The weird people you meet in Group Finder.

[DalekTheCat]

Minor weirdness in Hammer Station HM. I was on my sorc healer. My groupmates were a way overgeared jugg tank, a similarly overgeared sin DPS and a decently geared sorc DPS. On the triple boss they kill them strictly in order (Torch, Sawbones, Vorgan), not swiching targets even when the one they're beating on gets a shield. Apart from that the entire flashpoint went smoothly and there were no deaths. I was left wondering if they were too lazy to switch targets or just didn't realize what the shield does.

 

Most groups do that. The problem is that nobody ever wipes on that fight (don't tell me you've wiped on that, just don't, I'd like to maintain some faith in humanity) and nobody learns anything unless they wipe. Horribly.

 

So the dps just feel secure in going into braindead mode and not even noticing they're doing like 200 damage per hit.

[LuaRumina]

2 stories, pronouns are character's:

 

Lowbie Athiss on my new scoundrel, who is just below mob level and actually not overgeared for once. Everyone else is a level or so above - another scoundrel as healer, shadow "tank", and guardian dps. My 55 scoundrel is a healer and I don't really dps, so I'm excited to get a chance to try with a group.

 

But the shadow is in the wrong stance and doesn't pull. The guardian dps does. Repeatedly. Even after the healer and I both ask him not to. I whisper the tank at the start. The healer is trying, but keeps healing the tank when the guardian or I is taking all the hits. No, I do not get to use my back blast because I pull right off the guardian despite my gear (I had inheritance stuff because why not and I'd logged off thinking I'd gear up next time I logged on and naturally I forgot). With the use of tank markers and a tank actually taunting, we get past the first two bosses with the guardian dying half a dozen times. On both, naturally both the tank and the guardian completely ignore the adds, despite both healer and I saying something about it. I am very glad to have legacy markers to put down to explain things.

 

We get to the tunnels and all the sith-y golds. The other scoundrel has her out of combat CC and uses it. So of course the guardian jumps to it, the tank pulls a second guy, and later runs into the third because he won't sit still and tank. We wipe. Several times. And we keep telling the guardian to stay dead whenever he alone dies and he finally listens to us.

 

So, last boss. I explain the run away from flames bit. The tank decides to kite the boss and then stand in flames. But first the guardian dies because standing in flames is fun and the healer has either completely given up on him, or is ignoring the debuff (no cleanse yet, but you can heal the person whose health is randomly dropping, you know) and he was half dead from that.

 

So as the tank is starting to kite flames, suddenly the dead guardian is gone. Ok, he released. Not ok, he RAN BACK with FRIENDS. SO MANY FRIENDS. Healer and I rage quit. The end.

 

Second story, where everyone is bad, but we actually finish. SM Cademimu on my baby vanguard, who is slightly under level but way overgeared. I actually get a dps pop and swap gear and respec. I shouldn't have. The tank has had just enough experience to be worse than he should have been. The healer starts off by responding to my "Hi all" with "guard me" and repeats this throughout the fp. No guard goes out. Ever. Tank should have guarded me since I easily pull off during the first group. I hit my shield, medpac, burn like crazy, but the big droid finally gets me while the tank is not taunting ever. Here's a case where that stupid 5% reduction would have saved me. Because the healer wasn't anywhere near us, but back at the vendor droid through this long fight. I snark a little about not needing guard if you don't heal. Nope, healer says she's actually a dps.

 

And needs a guard.

 

And keeps telling us to wait. And complains about any single mob that hits her. Tank rushes and sometimes I, recuperating health, am not there for the pull. I immediately take care of adds on the healer, but this is not enough. Every blow is pure pain I guess.

 

I assume she respec'ed during one of those waits, because she actually heals and isn't too terrible the rest of the run, but I was bitter about dying and annoyed by her wanting guard so badly. She does try to CC trash, which tank leaps to. I die again on the big pull after the shortcut because I'm not getting heals and doing all the damage. Tank and other dps are fine.

 

Other dps and tank DO tunnel the boss when the droid activates and after the droid switches targets to the tank, he doesn't move and gets stunned. He lols and wonders how that happened, even though I quickly typed out what to do for the fight before he managed to pull.

