groups of 3+ should have to queue ranked Warzones

[cashogy]

Go PUG, then see what it's like to vs Hardcore PvP Guild Premades. You'll be annoyed to say the least.

 

Oh wait, I forgot, you're too scared to go PUG cuz you'll lose your advantage. My bad.

 

i pug every single day. in fact, the VAST majority of the time i play, i queue solo. in the past month, i have queued in a premade on 3 occasions.

 

and do you know what? i am absolutely annoyed. not b/c i am facing a premade, but b/c the other people on my team are busy figuring out what flavor their monitor is, rather than helping to win the match.

 

bad players, which is the overwhelming majority of people in this game, are what annoy me.

 

the manner in which i queue does not change the way that i play. i have beaten many, many, many premades as a PUG.

 

do you know why PUGs suck? b/c the players in them suck. if PUGs could do simple things like call incomings early, not guard on top of a node, zoom their camera out all the way, have "Pass the Huttball" at least on the toolbar, know which way the endzone is in huttball, know the difference between east/west, not rotate an entire team when some calls "inc 1", etc etc etc

 

i could literally go on and on and on. bad players are why PUGs suck. end of story

[V-Serp]

i pug every single day. in fact, the VAST majority of the time i play, i queue solo. in the past month, i have queued in a premade on 3 occasions.

 

and do you know what? i am absolutely annoyed. not b/c i am facing a premade, but b/c the other people on my team are busy figuring out what flavor their monitor is, rather than helping to win the match.

 

bad players, which is the overwhelming majority of people in this game, are what annoy me.

 

the manner in which i queue does not change the way that i play. i have beaten many, many, many premades as a PUG.

 

do you know why PUGs suck? b/c the players in them suck. if PUGs could do simple things like call incomings early, not guard on top of a node, zoom their camera out all the way, have "Pass the Huttball" at least on the toolbar, know which way the endzone is in huttball, know the difference between east/west, not rotate an entire team when some calls "inc 1", etc etc etc

 

i could literally go on and on and on. bad players are why PUGs suck. end of story

 

These deflections are so absolutely hilarious. If you PUG so much and the PUGs are so bad why does it bother you so much if it was changed to groups face groups? How would that change anything for you? What suddenly it'd be more challenging when you're PUGing because the premades would all be gone? Is that your argument now?

 

The absolutely inconsistent, mind numbingly illogical posts never stop with you people do they?

 

I'm not going to write them out, but we've now seen 3 ridiculous arguments that have constantly been disproven but the premade side won't stop repeating them anyway.

[-IceHawk-]

It is obvious that it is physically impossible for a pre-made to lose.

 

It has never happened.

 

PUGs, such as the OP, are clearly outmatched and will never learn the keys to communication nor will he ever have a group of like-minded friends to play with.

 

Ergo, instead of asking him to improve his gameplay and adapt it is clear that Bioware must restrict groups attempting to play this as a multi-player game.

 

Simply stated Bioware needs to make this MMO more friendly to solo-players.

 

They are obviously the core demographic of the population and they must be catered to!

[cashogy]

These deflections are so absolutely hilarious. If you PUG so much and the PUGs are so bad why does it bother you so much if it was changed to groups face groups? How would that change anything for you? What suddenly it'd be more challenging when you're PUGing because the premades would all be gone? Is that your argument now?

 

The absolutely inconsistent, mind numbingly illogical posts never stop with you people do they?

 

I'm not going to write them out, but we've now seen 3 ridiculous arguments that have constantly been disproven but the premade side won't stop repeating them anyway.

 

delfections? what the fk are you talking about?

 

please quote where i say that "im bothered by having to face other groups". oh wait, you cant

 

you think it would be *more* challenging w/out premades in the queue? thats laughable, since the overwhelming majority of PUGers are the whiny, sniveling bads that come to cry about it on the forums. the only way it would be more competitive is b/c youve removed all the good players from the bracket, so everyone sucks.

 

i would LOVE for real matchmaking. either to be able to queue 4v4, or solo matchmaking with some kind of algorithm that took into account actual skill. i would LOVE it. again for ya, since you seem to not notice things. I WOULD LOVE TO FIGHT PLAYERS MY OWN SKILL LEVEL.

