several friends and guildies who do place little to no importance on the story of companions. Think that Dragon Age Inquisition will be right up my alley so I have that to look forward to. Currently trying not to be too let down and actually enjoy my smaller pool of story and companion-interactions that is left. Haven't seen the entire Trooper, Consular, Sith Inq or Agent so there is much enjoyment left for me. Trying to focus on the fun I have before me and not that it might not be continued.

[ZionHalcyon]

I have to say, I do find it disappointing that here we've kept it civil and been rather level-headed and have no answers or dialogue after 8 pages, yet you look around, and the threads that get the attention are where people are stark raving mad bordering on insanity, acting inhumane and treating the developers as if they were sub-human, and THOSE are the threads that get responded to.

 

Strongly dislike the precedent that sets and the message it puts out.