ETA on Advanced Class change?

[Jaxtes]

I know I have heard, and even seen more then one post, about people who don't open the gear bag and never see that second lightsaber, double bladed lightsaber, autocannon, etc. It seems that at least some people don't know about the gear bag and its contents. By moving it to the AC selection window, BW may be trying to make it less likely that a new player will miss this gear bag and its contents.

.

 

Maybe, maybe... was not aware people were having trouble finding the gear-bag still don't think changing it will help only way i see is to make them unsellable(unless they are already so).

 

You made one comment that I think may be more accurate than you think. You said the devs were too smart to say never.

 

Thought that could be inferred from my comment.

 

I will leave this game one day not sure when or why maybe because of bad content or lack of it in areas i want. All i know is if AC switch comes will buy more coins to use it and may stay for a couple of weeks/months after breaking point hoping for more.

[Ratajack]

Maybe, maybe... was not aware people were having trouble finding the gear-bag still don't think changing it will help only way i see is to make them unsellable(unless they are already so).

 

The game does not go out of its way to make the customer aware of the gear bag and its contents. As it's been a while since I leveled a new character, I don't remember if the gear bag was even listed as a quest reward or if it was just placed into your bag.

 

I will leave this game one day not sure when or why maybe because of bad content or lack of it in areas i want. All i know is if AC switch comes will buy more coins to use it and may stay for a couple of weeks/months after breaking point hoping for more.

 

The bold part is why I said we may see class (AC) changes at some distant point in the future, but likely not in the foreseeable future. I think if we ever see class (AC) changes implemented it will be when the game is on its last leg, in an attempt to breath a little new life into it, or to get a few more months of revenue.

[JediKnightJax]

I wish they'd just add this already. I've lost count of how many times I've re-rolled the different Jedi classes because I wanted a different play style, but wanted to keep the same name.

[Knorlac]

This thread just keeps coming back...Has someone tried piercing its heart with a pointy wooden object or perhaps a silver bullet? Or a maybe we need to go for its brain?

[Halinalle]

Maybe, maybe... was not aware people were having trouble finding the gear-bag still don't think changing it will help only way i see is to make them unsellable(unless they are already so).

 

It's not just gear bag. Literally ½ of all Asharas I've seen use only one lightsaber.

[LordArtemis]

Well, I would say they had the opportunity to add this with disciplines, but for some reason chose not to do so.

 

I personally take that as promising.

[dbears]

I wish they'd just add this already. I've lost count of how many times I've re-rolled the different Jedi classes because I wanted a different play style, but wanted to keep the same name.

 

You've lost track? There's 4 different Jedi AC's.. you rolled a Guardian, didn't like it, switched to Sentinel. That's 1. You rolled a Sage, didn't like it, switched to Shadow. That's 2.

 

Or vice-versa.

 

There's a very small, finite number of Jedi AC's. To "lose track how many times.." is forsure an over exaggeration.

[Alssaran]

There's a very small, finite number of Jedi AC's. To "lose track how many times.." is forsure an over exaggeration.

 

Most likely.

 

I'm neither for nor against this change in particular. The only thing I want to add to those people who shout: "It takes so long to level!" is this.

 

I can manage (with a reasonable amount of playtime and XP-Boost) to hit 55 within a month. I have vocational school, martial arts training two to three times a week during the evening. And I still manage to level a character to 55 within 3 weeks to a month. So, please, don't come with the argument "This takes so long!". It really doesn't.

[sippelmc]

I watched the class streams and they commented that they have an AC change function on their internal dev server, but it is still buggy. So they are making some kind of functionality, either for internal purposes or future product/services delivery, but it is not ready either either way.

[dbears]

I watched the class streams and they commented that they have an AC change function on their internal dev server, but it is still buggy. So they are making some kind of functionality, either for internal purposes or future product/services delivery, but it is not ready either either way.

 

It's very far from being something like a Cartel Market consumable that people can buy.

 

Currently it looks like they have type in some "dev hacks" as they call them, to make it possible.

 

I still think there's a wide variety of things that can go wrong with something like this.

Edited November 17, 2014 by dbears

[Deewe]

Always go with the: leave the choice in the players hands.

 

As long as it's clear how to do so and everyone can either use it or opt out, there's no big deal with that.

