Here come the multi-boxers >.<

[Blackardin]

The guy i quoted was talking about money, not playstyle.

 

Speaking about your post, keep in mind that we are all different, and so are our views on what is fun and what is not. Playing loads of characters at the same time online in a multiplayer game may not be something you'd like to do, but this is definitely something he likes, and there's nothing wrong with that.

 

 

The problem with this line of thinking is that it fails to take into account that this individuals "style" of playing was not intended as part of that or any game. It also negatively affects the game play of a vastly larger contingent of players. Comparing that to removing some intended aspect of the game that does not negatively affect the game play intent of others is not a valid comparison.

 

This issue is basically an abomination created by players, not an intended game-play style.

[Blackardin]

Personally I didn't realize /follow had been removed from WoW. It’s an interesting move on Blizzard’s part and (now that I ask internally) we are already looking at any possible negative aspects that might occur if multi-boxing within SWTOR was to become a ‘thing’. I'll be clear that certain ways of technically implementing multi-boxing are very much against the Terms of Service, so I would suggest erring on the side of caution and not depend on existing functionality staying static...

 

It was a brilliant move.....and hopefully your team is equally astute as there is a much bigger game end-game, with much higher lewt levels being played here then just the one us players are enjoying. ;p

Edited March 9, 2013 by Blackardin

[Trollokdamus]

The problem with this line of thinking is that it fails to take into account that this individuals "style" of playing was not intended as part of that or any game. It also negatively affects the game play of a vastly larger contingent of players. Comparing that to removing some intended aspect of the game that does not negatively affect the game play intent of others is not a valid comparison.

 

This issue is basically an abomination created by players, not an intended game-play style.

 

It was not intended originally, but for a long time this playstyle is known and tolerated by Blizzard, which means it's a valid way of playing. The only game area which is negatively affected by multiboxers is BG's, but not on a large scale. If the negative effect would be really noticable, this way of playing would be banned long ago.

[translucentwolf]

I don't think multiboxing in our warzones will work terribly well. Huttball for instance. Hard to have 1 bot head for the zone, while 2 guard you as the carrier, and you carry.

[ivanhedgehog]

Blah... blah... blah... blah.

 

You sir are completely and totally missing the point.

 

You are assuming that the multi-boxers in question are complete and total noobs to multi-boxing. The people we're talking about, and specifically the person that this article is about, are people with over half a decade of experience doing what it is they do. You assume that these people are inexperienced and that they will have problems and you keep saying things like, "It's not as easy as you think."

 

No, it's not as easy as some people think. Because they've never done it. BUT IT IS as easy as some people think for THIS guy and all the other Multi-boxers that are going to be leaving WoW. They have the equipment. They have the resources. They have the know how.

 

If a dude was able to mutli-box 40 accounts... F-O-U-R-T-Y... in WoW... I'm pretty sure he won't have many issues with handling a 4 man group of LOLSmashers.

 

Ya..40 accounts. he fires a 400 hp damage shot at you and does 16000 point of damage..and that is a light shot. 1 shot to kill your healer, 1 more for each dps. how often can you fire a shot like that? repeatedly?

[ivanhedgehog]

It was not intended originally, but for a long time this playstyle is known and tolerated by Blizzard, which means it's a valid way of playing. The only game area which is negatively affected by multiboxers is BG's, but not on a large scale. If the negative effect would be really noticable, this way of playing would be banned long ago.

 

they are saying ok you can multibox..as long as you do it without /follow. And that the dont put a lot of weight on multibox players complaints.

[LordExozone]

Any game that allows this multiboxing looses a customer in me. It is cheating, plain and simple. Its like going into a boxing match, and when your opponent emerges, you find out its not just him, but him and 40 clones of him stepping into the ring.

Thankfully I haven't seen it in any game since WoW.

[Stoofa]

Any game that allows this multiboxing looses a customer in me. It is cheating, plain and simple. Its like going into a boxing match, and when your opponent emerges, you find out its not just him, but him and 40 clones of him stepping into the ring.

Thankfully I haven't seen it in any game since WoW.

 

But it wouldn't be quite like that. As you stepped into the ring and saw him and his 40 clones you'd surely just step out of the ring?

