I now have a new perspective on Recruit gear

[dcgregorya]

A game full of people finding exotic new reasons to do awful. This is a problem with the internet, if you were on my football team you wouldn't declare you're going to play like crap on purpose "because its your $15 and you'll do what you want."

 

Teamwork means everyone working together. And yeah, people are bad - but that doesn't mean you need to be.

[Eszi]

I recently rerolled an alt again and took him through 10-49 again and plan to lose my way to BM. So I took the Recruit token, sold it for 300K and used it to buy speeder training level 3 and got my WH offhand and proceeded to start losing in the 50 bracket.

Really? +20% mounted speed over a set of gear?

Also, why would you buy the offhand first? Mainhand costs the same ammount of comms and provides a bigger damage increase. Or, even better, just buy the bm mainhand (only 6 rating less) and wh implants and earpiece (no need to have the bm ones)

 

What's surprising is then you see the guys who tell you that you need recruit gear generally are much worse than you. For example in one game I did 80K damage, while the guy telling me I need to buy recruit gear did 60K damage. We're both pure DPS so we have no secondary functions. As you can surmise from these numbers I got totally owned in that game, but there were 3 guys who did less than 80K damage who weren't DPS. It was a standard 'totally owned' game so there was nothing strategic to defend since we lost the game as soon as it started so it's not like you could be doing low number because you're doing something else useful.

So, you got totally pwnt, huh? That's what happens when you enter lvl 50 bracket with green gear, that most of doesn't even have level requirements.

 

There was another case I was defending a node with another guy, that guy got attacked and died and I called for help relatively late, and we lose the node. Obviously it was my fault because the first guy who was attacked probably can't call for help while he was stunned. Incredibly, while I'm wearing literally random stuff I found on the ground on this character, and the other guy with me inspected me to repeatedly tell me my gear sucks, it never occurred to this guy that we're probably going to lose an obvious 2on2 so he should call for help.

Yes, it was your fault, because you obviously can't call for help while someone else is being attacked. I'm just wondering what do you mean by "relatively late", since most of the pugs tend to call incs "relatively late", as in they call it when they are already being roflstomped, when the enemy is already capping, or after they respawn and the enemy already capped the node (which at this point is useless tbh). It's not like you have a 5m visibility range, you can see when a pack of angry red is coming toward you from their spawn, and typing "inc w/e/mid [number]" isn't that hard either.

 

So if I indeed bought the Recruit gear what I am doing is essentially carrying guys who are way better geared than me who are inexplicably bad. Sorry, this isn't happening. I'm used to carry people on my WH gear characters, but even if the world doesn't plan on returning the favor when I'm on alt, I certainly don't expect to be carrying the team in Recruit gear. After I lose my 100th game I may feel merciful and go back to carrying the team again. My WZ numbers says I am somehow doing around average amongst teammates in my similar classification (maybe because I picked a good FOTM to reroll) so I think I pulled more than my expected weight. Yes I can do better, but not for the guys who are incredibly doing worse than me. If everyone is doing better than me, which is what should happen, I'll think about buying more Recruit gear. Until that happens, I'm going to save my credits as long as I'm with the guy who is somehow worse than me in BM gear while I'm wearing level 40 blues.

Yes, yes, we know, you are the biggest gift to all of us. Huh? You say that you are losing all the time? hmmm...you see a pattern here? Maybe it's because you are contributing to each of the loses by calling incs "relatively late", and by putting your team in a 7v8 situation. tbh you deserve to get kicked out of a wz and get replaced by a companion. Sure, he won't call incs either, but at least he is better geared, doesn't make bs threads like this, and doesn't expect to get carried to better gear.

[Legonick]

Way to play the hypothetical hero and be sure to talk about WZ consumables that nobody uses while gearing up.

 

Actually what happened was the guy complaining died without doing any damage to the attacker and the same thing happened to me. I'm not sure how many times I have to say this, but the entire team was incredibly bad. It has to be just the fact that while wearing almost nothing I still had higher leaderboard numbers than a few guys (who didn't quit). We also had stuff like Sentinels running to fight a Juggernaut 1on1 and lose while doing 0 damage to the Juggernaut.

 

It's really hilarious people are actually making statement in the form of "If you had Recruit gear..." I'm not going to say Recruit gear is useless against BM let alone WH augged characters, but if you think Recruit gear stops a BM let alone any stronger character for any period of time you must have some serious playing issues. After all the guy I was with had no problem of pulling I "can't type because I was stunned' deal while wearing at least BM gear.

