Lore wise, which class would win?

[Rayla_Felana]

Counsular would counter.

 

It's Consular, not Councilor, as some seem to pronounce it.

 

Also, how? the Jedi Consular has no way of countering Kallig's Force Walk ability, you can't kill Kallig and better yet anyone who's seen the final boss fight of Chapter 3 would know Kallig is probably second only to the Emperor himself, but with the advantage of being un-killable.

[lokdron]

It's Consular, not Councilor, as some seem to pronounce it.

 

Also, how? the Jedi Consular has no way of countering Kallig's Force Walk ability, you can't kill Kallig and better yet anyone who's seen the final boss fight of Chapter 3 would know Kallig is probably second only to the Emperor himself, but with the advantage of being un-killable.

 

Yeah the only way you can kill kallig i would say is to destroy kallig's body completely.

[Rayla_Felana]

Yeah the only way you can kill kallig i would say is to destroy kallig's body completely.

 

Easier said than done, like I stated, the final battle cutscenes show Kallig is more than formidable enough to make the Dark Council wet themselves.

Edited June 28, 2012 by Rayla_Felana

[undeadsithdread]

Easier said than done, like I stated, the final battle cutscenes show Kallig is more than formidable enough to make the Dark Council wet themselves.

 

that why sith inquisitors are the kings of the sith.

[Lodril]

I'd have to go with the Imperial Agent or Bounty Hunter on this one.

 

Sure in a stand-up fight, they'd have trouble against all that space-magic, but they're more likely to have already poisoned their opponent before it gets that far, and as neither the Jedi nor the Sith are Reverend Mothers of the Bene Gesserit, that would be the end of it. Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon almost bought it that way in Phantom Menace - I doubt even Jedi can hold their breath indefinitely, and had the droids not opened the doors to check, they would have died. A contact poison would have resolved the issue as well, or simply venting the atmosphere from that room. Magic powers only get you so far.

[Sinemetu]

That fight has your disabling him not killing him.

 

 

It takes Watch female to tell you how to take him down. Using those consoles to... I don't remember what. She actually tells you before the fight that you can't beat him straight up.

 

The fight was fun. It wasn't straight forward, but the whole point of that fight was that the IA couldn't couldn't win without help.

 

Except...

 

...you have the option to kill him and I don't remember ever using any consoles. The point was that you aren't expected to be able to take him on. You do. The fact that you can and do defeat a Darth that Dark Council members wouldn't want to face is why they put the control on the agent in Act 2. Heck, they wanted to kill you because they don't want to let a non-force-user who took a Darth on and won live. Look, when you get right down to it, if I board your ship, kill all your minions, and disable you to the point where my buddy can destroy your ship, I'm better than you. Watcher 9's claim that you can't beat him is completely irrelevant considering that you do beat him.

 

 

Also, ignoring planet quests is complete nonsense. The dialogue in planet quests refers to your class quest in any case, and Darth Decimus and Darth Maul and Darth Severin all seem to think the agent is powerful enough to take on the most dangerous Sith and Jedi out there.

 

The agent fights the enemies she fights because they pose the greatest threat to the empire, not because she's trying to go after the enemies that are the most physically powerful. I think you're confused with what bounty hunters do.

Edited June 28, 2012 by Sinemetu

[Captain_Zone]

I'd have to go with the Imperial Agent or Bounty Hunter on this one.

 

Sure in a stand-up fight, they'd have trouble against all that space-magic, but they're more likely to have already poisoned their opponent before it gets that far, and as neither the Jedi nor the Sith are Reverend Mothers of the Bene Gesserit, that would be the end of it. Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon almost bought it that way in Phantom Menace - I doubt even Jedi can hold their breath indefinitely, and had the droids not opened the doors to check, they would have died. A contact poison would have resolved the issue as well, or simply venting the atmosphere from that room. Magic powers only get you so far.

 

BH vs. Jedi at 7:36 into the clip. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY2FpPGrC-w&feature=related

 

Jedi gets pwned.

[Rayla_Felana]

I'd have to go with the Imperial Agent or Bounty Hunter on this one.

 

Sure in a stand-up fight, they'd have trouble against all that space-magic, but they're more likely to have already poisoned their opponent before it gets that far, and as neither the Jedi nor the Sith are Reverend Mothers of the Bene Gesserit, that would be the end of it. Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon almost bought it that way in Phantom Menace - I doubt even Jedi can hold their breath indefinitely, and had the droids not opened the doors to check, they would have died. A contact poison would have resolved the issue as well, or simply venting the atmosphere from that room. Magic powers only get you so far.

 

Just a word on Breathe Control, we know a Jedi could hold their breaths for whole weeks, etc...

[Aalexi]

Just a word on Breathe Control, we know a Jedi could hold their breaths for whole weeks, etc...