 

Wookie boss. I'm typing out the two main strats as we go, but tank just says "leap on here", so shuttle it is. I hate shuttle. Healer agrees. I stop being bitter about dying because I love people who hate the shuttle strat in an absolving way. Tank pulls, then proceeds to stand 1) in front of the shuttle then 2) on the shuttle. I sigh, pop tank cell, and leap off since I have aggro anyway. Adds go down like butter with the flamethrower and die to the explosion just like it should happen.

 

Then tank decides everyone knows to run through the next mobs to the elevator, though of course other dps and healer don't (no real indication they haven't been here before other than them getting confused about what destination to click for the shuttle when there's only one you can actually select) and I try to save us. So we all wipe. Healer starts complaining again about getting hit during parts where mobs are spread out because I am the only one going after any of them. I hate the healer again. Why do I even try? The other dps is a gunslinger. With blinders like a cart horse.

 

After all that, General Ortol decides to not fire up the place where we're standing for the entire fight, so we don't have to move, and no one dies. Thank you, Ortol. We needed that.

Edited July 16, 2014 by LuaRumina
clarifying stuff, grammar

[slafko]

My merc healer running red reaper. After a while, in which no-one has died, the tank speaks up:

Tank: "*my name* why do you keep pulling aggro" (as in, hes been pulling all the fights, but ends up tunnel visioning)

Me: "Im just trying to keep everyone alive"

Dps1: "You noob, learn to control your aggro" (to me, not tank)

Tank: "You shouldnt let the enemies hit you, your the healer" (now personally when im healing I dont care if I get hit, I can look after myself, BUT, before I get flamed, I dont expect others to share that opinion and do my best to hold aggro when tanking)

Me: "DW about it, no1's died, im not fussed if I get hit afew times"

Tank: "control your aggro or leave"

Next pull I end up holding most of the aggro, at the end of the fight the tank throws a vote kick on me

 

And it goes through...

I love tunnel-vision tanks when I'm on my sage healer. If I don't get guard as soon as they load the instance, I'm getting it after the first pull. Because I'm unleashing Force Quake while they're tunnel-visioning that one silver mob. It's even funnier ten minutes later when they realise I've clicked that Guard off.

[thewitchdoctor]

lSHYGDDT

 

I Stole His Yummy Godiva-Double Drenched Truffle?

 

I am so rubbish at these!

[slafko]

I had to Google it. Thank god for UrbanDictionary.com.

[mustopak]

Short story. 16m TC HM, not exactly GF but weird-ish.

 

The group fills with 16man. The phase was set, people zoning in, and then the ops leader said "brb 5-7mins". Ok, no big deal. People are still zoning in and setting up ISOs anyways.

 

Lead : I'm gonna finish my lunch quick

DPS #1 : Why don't you eat lunch after the fight?

DPS #2 : lol ikr.

Lead : It's gonna be quick, please set up ISO while I eat lunch.

DPS #3 : SMH.

DPS #1 : Fo' real?

 

So we waited for this leader while setting up ISO. After 10 minutes people start to get annoyed and leave. I left too when it was down to 6man lol.

 

Story #2. Also TC HM 16man.

 

Almost everyone zoned in, set the ISOs, then the leader explained the loot rules. There's one random Sentinel who is a little bit undergeared for this fight, so leader said to prioritize gear loot for the Sentinel. This does not sit well with this guy from this annoying guild, he said "lame" then left. No surprise there considering the reputation of his guild. We started fight after getting some replacements.

 

So my sent jumped, and as the fight goes on, I noticed this undergear'd Watchman Sentinel rotation. Which makes my eyes hurt.

 

Strike > Strike > Strike > Slash > Slash > Strike > Cauterize > Strike > Slash > Slash

 

Oh my. I can't. I can't. We downed the boss and wow, that Sentinel just got carried.

[JouerTue]

lol at the lunch guy! i would have waited!

[thewitchdoctor]

His mom probably wouldn't let him wait any longer.

 

'JOHNNY! You come eat your lunch RIGHT THIS INSTANT!'

 

EDIT: Which reminds me once upon a time when Molten Core was the hip raid. We were taking a break letting people relax their killing fingers while we got ready for whatever boss we were working on. Anyways, our raid leader and main tank comes back to game - though not voice! - and starts setting up for the boss. We are all like, 'oooh OK, a quiet kill?' Anyways, MT starts the fight and we figure, 'OK, its on.' Fight goes OK for a wee bit ... until an advanced tank move or some such occurs ... that was beyond the learned-by-watching-over-Daddy's-shoulder son of our MT! Daddy got up, son sat down and was like, "Pssh, Pops, this is how you do it!'

