HK-51 Quest & its PVP requirement.

[BrianDavion]

Outstanding Bioware. Now troll guilds and groups will form to prevent people from getting to the vendor. Just hand the keys too the kingdom over to trolls and make griefing as easy as possible. This happened before on PVP servers when you did the Rakghoul Event in the dunesea. Now your making it so non pvpers can get trolled.

 

just wait a week and the area'll be empty . or go at "off peak" times if you can (the games really quiet at 2 am in the morning PST not doable for everyone I know but... )

[Simbr]

So pleased to see a PvP requirement , you should see PvP as challenge not an excuse to cry. There is so a little on this game anyway, currently we cant even get into WZs!!!

[lafr]

You don`t have to interact with anyone, just ask for ops group when you`re near outlaws den and stay near the group. You can see your teammates on map. There will be moments when one faction get over the area but it`s not 1 vs full WH guild. Some of us joined teams on Illum, it's more like this:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=vKJDRQAKkxk

 

It`s not as bad as some people may think. Even for non pvp players I think you'll love this moment.

Edited October 25, 2012 by lafr

[AlixMV]

This isn't the first time Bioware's done this. I know of at least one Class/companion mission buried in Outlaw's Den with no way to get to it other than to go through and be flagged PVP.

 

My rage at this as a PVE player on a PVE server is what prompted me to join the forums. It was the only place/way I could think of to inform Bioware of how wrong I think their game design is in that instance.

 

I thought I read on dulfy's post that there was a way to access the vendor without actually going into the PVP zone and being flagged, but as I don't have a Level 50 on the PTS, I'd have no way of testing that out.

[Sambril]

This isn't the first time Bioware's done this. I know of at least one Class/companion mission buried in Outlaw's Den with no way to get to it other than to go through and be flagged PVP.

 

There is no need to go through Outlaw's Den for any class or companion quest - there is another route. The only other time it was a requirement was for one of the world bosses during the Rakghoul event.

[Uluain]

This isn't the first time Bioware's done this. I know of at least one Class/companion mission buried in Outlaw's Den with no way to get to it other than to go through and be flagged PVP.

 

Actually, there is a way around that avoids both the Imp base and the PvP area. You just have to tackle a few sandpeople. And it is not easy to find. If it is the mission I am thinking of.

 

But yes, camping the vendor with the explicit aim of preventing others from being able to complete the objective is griefing and, if I encounter it on Begeren Colony, will be reported as such to CS as well as to officers of the offender's guild.

Edited October 25, 2012 by Uluain

[Anakis]

My 2 mil creds;

 

PvP should be completely optional on PVE servers (isn't that how it was advertised??) and going into a PVP zone and being PvP flagged should not be a requirement to get a new companion which is used by us in PvE. We are already forced into PvP due to the flagging rules however, so this doesn't surprise me. By forced PvP, I mean you're a healer and you pug a group for a Heroic 4. One of the members happens to be flagged. You heal him rather than let him die, and you get the PvP flag. Then you get ganked on the way back to turn in the quest. Aka forced PvP!

 

In my particular case, I don't see it being too much of an issue to complete this, although I protest being forced into the situation. Nevertheless I will be going into the den to get the items with my assault cannon drawn and allies at my side. And I never PvP!

 

TL;DR: Bioware, you're jerks.

[Urael]

Actually, there is a way around that avoids both the Imp base and the PvP area. You just have to tackle a few sandpeople. And it is not easy to find. If it is the mission I am thinking of.

 

Indeed,

 

There there is second "tunnel" that drops you just below the southen entrance to OLD. You find it mid map on the eastern side of the dune see north of the imperial base thru the mid sized tuskan camp against the cliffs.

[DrewFromPhilly]

Stupid BioWare!! How dare they encourage you to try something you might actually enjoy!!

[Urael]

Stupid BioWare!! How dare they encourage you to try something you might actually enjoy!!

 

That's just it. It can be avoided very easily in fact, as I have pointed out in this thread. People that are QQing about this are not thinking this through. Surprising? No just more PEBKAC.

 

Edited October 25, 2012 by Urael

[Trews]

This proves my point exactly. This is why the PVE folks are annoyed.