 

 

Oh god.You can't say a person is bad when you complain about bad players calling you a bad player for doing a bad thing. It just rips a big-ol hole in the universe and the Doctor is like " Well **** you too" and then **** goes down and you end up at the end of the day.... as a baddie

[vimm]

i took it on my fresh 50.

I had 2400 WH tokens, and max Wz.

 

I bout my BM armor, then converted my WH into Wz tokens which i got all of the BM pieces but the wrist, belt, and boots. the rest was Recruit.

 

What a waste of warhero comms, lol.

[LenrocNewDawn]

OP you get an F from me for logic and resoning. Summer school for my young padawan.

[Pistols]

What a waste of warhero comms, lol.

 

Forever BM.

[Sungas]

If there is ever a great opportunity to call for help, it is when you are stunned. Your buttons are useless if your cc break is on cooldown. All you have left to do is type.

 

Personally, I have macros to call for help and I use them at the first inkling of incoming. Typically, if you call for help when you are stunned (the 8 second variety), you have already lost the node. That is if you are standing close to the node so that you can be stunned and then the attacker has a short jaunt to the cap. On occasion a stealth will stun you and that should be the only time you call for help when stunned. Other wise you should have seen them coming a mile away. If you are far enough away from the node you are guarding, the attackr's run to the cap will eat seconds off of your stun and give you time to break the cap.

 

The most difficult incomings to call are voidstar. You have to be quick to size up the situation. Occasionally, it is a gamble. You have to have a sense on if you can "take em" or if you should summon valuable assets away from the other side and you don't have much time to do it. Only experience will tell you what classes you can hold off and those you can't. Keep in mind that addtional opponents can arrive much quicker than in other warzones and your current cooldowns/health is definately a factor. If the heavily contested side is not in immediate jeopardy, your teammates should always take a quick peek before committing to make life a little easier for the weak side guard. When you summon help in voidstar, it will likely come from the spawn area. The barrior wall simply takes too long to circumvent. Again, it is on your team to have a sense that if there "aren't many on this side", they must be somewhere else. In Voidstar, it is everyone's equal responsibility to call incomings because the spawn area gives you a great vantage point to see which side the opponents are headed to. Conversely, as an attacker in Voidstar, you should run down the middle for as long as possible so that opponents in the spawn area can't make the quick call.

 

In summary, the OP's PVP noobness sticks out like a sore thumb.

 

I won't even go into the dumb concept of wearing crap gear instead of recruit.

Edited August 5, 2012 by Sungas

[dronepilot]

Let me first say that of course Recruit gear makes you perform better. This isn't about whether they're inadequate.

 

okaaay, go on...

 

I recently rerolled an alt again and took him through 10-49 again and plan to lose my way to BM. So I took the Recruit token, sold it for 300K and used it to buy speeder training level 3 and got my WH offhand and proceeded to start losing in the 50 bracket.

 

well your choice, I really didn't need that gear either, so yeah, took the money too !

 

And of course you get the 'omg you need recruit gear' which is no surprise.

 

What's surprising is then you see the guys who tell you that you need recruit gear generally are much worse than you. For example in one game I did 80K damage, while the guy telling me I need to buy recruit gear did 60K damage. We're both pure DPS so we have no secondary functions. As you can surmise from these numbers I got totally owned in that game, but there were 3 guys who did less than 80K damage who weren't DPS. It was a standard 'totally owned' game so there was nothing strategic to defend since we lost the game as soon as it started so it's not like you could be doing low number because you're doing something else useful.

 

I tell lots of people they need to get recruit gear, if they want to enter a Warzone, and no, I am probably 'not' worse than you. Its quite a big assumption really. Those numbers aren't typical of everyone's performance either.

 

There was another case I was defending a node with another guy, that guy got attacked and died and I called for help relatively late, and we lose the node. Obviously it was my fault because the first guy who was attacked probably can't call for help while he was stunned. Incredibly, while I'm wearing literally random stuff I found on the ground on this character, and the other guy with me inspected me to repeatedly tell me my gear sucks, it never occurred to this guy that we're probably going to lose an obvious 2on2 so he should call for help.

