Is PVP Healing going to be addressed?

[MasterFeign]

I think any class that can stay comfortably at 80% energy/force etc. while being max health for the entire duration of the fight is pretty ridiculous in and of itself.

[Astarica]

I'm starting to see Sages play the same kind of 'no interruptible heal' style as Op now and still never come close to dying. Of course the Sage usually still casts Healing Trance and Salvation, but the former is dangerous to interrupt (it probably ticked twice by the time you notice, and interrupting it means they get Deliverance cast for free), and the latter doesn't heal enough on the Sage himself to warrant interrupting (it's a lot of heal for the team but if you're trying to burst down the Sage the heal from Salvation is irrelevent), plus the usual precaution about the follow up Deliverance.

 

The only thing that makes this even tolerable is that since heailng is so easy now any random PUG can do it too.

[foxmob]

I disagree. Healing is ridiculously simple, all these guys with their BS saying healing is hard LOL. Im sure thats why more and more and more healers are popping up because its sooo hard and not because the average idiot jumps to easy mode.

 

lol. I have a healer. I wouldn't say I am a healer. you constantly have 2+ ppl harrassing you. you have no way of killing them. you spend the entire WZ ducking in and out of los, CCing, running for your life, tossing in dps, and oh btw, that whole healing thing (the EASY part). no. I dps too. on many more toons that I heal. dps is the easiest thing in the game. heals are a little overbuffed atm, and any team with 3 heals vs 1 or none is never going to lose a node. that's a composition thing. healing is only "easy" when your team is significantly better than the other team. in which case, every job in the ops is "easy." this isn't pvEasy mode, where healing is, in fact, the easiest task.

 

edit: the only thing that's really significantly changed is the effectiveness of tanks. now that absorb and shield are relevant, mitigation is through the roof.

Edited May 11, 2013 by foxmob

[Asvarduil]

I usually just harpoon a healer somewhere where it's easy to break LOS, and keep him there till his mates die due to lack of heals. Then he's done for.

 

That's also a legitimate strategy.

[Savej]

I'll probably reserve judgement until Bioware finally fixes Bolster and we see if the reason healers are over-performing is because of that. Also, 4+ of pretty much any class is going to be overpowered. Have you seen what happens when four Smashers hit the same person at the same time? If they weren't in heavy armor there won't be enough of 'em left to bury.

 

With that said, healing probably will need to be toned down somewhat (hopefully on a class-by-class basis and not the slaughterhouse-style of nerfing that went on in 1.2). One big difference I've noticed since 2.0 is that it's possible to heal warzones solo -- in my opinion, you should not be able to do that.

 

Not to derail this thread but it would take more than 4 smashes to kill my sentinel or my sin or most of my characters if they have a tank on them... 4 healers cross-healing (if they stand a ways apart) would not have any trouble with the initial smashes unless they were perfectly timed.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Savej

[Kerensk]

People still die in warzones so healers aren't good enough yet.

Buff healers.

[Draekos]

Just make sure you get it right, merc heals are not OP currently.

[DanAxe]

All those who say you cant kill a healer as hard as u try - try using a target marker and ask for help focusing, even with 3 healers around, if 2 good dps keep bursting the same target, wont take you more than 2/3 rotations to bring a healer down (and if u still find it impossible, well there is so many displacement of enemy mechanics in this game, pls dont tell u never thought of breaking the los of one of the healers from the others??)

 

All those who say healing is easy and dps is sooo much harder - You never played ranked pvp as a healer im sure, in order to survive good dps, u better be a good healer or you'll be a piece of meat waiting to be bagged.

 

But as far as the topic is concerned, yes healing is a bit over the top now for sorcs and scoundrels, specially scoundrels with energy regen going nuts. But even like that, try a sorc/sage healer and try healing for long periods of time, and then u get out of force and need to use sacrifice to regen... Show me how good you are in vids please i wanna see you make that look easy in intense fights...

 

You just like to say that u are sooo good at games that healing is beneath you because its easy... that just shows u never played REAL healing in pvp.... Stop trashing healers pls, or if u want to keep going, please post ur ingame names so i wont heal you if i ever see u around.. and i hope other healers do the same. Then u can go and heal urself with all ur mighty and overcomplicated dps....