 

It's not that I'm concerned about going into a PVP area to get the piece. I'm certain I can hold my own. It's that clowns like you, with nothing better to do with your time than camp in an area and wait for people to come in, with the sole purpose of griefing them, make the game unenjoyable.

 

It's one thing if people happen to arrive at the vendor at the same time and duel to see who goes first or battle it out and move on or have a battle for fun. But for some people to sit there and continually kill someone over and over to keep them from getting one small, but required, piece in a quest chain is annoying. Especially when I don't have the time to keep respawning because some level 50 is bored and wants to keep my level 30 toon from reaching his objective.

 

Give me a break. You guys are ridiculous.

How the heck can you complain about pvp happening in an OPEN WORLD PVP DESIGNATED AREA!?!?

You all immediately assume that people in favor of this are solely going there to "grief" other players. Have you been to outlaws den? Its a freakin ghost-town, i am excited for the prospect of actually seeing the enemy and being able to attack for once. It's about time Bioware did something like this.

 

I've never "camped" another player, and don't condone it at all, but there is nothing wrong at all with attacking a playaer from the opposite faction while in a pvp area. And if i know that there's a big fat pve carrot dangling on a stick in the outlaws den, you darn rights im going to be there lookin for fun!

 

You don't like it? Easy fix. Dont come to Outlaws Den.

[CharleyDanger]

That is actually an interesting thought. Assassination as requirement. It has a nice ring to it.

 

I do have flavor in my gaming life though. Remember my last paragraph says that I do PVP from time to time.

 

 

 

I just want to reiterate to everyone. My opinion on this is just based around having PVP as part of the Requirement for obtaining Companions. Even if it is just a possibility of a PVP Situation as a Requirement. Removing that one thing makes it a lot more appealing to more types of players. I just think it would be better all around to remove that one requirement. It just seems to me like a bad move to have it in a PVP Zone for something that is so widely wanted.

 

I can understand them wanting to make the Outlaw's Den more desirable, but they can do that in other ways other than using a Companion, something that is mostly used in PVE to begin with. For instance, they could just use really good gear that is for PVP as a better incentive for players to visit the Outlaw's Den. It does not even have to be just PVP gear. Any really good Gear would be better Incentive than a Companion. Heck they could have the more Top end Droid Parts drop as loot there. Say some Droid parts that are only for the HK-51. That would be better incentive than having the actual Requirements for Companions being there.

 

I do not want people to get the wrong impression of me. It is not that I do not like PVP, as I do like PVP. I am also not scared of PVP or getting killed by other players. After all I have PVP'ed from time to time. In fact I was in the Outlaw's Den the other day. I went through there to get that Datacron. It just seems like a bad idea to me to have something that is widely wanted by all types of Players, PVP and NON-PVP alike, have a requirement that makes one type of player be placed in a situation for something they do not really like to do. in this case PVP.

 

It is just how I feel.

 

It is good to see all of you post your views on this though. Even if we all do not agree. It makes for a better community and game if we all express our opinions freely. I hope to see more opinions on this.

 

I think on paper you are right, but big picture you are wrong. I agree that it is not the best design to put PVE players in PVP situations. Yet how soft have gamers become? People will spend more time reading this entire thread than they will spend in Outlaws Den in pursuit of HK. Does 5-10 minutes of discomfort really even warrant a thread, or even a thought? What would you do in real life if you were forced in to a minor inconvenience? From your posts I would say you are an intelligent and thoughtful person. Would you not just figure it out and move on? It is my thought that the PVE players should do the same.

[Sambril]

I think on paper you are right, but big picture you are wrong. I agree that it is not the best design to put PVE players in PVP situations. Yet how soft have gamers become? People will spend more time reading this entire thread than they will spend in Outlaws Den in pursuit of HK. Does 5-10 minutes of discomfort really even warrant a thread, or even a thought? What would you do in real life if you were forced in to a minor inconvenience? From your posts I would say you are an intelligent and thoughtful person. Would you not just figure it out and move on? It is my thought that the PVE players should do the same.

 

Or you know Bioware could just move the NPC and the problem goes away completely. PvP servers will still have red-blue open PvP and a lot more players would be happy.

[Uluain]

I honestly don't mind the placement, or even the occasional PvP dustup to get there, provided BioWare is damn sure to come down on griefers like the wrath of God. Seeing as some players are already gleefully announcing their plans to do just that, and given the absence of comment from BioWare in this regard, I am not sanguine about this being handled well.