Edited July 16, 2014 by thewitchdoctor

[Kingsbount]

"Lunch Wars: Return of Butter boy"?

 

Actually i would love to tell you about new sort of "weird" players.

I call them "Dread forged champions of Awsomeness"

 

You rarely can meet them in pugs, but if you do - beware.

You can think - Wow! This guy is full dreadforged! This is gonna be AWSOME run!

But then... You realize that he doesn't care about team work...

As a healers they usually doing more DPS than green numbers.

As DPS they position themselves as tanks (becouse i can solo it!).

As a tanks... Well... I can't say that they are bad tanks. But they are really obsessed with chain pulls. Even if team is still trying to manage mobs from previous pull.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Kingsbount

[slafko]

I was obsessed with chain pulls since Black Hole gear. Before that I was obsessed with chain pulls when Sin tanking Domain of Anguish in GW. Before that I was obsessed with chain headshot kills in UT.

[Dark_Mithrandir]

"Lunch Wars: Return of Butter boy"?

 

Actually i would love to tell you about new sort of "weird" players.

I call them "Dread forged champions of Awsomeness"

 

You rarely can meet them in pugs, but if you do - beware.

You can think - Wow! This guy is full dreadforged! This is gonna be AWSOME run!

But then... You realize that he doesn't care about team work...

As a healers they usually doing more DPS than green numbers.

As DPS they position themselves as tanks (becouse i can solo it!).

As a tanks... Well... I can't say that they are bad tanks. But they are really obsessed with chain pulls. Even if team is still trying to manage mobs from previous pull.

 

Dread forge is very easy to have. It's in dp/df hm and we cant call that ops hard to be honest.

 

Dread master full geared (with bonus) it's where you can find some good players and not even always because now df nightmare is "debuffed" making it not that hard. Healers can take a nap on some bosses haha

Edited July 16, 2014 by Dark_Mithrandir

[Irongut]

Are there seriously still people unclear of the concept of KDY?!

 

I still regularly zone into Korriban or Tython and have people say "oh no we can't do this we have no tank/healer*"

 

* delete as appropriate

[ZentheSecond]

@Kingsbount;

Chain pull all the things! Like... Seriously I do chain pull an entire FP, but I generally wait till the lash mob of the previous pack is dead or about to die before zipping off to the next one. Cause.. Well, I want the achievements and a quick run.

[Kingsbount]

@Kingsbount;

Chain pull all the things! Like... Seriously I do chain pull an entire FP, but I generally wait till the lash mob of the previous pack is dead or about to die before zipping off to the next one. Cause.. Well, I want the achievements and a quick run.

 

And your team at full energy and health. Becouse if team at 50% and you doing chain pull... Well... Your tanking is suck.

I really hope that you dont do such things.

[Jeweledleah]

Dread forge is very easy to have. It's in dp/df hm and we cant call that ops hard to be honest.

 

Dread master full geared (with bonus) it's where you can find some good players and not even always because now df nightmare is "debuffed" making it not that hard. Healers can take a nap on some bosses haha

 

and Elitist statement if I've heard one.

 

those ops are still hard for most people.

 

and I've seen this attitude from so-called elite raiders before, in other games as well, not just TOR. becasue they can solo something they don't give a damn about anyone else in their group, they only queued becasue its the only way to get daily commendations at the end of the run. once they are in - they don't give a damn anymore.

[DataBeaver]

Dread forge is very easy to have. It's in dp/df hm and we cant call that ops hard to be honest.

 

Dread master full geared (with bonus) it's where you can find some good players and not even always because now df nightmare is "debuffed" making it not that hard. Healers can take a nap on some bosses haha

Speak for yourself. My raiding guild is struggling with Corruptor Zero HM at the moment. I'm sure we'll beat it in a few more weeks, but it's still hard enough for us.

 

Also, a lot of people are not in raiding guilds. For those people dread forged gear is nigh impossible to have since the rare PUG runs of DF/DP HM generally require showing the achievement before you can get in.

[Khevar]

And your team at full energy and health. Becouse if team at 50% and you doing chain pull... Well... Your tanking is suck.

I really hope that you dont do such things.

If the team is at 50%, the problem isn't chain pulling, the problem is the tank isn't holding aggro.