 

Yes, BW should tune down the healing a notch, specially on bolstered, at conqueror level and on the ranked scene, healing is just fine and balanced. And if u disagree you've never been there...

[Ossos]

All those who say you cant kill a healer as hard as u try - try using a target marker and ask for help focusing, even with 3 healers around, if 2 good dps keep bursting the same target, wont take you more than 2/3 rotations to bring a healer down (and if u still find it impossible, well there is so many displacement of enemy mechanics in this game, pls dont tell u never thought of breaking the los of one of the healers from the others??)

 

All those who say healing is easy and dps is sooo much harder - You never played ranked pvp as a healer im sure, in order to survive good dps, u better be a good healer or you'll be a piece of meat waiting to be bagged.

 

But as far as the topic is concerned, yes healing is a bit over the top now for sorcs and scoundrels, specially scoundrels with energy regen going nuts. But even like that, try a sorc/sage healer and try healing for long periods of time, and then u get out of force and need to use sacrifice to regen... Show me how good you are in vids please i wanna see you make that look easy in intense fights...

 

You just like to say that u are sooo good at games that healing is beneath you because its easy... that just shows u never played REAL healing in pvp.... Stop trashing healers pls, or if u want to keep going, please post ur ingame names so i wont heal you if i ever see u around.. and i hope other healers do the same. Then u can go and heal urself with all ur mighty and overcomplicated dps....

 

Yes, BW should tune down the healing a notch, specially on bolstered, at conqueror level and on the ranked scene, healing is just fine and balanced. And if u disagree you've never been there...

 

Look what you just wrote. Two "good dps" need 2 to 3 rotations to bring down a healer. If there is a lag, or if the healer gets a single heal, your take on burning DPS down goes out the window. In your scenario it's a 2 v 1, and if the 1 gets intermitant heals, then there is no chance. 2 good dps, can go at 1 healer, the healer gets heals from another healer who is dps-ing one of the two attackers. That attacker is going to drop before either healer is...and that's what happens.

 

See, in your example alone, the need to drop that healer makes it a 6 v 7 in favor of the healer's team. Now, that's accepable if that healer drops fast...but that healer doesn't. That healer is going to go into "keep my own *** alive" mode while receiving a heal or two from one or two more healers. Meanwhile, the two attackers are being burned down by the healer's team. The attackers beating on the healer in this scenario cannot attack anyone else because then the healer will not drop for certain.

 

I used to play a Pally and a Priest in WOW and you have to look at it like this, as a healer you're going to throw out a heal or two, then you go full tank mode (in PvP, healers are the tanks). In a coordinated group, your group is going to be ready for the attack on the healer, and due to the game mechanics, it's easier for the healer's group to do their job then it is for the attackers (if it's a coordinated group).

 

So in any situation when three healers can tank 3/4 of the other team...then you have a problem. I noticed that you did say that some healers are a little over-tuned right now, well, that little bit makes all the difference.

 

Anyhow, I don't expect BW to do much about it, Eric whatever his name is has shown to be very bad at his job. Granted he's not as **** for brains as Ghostcrawler (WoW...I've met the dude, and he is a moron. Very slow thinker, very short-sighted person).

 

My goal here isn't to sob all over the place over PvP, just acknowledge a situation and move on (I just don't like people calling it like it's not).

[Battyone]

Look what you just wrote. Two "good dps" need 2 to 3 rotations to bring down a healer. If there is a lag, or if the healer gets a single heal, your take on burning DPS down goes out the window. In your scenario it's a 2 v 1, and if the 1 gets intermitant heals, then there is no chance. 2 good dps, can go at 1 healer, the healer gets heals from another healer who is dps-ing one of the two attackers. That attacker is going to drop before either healer is...and that's what happens.

 

See, in your example alone, the need to drop that healer makes it a 6 v 7 in favor of the healer's team. Now, that's accepable if that healer drops fast...but that healer doesn't. That healer is going to go into "keep my own *** alive" mode while receiving a heal or two from one or two more healers. Meanwhile, the two attackers are being burned down by the healer's team. The attackers beating on the healer in this scenario cannot attack anyone else because then the healer will not drop for certain.

