The relentless trash-talking aside, I doubt my efforts to gently corral this thread back on topic will be successful, but what the hell... I just watched the Gamerbreaker.tv segment, and I'm SO glad they covered this topic, Kudos to ZH for getting traction on this issue of class stories, which have BEEN an issue for over a year and a thorn in the side of many players. The folks at Gamebreaker said it best; Class Story was THE stand-out part of the game, and now it's irrelevant. It's just plain sad. It's time. It's time for Bioware and EA to address this out of respect to the community at large and the subscribers that have supported this game since Beta. And NOT in some comment out of the side of someone's mouth at a Cantina tour, or in some interview on another website that they can disavow later. The (since fired) writers have stated previously that subsequent chapters have been written. We deserve to know why "Your Saga" isn't going to continue when it was clearly meant to. Enough with the silence, which results in threads like this. It's tiresome two years in, and it ultimately strains credulity. * * *

I think people still harp on the removal of class story (and Bioware's staunch refusal to officially confirm it & explain the reasoning behind it by a dev post to the community) because those who enjoyed the Class Story as the most interesting part of the game feel seriously short-changed. Many of these players, myself included, feel that a majority of the class stories have serious loose ends that will never be tied up. Not to mention the limbo status of these stories seriously affects the Meta story. For me, it kinds feels like when a show I really liked gets canceled for reasons other than the quality of the show; that feeling of "Crap, I just wasted my time giving a damn about these characters, and it all came to naught." It especially sucks that we know the chapters have been written, but we'll never see them implemented. That's the real rub, IMHO, and what's angered me more than anything. Does that mean SWTOR is a bad game? Not at all. Bioware has found a profitable dynamic in micrtotransactions, and that will keep the game chugging along. For those who raid & pvp, the absence of story isn't going to break it for them. But nerd-raging aside, if paying players still want to voice their displeasure with the abandonment of (what was described at launch as) one of the most important pillars of the game, so be it. Especially since Bioware chooses to remain silent on the matter. I re-subbed for GSF, and was underwhelmed. Since the datamining discussed in other threads seems to suggest we're not going to see Class Story or even Companion Story updates in the next year or so, I just don't see the reason to keep paying. *shrug*. Sucks, but the game we ended up with, while not bad, just isn't what it could have been. And yes, that still irks some people. ***

I'm interested to see what "content" Bioware plans for this game after 2.6; The Dread Masters arc is finished, they've rolled out the PVP Space stuff. Someone else put this more succinctly in another thread, but my fear throughout this discussion has been that all the stuff they've rolled out over the last 2 years was prepped a long time ago, and likely meant to be rolled out long before it was. Bioware is reaching the end of that pool of content after stretching it out as long as they possibly could. So what now? What's the roadmap for 2014? A Flashpoint or Raid here and there? Maybe a new PVP map? Naturally more Cartel market items. Two years in, and no major expansion that progresses the meta? (Not talking about Oricron or Makeb; those were content bubbles for 1 xpac chopped up over a year that did nothing to advance the meta). I believe this is where scrapping story will bite them in the @ss. From 1-50, the game is designed to connect you to your character's unique story. After that, you are dumped into a generic all-purpose faction story line with ill-fitting (and at times absurd) dialogue choices. And while some have disagreed, I still submit that many of the class stories have loose ends that should have been tied up at least a year ago. Limbo sucks, even in an MMO. Despite the vitriol that gets directed at Bioware, they aren't stupid. They know players want more story, that's a given. But for whatever reason, money or manpower, they've abandoned it. Which is a shame. They can't erase the fact that SWTOR was built on the pillar of story, which sets every player up for disappointment once they reach 50. I totally understand their issues in keeping up with previous choices creating too many outcomes. But turning your toon into a generic "adventurer" where your past is irrelevant isn't the answer. There has to be some middle ground. The tragically underused companions could help fill in the gaps. I'm just not sure EA or Bioware has the will to do it. It's easier to push re-skins on the Cartel Market. In the mean time, I've had 2 guilds dissolve and all those folks leave the game, many of them unhappy that class stories have been shelved for the foreseeable future. I'll always hope that they rectify this. But I'm not holding my breath.

I think the fact that Bioware has one guy responsible for responding to PR-related player concerns on the forums, with no support to be expected when that one guy is away, speaks volumes as to where the players are on the company's priority list when communication is concerned. This is NOT an indictment of Eric, mind you; I'm sure he does what he can with the tools allotted to him. If they cared in the least, someone would have responded by now. Just sayin...