 

When I'm on my Shadow tank, I chain pull all the way through to the end, and I hold aggro so the healer usually only has to heal me (aoe damage notwithstanding). I get plenty of compliments whenever I do this.

 

-----

 

Now for a story of my own. Leveling my Operative healer, I finally hit 50 and decided to run some regular HM FPs (hadn't done any in a while). Had two interesting experiences:

 

1. HM LI. The tank says he's done it before. Nobody else has. I'm up for a challenge, so why not? We muscle our way through LR-5 with several wipes. The dps like to stand IN the dropped energy coils . The tank and myself finally kill him with both dps dead on the ground. /shrug

 

We make it to Sav-Rak. DPS #1 is demanding everyone spacebar through the 15 second cutscene (despite the fact that according to his achievements, he's NEVER run this flashpoint either in SM or HM). Go figure. DPS #2 asks for the strat. As tank is typing it DPS #1 pulls.

 

Everyone but me gets knocked off the platform on the first smash. /oy vei.

 

2nd try, I explain about the smash. Tank pulls. Everyone else gets knocked off the platform again.

 

3rd try, everyone else knocked off again. I use small words and try to explain you have to stand INSIDE the model of the boss at the exact center of the boss.

 

4th try, DPS #2 figures it out, everyone else gets knocked off. 5th and 6th tries both dps figures it out, but the tank keeps getting knocked off. Between LR-5 and Sav-Rak, I've now accrued a large repair bill, and I'm getting tired. I bow out, drop group and go to sleep.

 

I figure I was just unlucky, so I queue again the next day and get:

 

2. HM Boarding Party. The tank and both dps are pretty green, and have practically no achievements on flashpoints. But everyone has to start somewhere, so what the heck.

 

Begin a 2-hour slog through Boarding Party. Everyone is nice, no rudeness, (which helps and is the reason why I stuck around), but the poor tank cannot hold aggro on ANYTHING. I have to heal both dps and myself a LOT, and rarely have to heal the tank, which is a bad indicator. Particularly when you note that it takes the dps a long time to kill ANYTHING, so it's not like they're pulling off the tank because they have such stellar dps.

 

We hit a complete brick wall at Chief Engineer Kels, as we just cannot beat the enrage timer. One of the dps drops, and we get a 180-geared level 55 replacement who then (unsurprisingly) proceeds to one-shot Kels and Jorland.

 

/le sigh

Edited July 16, 2014 by Khevar

[ZentheSecond]

@kingsbount;

I always tell the healer to yell at me if I am goin to fast. Only really Sorc healers need a pause to recharge, Ops and Mercs are quite good at keeping resources down while keeping up on heals. Hell I think most Ops only put probes on me during thrash and use their bigger heals on boss fights and more difficult trash.

 

 

@jeweledleah;

May sound like an elitist statement but its more of a factual statement. Anyone who has done NiM DF prior to the buff falling off as a healer can plainly see the difference in damage being done. We do Nefra without cleanses now cause they are bored lol, and Grob is a walk in the park to heal (the mechanics are tank ones not a heal ones mind you) cause the adds do not instagib those they target.

 

New healers see the damage and get worried and think its a lot. Eventually they will get use to the values going out and become bored...

[Jeweledleah]

@kingsbount;

I always tell the healer to yell at me if I am goin to fast. Only really Sorc healers need a pause to recharge, Ops and Mercs are quite good at keeping resources down while keeping up on heals. Hell I think most Ops only put probes on me during thrash and use their bigger heals on boss fights and more difficult trash.

 

 

@jeweledleah;

May sound like an elitist statement but its more of a factual statement. Anyone who has done NiM DF prior to the buff falling off as a healer can plainly see the difference in damage being done. We do Nefra without cleanses now cause they are bored lol, and Grob is a walk in the park to heal (the mechanics are tank ones not a heal ones mind you) cause the adds do not instagib those they target.

 

New healers see the damage and get worried and think its a lot. Eventually they will get use to the values going out and become bored...

 

again. Elitist statement if I have heard one. you are assuming that just becasue its easy for you - its easy for everyone. you are assuming people have done NIM Nefra. except vast majority of the player base? have not. its still difficult for most people, especially people who do not have guilds with enough people that can also easily do that content. try looking outside of your own little bubble every once in a while.