I can only assume through a mix of meditation and extremely limited movement? When you're a BH with an air filtered helmet, your target not being able to move gives you a pretty big advantage.

Now for a short story of my own (as muh as I love bounty hunters):

A huge class battle raged, a Sage and Inquisitor competed with mighty force powers, shielding themself and causing great flashes of light as their shields crashed into one another, testing their power. A Knight and a Warrior fought fiercely with lightsabers, throwing each other across the battle ground with both kicks and the force. From nowhere an assain appeared to stab the Knight, being blocked by a shadow a second before the attack ended the life of a brave warrior. A bounty hunter fired a rocket, her devastating attack only stopped by a brave trooper activating their energy shield and throwing themselves into its path before returning fire.

The Inquisitor drew on the power of the force ghosts he had bound, breaking the sages shield and sending them flying against a wall with a fatal burst of lightning.The Trooper took advantage is his focus on killing the sage to fire an explosive round into his back, destroying his body almost completely before being bested by the superior tech and firepower of the Bounty Hunter. The Jed Knights focus outlasted the rage of the Warrior and through sheer endurance bested their opponent. While a worthy opponent the Jedi Shadow eventually succumbed to the trickery of the assasin and was killed. On his way to avenge the fallen shadow, the Knght had just enough time to see an agent on the roof before he was fatally shot. Turning their attention to the agent, the Warrior and assasin were suprised to see them vanish into thin air, before re-appearing and severing the tendons of the assasins leg. The agent vanished again, preparing to stab the Warrior once they had dispatched the agent. At this moment, a hail of gunfire came from behind a barrel. The agent took cover and the Sith deflected it, their laughter cut short as an XS-Freighter flew overhead and blasted them all into oblivion before landing.

As the smuggler went to get back on board victorious, another operative who had been waiting for the right moment dropped out of stealth behind the smuggler and raised their vibroknife, before being promptly crushed by an unbelievably strong bear-hug. Hearing the bones crunch, the smuggler turned round and simply said 'Thanks Bowdaar'.

[lokdron]

that why sith inquisitors are the kings of the sith.

Not really the SI is pretty much a brute with force lightning the sith warrior does a better job at manipulating people and acting like a sith.

[Ranadiel_Marius]

Yeah the only way you can kill kallig i would say is to destroy kallig's body completely.

 

Or in theory a light sided force user could purify the force ghosts from a DS SI, removing a giant chunk of his cut scene power and removing the immortality side effect in the process.

[Silimaa]

I think everyone can agree that Force Users > Non-force Users.

 

I think that the planet quests kinda of brake the lore a bit as they make us think that all the classes are on par to be able to defeat the bosses of each. The IA never defeats a force user on an even 1v1 unless it's a planet quest.

 

 

And Darth Jadus was...? Oh, yeah. A Force User, a Dark Lord, one of the most powerful members of the Dark Council, and the IA beats him one on one in the hardest boss fight of the game. (Or with a companion, but those don't count.)

 

[Chanez]

I think that the planet quests kinda of brake the lore a bit as they make us think that all the classes are on par to be able to defeat the bosses of each. The IA never defeats a force user on an even 1v1 unless it's a planet quest.

 

What about

Ardun Kothe

?

 

I think the inqusitor would win since he can make people bow down to him with his mind.

[undeadsithdread]

Not really the SI is pretty much a brute with force lightning the sith warrior does a better job at manipulating people and acting like a sith.

 

only reason warriors act better at "manipulating" people because bioware are warrior fanboys of course they try make warrior better at everything then inquesitor.

 

also "better" sith you mean as being enforcer in fact when baras asked sith warrior about sith code and it meaning either you bluff or you say you don't need it.

 

warriors always existed to be inquesitors sidekicks.

[lokdron]

Or in theory a light sided force user could purify the force ghosts from a DS SI, removing a giant chunk of his cut scene power and removing the immortality side effect in the process.

 

But would you not need to know the various rituals the SI went out to learn to purify the spirits? Cause if you are dark side you have the option to kill the people who teach you the ritual to control/purify the ghosts so that way you are keeping the knowledge for yourself.

Edited June 29, 2012 by lokdron

[Ranadiel_Marius]

But would you not need to know the various rituals the SI went out to learn to purify the spirits? Cause if you are dark side you have the option to kill the people who teach you the ritual to control/purify the ghosts so that way you are keeping the knowledge for yourself.

 

I don't see why you would need to know any of the rituals as the force user wouldn't be attaching the ghosts to himself. All the LS force user should need to know is that the ghosts are there and then they should be able to purify them in the same manner that a LS SI can, and no one teaches how to purify the ghosts, a LS Si is just able to do it.

And the person who teaches you to control ghosts....is dead when you meet him so I'm not sure how exactly you kill him...

 

 

Alternatively, if the JC used the Chpater 1 ritual that I forgot the name of on the SI, it would in theory destroy the SI's ability to eat ghosts which seems like it would be a hilarious encounter.