If I came across a multiboxer in a WZ I'd quit it. If I came across one in an event I'd leave the area - jump instance etc.

A multiboxer is really only ruining their own game, and to be fair, a game that is pretty easy with the exception of ops and then you're supposed to be playing with other people.

The multiboxer simply wants to play such games in single player mode - grand luck to them.

[CrazyOldMystic]

Multi boxing is a cheat. Its kinda simple really. All classes are attempted to be balanced with each other in some form or another. Multiple players playing against each other do not think the same way, so it makes for interesting competition. A multi boxer comes in with one class and has say 6 toons of that class, with one mind working behind six toons, and throws the balance of the game completely out of wack. Now these rich kids can claim all they want that its not cheating but it is. Otherwise op guardians or op snipers would be acceptable by the devs. They would have never nerfed so many classes sense launch.

 

The fact that world of warcraft has made this move is extremely interesting. I wonder if they plan on correcting other mistakes of the past. Ill have to keep an eye on things over there.

[Tycoon]

hummm... Let take a look at the math. 40 accounts have left WoW

 

ok so Blizzard had 9.6 million last time reported. 9.6 million x 14.99 = 143,904,000

 

if this information is correct, then blizzard has now 9,599,960 accounts. 9,599,960 x 14.99 = 143,903,400

 

/srcasm oh yah... Blizzard must be really hurting now...

 

God i hate this guy. His head is so far up his *** if he thinks Blizzard really cares about a few accounts.

[BPStarsiege]

Hmmmm logged into forums to investigate if I could bind or macro emoticons or companion abilities, so I could taunt an enemy on killing blow in WZ or be able to get my companion back round a corner out of los to draw ranged npcs close together etc. Came across this post and had to reply reading some comments.

 

Multi-Boxing is not really cheating, in essence you are not botting you are not hacking you are just a single person controlling more than one acct(of which ea acct has been paid for) For a decent Multibox setup thats worthwhile you need to subscribe or somehow get a decent Boxing application. Who wants a bunch of pcs running chewing up electricity whether or not you have connected em to one keyboard or mouse when a boxing client can do it all in one pc one monitor. I used ISBoxer for WoW/Eve that required me to be subscribed to innerspace then once setup I would have an active window for current character and smaller windows elsewhere on screen (you setup window position sizing etc). once done you then setup your profiles ie when my main cast lightning on enemy two of my alts join him another heals me and another groups heals etc(just basic example) and clicking on an alts lil window switched it to be main character other rotates to lil screen and profile changes so now when this guy hits a key for one of his abilities alt one does x alt does y and so on. Ea time you switched main(i rarely did) all alts would now follow the new main(that there is prolly the real exploit I saw and biggest reason for me to get it cos I originally had multi pcs etc and had use of family friends and my 2nd acct toons etc while they werent playing) but was a drag and I got annoyed and when looking for peripheral and cost to connect keyboard and mouse to all systems came across ISboxer and few others. I checked legalities because as far as I was concerned using multi pc and multiple keyboards etc with ea acct being paid for could not be something they could have a go at me for.) It wasnt against ToC cos I wasnt breaking anything or tampering just had it so I didnt have to hit 1 on 5 keyboards etc. Originally I would run ea toon to where I was hunting and would camp a section my alts just sat their (friends got xp while at work etc and I was working overtime cos I was doing dmg and killing things splitting xp to all of us and other than buffs pre fight and one or two heals mid fight from the alt healer I didnt want to hit buttons and move mouse all the time for all of em). With the auto switch follow in app I was overjoyed I could run all to camp at once etc. Dont really see it as cheating cos to do a decent 5man boss etc you still needed 5 and that still meant 5 accts were being paid for.