 

is beating up bads fun? sometimes. but is having bads on your team constantly cost you matches fun? hell no.

 

give me fully competitive PvP any day.

 

 

and what "ridiculous arguments"? youre telling me that if bad players stopped being bad, and started doing even HALF of the things i listed, that they wouldnt perform better? premades steamroll terrible PUGs b/c they are terrible.

 

this entire issue boils down to bad players being bad. it doesnt matter if you take 8 bad players and put them in a group for RWZ, or 8 random bad players in the normal bracket; they are still bad.

 

bad players are bad. it doesnt get any more complicated than that. if you dont wont to lose so much, figure out what you can do to better yourself, to improve your chances of winning.

 

or, you can just keep whining for bioware to take the big mean good players and put them where they cant hurt you anymore

Edited January 21, 2013 by cashogy

[V-Serp]

It is obvious that it is physically impossible for a pre-made to lose.

 

It has never happened.

 

PUGs, such as the OP, are clearly outmatched and will never learn the keys to communication nor will he ever have a group of like-minded friends to play with.

 

Ergo, instead of asking him to improve his gameplay and adapt it is clear that Bioware must restrict groups attempting to play this as a multi-player game.

 

Simply stated Bioware needs to make this MMO more friendly to solo-players.

 

They are obviously the core demographic of the population and they must be catered to!

 

We ran 4-6 premade groups constantly all throughout the day back when my PVP guild was active. I believe my groups lost a grand total of one time in 2 months of doing so. I'm not entirely sure how the other groups did, but it sounded like everyone was winning them too.

 

Just having proper composition is such a huge advantage. The fact that you almost never run into another premade when you premade as well is just silly. Whenever you PUG you're constantly running into the double premade, when you actually premade all you seem to ever do is run into PUGs. I think we'd actually play another premade maybe twice a week at most.

 

If your premades can't win, you are exactly the type of premade that is using it as a crutch because you are so bad. It's just such a ridiculous advantage. Anybody that has a triple digit IQ and normal human reaction speed and coordination knows this. Those with sub-100 IQs and really terrible reactions, such that the 1.5s gcd is actually not even enough time for them to react, will constantly make excuses and terrible arguments because that's what they are.

 

I've stated this many times and I'm very much a believer of this, but stupid people are extremely clever in their stupidity and you'll never win an argument with them. They're so stupid that they simply don't understand and accept commonly held assumptions and beliefs that are accepted as given by normal people. When you aren't bound by logic, consistency or the obvious you can argue and always win by pure attrition. This is also why stupid people also have an absolute hatred of lawyers and any other experts in actual sound argument or facts. They hate being disproven by anyone with a mark of authority.

 

I know full well the stupid people in this thread will keep going and everything I post is a waste of time, but it can be amusing so I do it. I would prefer more people however jump in and we get a nice giant fiasco.

[RankorSSGS]

Who the heck runs proper composition in 4 man premades? Mine tend to be 4 dps

[cashogy]

Whenever you PUG you're constantly running into the double premade, when you actually premade all you seem to ever do is run into PUGs. I think we'd actually play another premade maybe twice a week at most.

 

how do you know youre not facing a premade? cuz theyre not all in the same guild?

 

you are aware that many people have friends outside their guild, and PvP with them?

 

shocking revelation, i know. just b/c people are from different guilds/unguilded doesnt mean they are always PUGing

Edited January 21, 2013 by cashogy

[Kerensk]

Man, what is up with these sweeping generalizations? "All premades don't do Ranked just because they want to stomp on PUGS" Is this actually even true? How many people actually feel better after stomping on a team 100-0 than winning an incredibly close game at the last second? It's hard to do Ranked because it's hard for two separate teams to be on with the proper make-up to actually do Ranked and who want do deal with the stress that comes with Ranked. Premades can be like 2 juggs a PT and an assassin.... seems to be missing a lot of roles for ranked...

It's does apply to the majority of premades.

