SW:ToR Lacks Direction?

[Xcore]

Hey Guys,

 

I recently started playing again and I can't help but feel that with all the changes that have happened to Bioware over the year, is it possible that the game is kind of "all-over-the-place" in terms of direction?

 

I mean, I remember just before launch... the development staff was crazy enthusiastic about everything, talking about upcoming projects and this and that... how the story will unfold etc.

 

Now, the game direction feels like they themselves don't really know what will happen in 6 months from now. I mean, is there even a continuous story being told anymore? The Hut stuff seems so random... also the whole "Expansion" seems so random... Makeb? *** is Makeb... you know... I just feel like this is being run without passion... without enthusiasm and without vision.

[JerevFalar]

Its been like this since a lot of the original devs left. As talented as the newer members may be, keeping the same enthusiasm for something you are not nearly as invested in as the original devs were is near impossible.

 

Maybe it is just me, but I feel like a lot of EA employees get churned through and spit-out, and that's why their games are so inconsistent.

[TUXs]

Past the class quests, it's always been like this.

[Katano]

Also keep in mind as a whole this game was worked on for several years and there was so much hype and excitement for its launch that the way everything turned out with the massive amounts of negatively (which comes with EVERY LAUNCH but was extra hard on Swtor due to all the hype) without a doubt put a damper on some spirits. Then the fact that it went f2p so soon is just another nail on the coffin.

[Vandicus]

Well since you seem to be very unfamiliar with the game in general, its understandable why you'd be confused. Makeb was announced shortly after you left, and has apparently been in the works for quite some time. Furthermore, it is related to end game content story(which it sounds like you never reached) that was released before you left. To understand what's going on with Makeb more clearly, try looking up information on Karagga. All the operations we've received thus far have been planned(story wise) since before the launch, as the dialogue for the operations has been available for some time(including the upcoming operation, Scum and Villainy I believe is the name, which has yet to be announced). These operations have a continuous storyline, that they have had planned out for a long time. It would appear that Makeb precedes the events in the operation(as the operation references the recent failure of the Hutts in another bid for power).

[FeelFlow]

Maybe - but could it be that the game never delivered on its (generated by BW) marketing and hype?

 

Do you remember a trailer that was shown a few months before launch which was called 'War is coming' or something like that?

 

It showed the galaxy on the edge of chaos and then a full on war including a massive ground battle on what looked like Ilum.

 

I don't think that we've ever seen anything like that in-game.

[Xcore]

Well since you seem to be very unfamiliar with the game in general, its understandable why you'd be confused. Makeb was announced shortly after you left, and has apparently been in the works for quite some time. Furthermore, it is related to end game content story(which it sounds like you never reached) that was released before you left. To understand what's going on with Makeb more clearly, try looking up information on Karagga. All the operations we've received thus far have been planned(story wise) since before the launch, as the dialogue for the operations has been available for some time(including the upcoming operation, Scum and Villainy I believe is the name, which has yet to be announced). These operations have a continuous storyline, that they have had planned out for a long time. It would appear that Makeb precedes the events in the operation(as the operation references the recent failure of the Hutts in another bid for power).

 

But who planned all this? And are they still around to continue their vision? Thats the disjointed feeling... it feels like the people who created the game are not the same people that are patching it up/together now.

[Elly_Dawn]

yeah its called an FMV or promo video, things done in those are rarely if ever seen in game, sadly, when i see those i dont expect to see what they show in full motion promos...

[Turshek]

That's the main problem with SWTOR but not really new, it probably started around the Death Star day but I don't realy know.

 

All I know is the best way to do things is to focus on a particular direction to give a specific audience 110% of what they want so thoses people are completely hooked and tell their friends how great the game is while at same time give enough to others audiences so they are relatively happy.

 

The problem with SWTOR is nothing is that great, nothing really shines. It seemed they wanted story to be the leading part but they left some mechanics out comparing with their other games so we got less than we expected and they still haven't made any update with our stories.

 

I think at some point, some guys went in and said it's not gonna work, it's too much a niche or something like that. They scrapped many on-going developments to make it more like a normal MMO (WoW) but just adding features next to each other doesn't make a great game, just a decent one.

 

That's what SWTOR is, stories are ok but it lacks something, mainly meaningful choices with consequences.

PVE endgame was too easy and not really interesting at first, it's a bit better now but the progression is really not clear for new people.

As for PvP, Ilim was a failure, there's almost no owPvP and no reason to do any, there's some class balance problems, there's no real reason to do ranked warzones, we are still stuck on pre season 1 for more than 6 months, putting premades with min/maxed gear against pugs of people in recruit/PvE gear is kinda a problem too....

Crafting is borked too, some crew skills are next to useless, changes are made to give players access to gear more easily bypassing even more crafters, Some schematics are missing, some have wrong stats, some are completely useless, the UI is horrible, really ? a tree control with 4-6 main categories and hundreds of schematics in each ?