 

As far as pvp goes its even less of a cheat if any... I have known some awesome boxers in my yrs of mmos and they would dominate in pvp.... only if the ppl up against didnt know their ****. Its easy to set yourself up and pve in your own controlled environment you've chosen... how does one do that pvp? wicked you got isboxer you got 5 toons that devastate and kill everything you all follow chain cast have setup heals etc... what do you do when I run straight upto you not worried I am pansy caster and use a separate and cc ability or two while then starting to properly engage one of your characters... ie - your boxed alts are now running around feared knocked back asleep etc hopefully the ones not cc'd run out of follow range so you cant make use of the follow key to gather your composure and then proceed start on your healer or priority target of my choice. Multiboxers strategy goes downhill and 7 times out of 10 I would trump or come close on a 4-5 on 1 handicap. pvp is not scripted and cant be anticipated so take out that boxing ability and the boxer ends up having to give up worrying about control of 1+ (as many as you can break off the box there and then) and has to deal with controlling the characters he still has doing what he wants with every key stroke. watch how many boxers die in the arse when their system that they have been relying on goes pair shape. I know cos it is why i wouldnt box pvp in wow. you lose alt following or ccd etc and you dont have time to run your main close enough to pick up the follow etc... I willl kill you before you got em all gathered... instead you would start focusing on me at more of a one on one lvl and worry bout picking your alts up after the battle... Hehe 5 accts or whatever you pay for and someone calls it cheating in pvp... I call it waste of accts. The hardest thing is cc in pvp boxing...all your toons scatter diff directions you cant really setup break stun keys etc cos if done logically youd really want them bound to same key stroke all accts, which wastes 4 cooldowns cos you needed to free one person. with all the diff abilities etc and things you could setup you dont really want break stun on diff key for ea toon as you'd need alot of abilities and keybinding slots to setup the other actions taken by the ones not breaking the stun when you hit that button. And when I get cained by a boxer I dont think cheat I dont think i was outmatched... I think they got mad skills cos my own skills break up most boxers ability setups which in essence breaks them.

 

and btw I have no quarm with not being able to use macro or box if game dont want me to just would have been nice to assign emotes etc to keys or something cos i aint gonna try type /fistbump while 1sec cast killing blow knowing theres 2 others left, but would love to do that sort of taunting in pvp as I wouldnt really use the emotes otherwise unless bored talking to friend in fleet. Macros in WoW werent frowned upon cos you still needed to know your role and rotations etc macros just simplified it all so while running a raid I could be guiding my noob r/l mate that could be sitting beside me on what to do where to stand etc without having to be 110% on the ball. The game designers can stop major exploits used via macroing... I used a 696 or 969 69er rotation as paladin in wow when tanking and had a chain of 6 second cooldowns setup on button 1 and 9 second ones on the 2 and could spam 1,2 for most things just making sure I do whats needed during different phases of event. Most ppl had something setup and more and more joined me and those I had joined on a decent complex 2 button spam only for blizz to put in certain procs for example... one of my abilities now gets boost or mana cut when another ability procs meaning you want to use it then not just spam it so that macro button spam rotation goes out of window cos the abilities now work better or rely on other abilities for most use... You could still keep your macro but you'd be sub par to someone going through a standard key rotation. So theres heaps of ways to stop exploited in-game macros. I want in-game macros more so for the cosmetic and social aspect so I can hit a button and I send an emote and say something. And to be honest Im cool with no macro but am pissed I cant drag companion ability from ability page or emoticon list to my hotbar.

 

I havent boxed in a while and only got back into gaming recently after yr or so getting heavy into my paintball, racing etc. but love the ability to box cos its fun when you start knowing an mmo back to front and can actually add playability to a game you may have spent 5-10less playing if not for mucking round trying to kill epic **** by yourself... woot you killed a 10man raid solo... hmmm at 10xmonthly subscription = deserved if willing to pay for it. (not too mention if they all your accts thats all the accts you need to gear up which can be alot of effort and time over single toon - and if boxing using mates characters thats just good mates dont call cheater cos you obviously have no r/l mates on game or none that let you use their acct.

 

And macros rock can be controlled by devs and other than novelty take some time to setup decent ones cos lets face it you can setup macroing in the windows environment that will transfer in-game anyway so its not like they actually stop ppl. Guess gonna have to setup programmable key macro to /fistbump my next victim upon death.

 

In Conclusion Boxing is an expensive way to PvE but not really exploit and a skillful art in pvp unless someone manages to snipe with a couple of cycles of all their toons ranged nukes. sorry post is long winded and could be simplified but its hell late half asleep and I was just doing my macro search before I went to bed when came across this post.

