Endgame Crafting Goes Buh-Bye in 2.0

[Darevsool]

That concept is outdated anyways, they haven't had BOE armorings drop since HM EC. Nothing like that drops in NiM EC or HM TFB.

 

To the other guy that said most crafters learned their schematics from stuff bought from the GTN - do you think that is really true? Our guild probably knows 2-3 out of the 7 major armorings, 2 of the 7 major hilts/barrels and about half of all the 27 mods & enhancements but ALL were from ops drops. Just curious.

 

I've learned 4/8 armorings (27's) from the GTN.

I did a day of WZ's to see if it was an easy way to get stabilizers (it was) on my Sniper/Cybertech.

I do Heroic space missions every day on both of my 50's for the Grade 8 crafting mat boxes to get more stabilizers.

 

While I'm in a guild, I try to be self sufficient, and I've geared up my 2nd 50 much faster than had I been trying to do it only through Pugging raids (which is what I would have had to do for the Dread Guard level gear).

[psandak]

Let's look at this rationally and logically for one minute....

 

The OP quotes that BiS mods will no longer be reverse engineerable into schematics. All that means is that the best of the best mods will not be readily available. That does not mean that end-game crafting is completely dead. As someone else stated level 25 and 28 mods will be available BY TRAINER. There will be a market for entry level to mid range end-game mods. And in all candor this is where the majority of players play anyway. So that market will be very good.

 

To the OP I ask, can we say hyperbole (hi-per-bo-lee)?

[dsapp]

more like the sound of someone stating a known fact from most MMOs, and people calling it opinion

 

Most MMOs, but not the way this one was promoted to us. They stated numerous times that they didn't want the only way to get BiS gear to be through Operations. They wanted there to be multiple ways to achieve that possibility. It's another way of going back on their word.

 

And just because "most MMOs" use that strategy doesn't mean it's a fact. It's a fallacious argument similar to "50 million Elvis fans can't be wrong". It's still your opinion.

[SalBasss]

They wanted there to be multiple ways to achieve that possibility. It's another way of going back on their word.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but technically you can still get there without doing the top tier ops, no? Just not as quick...

[JamieKirby]

I craft my alts gear myself, and I do that because 15K for a lvl 15 prototype mod is ridiculous.

 

Thats common problem in mmos, majority of crafters tend to think about how much they can make instead of how they can help the server community, i know they need to make a profit to make it worthwhile to craft the items, but there is a difference between profit and greed.

 

I mean if it costed like 1k to make something, then selling it for like 1.5k-2k is an acceptable price in my mind and i would pay it, but 10k is just way, WAY too much.

[Darevsool]

Thats common problem in mmos, majority of crafters tend to think about how much they can make instead of how they can help the server community, i know they need to make a profit to make it worthwhile to craft the items, but there is a difference between profit and greed.

 

I mean if it costed like 1k to make something, then selling it for like 1.5k-2k is an acceptable price in my mind and i would pay it, but 10k is just way, WAY too much.

 

The problem is, for crafters with millions of credits, the time invested in making the low level parts, and the very small amount of profit involved, can mean (to them) that it isn't worth the time.

 

In "Theory" people leveling up cybertech should be making the low level parts as they work on leveling up their crew skills. The reality is usually just the opposite, people who have mastered long ago making them for alts and selling off crits, or gouging people who like to "twink" their lowbie alts and can afford the high prices.

[JMCH]

Let's look at this rationally and logically for one minute....

 

The OP quotes that BiS mods will no longer be reverse engineerable into schematics. All that means is that the best of the best mods will not be readily available. That does not mean that end-game crafting is completely dead. As someone else stated level 25 and 28 mods will be available BY TRAINER. There will be a market for entry level to mid range end-game mods. And in all candor this is where the majority of players play anyway.

And I wondered how BW could have considered players' turnover as a long term solution to the population issues...

 

Now, I'm almost sure you're the one who gave them such a stupid idea, as that's exactly how you pretend to give any use to crafting outside of biochem (consumables...) and cybertech (re-useable grenades, consumables ones being way too expensive).

 

A transition in no way is "end-game", your point is moot.

[dsapp]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but technically you can still get there without doing the top tier ops, no? Just not as quick...

 

Actually, you can't. Dread Guard gear is unattainable without tokens dropped from HM TfB. However, the mods, armorings, enhancements, and barrels can be crafted. With this change, that will be a thing of the past. Instead, for example, you'll only be able to craft level 28 mods when level 29 mods become new BiS.

[JMCH]

Actually, you can't. Dread Guard gear is unattainable without tokens dropped from HM TfB.