Some might be very bad with their new specs but well so might you and it's part of the game.

If you really want to group with skilled people group with the ones you know that are to your liking.

 

Then again with the 12x it's bit less annoying to level (wish I could shift + space bar skip whole dialog though)

Although I'd certainly use a couple of switching over my characters like making my Sith marauder and my Jedi guardian instead.

[MagikFingerz]

Well, since this was already necro'ed: Just today I decided to re-roll a character that I had previously made (level 15) just to change the AC. What would have been nice to have (not to say it's necessary or easy to implement, but nice) is a "Restore to factory default" option for a character. That would remove the need to recreate that character from memory. You would still start at level 1 on the starter planet as one would anyway, of course.

[Vhaegrant]

One of the hurdles I always struggled with regarding an Advanced Class swap feature was how to deal with retraining the abilities that differed between the ACs. Afterall, if you decided to AC swap at 55 you could have a considerable bill on your hands. Considering the scarcity of credits during levelling a mid level AC swap could bring its own troubles of being stranded without enough credits to purchase core abilities.

 

With this news: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7848903#edit7848903

 

The removal of training costs from the game. That hurdle has gone.

 

Swapping between ACs needs to be no more complex now than switching to a new specialisation.

[Jesseriah]

Are they ever going to do a class change (like jedi knight to jedi consular)?

[Vhaegrant]

Are they ever going to do a class change (like jedi knight to jedi consular)?

 

I really hope not.

I'm against Class swaps. And a Class swap carries with it the technical issues of how to deal with story choices and companion progression. In many aspects it has the same problem as a Faction Swap or even a Gender Swap (romance options).

 

However the AC swap is just about choice of role and a few ability/equipment changes, exactly the same things that the Specialisation swap deals with.

Every single Class choice remains the same.

Edited December 6, 2014 by Vhaegrant

[enigmacypher]

Bottom line this came up in the beginning of this game when majority of players were 20th level (maybe a little higher if you were willing to wear diapers and not sleep) .

 

you start out as a basic class not defined and then at level 10 (or so) decide your actual class..

 

this is like going to WoW and rolling a Paladin to max level and then switching to a mage or something else.

 

you can have up to 22 characters a server if subscribed .. and quite a few (not sure the numbers) if playing for free (let's face it there are probably a few players you know who NEVER pay a cent to the game which means there is no income for development and none to pay the programmers at all coming from this source).

Maybe if you want a different class you can reroll.. don't want the same storyline/world play the other faction..

 

Just a thought

[Ghisallo]

I just want this because when I rolled I said "nope I am addicted to healing, want that monkey off my back."

 

Damn bastich won't get off my back so all I want is to go from Jedi Shadow to Jedi Sage. I don't think that is a HUGE deal. I get the concern over jumping from say Consular to Trooper...but just swapping specialization seems a nice middle ground.

[enigmacypher]

Please NEVER..

 

you don't start as your class as such you choose your class at level 10 .. this has been a whinefest since the game opened ..

 

you are playing a consular and then get to 10th level choose to go ranged/healer .. oh wait don't like that now change to melee DPS/tank.. so if in wow context you start as a priest then change to a warrior of something..

 

THIS is more than just a dumb idea..

 

if by 11th level you don't like a class you delete a reroll it doesn't take that long and I sure doesn't take long to level up..

 

IF they ever do put it in it will just be a sign that money incoming to the game is more important than game balancing

[Vhaegrant]

Please NEVER..

Never is an awfully long time.

you don't start as your class as such you choose your class at level 10 .. this has been a whinefest since the game opened ..

Unfortunately this thread has been picking apart the semantics of Class since the opening pages.

Using SWTOR's definition of 'Class' you choose it at level 1.

At level 10 you get the choice to choose the 'Advanced Class', but do not have to.

SWTOR has 2 steps of specialisation where as most other games have just 1.

you are playing a consular and then get to 10th level choose to go ranged/healer .. oh wait don't like that now change to melee DPS/tank.. so if in wow context you start as a priest then change to a warrior of something..

Really if you wanted to use WoW as a reference you could at least be honest. Asking to keep the story elements, companions, visual customisations the same while being able to play any role is more akin to playing as a Paladin, Druid or Monk.

THIS is more than just a dumb idea..