 

I tend to walk out of a Warzone with people like you in that kind of gear.. but on the other hand most of the time I stay, its just that a lot of us don't like to carry you, especially when you have zero expertise equipped. Its not that your a bad player, its just that you do not have the gear to compete against the "team" that you and I will be facing against. People do have off days though, not everyone has 'perfect' matches every time. So ok, let me see, you have worst gear than the guy next to you, and he calls late (yes that is his fault not yours) but your saying its obvious your going to loose the node, ... because ?! look, Recruit gear is fine, so long as your not focused. If your not, the dps is fine. If you get focused your toast, its the nature of how this game plays at the moment.

 

So if I indeed bought the Recruit gear what I am doing is essentially carrying guys who are way better geared than me who are inexplicably bad. Sorry, this isn't happening.

 

Its not the gear.. Recruit gear is fine, as I say, your putting your experience down to mainly, that a guy called late in a match, and wasn't as skilled fighter. Some people can have excellent gear, and produce low DPS numbers, its not the gear, its mostly the person, and their ability to understand their class and what's going on around them in the WZ. It essentially comes down to skill of the player. Because this guy has lower DPS than you it doesn't necessarily mean, that its the gear that's at fault in other words.

 

I'm used to carry people on my WH gear characters, but even if the world doesn't plan on returning the favor when I'm on alt, I certainly don't expect to be carrying the team in Recruit gear.

 

Remember when 'you' had to start some where ? when people had to carry you ?? - what makes you think your special, that you shouldn't have to help people up on to the ladder so to speak ?! People who are Fresh to WZ's have to start some where, and as it currently stands, we all share the same WZ's. You can choose to walk out, that's your call, but to be honest, don't be a hypocrite either.

 

After I lose my 100th game I may feel merciful and go back to carrying the team again. My WZ numbers says I am somehow doing around average amongst teammates in my similar classification (maybe because I picked a good FOTM to reroll) so I think I pulled more than my expected weight. Yes I can do better, but not for the guys who are incredibly doing worse than me. If everyone is doing better than me, which is what should happen, I'll think about buying more Recruit gear. Until that happens, I'm going to save my credits as long as I'm with the guy who is somehow worse than me in BM gear while I'm wearing level 40 blues.

 

Then stop playing pugs. Play more rated, and play with people at the same level as you, seriously, ?! moaning over carrying people who are just starting out in WZ's is really pathetic, and inconsiderate to new players. You were one once, don't make other people feel un welcome in WZ's because "I gots a War Hero" mentality.

 

Any way thank you, really entertaining read !

Edited August 5, 2012 by dronepilot

[randalthorr]

I want more of your type in pvp. Then I can get mega crits and feel epic about my pvp skills.

 

YES PLEASE

[Draekos]

I want more of your type in pvp. Then I can get mega crits and feel epic about my pvp skills.

 

YES PLEASE

 

Yes please I want more demolisher medals!

[Sathid]

A person was telling me this on The Bastion not just two hours ago,claiming that Recruit gear means nothing and is pointless and he is better off with Rakata etc,trust me you cannot reason with these people,there needs to be a small gear check now with the Recruit geared handed to players in the 50 Wz's.

[Zunayson]

Ahh, a new twist from the PVE'ers:

 

1) Spend the token money on anything but recruit gear

2) Check post-screen damage to find someone who did worse, then use that as "proof" that you don't need expertise.

3) Compare tactical errors to gear/expertise (which have nothing to do with each other) to further bolster your "proof"

4) Ruin more warzones for the real PVP'ers

 

Yes, there are people in expertise gear that play worse than you - but you still die in 10 seconds, over and over.

Trust me, you ain't "carrying" nothing and nobody, don't delude yourself.

 

So, unless you are on the other team, get the hell outta of my warzones!

 

I don't care how good you are tactically, or how skilled you are (Or think you are), the fact is, almost anyone in full WH vs you without recruit gear WILL kill you in 6 seconds.

 

Gear is a bigger factor than anything in PvP. It's not progression, it's

 

Okay, step right folks, grab your tionese, and let's wipe at HM EC until we get enough sympathy points until we get 1 Rakata Commendation!

 

Progression is low lvl playing low lvl, high lvl playing high lvl.

 

Not this sutpid roflstomp gear crap.

[Exilim]

Don't need recruit gear to force push people off the voidstar bridges so obviously why should I waste money on that stuff. Pfffffffff.

[Fdzzaigl]

I don't really see the "new perspective" here.

There are a lot of terrible players in PvP? Ok, that's not exactly new is it?