Yes it's true they enjoy stomping pugs, that's why they talk smack on the other team.

Yes they like easy games, the few that pug often quit if facing a premade.

 

You do have a valid argument that Ranked shouldn't require a team of 8.

But when you say it's hard to get 2 seperate teams to play together you point out the problem with pugs vs Premades.

You think it's hard getting two 4 man teams to work together against a voice coordinated team? Try getting 8 one man teams to work together against a voice coordinated team.

 

Also being a pug playing alongside a premade sucks too, while somebody is mentioning it. VOIP premades don'tccommunicate with the pugs they have to type chat to. They just expect to carry the team (and often do, VOIP is an awesome help). But if you end up losing they just blame the pugs asking why we didn't do this or that.

Sorry, you never once typed anything and ignored the strategies us pugs chatted to go with. We chatted rush the right door and you 4 went left. We said 2/6/0 you all went right. A VOIP premade is the worst teamates to have because they completelyignore the rest of the team .

[PloGreen]

Who the heck runs proper composition in 4 man premades? Mine tend to be 4 dps

 

We just run with whoever is on. Otherwise if no ones on I solo queue, not really a big deal.

 

/shrug

[Masarko]

Its because of people like you classes are getting nerfed.

 

hope youre happy with yourself, now im gonna premade cya

[WolfSp]

Premades dont sleep...we would kick every slacker who does immediately from our guild. Thats the only way you can ever achieve that elite Status we all crave for

[Neoforcer]

This is a MMO not battlefield 3 it a Massively multiplayer online game. That means group pvp hmm go figure. This is not a que solo for just you so you can fight on a war-zone like battlefield 3. Putting 4 man groups into a 4 man group only would make ques just as long as rank since no one would que for them. Pre-made should be in with the reg pop why well your que would take for ever to pop then you have more to QQ about.

 

Poeple will QQ no mater what seems that all this community can do is QQ they don't have a I win button.

Edited January 21, 2013 by Neoforcer

[snewsh]

This is a MMO not battlefield 3 it a Massively multiplayer online game. That means group pvp hmm go figure. This is not a que solo for just you so you can fight on a war-zone like battlefield 3. Putting 4 man groups into a 4 man group only would make ques just as long as rank since no one would que for them. Pre-made should be in with the reg pop why well your que would take for ever to pop then you have more to QQ about.

 

Poeple will QQ no mater what seems that all this community can do is QQ they don't have a I win button.

 

you do know what solo means, right?

 

i dont see the point in having two seperate ques if people are just going to group up for solo. just get rid off ranked. that way at least some soloers will have a chance against groups.

[Darth-Rammstein]

I don't mind premades in a normal wz but I hate them in huttball. Huttball is very communication dependent and can easily be won with just a couple of people passing/pulling/leaping...this is where premades outshine any pug they encounter. All the other wzs can easily counter a premade since the other 4 members of their team are still vital to their success, huttball doesn't really require the other 4 guys to do much of anything but sit back and enjoy the free win. Edited January 21, 2013 by Darth-Rammstein

[Smashbrother]

Join a guild and get teammates. I do premades if there are spots open in the guild, but if not I'll solo Q. I don't like getting grouped against an unwinnable premade, but I also don't come crying about it on the forums. Nobody forced me to solo Q.

 

Honestly, what bugs the **** out of me more are the bads who refuse to augment their WH gear, or are wearing ****** blues and greens instead of their goddamn free recruit.

[thegreebler]

Imagine if they did this in sports; you random guys dont know who you are with, and can ONLY talk thru text...

 

while you others get to not only choose how to fill out your group; but you are usually on voice chat.

 

pretty obvious people would see that as unfair; but this is biowares current norm. One that ruins pvp in its current state, and will only cost them customers.

Edited January 21, 2013 by thegreebler

[symke]

Anyone know what the 2 M's in MMO stand for?

 

Seriously, if people playing together is such a serious problem to you, go back to your single player games. People play MMO's to play with other people, deal with it.