 

Well I could rant more but it won't change anything anyway. There was a vision at first, then it was changed, since then they just slowly add things to please a different audience at a time, to make us continue to play but no there's no direction.

[Leonick]

Hey Guys,

 

I recently started playing again and I can't help but feel that with all the changes that have happened to Bioware over the year, is it possible that the game is kind of "all-over-the-place" in terms of direction?

 

I mean, I remember just before launch... the development staff was crazy enthusiastic about everything, talking about upcoming projects and this and that... how the story will unfold etc.

 

Now, the game direction feels like they themselves don't really know what will happen in 6 months from now. I mean, is there even a continuous story being told anymore? The Hut stuff seems so random... also the whole "Expansion" seems so random... Makeb? *** is Makeb... you know... I just feel like this is being run without passion... without enthusiasm and without vision.

 

As far as I see the direction is the same it's always been. We've known about much that has happened over the year since shortly after the launch. The rakghoul thing, the Dreadmasters and the Hutts, Terror From Beyond and Section X and more things we've yet to see involving these story elements (the Dreadmasters and the Hutts) was dataminded/leaked in early February last yea (you can find it on torhead).

 

Now granted, some things have changed, most notably the original plan seem to have been for fewer but much bigger content updates and for example there were to be a Flashpoint released with the Terror From Beyond operation that we've yet to see, still, my point is, the story we're seeing unfold and the general direction we're headed in such regards are still according to the original developers plans.

[Marak]

The story makes sense if you actually watch the cinematics. A rare thing, I know.

[SNCommand]

Personally I feel the game has had a solid direction so far, in fact, sometimes I feel we get pounded into our heads about the dread masters and the hutt cartel perhaps a little bit too much

[Machine-Elf]

The story makes sense if you actually watch the cinematics. A rare thing, I know.

 

Personally I have a lot of trouble following the story. There's just too much happening at the same time, it feels disjointed, and the game fails to clue the player in as to which chronological order operations, in particular, should be run in.

[SNCommand]

Personally I have a lot of trouble following the story. There's just too much happening at the same time, it feels disjointed, and the game fails to clue the player in as to which chronological order operations, in particular, should be run in.

 

The order they were released would be the logical assumption, wouldn't it?

[Machine-Elf]

The order they were released would be the logical assumption, wouldn't it?

The game doesn't tell you the order in which they were released.

[SNCommand]

The game doesn't tell you the order in which they were released.

 

Probably hasn't mattered to me because I've been playing since launch, but if anyone's wondering it's not exactly a state secret, a internet search would lead to all the answers

[Aries_cz]

I recently started playing again and I can't help but feel that with all the changes that have happened to Bioware over the year, is it possible that the game is kind of "all-over-the-place" in terms of direction?

The game got pretty much shafted by EA when they did not get 10 mil subscribers right after launch (not sure if they really expected that), I got hurt by the proclamations at EA meetings for share-holders, etc.

Then the game went F2P, which put much of other work "on hold", until the numbers came back of its success. Now that the numbers are in, and they seem really positive, EA seems like they are willing to support the game more, so we could see more good stuff happening.

 

I mean, I remember just before launch... the development staff was crazy enthusiastic about everything, talking about upcoming projects and this and that... how the story will unfold etc.

Well, have you ever met a developer who is not trying to hype his game before launch? This is not a really BW problem, it is just how the game industry works

[Machine-Elf]

Probably hasn't mattered to me because I've been playing since launch, but if anyone's wondering it's not exactly a state secret, a internet search would lead to all the answers

IMO players shouldn't have to work to make sense out of something which Bioware has long considered being of paramount importance in their approach to creating games, their "fourth pillar"—even if that work amounts to no more than a menial internet search.

 

Plus, fixing this problem would seem like a fairly easy task.

 

And finally, we're not even sure that the order in which they were released ARE the proper order in which to play them (see other poster's assertion re: Makeb taking place before Karaga's Palace above).

Edited February 9, 2013 by Machine-Elf

[SNCommand]

IMO players should't have to work to make sense out of something which Bioware has long considered being of paramount importance in their approach to creating games, their "fourth pillar"—even if that work amounts to no more than a menial internet search.

 

Plus, fixing this problem would seem like a fairly easy fix.

 

Well I haven't done any work and the storyline makes perfect sense for me, that you can't use a little bit of simple logic to work out which operation is in which order is kinda sad, there's like four of them, it's not the hardest puzzle in the world

 

And finally, we're not even sure that the order in which they were released ARE the proper order in which to play them (see other poster's assertion re: Makeb taking place before Karaga's Palace above).

 

Makeb definitely happens after Karagga's palace, Karagga was the leader of the Hutt Cartel until you killed him, now that evil looking Hutt you see in the trailers is the new leader of the Cartel

Edited February 9, 2013 by SNCommand

[Machine-Elf]

Well I haven't done any work and the storyline makes perfect sense for me, that you can't use a little bit of simple logic to work out which operation is in which order is kinda sad, there's like four of them, it's not the hardest puzzle in the world

Maybe it is sad though I suspect I'm not alone in my befuddlement.