 

I used to play a Pally and a Priest in WOW and you have to look at it like this, as a healer you're going to throw out a heal or two, then you go full tank mode (in PvP, healers are the tanks). In a coordinated group, your group is going to be ready for the attack on the healer, and due to the game mechanics, it's easier for the healer's group to do their job then it is for the attackers (if it's a coordinated group).

 

So in any situation when three healers can tank 3/4 of the other team...then you have a problem. I noticed that you did say that some healers are a little over-tuned right now, well, that little bit makes all the difference.

 

Anyhow, I don't expect BW to do much about it, Eric whatever his name is has shown to be very bad at his job. Granted he's not as **** for brains as Ghostcrawler (WoW...I've met the dude, and he is a moron. Very slow thinker, very short-sighted person).

 

My goal here isn't to sob all over the place over PvP, just acknowledge a situation and move on (I just don't like people calling it like it's not).

 

 

See in WoW the healers were the tanks, except when you were running something like RLS or RLP or Kittycleave or basically any 3s/5s comp or did rated bgs, oh and in this game the tanks are, of course, the tanks. Since they can taunt off, and guard for protection from damage.

 

Either way a healer trying to keep someone up who is being focused properly won't have GCDs to throw into DPSing the DPS as well. The situation described, assuming there is not a disparity in the skill of the players involved, would be a stalemate at best, assuming people just standing around freecasting (which you seem to assume) and no other damage going out.

 

Guess what? You now have the heals not healing the rest of the team, and 6 other players on your team hopefully taking advantage of that. In a pug/random I can see this being problematic since it's always wise to assume the least common denominator, but in ranked teams will eat that alive, healers can't afford to be locked in cross heals limbo forever, it will lead to the entire team going down.

 

That doesn't even address the fact that two DPS focusing a healer (at least a sage since that is what I play) can out-spike our heals. Pop CDs and we melt, our 2.5s base heal can crit for 10-11k, our HoTs and channeled 2-3k a tick. I've taken screams for 9k, I've taken 5k saber throws, etc. Even if a heal gets off that won't account for more than 1 extra GCD and you _still_ have the healers occupied. The damage inbound on you is the other team protecting their healers, and is why you have healers yourself. It's not like one side has access to heals and the other does not.

 

So in your scenario you've locked down the healers and if your team isn't a bunch of potatoes or something then they will be able to make the best of it, or more realistically if you roll your CDs and burst hard they pop and you just went from a moderate team advantage to a great team advantage. I have a lot of footage of teams not bringing me down, I have a lot of footage of teams popping the hell out of me. It comes down to how they work together, this isn't 8v8 solo dueling. I'd love you to find spare GCDs to throw out damage in some of the insane **** I've had to pull to keep my team alive.

[Thaladan]

 

(...) But even like that, try a sorc/sage healer and try healing for long periods of time, and then u get out of force and need to use sacrifice to regen... Show me how good you are in vids please i wanna see you make that look easy in intense fights... (...)

 

.

 

+1

 

and i confirm : dps is more easy to play than heal, by far.

Edited May 12, 2013 by Thaladan

[dejavy]

Yesterday played as a healer in dps gear. Done about 650k healing first match and about 750 the other with my commando. THere was a scoundrel healer and sage near by. It was the first time i pissed off maras and lauged them in the face and their tiny smash consequences.

[Arkerus]

I believe it will be fixed. PvP does not work with stalemates.

[Kodite]

the only problem is staying on the healers now. ops can spam roll to get away with very little energy consumed. Sorcs can bubble and wait for help. mercs can hydro. overrides and shield. /lol'ing as they heal themselves up with me chasing after them.

[Astarica]

In 2.0 healers basically got new ways of escaping while there are no meaningful new ways for a DPS to catch up with a healer so it's much harder to kill them compared to before.

