To Bioware, regarding Tank vs DPS Shadows/Assassins

[Goldenstar]

They done not only that.. They take away Armor from Tank spec..

«Tank» that will die as quickly as any DPS class.. what a joke!

 

Exactly. Tank spec sins will now have 15% more armor than SORCERERS (the lightest class in the game). What kind of sense does that make?

[Revelationjp]

I've played both an arsenal merc and a tankasin since EGA. No one really likes a nerf to their favorite class/spec, but one thing I did like about the one to arsenal merc and now this one is that it tends to run off the FOTM players who play the class only for some perceived "easy mode". I play those classes/specs because I think they're cool and love their respective playstyles, and I enjoy that i'm a little more unique after everyone flees. Like the arsenal merc nerf, this one seems a tad much. I think they'll find they went a bit too far. The armor is prob where the overkill is, a tank needs heavy armor equivalence. My feeling is that in the future we'll see a slight back pedal on this nerf, just like we're seeing now with the arsenal buff. In the meantime, I'll be sticking around, as I'm no easy mode FOTM player, I play this class for the aesthetics/playstyle.

[Missandei]

My feeling is that in the future we'll see a slight back pedal on this nerf...

 

What future? They just kill the PvE tanking for Shadow.. So there will be no Shadows in notime after the 1.3...

They just lose another 200-300K of subs..

By the end of year they will close the game due to the unexistence of subscriptions..

[Pekish]

you have to look it at the complexity of the change

 

they removed relic/adrenaline they removed the highest peak damage... (as the operative was whining)

 

so our heal was OBVIOUSLY out of place as it was our armor.... without the combo relic/adrenaline there is no way someone can kill a tanksin

 

so looking at the change to tanksin without looking at the change in the way damage is applied is wrong

 

TTK was highly dependent from RELIC+ADRENALINE with relics lasting 20 second (not 3 or 5 second)

once you remove the capacity for the DPS class to make big number (and this nerf go to ALL dps class not only Operative but MARAUDER/SENTINEL and PYRO too) you cannot have a tanksin healing so damn much with so much armor

 

so the 2 are connceted i dont think the tanksin nerf is a tanksin nerf but a shift in DPS numbers of course the class untouched are the one Buffed

[Jabbabba]

What future? They just kill the PvE tanking for Shadow.. So there will be no Shadows in notime after the 1.3...

They just lose another 200-300K of subs..

By the end of year they will close the game due to the unexistence of subscriptions..

 

Yes so true,they made the worst decision on which stat they should nerf and they called ARMOR.

I don't have any worries about healing nerf,but armor nerf for a tank?

How im supposed to tank Warlord Kephess?yeah ill taunt him and kite him until he get bored!

The metric's cause of this nerf was based on pvp obviously,VG /PT was and will be the best tanks in pve.

I hope someone will try EC HM on PTS and just lol about shadow tank's!

 

So shadow tanks will still be OP in pvp cause even they have a damage reduction like a marauder,dps classes will not have much burst to down them without the relics/adrenals(LOL)!

[tynt]

Deception and madness are both great specs but why play either when tank spec was just so damn good.

 

You think deception is bad??? Try conceal op.

[ShadowOfVey]

Deception and madness are both great specs but why play either when tank spec was just so damn good.

 

You think deception is bad??? Try conceal op.

 

I feel really bad for concealment ops. No on demand burst with relic/adrenal is going to be miserable.

[Larzi]

Too funny, They basicly addmitted that thr assassin tank spec was jacked, LOL at all the peeps with mad skills that play a stakced class

[Astarica]

Deceptoin/Madness appears weak as a side effect of Tankasin being supremely overpowered. Also, since people assume you're someone that takes 4 guys to take down when they see the double bladed lightsaber, this means anyone who didn't spec into Darkness dies really horribly since your enemy isn't going to ask you what spec you are before attacking you.

[Xienive]

Really? Assassin/Shadows in non-tank spec do just fine and their role is perfect. The problem is giving what should be a pure DPS class any sort of HUGE mitigation ability.

 

IMHO, the tankassin nerf still isn't quite far enough - the tanking technique should reduce damage output by at least 30%. You wanna tank? Be a tank and soak up damage while doing squat for damage. You wanna do damage? Fine, but your survivability needs to be reduced.

 

There is not a doubt in my mind you have never played a tank or DPS specced Shadow.

[iNeXxS]

Whats wrong with Infiltration Shadows again? You have the most burst in the game when popping out of stealth, and a backstab that you can use multiple times without a cooldown. The only classes that can complain right now are DPS Ops and Healing Mercs.

[cycao]

Whats wrong with Infiltration Shadows again? You have the most burst in the game when popping out of stealth, and a backstab that you can use multiple times without a cooldown. The only classes that can complain right now are DPS Ops and Healing Mercs.