[enigmayshi]

The Jedi Knight stepped out into a beautiful autumn morning on Voss. He looked around, inhaling the sweet air in the early morning hours. He got a vague sense that something is a bit off, and had just enough time to look up with a concerned expression on his face as a red beam struck him in the temple. He never heard the snap/whine of the high powered sniper rifle as the bolt entered his skull, boiling his brain as it killed him instantly.

 

Imperial Sniper FTW.

 

Dodging a shot fired from the side and behind is quite another. Especially a shot fired at ELR and not having to adjust for windage or elevation (since blaster energy is unaffected by air currents or gravity). He might have just enough time to figure out something might be a bit off, then pop.

 

"Judge me by my size do you? Well you should not, for my ally is the force, and a powerful ally it is!"

 

As HK so astutely observed, "Explanation: Statistically, over planning the assassination of a Jedi seems to backfire. Extrapolation: There are many theorists who claim Jedi can see the future and I do not know if that is true, but it seems impulsive acts are more common to succeed than planned incidents. Jedi like Sand-Kivers seem to sense trouble a few seconds before it happens. They are tricky little pests."

 

Translation, Smuggler is probably a far better Jedi/Sith killer than the Imperial Agent could ever hope to be due to their impulsive actions and making everything up as they go along. And Agents tending to try and formulate an entire play by play before things happen.

[RendValor]

It's Consular, not Councilor, as some seem to pronounce it.

 

Also, how? the Jedi Consular has no way of countering Kallig's Force Walk ability, you can't kill Kallig and better yet anyone who's seen the final boss fight of Chapter 3 would know Kallig is probably second only to the Emperor himself, but with the advantage of being un-killable.

 

Except they do, it's called Consular Shielding Ability. It counters everything

[Kaisernick]

smuggler because they would most likly cheat in the fight.

[darthkargtor]

A light side SI beats a DS si because a dark side SI would end up like the

dark council member lord scourge kills

from the revan novel becoming a shell having to spend a large amount of time to build up enough power to use one ability due to the massive corruption, where as a light side SI would be less weakened by age and corruption and their for able to fight effectively.

Edited June 29, 2012 by darthkargtor

[Ancaglon]

Except they do, it's called Consular Shielding Ability. It counters everything

 

 

Not exactly, but it is used in forcing and locking out the spirit of an ancient Sith Lord from the body of a living man, so it would seem to exactly counter these force ghosts.

 

[Liquidacid]

whatever class I'm currently playing

 

/thread

[Captain_Zone]

Translation, Smuggler is probably a far better Jedi/Sith killer than the Imperial Agent could ever hope to be due to their impulsive actions and making everything up as they go along. And Agents tending to try and formulate an entire play by play before things happen.

 

Agents also have to improvise as they go, and have mental training to hide their intentions (as evidenced in dealing with Darth Jadus). I suggest playing through the IA storyline. Not only is it the best in the game, imo, but it really shows how one non-Force user can make a difference.

[Lionflash]

And Darth Jadus was...? Oh, yeah. A Force User, a Dark Lord, one of the most powerful members of the Dark Council, and the IA beats him one on one in the hardest boss fight of the game. (Or with a companion, but those don't count.)

 

I guess the IA has faced a few force users, but not as many as other classes, certainly not as many as the JK.

 

 

The fight between Jadus and the Agent seemed to play out suggesting that Jadis is stronger, but the IA just had the right circumstances... which I liked! Because to me I don't think the IA is stronger than the other force users.

 

 

I'm not saying Jedi >>> Imperial Agents. I'm saying 'The Jedi Knight' >>> 'The Imperial Agent'.

 

I know that some non-force users can beat force-users but the JK in the SWTOR story has defeated much more powerful enemies than the IA has.

 

 

It just doesn't make sense that the IA could be able to defeat force users like Ardun Kothe

and Jadus without being force sensitive, and on Voss the Agent admits that he/she isn't.

 

[Sinemetu]

I guess the IA has faced a few force users, but not as many as other classes, certainly not as many as the JK.

 

 

The fight between Jadus and the Agent seemed to play out suggesting that Jadis is stronger, but the IA just had the right circumstances... which I liked! Because to me I don't think the IA is stronger than the other force users.

 

 

I'm not saying Jedi >>> Imperial Agents. I'm saying 'The Jedi Knight' >>> 'The Imperial Agent'.

 

I know that some non-force users can beat force-users but the JK in the SWTOR story has defeated much more powerful enemies than the IA has.

 

 

It just doesn't make sense that the IA could be able to defeat force users like Ardun Kothe

and Jadus without being force sensitive, and on Voss the Agent admits that he/she isn't.

 

So basically what you're saying is that you don't like the idea that a non-force user can kill a force user, and you intend to disregard all evidence to the contrary.