I find it very interesting (or telling, depending on your preference) that no one official from Bioware, forum mods or devs, has responded to any of the 5-6 threads asking for input in over 2 weeks. Not even the ubiquitous "tone it down, folks" finger shaking we usually see. After what happened with the class reps and the PR fiasco that followed, I seriously doubt a dialogue with unhappy players will be forthcoming, even if their griping is justified. I've said it in other threads, but I'm getting a "this is all we got, love it or leave it" vibe from EA/Bioware. Sorry state of affairs.

So very much this. I spent a lot of time trying to decide if EA/Bioware didn't care about customer service issues regarding this game, or if they just don't have the manpower to rectify them. I've settled on it's probably a bit of both. EA clearly doesn't care about customer retention, and due to that, they haven't staffed enough employees at Bioware to implement fixes or address customer service issues in a timely manner. I mean, not pushing fixes that are making the game unplayable barely qualifies as maintenance mode. Having this much extended downtime for a patch with no support for the many people having trouble downloading it is game-breaking for these players. It's also why many of them have or will move on to games whose parent company still gives a d@mn about keeping the game going. This was an amazing game with tremendous potential, but dreadful mismanagement can kill anything, even Star Wars. * * *

That "SWTOR will last for decades" quote was from an interview granted prior to launch. It actually highlights one of the biggest problems with the game as is; it just never lived up to expectations, reasonable or unreasonable. To be fair, some of the endless b*tching on the General forums is over minor stuff. But it's pretty clear at this point that EA is either unwilling or unable to address some of the major issues that keep cropping up. Here's a short list; to be sure, there is more depending on who you talk to: Engine optimization Consistent and serious lag in WZs, Fleet and daily areas, regardless of your rig Stealth discontinuation of Class Story, when some of the stories were obviously meant to be continued Generic, awkward dialogue options for all classes Over-reliance on creating items for the Cartel Market rather than playable content regurgitated content billed as "new" (difficulty modes for current Ops, FPs and the "new" PvP system) broken Codex entries since launch ineffective customer service I can't help but get the feeling that EA (it's not really Bioware anymore & hasn't been for some time) is purely in lifeboat mode, trying to make as much money back as they can. If the parent company isn't willing to invest what is necessary to improve it, then it's a lost cause. They just pulled the plug on Warhammer after 8 years, and Star Wars license or not, EA will do the same to SWTOR if their balance sheet supports the move. I think of what this game could have been, and it's a tragedy. But it seems silly to hold on to what isn't there. Maybe one day, EA will get its act together, but I won't hold my breath. * * *

There's got to be some reason Bioware doesn't want to resurrect this event, and it's got nothing to do with lore. Players have been asking for it's return for over a year. Maybe the graphics involved when one player spreads the virus to others put a load on the servers and with the new "super servers," it's too much. Or they got too many complaints about other players standing on Fleet infecting other players. Personally, I thought this was the best part of the event. It was hilarious. Besides, they could easily explain it with Czerka (as someone already pointed out), or with the Macrobinoculars quest; I believe you run into rackghouls during it. I have the green light-saber crystal from the event on my sorc. I've seen maybe one other on fleet in a year. Come on, Bioware, throw us a bone. * * *

^^^^^^^ So very much this. Glad I'm not alone in thinking this. Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of breaks in logic in the Inquisitor story. I heard somewhere that it underwent extensive revisions just prior to beta release, and that Chapter 3 was essentially scrapped and re-written to the mess that it is today. But given the original racial choices for the SI, and dialogue choices if you play a Twi'lek (I have both Human and Twi'lek Inq), the "cannon" SI is almost certainly an alien. To wit, Lord Kallig is almost certainly not. There was thread after thread on the forums at launch that went to great pains to explain how Lord Kallig's family interbred with alien slaves to produce the SI. The only explanation that makes sense, and simplest, is that Kallig is lying to you when he says you are "family." SI Story Spoilers, do not click if you haven't played through. That said, it's pretty ironic that Malgus, in his defeat, got pretty much exactly what he wanted. Life in the Empire after Makeb is certainly easier for an Alien than it was before. Of course, that's mainly because the Empire is losing at the beginning of Makeb, and their primary purpose is filling their ranks rather than equal treatment under Imperial Law. In playing the IA story through as a Chiss, even as the only official alien "ally" of the Empire, you still pretty much catch relentless crap for being a Chiss. In any case, it will be interesting to see how the new Alien initiatives play out in future expansions for the Empire. * * *