 

Inb4 "oh ur a baddie scared to lose the advantage u get roflstomping poor deprived loners like me" No, I'm not. If BW puts in a good system for group vs group queues, I'd gladly join it. But right now there isn't, and I'm not going to ignore my friends while I wait for a feature that may never come. Ranked games are not always possible, sometimes my guilds just do not have the people. And even if we do get a group together, ranked queues are so dead most of the time that there's nobody to queue against. I'm not paying my monthly sub to stand in the fleet, so I'm going to join the regular queue.

 

I like competition, I don't enjoy roflstomping full pug groups, but I have really no other options until a group vs group queue is put in. And at least on my server, over 50% of the pvp population is in the same boat as me, so 90% of our games are premade vs premade anyway.

 

So you QQer's can either make friends, quit the game, or grow up, it makes no difference to me. Flame away, because now I'll start feeding on it.

 

Do you know what those two M's stand for?

Do they stand for "stay close to your buddies and don't leave their side no matter what"?. Do they stand for "playing with few teammates"?

They stand for "Massively Multiplayer" which is much more than those few buddies you can't play without. WZ is general is not exactly MMO.

 

And ranked queues are empty because your group (among others) is not using them.

[Smashbrother]

Imagine if they did this in sports; you random guys dont know who you are with, and can ONLY talk thru text...

 

while you others get to not only choose how to fill out your group; but you are usually on voice chat.

 

pretty obvious people would see that as unfair; but this is biowares current norm. One that ruins pvp in its current state, and will only cost them customers.

 

You've obviously never ever went to a park or recreation center of some kind and played a game of pick up game of whatever sport. Some people show up with friends, while others show up solo. They all get into teams, and play whatever game they're playing. This **** happens ALL the time. And people don't ***** about playing against "premades" in those situations either.

 

If you're talking about PRO sports, then yes having premades against solo would be unfair. And this is why there will never be a solo rwz Q.

Edited January 21, 2013 by Smashbrother

[Stonehound]

You've obviously never ever went to a park or recreation center of some kind and played a game of pick up game of whatever sport. Some people show up with friends, while others show up solo. They all get into teams, and play whatever game they're playing. This **** happens ALL the time. And people don't ***** about playing against "premades" in those situations either.

 

If you're talking about PRO sports, then yes having premades against solo would be unfair. And this is why there will never be a solo rwz Q.

 

Local pick-up sports do not put anywhere NEAR as much of a gap in communication abilities between friends and singletons as WZs put between premades and PUGs.

 

I'm not even an anti-premade type, and I still have to point this out because your logic is just that bad.

[Debaucher]

Every single such topic makes me want to get 3 smashers in my group and just stand there watching them faceroll tbh.

 

Cause i 've tried explaining, but got bullied by the PUG Crusaders.

[cashogy]

i was in a Huttball match against a premade tonight. probably one of the better groups of players that i know of. i queued solo on my fresh 50 powertech.

 

with very little communication in Ops Chat, and as far as i could tell no premade on our side (mix of guilds/unguilded people/people i didnt know), we pushed the match to a 2-2 draw, and lost in the last 3s of the game.

 

how can this be possible? a PUG managing to stalemate a premade? this may come as a shock to some people, but good players that are aware of what is going on around them can act cohesively. in fact, for our first score to tie the game, i saw an open player cloaked in the endzone. w/out any form of communication i threw the ball to an open spot, and they rushed into the GTAOE, decloaked and caught the pass for the score. nothing but awareness and instinct led to that score; unless the assassin was telepathic

 

awareness, knowing how to play your class, and understanding the mechanics of the game and how to win each warzone are WAY more important than being in Vent/TS.

 

this entire premade v pug issue boils down to bad players being bad, and whining about having to face better players. if you get beat all the time, instead of coming to the forums and whining about it, maybe try to understand WHY you lost, and what you can do to reduce the likelihood of those same circumstances repeating themselves?

[symke]

...

this entire premade v pug issue boils down to bad players being bad, and whining about having to face better players. if you get beat all the time, instead of coming to the forums and whining about it, maybe try to understand WHY you lost, and what you can do to reduce the likelihood of those same circumstances repeating themselves?

 

Or adjust the system so more players will find WZs enjoyable.

