Tython lovers side quest *obvious spoilers*

[BrianDavion]

I ratted em out, they really struck me as sort of creepy in their relationship. it was obvious they lacked the maturity to handle it

[BrianDavion]

Then what about the person you meet in a certain flashpoint ..

 

 

Revan? He obviously wields both light and darkside force powers, pretty much simultaneously. And he's a beast.

 

 

This isn't an argument, this is a question. I'm curious how people who feel the way you do fit him in?

 

 

I've gotta take Byte's side on this one. The "provocative jabs" you made were about him/her personally, not the subject at hand. You're assigning values to someone else in an attempt to get them going.

 

It's a debate about characters in a video game. It really shouldn't ever be made personal, imo.

 

 

reven? total dark sider. sure he claims to be "grey" but be realistic

 

in foundry

the guy's attemping to basicly kill 97% of the imperial population. he's commiting genocide.

 

 

There's no grey area where that's concerned. it's evil. plain and simple. Revan had fallen to the dark side... again

[AlexDougherty]

I reported them, the problem isn't that they are having a relationship, it's that SHE is obsessive about it, the guy is actually rather balanced about it (I feel sorry for him), but she is unhinged about the relationship, not a good position for anybody let alone a force user.

[Euphrosyne]

However ...

 

 

I don't think you can lay the attitudes of the Revanites on Dromund Kaas at his feet, unless they were actually around and taught by him before his imprisonment. (Which is possible, as I said I don't know jack about Star Wars lore). They struck me as having heard of his existence, and muddled out what they thought his codes, ideals and motivations were.

You're right, you can't. They had nothing to do with him personally, had absolutely no idea about his actual circumstances, and you can mention them to him and he'll be all "ugh, ew, that's totally not what I had in mind".

 

Then again, the fact that he's trying to be a mass murderer on a par with Pultimo, Palpatine, and Tsavong Lah far outweighs his disapproval of Tari Darkspanner's creepy little cult.

 

Edited May 14, 2013 by Euphrosyne

[Morgulian]

I told them that they cannot continue their relationship.

Accurate role-play is very important for me. I decided that my Jedi character will be very strict about following the Jedi code, and will do all by-the-book. My Sith character acts like typical Lawful Evil villain. I plan making another character someday, which will not follow some specific code in the game, I will make the choices I would do if I was him.

[ImmortalLowlife]

I lied to the masters for them, & told them to basically be careful & have a great life. That's always been a part of the Jedi code I've never agreed with. Their no attachment policy Imo did more harm than good. The old Jedi became so detached they completely lost touch with the realities that were apparent to the ppl they were trying to protect. Instead of "hiding" from an emotion, it's better to learn HOW to recognise, understand, & then eliminate attachment from the decision making process. That's why the NJO is as a whole more in touch with the force than the old Jedi.

 

 

#stop snitchin

Edited May 15, 2013 by ImmortalLowlife
added more

[TalonVII]

I ratted them out. This is why. They were infatuated, they had lust/passion not true love. They were teenagers who thought they knew something. They were not ready for what love truely is. Jolee Bindo said it best "love can damn you, but it can also save you."

 

True love, is how Revan brought Bastilla back from the dark side. It's also how Darth Vader was redeemed, his love for his son. But on the flip side, that love for his wife that consumed him, is what damned him.

 

This is why jedi forbid it, it's the easier solution. Personally I feel this is wrong. Shutting yourself down instead of dealing with it rationally, becoming at peace with yourself and with your choices is what the Jedi should teach.

 

Teaching "don't have attachments" is wrong. Teaching how to cope, how to deal with feelings, how to make that awful choice, THAT is what needs to be taught. Hell in the military we form attachments all the time. Doesn't mean that LT won't sacrifice that sgt and his squad to save a planet if he has to. The LT will hate himself and probably his men, but in the end, he'll make that choice.

 

What they need to teach jedi to do.

[ScarletBlaze]

I had a problem with the masters even asking that of a padawan. They were in fact wanting you to spy on a fellow padawan when in all honesty they should have found a different way to find out. They should have never used a padawan to spy on something like this.

 

In my book they showed lack of judgment and lack of leadership skills.

Edited May 15, 2013 by ScarletBlaze

[Lodril]

Teaching "don't have attachments" is wrong. Teaching how to cope, how to deal with feelings, how to make that awful choice, THAT is what needs to be taught. Hell in the military we form attachments all the time. Doesn't mean that LT won't sacrifice that sgt and his squad to save a planet if he has to. The LT will hate himself and probably his men, but in the end, he'll make that choice.