Pretty much everything you said, Tatile. It's really indicative of a massive disconnect between the people who developed the stories, and the People In Charge (PIC) now. The is very little continuity in how everyone's Chapter 3 ends, and how your character ends up on Makeb. I'd imagine there will be less so going forward unless the PIC get serious and fix the class story plot holes. I'm not an idiot, I understand that asking Bioware to produce full Chapters 4-5-6 is asking too much of them at this point. However, despite the seriously reduced means at their disposal and that they are hell-bent on doing group content and group content only, they did say in the Seattle Cantina tour that they were hoping to "improve" class specific responses, so that gives me a little hope. My issue throughout all of this is that some of the class stories end needing further closure. Even if they can't do full chapters, it's not unreasonable to ask that, if they really want to wrap up class stories, that they actually wrap them up. There are ways to do this other than full chapter quests. I'm having a hard time figuring out if Bioware knows how to fix things and just don't want to, or if they really are in a bind and need help. Hell, I have some ideas... * * *

I didn't really mind Makeb. I ran it twice on 2 Imp toons but I'm struggling with my Trooper. There are parts of the planet that are so annoying (endless trash mobs with high-agro range), I am considering just leveling via PvP and wrapping up the faction story as quickly as possible. Personally, if Bioware wants to "wrap up" class stories, that's fine with me. The problem is 1. They didn't make it clear from the outset that they were closed story lines (because they weren't, obviously) and 2. Many of the stories have loose ends. I think what a lot of folks are hoping for in this thread is that EA/Bioware realizes the error they've made regarding class story and choose to release another chapter (or 1/2 a chapter, whatever) that ties up some or most of the loose story ends (Agent, Warrior, JK, come immediately to mind). I don't think that's too much to ask. Let's say for instance, they don't want to do full chapters. They could certainly send each class a datacron or holo vid. There are ways to do it. EA just has to want to. Never mind an official response on the matter, which is yet to be seen... * * *

If it were that simple, there wouldn't be a 10 page thread with almost 100 responses.

Really? The only quote I read from the Cantina Tour was Class Stories are not in the cards right now, BUT they are focusing on group story content. They have yet to explain why this is. That is what we want dialogue on. Even if the answer is "because we're not telling you," we would like this thread addressed by someone at EA/Bioware. * * *

Respectfully, I disagree. EA/Bioware seems to get into the most trouble when they remain vague and silent on an obvious issue. This qualifies in my mind as an "obvious" issue, as there are multiple threads about it. There have been many instances (server transfer issues, Cartel Market story cubes, War Zone exploits, and the ever-popular graphics/clipping issues with CM gear) where Bioware was silent on the issue for a week or two, then the community pretty much forced them to address said issues. In fact, more than once in this game, both the devs and forum moderators have had to do a public "mea culpa" along the lines of "We're sorry we haven't been communicating properly or frequently; things will change going forward." Also, if the forums posters are any indication, they've gotten an uptick in cancellations due to discontinuation of class story; that's sure to get their attention. I think many of the players posting in this thread would be happy with "We hear you; we'll be clarifying our position on class story in upcoming announcements." Even if it is in the time frame of the dreaded EA/Bioware "Soon™" Even if that gets us "We aren't releasing story now, but we're re-visiting the possibility in future updates," I'd say that's a plus. Dialogue is important. They need to have it with the players for the game to continue successfully. * * *

I seriously doubt that Developers actually polled a bunch of players and they said "Oh, class stories? YUCK. Get rid of them! We want generic missions fighting as a faceless Imperial/Republic hero, all with identical dialogue!" Really? No, I think not. A "State of the Game" is quite a bit overdue from Daniel Erickson, plus they should be discussing Fall/Winter content (*cough cough*), and I mean more than leaving the forum cleanup to the moderators. Again. I'm in agreement with ZH that this is a big issue and deserves a comment from the Devs either way. If EA/Bioware ~was~ looking to throw us a bone, I think they could conceivably stick a story quest or two in the upcoming content pushes. We know they have it. Or give us a plausible explanation as to why they're letting class stories die out. * * *

This. ^^ You know, I'm not sure why (a vocal few) people are surprised SO many players are unhappy with EA/Bioware's decision to discontinue releasing class story. EA/Bioware are the ones that set the bar as high as they did to draw customers. Now, coming up on the 2 year mark, when players were reasonably expecting enough time had passed for their "saga" to be continued, EA/Bioware basically says "Nah...yeah all those things were promised at launch regarding story? Well you're not getting them. But here's some neat new dye-able armor! Thank's for subbing..." O_o Requesting a little clarity from the Developers on this matter is not unreasonable. "Your" personal story was one of the lynchpins of the game. Never mind the fact that many of the class stories have loose ends yet to be tied up. So yeah, people are upset that what we are left with is more Makebs and the Cartel Market. * * *