It's an idea, just because you don't agree with it doesn't make it dumb.

if by 11th level you don't like a class you delete a reroll it doesn't take that long and I sure doesn't take long to level up..

11th level? Many of the players that have been asking for this feature have got characters languishing in the mid 30s. Now, I understand that levelling is easier than it has ever been, but it can still add up to 30+ hours.

There may also be other aspects like titles, cartel purchases, etc... tied to the character that the player wants to preserve.

Or, as the Shadow and Sage share exactly the same story, companions, customisation options, maybe the player doesn't want to retread the same ground.

IF they ever do put it in it will just be a sign that money incoming to the game is more important than game balancing

Allowing an AC swap has absolutely zero impact on game balancing.

A Shadow swapping over to Sage doesn't retain the specific AC skills of the Shadow. The character is at any one time only ever a Shadow or a Sage, not both at the same time.

In this respect it is no different than the current Specialisation choices when choosing which role you want to play.

Hopefully with the removal of trees and the inability to make Hybrid builds balancing of Class>Advanced Class>Specialisation (Role) will be far easier and result in less impact from Flavour of the Month exploits.

Edited December 18, 2014 by Vhaegrant

[LordArtemis]

ITS ALIVE!!!!!

 

Well, I feel like my choice has a bit more meaning now. So that was a good step in the right direction. Early on I do feel like I am actually playing my role.

 

One thing I would say is that I like the utility arrangement, and the ability to easily change my role on the fly inside the AC...now all we need is something to save the position of our specials on our bars.

[Andryah]

ITS ALIVE!!!!!

 

It needs a good sloshing of industrial strength pesticide.

 

On topic.. seriously... they have made it pretty clear they are not going to do this. Suck it up and move on folks.

[Vhaegrant]

It needs a good sloshing of industrial strength pesticide.

 

On topic.. seriously... they have made it pretty clear they are not going to do this. Suck it up and move on folks.

 

On topic, it's a forum where people passionate about the game like to throw ideas about and discuss the impact. As long as it remains civil I see no reason why any one needs to move on.

 

As to what 'pretty clear' means, could you compare and contrast these two quotes about training costs.

 

Hey folks,

 

Ok so I have an update on the training/re-training of abilities with the launch of 3.0. With all of the changes that hit with 3.0 to Disciplines, it is intended that there are abilities that need to be trained/re-trained. Here are some of the criteria that could cause this to happen:

• If an existing ability changed, in name or functionality. This could especially affect Disciplines which used to share an overlapping name and set of abilities, such as Lethality Sniper/Operative.
  
• We adjusted at what level you would acquire certain ranks of skills. If you are a character pre-55 you may be training skills at ranks that were previously unavailable.
  
• In some cases we moved abilities from the Base Class to the Advanced Class or vice-versa. This technically means you could have to retrain an ability you already had, since it changed where/how you got it.
  

I had not realized the scope of abilities that would need to be trained or I would have been more proactive in alerting everyone to this prior to 3.0. With this in mind, the need to train/re-train abilities in 3.0 is intended and therefore we are not planning on making any changes at this time. I apologize sincerely for the inconvenience this has caused.

 

Thank you for your understanding.

 

-eric

 

The need to train/ re-train intended and therefore no changes at this time.

 

Hey folks,

 

Let’s talk a bit about training costs for your characters abilities. One thing has become clear from the player feedback in not only this thread, but since launch: players do not like training costs. It is a situation where every level you will see your hard earned credits go to a holographic Hutt doctor in order to make yourself a bit stronger. We have been talking about this topic internally for quite some time and when you add player feedback to the mix one thing becomes clear… We should make training costs a thing of the past.

 

Since launch, you have spent millions of credits training skills across your characters. As of our maintenance next week all ability training costs will be completely removed from the game, forever!

 

What does this mean for you? This means that starting next week, instead of spending your credits on training skills, you can now spend them on literally, anything else you want. Note that this only affects ability training, you will still need to spend credits to training schematics for Crew Skills, etc.

 

Thank you again for your feedback.

 

-eric

 

Boom!

Changes made less than a week after the initial release of 3.0.

While I was stung a little at the time from having levelled up and trained two characters from 55 through to 60, I think the removal of training costs is nothing but positive for the game.

More to the point this is a change to a fundamental of MMOs, when you level up you pay for new abilities at the trainer.