 

The difference is that the LT is not empowered by killing the men he cares about. In the end, thinking bad thoughts about his men leads him to be unhappy... but that unhappiness largely stops within him. If the LT's unhappiness instead made him into a Colonel, he'd have a chance to turn around, but seeing what that unhappiness can do for him, he's more likely to increase it and become a General. As a General, he can now sacrifice people in droves, for whatever petty goals come to mind, without ever seeing them or thinking about it, and would be encouraged to do so. He would no longer be struggling with the sacrifice of a handful of men he worked alongside, but rather preventing the need for it by sacrificing strangers in droves. Instead of working hard and becoming a worthy officer, he would be raised solely through his capacity for evil, thus ensuring vast widespread destruction on epic scale.

 

And that's why the Jedi should be kept apart from attachment. They are not like lovestruck teenagers, or military officers, or whatever else you might compare them with in the real world. Attachment does not encourage detached self-control, and part of maintaining detached self-control is surrendering attachments. If someone is unwilling to do that, even for noble reasons like love, then they will not make a good Jedi, should be removed from the order, and be thankful that they will have an opportunity at a normal life.

[Azzarr]

One of the strangest things about this whole Jedi romance thing, I mean they're basically an order of mind readers. Wouldn't they KNOW?

 

Probably the best option is the one where everyone acts like an adult capable of resolving their own problems and you go talk the two into cooling things off, since one of them was kinda starting to go a little "kill everyone who finds out to hide the relationship" and that needs to be sorted, do some soul searching, you know. You get both light side and dark side points for that so it balances out.

 

But, unfortunately, it didn't make sense for any of my characters to take that option - see again the masters are thought police.

 

What are they even doing getting another Master's padawan to do their dirty work? There appears to be a derth of trainers and masters on Tython who give their students any oversight and most of them seem to take their lesson plans from fortune cookies.

 

They can read the minds of weaker minds. Usually those who are Force-Sensitive, or strong-willed, won't allow people to have their thoughts being read of persuaded. Especially when you're trying to hide something. Its not like you can hear their thoughts going: " OH MY WE'RE IN LOVE, LETS HOPE NO ONE FINDS OUT", as they walk by the Masters. Ofcourse, the right thing is if one of the Masters would confront them. However the Masters feared they would drive them into a corner which would only allow dark emotions to evolve.

 

So they send you, the new hope ( see what I did there..) and think that you can convince them, or prove your worth as a rolemodel. Not the best strategy, yet it can be effective.

[KennethHoover]

I ratted them out and broke their hearts and dashed all their dreams of lovemaking and a happy life together.

 

I slept well that night.

[Noblis]

I ratted them out and broke their hearts and dashed all their dreams of lovemaking and a happy life together.

 

I slept well that night.

 

Same.

I tried to press them to a fight. Never happened.

I would not lie to a Master.

I saw this as a test. The Jedi already knew what was going on. They could do something but sent me.

If the Jedi already know something is up and I lie, the kids are still out and now I am also.

[AlrikFassbauer]

I did it once - and then I simply ignored the quest, because I - personally - find it stupid.

 

But that's because my personal philosophy of the Jedi is quite different from that which is "official".

 

In my opinion, Anakin Skywalker failed because of too much attachment, not because of the love he felt - but the official view is that he failed because of the love he felt. RL people don't seem to be able to distinguish between both.

 

Usual "Jedi Lore" puts them into a state of celibacy. I don't think that this is a good idea, because celibacy imho just isn't the answer to the "attachment problem" of Anakin Skywalker. And it's too much RL for my taste, too.

 

As fan fiction, I wrote a short story about a female Jedi and a man falling in love with one another - and they are both fully aware of the "attachment problem".

 

My personal view is a bit more "meta" than that : In my personal philosophy of the Force, the Light Side of the force is pure love,

meanwhile tha Dark Side of the force is pure hate.

 

Meaning that people falling in love with one another would be an expression of the Light Side, imho.

 

And from this point of view, I just cannot understand Quests like this one in SWTOR.

 

(And from this point the evilness of The Emperor comes even more obvious, since he managed to twist and to mis-direct Anakin's force to into an entirely different direction ...)