 

It's not a big deal in the grand scheme of things because whatever unkillability of healers applies to yours too, so unless your team has no healers (which would be unfortunate but reasonable to expect a disadvantage) it's fine. But stalemates where both sides have total deaths in the single digits is just stupid. Focus fire doesn't work against a healer that's properly supported mostly because of LoS issues.

[Dawginole]

Question is - are you supposed to kill healer 1x1? No, you shouldn't.

 

 

lolwut?

[DanAxe]

Well the problem is this post is about how healing is over the top, and to that i agree, it needs twitching, but it all gets bad and soar when people start trashing healers as the least skilled players in the game.. Thats just lame, innacurate, and totally uncalled for in this post.

 

But everything people say in this thread is debatable and there are many different kinds of players, many different playstyles and many different douchbags who like to trash others just to cover up for their lack of skills.

 

Im healer sage, full conqueror, and when going against a good team (even in pugs, yes) even if we have 3 healers, i can still be killed in a matter of seconds. Mercs/commandos have a little something that prevents a sage from using speed and barrier.... U stun a healer, u put the net, u have 2 dps focusing him, its a bye bye no matter how many cooldowns u still have up.

 

I really hate seeing people trashing healers when they really have no idea what they are talking about... And it seems to me they dont even know to play their class well if they say such things. I also have dps alts and its not like you say at all. Yes in most cases i cant kill a healer in 1on1, but why should i be able to do that?? how many healers u have in a 8man team compared to dps?? if each dps was able to kill 1 healer by himself then there is no point at having healers at all.

 

Its just probably they were in a group with 3 healers and they still died countless times and now they are mad at healers for not healing them (maybe because they were being focused and couldnt heal anyone besides themselves, leaving the rest of the team vulnerable, which completely breaks ur point of healers being unvincible and able to keep the whole party at max health).Just outsmart them!! IF u cant... well you've been outsmarted and ur raging about it .. Get over yourselves people. You wanna make a point? do it politely if u wanna be taken serious, otherwise just rage quit pls...

Edited May 12, 2013 by DanAxe

[PerinnAybara]

They need to bring sage and operative healing in line with mercenaries. There should be a healing trifecta not this crap show of balance we have now.

[Thaladan]

the only problem is staying on the healers now.

 

- ops can spam roll to get away with very little energy consumed.

- Sorcs can bubble and wait for help.

- mercs can hydro. overrides and shield. /lol'ing as they heal themselves up with me chasing after them.

 

- roll ones = 1/4 energy... very little energy consumed? 1/4 ?!? i don't think so..

 

- static barrier now covers 7-8k damage ..difficult for a dps? i don't think so./ force barrier..well every 3minutes..and it is not killing you, you can tag the point, dps others players etc etc..

 

- shield..are you saying this talent is OP ??

 

a good dps will kill a healer in 1vs1 if no help arrives.

 

this thread is just for "no brain" dps who don't want to focus on healers, but just damage the first ennemy they see, that's all.

and they whine they can't kill him because a healer next to him is healing him

 

sorcerer and commando healers are balanced in PvP. maybe operatives are too strong (energy managment is too easy, tactic advantage to easy to have, instant heal+heal over time, roll+vanish+ 2 cc), i agree.

[DanAxe]

My goal here isn't to sob all over the place over PvP, just acknowledge a situation and move on (I just don't like people calling it like it's not).

 

 

You saying i'm calling it like it's not? Well i was not making assumptions, neither was i "imagining" scenarios. I talk of what i see being done and of what i do.

 

So what i said its not only possible, it happens often... So dont tell me im calling something that its not.

 

At the end of the day it all comes down to the skill of the players and their awareness of whats going around them.

 

Ofc if you have a bad pug going with you, as skilled as you may be, you alone probably wont be able to win the game (but it is possible in some warzones). So the problem here is probably the pugs you get into? Well, complain about the pugs then, dont complain about healers being skill-less (cause thats what really pushed my buttons, and i know you didnt say that, so thats not meant for you mate).

 

Operatives need a Roll cooldown (even if just 5 secs or so) and less energy Regen.