[BPStarsiege]

Just read my previous post god damn that was longer than it felt typing it out hehe. But after reading it and realizing most points are justified I left out one HUGE factor... The world revolves around getting more if you are willing to pay.

How is someone that wants to pay for multiple accts and be less social on a MMO in the process any different to me being able to do alot more than a free to play player can or that I got on and within first day had 12 toons created all decked out with gear and sold my mate that got me into it a couple of super mounts thanks to cartel. Is that cheating because I chose to do that when I started instead of wasting the cash the next night at a club pub etc like I would. This whole thread when you encompass the game mechanics itself without the boxing/macro theory is based on attacking ppl who are willing to pay to get ahead. I dont make any more than the next low lvl blue collar but that week or once a month whatever the case may be, I make sacrifices because opening some stoopid lil box in a game gives me a smile or subscribing so I can have more alts go more places and do things you cant for free. I aint ever heard a free to play call a sub a cheat... why not based on theory behind multiple accts etc. Starting day 1 with +41 gems, adaptive armor, half global legacy unlocked and few mill credits selling some mounts from cartel to mate for under half what they were on trade is alot more epic in scale and game unbalancing than I ever found in boxing. You need skill to box something thats not grinding and is aimed at your lvl and gear (other than easy tank spank bosses) the event script mechanics are still involving you making multiple logical actions to accomplish the task as the game considers you as multiple players thinking individually which is easier when you think about an event where at this point tanks need to move to "X and do something, dmg have to cc or kill adds from over near "y" and healers poss pick up something floating around to give em bonus or mitigation needed to survive a phase (example). Boxing costs money 9 times out of 10 and out of it the avg boxer will do so to see if he could kill a lower tier raid(ops) without another real person for drops or carry low lvl alts etc. Not sure I seen or heard of more than one or two in the 9mill wow players that could box raids intended for individuals at their characters tier lvl. And is alot harder than having ea of those accts run by person that only has to do his role at any one time.

 

Welcome to the World my friends. Everything is going free with the pay for more option.

[Blackholeskipper]

Personally I didn't realize /follow had been removed from WoW. It’s an interesting move on Blizzard’s part and (now that I ask internally) we are already looking at any possible negative aspects that might occur if multi-boxing within SWTOR was to become a ‘thing’. I'll be clear that certain ways of technically implementing multi-boxing are very much against the Terms of Service, so I would suggest erring on the side of caution and not depend on existing functionality staying static...

 

Great that you guys are active on the forums but why is it always follow WoW? Swtor needs more initiative.

[JoeeyyMagzz]

I have never and will never multibox for the sole reason that it is just too damn expensive. But, if people have the money to do this then why should the company or other players care? Multiboxer's pay per account just as much as we do, they have to spend more money on crazy computer set ups (especially if they intend on multiboxing swtor), and they have to spend hours upon hours configuring and tinkering to get all of their toons to act properly when they send key commands. To me, that is not something that should be stopped, limited, or looked down upon because these people are working incredibly hard to do this. It's not easy to do and not everyone can do it, but those are not reasons to stop others that do have that ability.

 

Also, to stop multiboxer's causes companies to lose out on a lot of subscription money every month... I saw one guy had 100 WoW accounts for the last 6 years My brain nearly exploded.... lol He was the exception to the rule, but multiboxer's, from what I've seen, typically run at least 5 accounts at a time for WoW, which I guess they would only run 4 accounts on SWTOR.

[Ailie]

I'm pretty sure I've already seen some, and reported them too. Same advanced classes, mirror actions, similar names. And both times the class of choice has been snipers.

[abokado]

I can understand blocking the /follow command in PvP because it would me unfair towards other players.. though I'm wondering - I don't know anything about the PvP in WoW, so sorry - aren't they like gimping themselves if they multibox in pvp? I mean, it wouldn't work in tor at all. Sure, the person could go attacking a node and others could defend, but I really cannot see how multiboxing may be any kind of advantage in pvp. At all. So, I guess multiboxing shouldn't be allowed in pvp because it would be unfair for your group mates since there is a higher probalitiy of losing?