 

full 180 is easy, given how fast you can farm up ultimate coms. full dread forged? is a whole different story

 

and yes I say that as someone in a guild that's been doing one night clears of both hardmodes (not all the guildies though, just progression groups) before summer struck and have been killing NIM Nefra. but I'm also painfully aware just how quickly farm content can turn into a ********* when not everyone is on a ball.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Jeweledleah

[ZentheSecond]

again. Elitist statement if I have heard one. you are assuming that just becasue its easy for you - its easy for everyone. you are assuming people have done NIM Nefra. except vast majority of the player base? have not. its still difficult for most people, especially people who do not have guilds with enough people that can also easily do that content. try looking outside of your own little bubble every once in a while.

 

full 180 is easy, given how fast you can farm up ultimate coms. full dread forged? is a whole different story

 

and yes I say that as someone in a guild that's been doing one night clears of both hardmodes (not all the guildies though, just progression groups) before summer struck and have been killing NIM Nefra. but I'm also painfully aware just how quickly farm content can turn into a ********* when not everyone is on a ball.

 

Okay then, back it out and remove NiM completely. Throw it back to the days when HM DP/DF 5/5 in both was the thing to be as a guild.

 

You had 3 sets of groups;

1 night full clears

2 night full clears

No full clears

 

The only thing that made a group move up the rungs of those groups was getting use to the fight. I feel like many groups do not attempt the harder content cause they do not want to spend a 3 hour raid night wiping. Well guess what, hate to say it, but if you want to clear the content you need to put in the time. And you had groups that went from never full clearing DF/DP HMs to full clearing them in 1 night. They then got bored, just as healers/dps/tanks can get bored when they know the content they are going into. They know what is going to happen at X time or Y time during the fights.

 

Just like how NiM is now to some groups, and especially now in DF with the power buff gone. Some of the fights are... really boring to people because they know the mechanics. Healers know the damage spikes, Tanks know when to pop specific Cooldowns, and dps know when they are able to do their burst or sustain their rotation for longer periods. Same thing happened in HM, it'll happen to NiM and it'll happen in the new content when it comes out.

 

In the end, I partly wonder if there aren't more guilds out there that COULD do the content. The only thing that stops them is the "Nightmare Barrier". Where they feel that because the content is Nightmare, its outside of their reach cause its harder. Yes its harder, its suppose to be harder. The other part of this barrier is something that can effect any level of content... The time required. If teams can clear DP/DF HM in 1 night of raiding, do they really want to step into NiM DF? Where they may spend their entire night of raiding and only down... 1 boss? 2 bosses?

Not likely... People want gear. And the gear you get from doing NiM is only a little bit better then that of HM... So the reward isn't there for some groups to do it. They just keep doing the same old Ops week after week...

 

 

*shrugs*

In the end, your opinion is your own. Nothing I can do or say will change it, you've decided I'm some elitist when I'm far from it. As the typical Elitist would come along and just say "L2P n00b" and move on. Do I? Nope. Cause I've seen the full gambit; from being in a group that couldn't clear HM Zero and never stepped foot into HM DP (Cause we had Nefra/Draxus/Grob on farm and therefore loot), into a group that had DF/DP on 1 night full clears, into a group that is NiM DF full clear w/ timed title and working through NiM DP.

 

Its been a long road, and I know what it takes. Takes wiping... a lot. And I doubt many people have the stomach for wiping for 2 raid nights on a single boss... Let alone putting in 130 pulls on a single boss just to kill it the first time.

[Brutal]

best one i had was on my gf low lvl assasin (20) qued for kdy up on loading the grup asked me if im sure i can tank this it may be too chelanging ( was qued as dps or tank for hammer station) ended up saving day quite a few times

[TACeMossie]

"Lunch Wars: Return of Butter boy"?

 

Actually i would love to tell you about new sort of "weird" players.

I call them "Dread forged champions of Awsomeness"

 

You rarely can meet them in pugs, but if you do - beware.

You can think - Wow! This guy is full dreadforged! This is gonna be AWSOME run!

But then... You realize that he doesn't care about team work...

As a healers they usually doing more DPS than green numbers.

As DPS they position themselves as tanks (becouse i can solo it!).

As a tanks... Well... I can't say that they are bad tanks. But they are really obsessed with chain pulls. Even if team is still trying to manage mobs from previous pull.

 

Im guilty of being a DPS in a mix of dread forged/dread masters that positions himself as a tank.

 

Mainly because its better for me to take damage when I pull aggro (inevitable) than the entire group. The good tanks do use the taunt button though, so I only pull aggro until the 1 minute mark.