You could as well use a Tionese/Columi/Rakata shell and player crafter 27s in it, altough this very case is "fixed" too in 2.0...

[dsapp]

You could as well use a Tionese/Columi/Rakata shell and player crafter 27s in it, altough this very case is "fixed" too in 2.0...

 

That was the point I was getting at when I said the mods, enhancements, barrels, and hilts could be crafted.

[Khevar]

As it stands, crafters will be able to make level 69 (Arkanian) gear. These are grade 30 items. They are learned by RE'ing the gear, same as grade 26/27 stuff is on live.

 

Arkanian gear is bought with Elite Commendations, obtained by running end-game content, and has a weekly cap. That fact is important: Weekly Cap. Players will need 69 gear to progress to get the 72 top-end gear. The only way to gear faster than the Weekly Cap is to raid on multiple level 50s, buy the gear and legacy-shlep them over.

 

Or ...

 

You could craft them. (O.o)

 

I believe there will still be a market for grade 30 gear. It will not be massively profitable (i.e. buy 6 molecs for 700k, sell barrel for 6 million). But there WILL be a market for it.

 

But hey, the more doomsayers drive off grade 30 crafters, the more market is left for the rest of us.

 

Cheers.

Edited March 7, 2013 by Khevar

[SalBasss]

Actually, you can't. Dread Guard gear is unattainable without tokens dropped from HM TfB. However, the mods, armorings, enhancements, and barrels can be crafted. With this change, that will be a thing of the past. Instead, for example, you'll only be able to craft level 28 mods when level 29 mods become new BiS.

 

Ah, my bad - I was referring to 2.0. I know you can do this on live, lol. In 2.0, I think it is posisble to get all the mods from Ultimate commendations (though you may not have the set bonus and therefore 4 armorings that aren't BIS) - correct? My understanding is just that it would take a lot longer.

[JMCH]

I believe there will still be a market for grade 30 gear. It will not be massively profitable (i.e. buy 6 molecs for 700k, sell barrel for 6 million). But there WILL be a market for it.

 

But hey, the more doomsayers drive off grade 30 crafters, the more market is left for the rest of us.

Just proves where the issue lies with crafting... only those seeking profit$$$!!! care about it, while it should be something important in the game.

 

Hey, look at your barrel's price dude... that's just totally absurd, no one could afford this for, say, half their gear, and you've even forgotten the fact you could only RE the barrels that loots from S&V last boss (weekly lockout, 1 per week per 8-man op group), with a 10% chance to learn, and RE not returning grade 10 mats anymore...

Edited March 8, 2013 by JMCH

[dsapp]

Ah, my bad - I was referring to 2.0. I know you can do this on live, lol. In 2.0, I think it is posisble to get all the mods from Ultimate commendations (though you may not have the set bonus and therefore 4 armorings that aren't BIS) - correct? My understanding is just that it would take a lot longer.

 

Much longer. Seems there's only two ways to get Ultimate comms and one of them is to run the Weekly Operation. The other way is to run the Weekly for HM FPs. Just to get 1 piece without running Ops, it would take a minimum of 7 weeks. That means, unless they stop putting out content, you'll never be geared with BiS unless you run Ops.

[Khevar]

Just proves where the issue lies with crafting... only those seeking profit$$$!!! care about it, while it should be something important in the game.

 

Hey, look at your barrel's price dude... that's just totally absurd, no one could afford this for, say, half their gear, and you've even forgotten the fact you could only RE the barrels that loots from S&V last boss (weekly lockout, 1 per week per 8-man op group), with a 10% chance to learn, and RE not returning grade 10 mats anymore...

I think you misunderstood me. I've never ever ever sold any piece of gear for that sort of absurd profit. I was exaggerating for comedic effect.

 

Currently, with the lowered interest in grade 27 gear on live (anticipation of 69-72) one piece of my armoring sells for ~800k. If I keep watch over the GTN, I can pick up molecs for ~85k and mandiron for ~9k. I've plenty of durasteel/zal alloy/matrixes so I haven't factored that into costs for a while.

 

6 x 85k + 8 x 9k = 582k. Sell for 800k == 218k profit.

 

Before 2.0 hit the PTS armoring was selling for ~1.3 million, molecs were ~140k and mandiron was ~11k == ~400k profit.

 

I expect grade 30 gear to turn a similar profit.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Khevar

[MrHotter]

It sounds more like this will open up end game crafting to more players. The mods people will want to have in order to start end game raiding can be made by most max skill crafters.

 

This just means that end game raiders will not be going into some raids for the first time with better gear than what will be dropping.