Oh, I'd love to hear a developer or Erickson spin this. But I seriously doubt we'll get EA to admit the obvious; that there are additional chapters written, and likely recorded, but EA is not interested in devoting the resources to pushing them out. I absolutely, 100% believe they intended to continue at launch, but they were scrapped when the game went F2P. That's why your loading screen said "Interlude." It's obvious to many (although some may disagree) that almost all of the stories lack the definitive closure necessary for EA to get away with "Yeah, no more class stories." Cases in point as noted by the OP: Agent, Warrior. Also, I have no idea how they'll get around the fact that a Dark Council/Jedi Council member is running around doing grunt work. Or why the best smuggler in the galaxy is doing fetch quests without the promise of an enormous payoff. Honestly, I would have been happy with 1 or 2 more class-specific quest chains to place our characters in a position to logically explain why they are doing what they are doing, maybe similar to the seeker droid quest, but class-specific. Not even full chapters; just a little freaking closure. An in-game mail once in a while. Anything. And that's not even getting into the issue that players have married companions that have simply stopped speaking to them, with no plans to correct that, either. Sad, sad, sad. Again, some may disagree, but IMHO, these are huge issues that are a deal-breaker for me. There was a way for EA to transition 8 individual stories to 2 faction-based story arcs. The way it was done was the worst way possible. And that makes me totally uninterested in continuing to play.

Pretty much this. One of the lead story writers confirmed on Twitter yesterday that they had no plans to continue class stories. Not "for the time being" or "foreseeable future," but just "no plans." That's the hardest "no" you're going to get out of EA/Bioware. The link is in the petition thread somewhere, I don't have the energy to hunt it down. When SWTOR went F2P and launched the CM last summer, lots of nay-Sayers decried that move as an end-run around having to put one more dollar into development of the game, paired with blatant cash grab before sun-setting the license. Foolishly, I chose to believe there was no way EA would torpedo the game like that. Unfortunately, those fears seem to have been realized. Class story aside, we know from Dulfy's data mining that EA has 4-6 planets worth of material, likely with Voice Acting already recorded. But all the players will see is the generic, 2-faction questing. So, once again, a member of the Dark Council and an exiled Agent, or Barsen'thor and Trooper, will have pretty much the same exact responses to NPCs. No thanks, I'll pass. Even so, let's say they launch these new planets every six months to a year. If EA got the standard 10 year deal that SOE did for Galaxies, & provided they have stopped future development, that content won't take them through the end of their license. We're looking at 2016-2018, maybe. So what then? EA set themselves up for this kind of backlash by launching an MMO with awesome immersion in the Star Wars universe, then 6 months after launch, deciding they can only recoup their losses by turning it into WoW in space with a cash shop, totally eliminating the individual experience promised at launch. This paired with the "Heal to Full" debacle, makes me think of a line in the movie "He's Just Not That Into You." If a guy is treating you like he doesn't give a sh*t, he genuinely doesn't give a sh*t. No exceptions. ...and so it goes with EA. ***Edit, apparently they are addressing the Heal to Full stuff; it only took a youtube vid to get their attention

The problem is they don't make sense. The only way they make sense is if you entirely discard the 1-50 story for each class, wipe the slate clean, so each class is essentially just another WoW-type fighter drone, all doing identical collective missions. This is completely in opposition to the promises made in the 1-50 story, where your choices were meant to matter later on. Which is a problem, because the story is what set this MMO apart. The other problem is that some of the stories, even after the last Act III mission, have questions that were meant to be answered in the Act IV that will never come. That's the real kick in the teeth. Never mind the promises made about alignment and companion relationships. I wouldn't be surprised if Dark Side/Light Side choices are entirely removed soon, as they now have no impact whatsoever on the game. Oh well. It was a great run while it lasted. * * *

You know, I was about to get all hopping mad about this, then I saw who was posting it, so I just laughed. Like a good friend, Andryah enthusiastically supports EA's position even when they are wrong. They aren't wrong all the time, but I believe they are wrong on this. Andryah disagrees, and that's fine too. As far as your claim that not many people will actually quit over discontinuation of class story, 1. Only EA knows how many will for sure, so you have no basis to make this determination; and 2. Since they added the reason to the selections when you cancel, they are obviously interested in collecting metrics on it. As far as your claim that players who were expecting more class story "were not destined to be a long term player of the game anyway..." obviously, that was just your attempt at a derisive swipe at anyone who is voicing their unhappiness at the discontinuation of class stories. I can only speak for for myself. I'd call almost 2 years paying a sub to an MMO a "long term player." You may disagree. And again, that's fine. Numbers only mean something when they are assigned a value, any mathematician will tell you that. As for what impact the discontinuation of class stories will have on the sub numbers overall, only time will tell. In the long term, that is. * * *