Well, I don't really care. If someone wants to pay multiple accounts and can play them at the same time, go ahead, I guess.

[keitzy]

This game actually would be hard to multi box.

A group cannot consist of more than four and OP's cannot enter any instances other than op's.

So basicly any class quests cannot be done plus xp is only shared as a group.

If the same class in a group of four then each character of the same class has to do the class quest individually.

Unless the multi boxer wants to spend alot of money on XP boosts then lvling will be very hard.

WZ's only allow 4 per group.

Some h2's and H4's are instances only .

All class and most planet story quest givers are inside an instance.

Instances cannot be followed into.

[BPStarsiege]

I saw one guy had 100 WoW accounts for the last 6 years My brain nearly exploded.... lol He was the exception to the rule, but multiboxer's, from what I've seen, typically run at least 5 accounts at a time for WoW, which I guess they would only run 4 accounts on SWTOR.

 

Being a former Multiboxer and probably will get back into it someday. I can say there would be nothing stopping me from running more than 4 on SWToR if I was to go about it and had the money (too busy building new desktop paying mortgage and integratin DLNA + Gigabit + HDMI throughout house in diff forms like wall sockets etc) then I would have 4 sub accounts and as many extra F2P ontop that the system could hold (used to run 5 by memory on old pc and would change that to 4 and 4 across 2 pcs if borrowing friends toons). Still new to SWToR and like it enough just for storyline only 1 toon bout to hit max lvl this week and not bored of it, that I would guess 4 sub or pref or F2P I guess that I am really interested in I could use then any extra would def be F2P and used outside Group for heals etc... just guessing but either way Swtor doesnt have the Multibox appeal to it I dont think. A much more limited access to the game mechanics player side would end up make me feel I am just dragging round alts... I Boxed for fun in wow... I had multi max lvl toons had bunch of r/l mates with multi max toons. So I would not Box a raid cos I was progressing with a guild and had no need to box with the amt of friends a call or 5sec walk away. I just enjoyed setting up complex scripting macros ie like of baldurs gate slightly so I could play round on alts etc or attempt the tier or two below raids.

[LVCommando]

<Snipped to avoid TL:DR> The world revolves around getting more if you are willing to pay.....This whole thread when you encompass the game mechanics itself without the boxing/macro theory is based on attacking ppl who are willing to pay to get ahead....I aint ever heard a free to play call a sub a cheat... why not based on theory behind multiple accts etc. Starting day 1 with +41 gems, adaptive armor, half global legacy unlocked and few mill credits selling some mounts from cartel to mate for under half what they were on trade is alot more epic in scale and game unbalancing than I ever found in boxing.

 

Welcome to the World my friends. Everything is going free with the pay for more option.

 

The main problem with your argument is you seem to be taking the point of view that. "If you've got enough money to spend on the game why shouldn't you be allowed to do it??" This is flawed on several levels, the least of which leads to "If i'm willing to pay for it how come I shouldn't be allowed to buy gold/equipment/a lvl 50 toon from someone else instead of having to play thru the game to get it??"

 

You justify the argument by talking about someone who starts on day 1 with +41 gems, adaptive armor, etc...etc... The thing is these are all things that are built into the game with at least a general understanding of how they are going to affect the game economy, and still do not result in this player being able to more easily play game content intended for multiple people than would be provided to someone thru 8+ multiboxing. Also your estimate of how much money this person would have I think is grossly exaggerated from selling the items you listed, although you may have just been simplifying there.

 

I think you would be hard pressed to find a developer or concept designer who would say "Oh yes we know bunches of people are going to multibox this game so they can get around the more difficult content designed for larger groups so we'll make sure the game allows for it." Do they understand it happens? Yes i'm almost certain most do, but this game does an excellent job of making the idea of mulitboxing to do any of the significant end game content fairly undesirable.

 

Don't get me wrong i'm not totaly against multiboxing even in this game. However I had numerous bad experiences with people multiboxing in WoW when I still played both from people owning BG's in PvP and also people trying to do it as part of a pug raid and it was annoying in both aspects. And leaving a pug HM BG in this game penalizes you so if your trying to get away from someone who is multiboxing because you don't want to deal with them playing one character and expecting you to make up for the other 3 they are trailing along you really don't have much choice.