[maxetius]

Revan was obviously deeply disturbed, insane even, by his 300-year-long connection with the Emperor. The fact that he managed to keep a seperate identity for so long is a credit to him, but then he decides

wipe out 97% of the imperial population, which would allow the Emperor to immediately perform his ritual and become a god, which obviously isn't an intelligent thing to do for someone claiming to know the Emperor's plans. He (Revan) was obviously not really there anymore, at the very least consumed by the dark side, basically doing the Emperor's wishes without realizing it.

 

 

Which means the Imperials who face him in the Foundry actually save the galaxy.

Edited May 17, 2013 by maxetius

[Dan_Loto]

It was awhile ago, but I think I told on them just because they considered killing me to keep their secret.

[Euphrosyne]

It was awhile ago, but I think I told on them just because they considered killing me to keep their secret.

Yeah, and they also try to bribe you.

[Bytemite]

It was awhile ago, but I think I told on them just because they considered killing me to keep their secret.

 

Y'know, that's another highly questionable problem with the masters asking you to do this. Say you weren't the lightsaber or force savant the player characters seem to be, the masters randomly ask some padawan walking down the road to check on their suspicions. The padawan is potentially walking into a two against one situation, and one of them considers killing to keep the secret.

 

This sounds more like a concept for a murder mystery than responsible behaviour on the part of the masters. Body found --> WELP. GUESS WE FIGURED OUT IF THEY'RE HAVING A RELATIONSHIP! /capslock

Edited May 17, 2013 by Bytemite

[Euphrosyne]

Y'know, that's another highly questionable problem with the masters asking you to do this. Say you weren't the lightsaber or force savant the player characters seem to be, the masters randomly ask some padawan walking down the road to check on their suspicions. The padawan is potentially walking into a two against one situation, and one of them considers killing to keep the secret.

 

This sounds more like a concept for a murder mystery than responsible behaviour on the part of the masters. Body found --> WELP. GUESS WE FIGURED OUT IF THEY'RE HAVING A RELATIONSHIP! /capslock

Yes, like most sidequests in an RPG, the logic behind it breaks down very quickly if you actually think about it.

[Lodril]

Y'know, that's another highly questionable problem with the masters asking you to do this. Say you weren't the lightsaber or force savant the player characters seem to be, the masters randomly ask some padawan walking down the road to check on their suspicions. The padawan is potentially walking into a two against one situation, and one of them considers killing to keep the secret.

 

Actually, as I recall, they do know who you are at the beginning of that quest, so it's not entirely random. Second, neither of those two was more than fifty yards from a small encampment of full Jedi. Third, they knew their own Padawans and thought the two of them might be sneaking around because they were in love, they didn't have any reason to think they'd become full blown serial killers because of it.

[Bytemite]

I'm envisioning Law And The Jedi Order, new up and coming holonet drama. Just let me have my imagine spot, I'm doing fine here.

 

Edit: best episode. The investigators search a padawan's room and find an unsettling shrine to Satele. Meanwhile, a young consular is suspected of tipping an Uxbeast. Also, twilek mud wrestling at the pilgrimage.

 

I don't remember them seeming like they know you, but it's been awhile. Good points anyways. Mostly I just like to make jokes about stuff now and then.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Bytemite

[Noblis]

[zzoorrzz]

Y'know, that's another highly questionable problem with the masters asking you to do this. Say you weren't the lightsaber or force savant the player characters seem to be, the masters randomly ask some padawan walking down the road to check on their suspicions. The padawan is potentially walking into a two against one situation, and one of them considers killing to keep the secret.

 

This sounds more like a concept for a murder mystery than responsible behaviour on the part of the masters. Body found --> WELP. GUESS WE FIGURED OUT IF THEY'RE HAVING A RELATIONSHIP! /capslock

 

They are jedi masters. They look at 2 padawans and know which one is going to win the fight. And since they already knew those 2, they only needed to look at you.

[Pingonaut]

and worse of all the Jedi Master actually trIES to recruit SITH LORDS.

 

I've "changed" some from the dark side and they became Padawans. What are you talking about?

[RevanKnight]

I just skip that quest all together. George Lucas himself says the old jedi order is wrong about love.

[BradTheImpaler]

I just skip that quest all together. George Lucas himself says the old jedi order is wrong about love.

 

Not calling you a liar, but...Where?

If that's the case, George Lucas is wrong, anyway! Anakin is proof. Jolee is also proof (despite what he says, he couldn't bring himself to kill Nayama and she went on to kill a bunch more Jedi). Shaela Nuur is proof. Plenty more where that came from.