[Monoth]

I have no doubt that when HK-51 launches there will be Griefers who hang out in the FFA area to kill people trying to get to the merchant NPC.... A easy fix is to group up with fellow PvE'ers and go as a big group, if someone tries something you will have numbers on your side and will destory the griefers...

 

It's not hard to do .... GENERAL CHAT: LFG to get HK-51 parts in FFA area..... Probably only need 3-4 people to get it... It's not a huge issue although people will say "I'm a solo person I won't group with anyone even if someone puts a gun to my head" but I say just let them QQ about it... After the first few days griefers will get bored as traffic will die down and you can probably go in there at any time and get the parts you want without anyone bothering you.

 

No different then the other parts of the quest where you have to get a group together to do a FP...

 

Although after thinking about it you know there is going to be some serious pvp going in there on the first day as guilds will be fighting it out.... should be fun and I'm sure this is what Bioware had in mind when they made it a requirement to go in there.. If you hate this idea then just wait a few days after all the excitement dies down and you'll have free access to it....

Edited October 25, 2012 by Monoth

[AMulls]

Give me a break. You guys are ridiculous.

How the heck can you complain about pvp happening in an OPEN WORLD PVP DESIGNATED AREA!?!?

You all immediately assume that people in favor of this are solely going there to "grief" other players. Have you been to outlaws den? Its a freakin ghost-town, i am excited for the prospect of actually seeing the enemy and being able to attack for once. It's about time Bioware did something like this.

 

I've never "camped" another player, and don't condone it at all, but there is nothing wrong at all with attacking a playaer from the opposite faction while in a pvp area. And if i know that there's a big fat pve carrot dangling on a stick in the outlaws den, you darn rights im going to be there lookin for fun!

 

You don't like it? Easy fix. Dont come to Outlaws Den.

 

You completely missed my point. I'm not complaining about PVP in a PVP area. I understand that it could happen if I choose to go in there. And if I want to complete the HK quest chain, which, by the way, is a PVE quest, I am FORCED to enter the Outlaw's Den. So, in essence, I can't NOT go there.

 

The complaint is that Bioware put a PVE-centered quest objective in a PVP area. So, I can't avoid the area if I choose to pursue that quest. That's where the complaint lies. And in the attitude of many PVPers, who see this as an opportunity to PVP against people who don't particularly enjoy it. As many have admitted in this thread, they will be camping the area to make it as difficult as possible for those folks who don't enjoy PVP, and are only entering Outlaw's Den because Bioware is forcing them to.

 

Also, as I pointed out, if I were on a PVP server, I would have no cause for complaint whatsoever, since PVP would be happening all over the galaxy. So, I turn the question back to you, if you want open world PVP so badly, why not play on a PVP server (assuming that you are not already doing so) and leave the PVEers to play on PVE servers?

 

And further, War Hero relics are BiS for at least a few classes/roles. But you don't see me complaining about having to PVP to get those do you? No. Because while they can be used quite effectively in PVE, they are intended for PVP use, so I would expect to have to PVP to get them. PVPers don't have to PVE in order to get those. So, why should PVEers have to PVP to get a predominantly PVE companion?

[Urael]

I have no doubt that when HK-51 launches there will be Griefers who hang out in the FFA area to kill people trying to get to the merchant NPC.... A easy fix is to group up with fellow PvE'ers and go as a big group, if someone tries something you will have numbers on your side and will destory the griefers...

 

It's not hard to do .... GENERAL CHAT: LFG to get HK-51 parts in FFA area..... Probably only need 3-4 people to get it... It's not a huge issue although people will say "I'm a solo person I won't group with anyone even if someone puts a gun to my head" but I say just let them QQ about it... After the first few days griefers will get bored as traffic will die down and you can probably go in there at any time and get the parts you want without anyone bothering you.

 

No different then the other parts of the quest where you have to get a group together to do a FP...

 

Although after thinking about it you know there is going to be some serious pvp going in there on the first day as guilds will be fighting it out.... should be fun and I'm sure this is what Bioware had in mind when they made it a requirement to go in there.. If you hate this idea then just wait a few days after all the excitement dies down and you'll have free access to it....

 

Indeed. There are many ways to mitigate going to OLD. One just has to think. Again it comes down to a PEBKAC issue.