Sorcs need MORE force regen and a little less healing power (i have to admit it is easy to get 1 player from 1-100% health really fast when not being focused by more than 1)

Mercs need ... well they need a lot, they are not op at all like other healers. Which is good in a way, because in order for you to be a really good merc healer u need to be a really good player and thats good for those douches who think healing is too easy, they should deffo try that out

 

But when all is said and done i think at top gear and ranked games healers are where they should be.

 

Bolstered and normal wzs? Yes you'll probably see many healers who dont know what they are doing that can still pull out 1M healing out of their arses. But thats just the same as a crap or unexperienced player picking up a smasher and do 1M damage... It's been happening for months, and people rage about it.. Now it seems they got something else to rage about... But trashing healers as a whole, and saying only girls play healers cause girls cant play games? Im not a girl and i feel offended on their behalf... I know girls who could teach these douchragers more than they ever thought would be possible to learn.

[MidichIorian]

Ive seen girls who have never played any game before play healz competently...never the same for DPS. Neither are that complicated, healing is for the people who are too stupid to even DPS as it take absolutely no skill.

 

 

Yes girls are terrible at games and that's why the majority play heals.

 

The end.

Hold on! I've come across a few girls in this and other games, genres where girls can be considered unicorns due to how rare they are, and I'm willing to bet that the good:bad ratio is no worse than for guys. Just look at how many bad male players there are for every good one. The main thing females in general have against themselves is that the majority didnt spend their youth playing video-and pc games.....but that's more a reflection of the female player pool and not the skill of those who did play.

 

That said, I think that healing is a bit over the top. Merc healers seem to be in a fairly good place, due to their other shortcomings, but sorcs and operatives need some tweaks. I wouldnt mind if sorcs were brought down a bit and got better force management instead. For operatives, nerf them to the ground or atleast do something about their mana, they never run out so they're allowed to spam their crap while walzing off and healing themselves to full.

Edited May 12, 2013 by MidichIorian

[Eillack]

Yes, pvp healing is way over the top right now. Add in a tank and it is just stupid....especially if it is a scoundrel being guarded. Emergency medpac is just beyond OP.

 

Try playing a CM, you'll see how crippled we still are.

 

So please, before you cry, how about to look beyond Sages and Scoundrels....

[Mercediz]

Healing should be pretty OP IMO... I look at it this way, if you are on a pug team and people don't focus and CC healers and guards. Then why should they be able to ignore the healer and still be able to kill targets ? It should take more then 1 DPS to kill a healer, That's sorta the advantage of being with pugs or a premade. You cant make healers to the point where you can train DPS on a target and it dies. I'm not saying its perfect now, and I'm not a healer class either.

[PerinnAybara]

Healing should be pretty OP IMO... I look at it this way, if you are on a pug team and people don't focus and CC healers and guards. Then why should they be able to ignore the healer and still be able to kill targets ? It should take more then 1 DPS to kill a healer, That's sorta the advantage of being with pugs or a premade. You cant make healers to the point where you can train DPS on a target and it dies. I'm not saying its perfect now, and I'm not a healer class either.

 

For many healers, their heals are casts, actually that's only the case for mercenaries :/

[throapy]

Am I the only one that thinks PVP healing is a bit ridiculous right now?

 

Let me first state that I know my gear isn't maxed and it does still need some updating (full Partisan, 1 piece of Conq) and this isn't a whine post, simply curious if anyone feels the same as I do.

 

I've always thought of healing in pvp as a support aspect, not a sole role. Healers in pvp are so efficient they are nearly impossible to bring down without multiple people focusing them. That being said, bring 3 healers, win. That's the new pvp system, it's not about skill imo, it's about how many healers you have.

 

It's pretty amazing how I can be hitting someone really hard, just to have them go from almost dead to full health. It's incredibly frustrating. Switch to the healer, another healer heals them. Or they pop their Paladin bubble or CC you, run away 1 cast top off. It makes pvp unbearable.

 

Once I blow my stun or interrupt they have free reign to just out heal any dps. One class should not require a team to take down.

 

For example, last game I played I did 350k dmg and 5 kills... another game I did 400+k and 0 kills. Something is wrong here... again, my dmg may not the best, but it still doesn't add up.

 

The day after they fix the smash monkey issue. And the day before the snipers, LOL.