[glocklB]

i was in a Huttball match against a premade tonight. probably one of the better groups of players that i know of. i queued solo on my fresh 50 powertech.

 

with very little communication in Ops Chat, and as far as i could tell no premade on our side (mix of guilds/unguilded people/people i didnt know), we pushed the match to a 2-2 draw, and lost in the last 3s of the game.

 

how can this be possible? a PUG managing to stalemate a premade? this may come as a shock to some people, but good players that are aware of what is going on around them can act cohesively. in fact, for our first score to tie the game, i saw an open player cloaked in the endzone. w/out any form of communication i threw the ball to an open spot, and they rushed into the GTAOE, decloaked and caught the pass for the score. nothing but awareness and instinct led to that score; unless the assassin was telepathic

 

awareness, knowing how to play your class, and understanding the mechanics of the game and how to win each warzone are WAY more important than being in Vent/TS.

 

I agree with this one. Someone could call me a premade player, someone wouldn't. I play solo and in group with friends (not even guildies) 50/50 and ofc without any voice chat. I'd like to group with my friends though, i prefer it, because at least i know they're good guys and they care about match outcome enough (not too much to worry about losses anyway).

 

this entire premade v pug issue boils down to bad players being bad, and whining about having to face better players. if you get beat all the time, instead of coming to the forums and whining about it, maybe try to understand WHY you lost, and what you can do to reduce the likelihood of those same circumstances repeating themselves?

 

Here is what i disagree with. The point is that i understand that some people lose much more often then win. Of course it's more likely skill issues, but everyone will agree that if 7 in group have no clue about pvp this group will lose no matter how good the rest 1, even if he is a god of pvp and they face group of 8 average players.

 

So my point is, there should be some match making system or different queues. I bet casual players would like to play each other without being roflstomped. Maybe some ranking system should be implemented to separate players. Could be some sort of personal ranked implementation (or league system), it could make queues a bit longer, but maybe it's a good exchange to make pvp more enjoyable for everyone.

[fleshtaker]

The problem isn't who team they are on. The problem is they are in the same queue as us. I and many others don't want to be grouped with these people. They should be in a separate queue. If you're a premade queue for ranked PVP and stop being cowards. Leave the normal pvp for pugs.

 

Um im sorry but since when are unranked games designed for pugs? they arnt your ques there everyones

everyone knows ranked wz was fail to hard to get enough ppl on at same time to make it viable and if im not mistaken ever since launch u could que with up to 4 ppl so sorry thay ARNT pug ques there everyones ques..

This ima buy a mmo and play solo so they should change the game to suit me attitude is getting boring u play mmo's to make friends if u dont wanna play this mmo with other ppl and grp up to do stuff quit the game go play a single player game.

If u really like this game but are to simple to make firends then suck it up princess and lose with dignity u dont deserve to be at the top level in the game pvp wise if u arnt prepared to make firends and play the game how it was designed.

Edited January 21, 2013 by fleshtaker

[Brimmer]

Um im sorry but since when are unranked games designed for pugs? they arnt your ques there everyones

everyone knows ranked wz was fail to hard to get enough ppl on at same time to make it viable and if im not mistaken ever since launch u could que with up to 4 ppl so sorry thay ARNT pug ques there everyones ques..

This ima buy a mmo and play solo so they should change the game to suit me attitude is getting boring u play mmo's to make friends if u dont wanna play this mmo with other ppl and grp up to do stuff quit the game go play a single player game.

If u really like this game but are to simple to make firends then suck it up princess and lose with dignity u dont deserve to be at the top level in the game pvp wise if u arnt prepared to make firends and play the game how it was designed.

 

Heh what a hypocrite. You talk a lot about how this is a MMORPG yet you hide with a preset group. Try being social and pug for once. Meet new people. Hide in your little 4 man group, if you must. Though I will say: should try out call of duty, you'd enjoy it. You would fit well in the community there. So I guess the message here is suck it up princess and lose with dignity, you don't deserve to be at the top level in the game pvp wise if you aren't prepared to make friends and play the game how it was designed.