 

Why do you think the developers would be so unlikely to consider another change in direction?

[Vhaegrant]

ITS ALIVE!!!!!

 

Well, I feel like my choice has a bit more meaning now. So that was a good step in the right direction. Early on I do feel like I am actually playing my role.

 

One thing I would say is that I like the utility arrangement, and the ability to easily change my role on the fly inside the AC...now all we need is something to save the position of our specials on our bars.

 

You could always change your role if you purchased 'Field Respecialisation', that really hasn't changed.

Moving the points around in the Utilities isn't really changing your Role as much as it is tweaking the build to a PvE/ PvP preference.

 

I have to be honest I've not respecced any of my characters yet from the initial choice made at 3.0. I might go and have a look as a few have 'Field Respecialistation' and find out if additional abilities need to be purchased each time or if it is just the 4 active abilities from the Spec progression.

[Ghisallo]

Never is an awfully long time.

 

Unfortunately this thread has been picking apart the semantics of Class since the opening pages.

Using SWTOR's definition of 'Class' you choose it at level 1.

At level 10 you get the choice to choose the 'Advanced Class', but do not have to.

SWTOR has 2 steps of specialisation where as most other games have just 1.

 

Really if you wanted to use WoW as a reference you could at least be honest. Asking to keep the story elements, companions, visual customisations the same while being able to play any role is more akin to playing as a Paladin, Druid or Monk.

 

It's an idea, just because you don't agree with it doesn't make it dumb.

 

11th level? Many of the players that have been asking for this feature have got characters languishing in the mid 30s. Now, I understand that levelling is easier than it has ever been, but it can still add up to 30+ hours.

There may also be other aspects like titles, cartel purchases, etc... tied to the character that the player wants to preserve.

Or, as the Shadow and Sage share exactly the same story, companions, customisation options, maybe the player doesn't want to retread the same ground.

 

Allowing an AC swap has absolutely zero impact on game balancing.

A Shadow swapping over to Sage doesn't retain the specific AC skills of the Shadow. The character is at any one time only ever a Shadow or a Sage, not both at the same time.

In this respect it is no different than the current Specialisation choices when choosing which role you want to play.

Hopefully with the removal of trees and the inability to make Hybrid builds balancing of Class>Advanced Class>Specialisation (Role) will be far easier and result in less impact from Flavour of the Month exploits.

 

You hit the nail on the head with more than a few bits. I prefer Jedi. As such to have a healer I would prefer Consular, however I have seen that story. So I am leveling a Commando to heal. It annoys me because I don't dig the story, but it was less painful than the smuggler I abandoned at 20 because of the story.

 

Also stupid is indeed a matter of perspective. It takes zero time to get to level 10-11. You don't have a feel for the AC imo because you don't have the AC defining abilities, or even needed abilities. Example doing the early flashpoints I pretty much thought Commando completely sucked as a healer. No AoE heals, the only heals with real "ooomph" all cast times. It made healing a PITA. Eventually it came into its own, but if the Commando was not a healing style I appreciated I would have been like "I wasted the time leveling to 40 for this?"

 

Personally I would even be cool with a one time only change, but if anyone says you actually have a clue how a class operates with how fast it takes to level up to 20, they are either fooling themselves or outright fibbing.

[Aries_cz]

You hit the nail on the head with more than a few bits. I prefer Jedi. As such to have a healer I would prefer Consular, however I have seen that story. So I am leveling a Commando to heal. It annoys me because I don't dig the story, but it was less painful than the smuggler I abandoned at 20 because of the story.

You do know that you could for example level a opposite gender and opposite alignment character, right? that would give you a new perspective on the "same" story...

 

Also stupid is indeed a matter of perspective. It takes zero time to get to level 10-11. You don't have a feel for the AC imo because you don't have the AC defining abilities, or even needed abilities. Example doing the early flashpoints I pretty much thought Commando completely sucked as a healer. No AoE heals, the only heals with real "ooomph" all cast times. It made healing a PITA. Eventually it came into its own, but if the Commando was not a healing style I appreciated I would have been like "I wasted the time leveling to 40 for this?"

And now, thanks to Disciplines, we get defining abilities sooner, so you should have a general idea how it work around Nar Shaddaa (so basically after 3 planets) Edited December 18, 2014 by Aries_cz