[Monoth]

You completely missed my point. I'm not complaining about PVP in a PVP area. I understand that it could happen if I choose to go in there. And if I want to complete the HK quest chain, which, by the way, is a PVE quest, I am FORCED to enter the Outlaw's Den. So, in essence, I can't NOT go there.

 

The complaint is that Bioware put a PVE-centered quest objective in a PVP area. So, I can't avoid the area if I choose to pursue that quest. That's where the complaint lies. And in the attitude of many PVPers, who see this as an opportunity to PVP against people who don't particularly enjoy it. As many have admitted in this thread, they will be camping the area to make it as difficult as possible for those folks who don't enjoy PVP, and are only entering Outlaw's Den because Bioware is forcing them to.

 

Also, as I pointed out, if I were on a PVP server, I would have no cause for complaint whatsoever, since PVP would be happening all over the galaxy. So, I turn the question back to you, if you want open world PVP so badly, why not play on a PVP server (assuming that you are not already doing so) and leave the PVEers to play on PVE servers?

 

And further, War Hero relics are BiS for at least a few classes/roles. But you don't see me complaining about having to PVP to get those do you? No. Because while they can be used quite effectively in PVE, they are intended for PVP use, so I would expect to have to PVP to get them. PVPers don't have to PVE in order to get those. So, why should PVEers have to PVP to get a predominantly PVE companion?

 

For most people PvP is just as important as PvE and vice versa.... I enjoy doing both and I would say the majority of players do also to cetain extents.... Having this NPC in outlaws Den will now attract a lot of people to it... As I said there are ways around it, go into the area with a big group, i'm sure there will be people forming groups outside Outlaws Den in order to safely get to the NPC.... or as i mentioned above you can wait a few days until the excitment dies down and go in there by yourself....

[AlixMV]

There is no need to go through Outlaw's Den for any class or companion quest - there is another route. The only other time it was a requirement was for one of the world bosses during the Rakghoul event.

 

There isn't?

 

 

As far as I can tell, the only way to get to one of Corso's Companion quests (I think the second one) is to go through the Outlaw's Den. And, believe me, I tried.

 

If there's another route, I'm all ears.

 

Edited October 25, 2012 by AlixMV

[Monoth]

If i'm not wrong the Expertise stat will not work in Outlaws Den (just like world pvp) so PvE'ers will have a gear advantage against people who only have PvP gear.... Edited October 25, 2012 by Monoth

[Imhotep]

I won't be doing quest if it goes live as is.

 

Your loss then

[Monoth]

There isn't?

 

 

As far as I can tell, the only way to get to one of Corso's Companion quests (I think the second one) is to go through the Outlaw's Den. And, believe me, I tried.

 

If there's another route, I'm all ears.

 

Regarding your spoiler, it's wrong, you don't have to go into Outlaws Den for any of your companions quests..

[Urael]

There isn't?

 

If there's another route, I'm all ears.

 

There is another route .. I posted it in this thread with some orienteering info to find it ..I will leave it for you to find here.

 

*coughpost66cough*

Edited October 25, 2012 by Urael

[AlixMV]

There is another route .. I posted it in this thread ..I will leave it for you to find.

 

I found it after I posted it, but even then, the description is confusing.

 

Not directed at you, but, seriously, the design of that quest still pisses me off. I spent like an hour looking for a way to get to that spot that didn't involve being pointed through both other-faction outposts near it or the PVP area and didn't find it. I believe you guys that it's there, somewhere, but it is completely non-obvious. I looked pretty hard in the Dune Sea for an exit to it, and couldn't place it.

 

I'm not the only one that happened, to, though--I had a friend with a higher level character of that class also 'have' to cut through the Outlaw's Den to get to the spot.

 

Maybe this vendor is placed similarly, but if so, I hope it's more obvious than that class quest.

[Sambril]

There isn't?

 

 

As far as I can tell, the only way to get to one of Corso's Companion quests (I think the second one) is to go through the Outlaw's Den. And, believe me, I tried.

 

If there's another route, I'm all ears.

 

THer quest indicators on the map are misleading as they will always show the shortest route from your current position, which is not always the way that you want to go.

 

 

There is a tunnel leading to the quest area from the Dune Sea, you will see some sandpeople outside.