 

Multiboxing here to play thru Heroics? Meh....no big deal, if you can do it, go for it. I know there have definitely been times I dident feel like grouping to do something. Doing it to solo a HM FP? eh...seems a bit unfair to me but not to the point i'd go QQing all over the forums about it. But multiboxing in anything that requires more than 4 people should not be allowed. And definately not in PvP. Although from reading other peoples posts it seems trying to do it in PvP would be a joke at best. LOL.

 

But saying people should be allowed to do it just because they have the money to spend? No, that argument holds no water whatsoever.

[killmaimburn]

Mutli boxing is fun though. Someone said they enjoy the complexity of it. That's what I like about it. It's way more complicated than working with another player. If I could multibox a raid, that would be awesome. That really isn't possible though because there's so much movement required and multiboxing usually consists of toon just bunching up and soaking aoe damage. It is something that I would like to do for leveling though. Hitting up the heroic quests and running through content without having to rely on unknown players who may not be on the same page as I. There's an argument for and an argument against this. I see only the positive. The game economy... supply goes up, prices go down. Now suddenly my credits I earned from dailies have more purchasing power. ... hmm...

[AyeEs]

Multi-boxers are already here. During the Gree event I watched someone with 4 similar named characters of the same class in a 4 man group. They moved as a unit, attacked as a unit. I figure it was one keyboard controlling 4 boxes. It was comical and so obvious.

[Uvirith]

Why dont you people let people play the way they want. So much hatred nowadays.... Edited March 12, 2013 by Uvirith

[Burtlebe]

Think about one guy with 4-5 smashers in a pvp match all jumping to the same target or attacking a node. Guilds or premades may have that kind of coordination, but a mutliboxer would be pretty rough to a random team or pug.

 

the hardest part of large multi boxing in this game is targeting, in other games I have multi boxed you could have all your boxes target the main one and you would fire through the person. You dont have that here so would make it more problematic

[Scritty]

For my part. Coming from EvE and WoW (EvE dual boxing or at least "dual accounting" is positively ENCOURAGED "The Power Of 2" and "Why not get a second account" drops into my inbox all the time)

 

For me the only issue in Swtor is PvP bullying or ganking - that should be an issue whether it is one player playing many accounts or many players playing one account - however - it is a little more likely with one person. To gank in a group you need to find several people with the same bullying mentality..and thankfully that is a lot rarer than a "rogue" one man ganker.

 

Outside that who cares> And if you do why?

 

Being upset because someone is dropping more money on their hobby than you is neither here nor there. If people want to spend $600 a month (and I know 1 guy who teamed 40 mans in WoW back in the day who did just that) then that's fine by me. It doesn't affect me one tiny bit.

As for the old chestnuts. The 5 man WoW druid team...

5 druids all equally specced would be a monumental waste of time and effort. Againt 5 individual players of the same level in PvP they would be Pwned every time even by those with lesser skill at the game, and in raids and other high end PvE - 5 man all the same class is a total waste of time. No flexibility of either skills or in the ability of the single user to adapt to situations.

 

"5 real brains against 1" If the one brain wins it is for two possible reasons.

 

1) He is ganking with higher level characters one shotting lower players. This should be reported

 

or (more likely)

 

2) If you have 5 characters the same level as this guy played by five different players and he STILL beats you. He's a LOT better than you at the game. 5 brains should beat one in an equal fight just about every time. Suck it up and live with it.

 

Would I spend $500 a month on gaming. Maybe. I'm not short of cash. I'd have to think about it but no big deal for me personally. Hell what about the guy who spent $60,000 real dollars to buy a space station in Entropia to earn real dollars back from trade tax from other players that use it. Now THAT'S serious. Leveling quick by running heroics with a dual box set up. Who cares?

Scritty

Edited May 13, 2013 by Scritty

[AlrikFassbauer]

A Newbie's question :

 

What does /follow do and what does the teerm "multiboxing" mean ?

Is this a kind of tactic ?