But i's not just the operations. The operations are linked with flashpoints and planetary quests. There's stuff with the Gree on Coruscant, which ties to Malstrom Prison, which in turn ties to a bunch of other stuff further down the line; meanwhile the player is trying to juggle whether to go to Illum, do a Flashpoint, return to another planet's Bonus Series....

 

It all gets very confusing, very quick. For me, anyway.

[SNCommand]

Maybe it is sad though I suspect I'm not alone in my befuddlement.

But i's not just the operations. The operations are linked with flashpoints and planetary quests. There's stuff with the Gree on Coruscant, which ties to Malstrom Prison, which in turn ties to a bunch of other stuff further down the line; meanwhile the player is trying to juggle whether to go to Illum, do a Flashpoint, return to another planet's Bonus Series....

 

It all gets very confusing, very quick. For me, anyway.

 

Well, for some things at what time you do things don't really matter, I mean the Rakghoul flashpoints could happen at any time in the story, the only things that matter are those that has a chronological placement

 

For example the first operation, Eternity Vault, could happen at anytime, it has at this point had no later effect, Karagga's Palace on the other hand happens because the Dread Master are taking their territory, thereby it must have happened after they were freed as a Imperial character, Explosive conflict then happens as the Dread Masters expand, and Terror from Beyond is clearly happening after explosive conflict as Kephess has been reborn

 

The whole thing with Makeb now and the new operation is happening as a result of what happened when you killed Karagga and the Dread Masters continuing assault on Hutt territory

[Nicolettexiv]

"Here is how game development works:

 

a) A bunch of developers toss out a lot of things they think might be cool.

 

b) Someone from marketing sticks his head in, and says, “We have to start hyping this! What’s cool about it?”

 

c) They toss him the list and hope he goes away. He feeds the list to the press.

 

d) Over the course of years, each idea on the list is evaluated for practicality, fun, and so on. One by one, they fall into “Not for release” or “Not ever”. Meanwhile, the initial PR is flying all over the net, preserved forever by rabid fanboys who have dedicated their entire existence to a game they have never seen and which might never come out.

 

e) Eventually, the game ships, and people start wailing about how they were “lied” to. Then they glom on to some other barely-announced game and repeat the cycle."

 

http://mrlizard.com/rants/why-havent-they-fixed-this-bug/

[aeterno]

Not sure about direction, but it definitely lacks ambition.

 

At least as far as we can tell, given the lack of communication.

[Turshek]

"Here is how game development works:

 

a) A bunch of developers toss out a lot of things they think might be cool.

 

b) Someone from marketing sticks his head in, and says, “We have to start hyping this! What’s cool about it?”

 

c) They toss him the list and hope he goes away. He feeds the list to the press.

 

d) Over the course of years, each idea on the list is evaluated for practicality, fun, and so on. One by one, they fall into “Not for release” or “Not ever”. Meanwhile, the initial PR is flying all over the net, preserved forever by rabid fanboys who have dedicated their entire existence to a game they have never seen and which might never come out.

 

e) Eventually, the game ships, and people start wailing about how they were “lied” to. Then they glom on to some other barely-announced game and repeat the cycle."

 

http://mrlizard.com/rants/why-havent-they-fixed-this-bug/

 

While there's some truth here, it doesn't really answer about whether or not BW know clearly where they want this game to go or are they just reacting to feedback or are they just giving a bit of something to a specific audience when they patch to keep them playing.

 

Some games focus more on solo content, on endgame PvE, on PvP, ... while most try to please more than one audience, they still have a clear direction, it's easy to know what's more important.

But with SWTOR what's the direction ? Prelaunch they hammered the story thing, yet one year later, there's no update in that direction and they could have gave us better like many more meaningful choices with consequences in our stories.

If PvP is really important for them, why wait a year to fix Ilum ? Why didn't they tried to do something about owPvP ? If it's not, why did they spent time working on ranked warzones ?

...

 

Again, you can look everywhere and everywhere you can see things that could be done better which means nothing is great, nothing was really well thought to try to give the best experience in that field, which means there's no real direction.

Edited February 9, 2013 by Turshek

[SebastianII]

Too many posts in this thread are saying I can't follow a simple storylines, so Bioware and Star Wars has failed.

 

The current situation at end game storyline are as follows: The gree are in trouble and need help. The Empire is preparing for counterattack on the Republic. There is going to be showdown with the Dread Masters. There is going to be a showdown with the Hutt Cartel.

 

Is this lack of direction or lack of ability to understand a simple story?

 

I hold a Bachelor's in Literature, so my adive is put down the star wars and read a book. I recommend the story of Chicken Little. Its a story about a chicken who misinterpts a simple situation and believes the sky is falling.

 

My next post will cover irony in storytelling.