 

As you said yourself, you'll get owned without recruit gear, none of us can do anything about your choice to take the credit token and get yourself owned for a week or more because you don't care.

Your team mates being terrible however, does not change anything about the fact that by not taking recruit gear, you are actively sabotaging the team, whether they are terrible or not.

 

Which in turn makes you a pretty terrible player yourself, at least when it comes to actually caring.

[sanchito]

This guy doesn't have rakata gear....

While I agree, that rakata gear is nothing to rag on someone about. I will call someone stupid if they say Rakata gear is better for pvp than recruit gear. And yes, it has happened quite a few times before. They actually didn't even say recruit. They went so far as to say Rakata was better than BM gear.

 

I was under the impression that Rakata IS better then recruit, but worse then BM. Campaign to BM being a wash basically.

 

Is that incorrect?

[Leiralei]

I don't care how good you are tactically, or how skilled you are (Or think you are), the fact is, almost anyone in full WH vs you without recruit gear WILL kill you in 6 seconds.

 

That's different while wearing recruit gear how exactly?

[Wookubus]

you have to get it out of your head that just because your a dps specced player, thats all u should/need to do in a wz to succeed.

 

expertise plays a huge factor in pvp.... and if your without then your a liability to the team because i can't, in good faith, leave you behind to defend a node and go tank another without knowing in the back of my head your gonna last all of 20 seconds if attacked...

 

. without any expertise you should be a back burner support role....

[Sinemetu]

That's different while wearing recruit gear how exactly?

 

TTK of someone wearing recruit gear vs leveling greens is significantly longer. Depending on your class and how well you kept up on gear, that could be 3k more hp and what, 15% damage reduction? You could last twice as long, more if you get heals (since you're surviving longer, you're more likely to get some in the first place).

[Racter]

I was under the impression that Rakata IS better then recruit, but worse then BM. Campaign to BM being a wash basically.

 

Is that incorrect?

 

No, no PVE set gear is remotely viable in PVP, regardless of what it is. Look at it like this, I have 1200 expertise, you have zero. That means I'm hitting you ~23% harder than I would with no PVP gear. I also have ~18% damage reduction against whatever you can hit me for. Your 20-25k health from your campaign gear doesn't mean dick because I can hit you for 5k+ all day while you hit me with a wiffle bat.

 

It's one thing to take the armorings and use them to get the PVE set bonus, or maybe a relic, bracers, some off piece like that. You're only losing ~50 expertise, so as long as you've still got a solid number (1100 plus) it's not that big of a deal to drop a little. No expertise vs even recruit gear? You're gonna have a bad time.

[dcgregorya]

No, no PVE set gear is remotely viable in PVP, regardless of what it is. Look at it like this, I have 1200 expertise, you have zero. That means I'm hitting you ~23% harder than I would with no PVP gear. I also have ~18% damage reduction against whatever you can hit me for. Your 20-25k health from your campaign gear doesn't mean dick because I can hit you for 5k+ all day while you hit me with a wiffle bat.

 

It's one thing to take the armorings and use them to get the PVE set bonus, or maybe a relic, bracers, some off piece like that. You're only losing ~50 expertise, so as long as you've still got a solid number (1100 plus) it's not that big of a deal to drop a little. No expertise vs even recruit gear? You're gonna have a bad time.

 

Rakata is better than recruit. The 40% better stats makes up for the 20% damage loss.

[KantaUO]

Rakata is better than recruit. The 40% better stats makes up for the 20% damage loss.

 

The healer on your team disagrees.

[Totaltrash]

Rakata is better than recruit. The 40% better stats makes up for the 20% damage loss.

 

Wrong!

Expertise works in 2 ways - increases damage AND increases damage mitigation.

 

In your own (crude) numbers:

20% damage loss PLUS 20% damage mitigation on the target = 40% damage loss.

[dcgregorya]

The healer on your team disagrees.

 

Hmm, healing 13k with 15% dam reduction or 20k with 0% damage reduction.

[dcgregorya]

Wrong!

Expertise works in 2 ways - increases damage AND increases damage mitigation.

 

In your own (crude) numbers:

20% damage loss PLUS 20% damage mitigation on the target = 40% damage loss.

 

In your terminology "Wrong!" 40% more HP is better than 15% damage reduction.

[Darth-Rammstein]

Sorry OP the only one bad here is you...you opted for the 300k token to buy speeder training instead of getting the recruit set so you wouldn't be such a burden to your team. You sir are a ******.