 

3 seconds before the boss dies

Edited July 17, 2014 by TACeMossie

[Jeweledleah]

Okay then, back it out and remove NiM completely. Throw it back to the days when HM DP/DF 5/5 in both was the thing to be as a guild.

 

You had 3 sets of groups;

1 night full clears

2 night full clears

No full clears

 

The only thing that made a group move up the rungs of those groups was getting use to the fight. I feel like many groups do not attempt the harder content cause they do not want to spend a 3 hour raid night wiping. Well guess what, hate to say it, but if you want to clear the content you need to put in the time. And you had groups that went from never full clearing DF/DP HMs to full clearing them in 1 night. They then got bored, just as healers/dps/tanks can get bored when they know the content they are going into. They know what is going to happen at X time or Y time during the fights.

 

Just like how NiM is now to some groups, and especially now in DF with the power buff gone. Some of the fights are... really boring to people because they know the mechanics. Healers know the damage spikes, Tanks know when to pop specific Cooldowns, and dps know when they are able to do their burst or sustain their rotation for longer periods. Same thing happened in HM, it'll happen to NiM and it'll happen in the new content when it comes out.

 

In the end, I partly wonder if there aren't more guilds out there that COULD do the content. The only thing that stops them is the "Nightmare Barrier". Where they feel that because the content is Nightmare, its outside of their reach cause its harder. Yes its harder, its suppose to be harder. The other part of this barrier is something that can effect any level of content... The time required. If teams can clear DP/DF HM in 1 night of raiding, do they really want to step into NiM DF? Where they may spend their entire night of raiding and only down... 1 boss? 2 bosses?

Not likely... People want gear. And the gear you get from doing NiM is only a little bit better then that of HM... So the reward isn't there for some groups to do it. They just keep doing the same old Ops week after week...

 

 

*shrugs*

In the end, your opinion is your own. Nothing I can do or say will change it, you've decided I'm some elitist when I'm far from it. As the typical Elitist would come along and just say "L2P n00b" and move on. Do I? Nope. Cause I've seen the full gambit; from being in a group that couldn't clear HM Zero and never stepped foot into HM DP (Cause we had Nefra/Draxus/Grob on farm and therefore loot), into a group that had DF/DP on 1 night full clears, into a group that is NiM DF full clear w/ timed title and working through NiM DP.

 

Its been a long road, and I know what it takes. Takes wiping... a lot. And I doubt many people have the stomach for wiping for 2 raid nights on a single boss... Let alone putting in 130 pulls on a single boss just to kill it the first time.

 

you know, you have just proven my point, right?

 

if clearing hardmodes was easy - everyone would do it. its not. and its not easy for variety of reasons, one of them being - it takes effort and time investment to get to a point where you whole group knows the content and the characters they are playing so well, they are bored of it. now one person. a group of people. the reason why getting oriconian gear is easy is becasue you can pug your way to it with minimum effort. you can do so by running various weeklies you don't need a team. you don't need anyone else to be a good player.

 

so it feels easy to you becasue you've done all the work getting there. you were motivated to do all the work and were with people who were also motivated to do all the work, put forth all that effort. but... very few people are like that. there are statistics out there, just how much of the minority raiders are. any kind of raiders, but especially hardmode and beyond raiders.

 

and then there's also the fact that anyone can be a decent player, but it takes at least a good player to be able to do hardmodes and beyond. and not everyone can be that. even with help, even with instruction, even with practice. not everyone can be that. not everyone has the reflexes etc.

 

so no. Dread forged gear is NOT easy to get. not for majority of people.

[jrwellworth]

you know, you have just proven my point, right?

 

if clearing hardmodes was easy - everyone would do it. its not. and its not easy for variety of reasons, one of them being - it takes effort and time investment to get to a point where you whole group knows the content and the characters they are playing so well, they are bored of it. now one person. a group of people. the reason why getting oriconian gear is easy is becasue you can pug your way to it with minimum effort. you can do so by running various weeklies you don't need a team. you don't need anyone else to be a good player.

 

so it feels easy to you becasue you've done all the work getting there. you were motivated to do all the work and were with people who were also motivated to do all the work, put forth all that effort. but... very few people are like that. there are statistics out there, just how much of the minority raiders are. any kind of raiders, but especially hardmode and beyond raiders.