[Anishor]

more like the sound of someone stating a known fact from most MMOs, and people calling it opinion

 

'most mmos' in this case are poorly designed MMOs for losers who want to epeen over other players with gear that their teams carried them to get. Good players know they're good and don't need to a red badge of honor to show off their skill. ( Same thing with Athletes. ) Don't need to talk big, they let the fact that they're the best in their field do that talking.

[Reapermoonshadow]

hi all i am wandering is ,,i spent a mouth reing all the armoring and mods and .u get nothing but the advanced for mods and armoring,,i did not use any one mods but what i crafted and got the advanced pretty quick.the thing that makes me mad is that to get the 27s crafter should earn from makeing all the mods advance an get a prize,,in a sence.so in less u do the high end raids and reing the mods and armoring from them there no chance to get 27 thats lame in my eyes i have spent so maney credits to master cybertech..and what the prize for that.foot to @ss

i thank u should be able to get the schmatic to make 27 for any crafter onece u fully master all mods and armoring to advance not from coms 2,0 i hope fixes that just my lame thanking but it just sames that u can .get (9-22) from trainers why not (24 to 27) as well if u master all the advanced..as a crafter.. just a out look on what i see thax

[Reuta]

I think you misunderstood me. I've never ever ever sold any piece of gear for that sort of absurd profit. I was exaggerating for comedic effect.

 

Currently, with the lowered interest in grade 27 gear on live (anticipation of 69-72) one piece of my armoring sells for ~800k. If I keep watch over the GTN, I can pick up molecs for ~85k and mandiron for ~9k. I've plenty of durasteel/zal alloy/matrixes so I haven't factored that into costs for a while.

 

6 x 85k + 8 x 9k = 582k. Sell for 800k == 218k profit.

 

Before 2.0 hit the PTS armoring was selling for ~1.3 million, molecs were ~140k and mandiron was ~11k == ~400k profit.

 

I expect grade 30 gear to turn a similar profit.

 

Too true Khevar too true.

[Slicksteezin]

more like the sound of someone stating a known fact from most MMOs, and people calling it opinion

 

LOL win.

 

He's right though, an ideal MMO economic system should not have crafting valued as much as it is in this game. It's supposed to be an alternative way of making money/supplying the community, not the only way. Let's be honest, the best(and pretty much only) way to make credits in this is by crafting.

 

This will not ruin crafting, but simply give more value to end-game raiders.

 

Funny OP says crafting is gonna be ruined, when in actuality they are probably going to fix an already broken crafting system

[AshlaBoga]

LOL win.

 

He's right though, an ideal MMO economic system should not have crafting valued as much as it is in this game. It's supposed to be an alternative way of making money/supplying the community, not the only way. Let's be honest, the best(and pretty much only) way to make credits in this is by crafting.

 

This will not ruin crafting, but simply give more value to end-game raiders.

 

Funny OP says crafting is gonna be ruined, when in actuality they are probably going to fix an already broken crafting system

 

The thing is, that crafting BiS slot was one of the few things that seperate SWTOR from WoW. I don't want this game to become even more of a WoW clone.

[Slicksteezin]

The thing is, that crafting BiS slot was one of the few things that seperate SWTOR from WoW. I don't want this game to become even more of a WoW clone.

 

This game is not a WoW clone... similar, but regardless if you like WoW or not (which i don't), BiS crafting is a bad for an MMO. SWTOR's market proves it.

Edited March 13, 2013 by Slicksteezin

[Khevar]

This game is not a WoW clone... similar, but regardless if you like WoW or not (which i don't), BiS crafting is a bad for an MMO. SWTOR's market proves it.

While I'm personally fine with 72 gear not being craftable, and I think it's good for the game, I don't understand what you mean by:

 

"SWTOR's market proves it."

[bbare]

Every crafting skill is important for endgame even without being able to craft BiS gear.

 

Artifice: Entry Level Enhancements. Can RE and get a schematic for the best color crystals in 2.0. Lots of possibilities there.

 

Armstech: Augments

 

Synthweaving: Augments, Augment Slots

 

Armormech: Augments. Augment Slots

 

Biochem: Stims, Adrenals, Medpacs, etc...

 

Cybertech: Grenades, Entry-Level Mods and Armorings.

 

 

Just Because you aren't going to be able to craft BiS gear, it doesn't mean each skill won't have a reliable market to sell to. That is far more endgame crafting than most MMO's allow.

Edited March 13, 2013 by bbare

[Idaho-D]

So, does this mean I will no longer be able to craft level 10-45 purple gear? I worked very hard for years for that ability. Or is this just a change to level 50 and above gear?