To answer your question, no, there will be no more class stories for the foreseeable future. Although EA has not given a "hard no" when posed the question, they've given plenty of "soft nos" in various interviews and most recently in the Germany Cantina tour. You won't get a "hard no" from EA on this. That would mean being honest with all the people who continue to sub in hopes of funding more class story. All SWTOR will get going forward is Makeb style planetary arcs, as they are the cheapest to produce and they likely already have the small amount of voice acting for each class needed already recorded. Personally, after the first run-through, getting my alts through Makeb was a slog, and I have zero interest in continuing with this game if that's what's on the horizon. However, the most compelling support for the position that there will be no more class story is that when I canceled my sub after reading the Germany Cantina Tour transcript, one of the reasons you can select for canceling is: There are no more class stories. So, that's pretty much that. EA and the player forum drones can spin it any way they like. It is what it is. It's very sad. I'm sad to leave this game. But when SWTOR went F2P, EA fundamentally changed the direction of the game, and it's no longer what was promised at launch. Instead of continuing class story with the individualized adventure where choices matter, we get short, planetary quests where our choices have zero consequence, and all choices made prior to that are essentially forgotten. Oh yeah, and reskinned speeders in the Cartel Market and Nightmare Mode Athiss. What a waste. P.S., to get to that selection in the cancellation menu, I believe you choose: * * *

Yes, unfortunately it is nested within many choices. I considered posting a screen shot but I figured the forum police would yank it. And I was too mad at the time. Go figure. If memory serves, at least the route I took, you have to choose "Game did not meet expectations," then "not enough/unsatisfied with endgame content," then it gives you the line about no more class stories. I assure you, it's there. Not lyin', man * * *

That's totally fine. EA can take a year (on top of the 2 they've had since live beta) to figure out that class stories are what made SWTOR unique, and allowed the players to overlook some of the glaring deficiencies of this game. Hell, take 10 years. But I refuse to fund another minute of their "research" until they do. And even then, until that patch is ready to push to my rig, no $ from me. On top of that, I'm not sure I'll bite. In 2 years, I'll (hopefully) have moved on to other things and won't still be hung up on Bioware's penny wishes. At this point, I'm kinda worn out by EA and their policy of vague statements & blatant misinformation regarding the future of this game. Chu and I have gone back and forth over the years debating whether or not class stories will return. I should have listened to him Anyways, kudos to anyone who stays subbed. I'm all out of patience. * * *

Actually, here is a fun fact, for all who still think the discontinuation of Class Story is a gray area. When I went to cancel my sub... ...one of the reasons to select for cancellation was... ...THERE ARE NO MORE CLASS STORY LINES! I kid you not. So there it is, folks. Bioware, EA, whoever the hell they are now, will never get another damn cent from me. And it's a shame, really. I loved this game. Not that they'll read it, but I did mention in my cancellation rant that it's shameful how they've strung players along (who were hoping for more class story) all this time. But the joke's on me, they got their $180 out of me since they made the decision, likely when F2P and the Cartel Market launched. I just didn't want to believe it, I guess. *sigh*

So very much this. I know class stories don't mean much to some players, but for me, they were what drew me into the game. The hope of having more class stories is what kept me going for this long since launch. But if all we are going to get is more Makebs, then I'm out. The confirmed scrapping of class story was always the line in the sand for me, and it appears that with the Germany Cantina tour & the other links provided, that's happened. Of course, no one at EA-Ware will ever come out and say "Yeah, class stories are over," because they know enough players like me will leave because of that. They'd rather continue to string us along with a lot of meaningless word salads and "maybes" and "not nows, but perhaps much, much later on." It still sounds like "never" in different clothes to me. Shame on them for that. Last night, I spent an hour trying to convince my GL to stick with the game; almost everyone else in my guild has left. I'm really, really sorry I wasted his time. I'll be apologizing to him later, when I see him online in the game we've moved to. SWTOR sub canceled as of today. It's astonishing how EA-Ware is hell-bent on making sure SWTOR never lives up to its potential. It sucks because the greatness it could have been is just out of reach; you can almost touch it. But obviously since the firings/dev meltdown/turnover from last year, the right people are no longer in charge. And that's not even mentioning the endless bugs, poor performance and clipping issues, which are indefensible after 2 years of live code. The Cartel Market was interesting, but seven re-skins of iconic Star Wars armor (that should have been in the game since launch, let's be real) does not make up for recycled and uninteresting content. I'm through with the misplaced hope and cryptic responses from uninterested/overworked developers, all the while paying $15/month for the privilege. To those who stay, good luck to you all, you have more patience than I do. * * *