 

and then there's also the fact that anyone can be a decent player, but it takes at least a good player to be able to do hardmodes and beyond. and not everyone can be that. even with help, even with instruction, even with practice. not everyone can be that. not everyone has the reflexes etc.

 

so no. Dread forged gear is NOT easy to get. not for majority of people.

 

I'd like to know which server your on, if you are on mine (BC pub) I'd like to take you to get you kitted out in full dread forged in one, yes one, night. Show you just how simple it can be, with a little teamwork here, sprinkle some teamspeak 3 on that, some bad jokes, me dropping my lit smokes on my keyboard or down my shirt, some instruction and there ya go, do 8/10, or council if ya really want the MH and your there minus one relic. Maybe an earpiece also, Bestia has hated us lately.

 

Seriously though, all these guys are saying is that it is easy for some, and nim df healing has became easy for some. I don't think the guys over at zorz or severity are stressed when they gotta heal nim df. It's the same when you have done the same dailies, flashpoints, story mode operations etc over and over. They become a breeze. How is it elitist to say that? Since when has it become elitist to be good? There always has to be someone.

[jrwellworth]

Okay then, back it out and remove NiM completely. Throw it back to the days when HM DP/DF 5/5 in both was the thing to be as a guild.

 

You had 3 sets of groups;

1 night full clears

2 night full clears

No full clears

 

The only thing that made a group move up the rungs of those groups was getting use to the fight. I feel like many groups do not attempt the harder content cause they do not want to spend a 3 hour raid night wiping. Well guess what, hate to say it, but if you want to clear the content you need to put in the time. And you had groups that went from never full clearing DF/DP HMs to full clearing them in 1 night. They then got bored, just as healers/dps/tanks can get bored when they know the content they are going into. They know what is going to happen at X time or Y time during the fights.

 

Just like how NiM is now to some groups, and especially now in DF with the power buff gone. Some of the fights are... really boring to people because they know the mechanics. Healers know the damage spikes, Tanks know when to pop specific Cooldowns, and dps know when they are able to do their burst or sustain their rotation for longer periods. Same thing happened in HM, it'll happen to NiM and it'll happen in the new content when it comes out.

 

In the end, I partly wonder if there aren't more guilds out there that COULD do the content. The only thing that stops them is the "Nightmare Barrier". Where they feel that because the content is Nightmare, its outside of their reach cause its harder. Yes its harder, its suppose to be harder. The other part of this barrier is something that can effect any level of content... The time required. If teams can clear DP/DF HM in 1 night of raiding, do they really want to step into NiM DF? Where they may spend their entire night of raiding and only down... 1 boss? 2 bosses?

Not likely... People want gear. And the gear you get from doing NiM is only a little bit better then that of HM... So the reward isn't there for some groups to do it. They just keep doing the same old Ops week after week...

 

 

*shrugs*

In the end, your opinion is your own. Nothing I can do or say will change it, you've decided I'm some elitist when I'm far from it. As the typical Elitist would come along and just say "L2P n00b" and move on. Do I? Nope. Cause I've seen the full gambit; from being in a group that couldn't clear HM Zero and never stepped foot into HM DP (Cause we had Nefra/Draxus/Grob on farm and therefore loot), into a group that had DF/DP on 1 night full clears, into a group that is NiM DF full clear w/ timed title and working through NiM DP.

 

Its been a long road, and I know what it takes. Takes wiping... a lot. And I doubt many people have the stomach for wiping for 2 raid nights on a single boss... Let alone putting in 130 pulls on a single boss just to kill it the first time.

 

Nothing elitist about it man. Just takes a certain kind of people. I could care less if we wipe 130 times on a boss as long as were making progress. When that clear comes it will be sweet. I was elated on my teams first HM council kill. After all the drama, the problems with scheduling, putting a team together, everything that went into it. I'm proud of the work we've done the progress we have made. In that time, I've also made good friends, people that I call at home the sht with. I've had great fun. The homework, the optimizing, the learning the fights, the wiping, it is all worth it for me, cause 3 days a week me and my buds hop on and have a good old time, progressing and wiping, and throwing headsets and all that comes with it.

 

You are right, it does take a certain type, and ya it might get bit boring to farm grobby or raptus for the umpteenth time, that is not elitist, it's just a fact. Ya the large majority might not do it, but they could if they wanted to, the other poster sells em short. It just takes some time and dedication.