 

Well we have no opener so I dont know what best burst out of stealth is. The "opener" I speak of is a 2 sec knockdown and our burst requires set up and you can see it coming a mile a way.

 

Deception/infiltration brings nothing to the table in terms of competitive PvP, they are effectively taken out of the equation with roots and snares as they have no real gap closer out side of force speed but with all the CC in the game it does not help. There overall lack of defenses (should not have to explain this one) means they fold like origami under a little pressure. Still now I may give this class a shot I have a friend who is rank 90+ and I feel me and him would melt faces off with our power stacking that we have been doing

 

Madness is great but have not played it enough but have seen it in action and can have great dps I mean great and self healing that I felt was way better than darkness mainly because there is no way to stop it.

 

I have no problem with the changes but I was expecting something to happen with the other trees to make them more appealing to other players as they did with mara/sents for 1.2

[CasperTricks]

Yes, the tank spec needed to be toned down a bit for pvp, but you're also not realizing the reason why all Shadows and Assassins are pvp'ing in the tank spec. It's because the two dps specs are not that great. The damage, utility and survivability are both too low to compete effectively.

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most people that rolled a shadow or assassin didn't do so thinking they were going to be pigeonholed into a tank spec in order to have any chance to compete. If you want less people to pvp as tank shadows/assassins, you're going to have do something about the other two trees to make them more appealing options.

 

I have to agree fully with this statement, When I started playing my assassin I started as deception. I stayed deception up until the day I became full WH. I love deception assassin but I have to say as a matter of fact 2 things. A) I have never to this day seen a madness spec'd assassin that was effective in PVP... Im pretty sure mediia just created a thread asking who the best madness assassin on swiftsure was and im pretty sure to this day there is still no replies with a single madness spec sin worth noting. B) As deception the most DPS I had ever accomplished in a match was 313k, I recently switched to tank sin for the first time using the full DPS WH gear & have broken 400k at least a three dozen times & pushed 550-600k twice...

 

Something here, is just not right. I would very much like to play my heart and soul class deception sin, but as long as BW ensures Tank sins will outperform the designated DPS on the DPS charts, I will play the "Tank"...

 

For those saying Pics or it didnt happen I just got fraps & in a half match of voidstar not really trying that hard I broke 200k+ took #2 DPS & #1 kills (Aoes kills im sure) as a.... "Tank" the other's in the match were strictly business as well, a top end swiftsure pvp guild so its not like they were random noobs or something competing with my "Tank" DPS.

 

 

Im planning on making more videos to show how broken this class is and hopefully inspire BW to pump up their intended sin "DPS" instead of just nerfing their intended "Tank"

Edited June 6, 2012 by CasperTricks

[NoTomorrow]

I feel really bad for concealment ops. No on demand burst with relic/adrenal is going to be miserable.

 

Excelent. As many classes really strugled against this on demand burst operatives had. Striking from invosible when the odds are stacked in you favor = giving no fighting chance to the victim. Yet another BS removed from this game. What an amazing patch is 1.3 going to be.

[Kawiki]

Excelent. As many classes really strugled against this on demand burst operatives had. Striking from invosible when the odds are stacked in you favor = giving no fighting chance to the victim. Yet another BS removed from this game. What an amazing patch is 1.3 going to be.

 

 

Wow dude. I am curious what class do YOU play that you have issues with all these classes??

[beyondkilling]

are you kidding me you guys have very high burst and good survability just LEARN TO PLAY

[cycao]

are you kidding me you guys have very high burst and good survability just LEARN TO PLAY

 

I am not arguing anything in terms of "burst" which I put in " " because of the changes being made to TTK but to the fact that they changed the only viable spec for PvP and make no changes to the other trees. Deception is "fun" but broken, it brings nothing to the table. Madness is what I feel now a stronger class but I am not worried at all I know all the specs well but my pre made needs a tank so I am stuck.

[Larzi]

So all these pissed off tank assassins REALLY and TRUELY believed they were just that much better than everyone else in pvp? Never considered that their class was unbalanced.

 

If you still have a fat h ead from face rolling pvps, then this shouldnt make you miss a stride, cus you know, you are incredible at PvP, liek the best ever, not because of the broken class, but because the way you move your fingers, in pvp

[Ballisticbryan]

Ok... so they nerfed the PVP aspect of the shadow/sins... but they buffed the PVE aspect.... lame sauce....

 

So will the buff in taunts increase our protection output in pvp at all?? as in give us more medals and record more prot numbers??

[Kaze-Yama]

Ok... so they nerfed the PVP aspect of the shadow/sins... but they buffed the PVE aspect.... lame sauce....

 

So will the buff in taunts increase our protection output in pvp at all?? as in give us more medals and record more prot numbers??

 

They nerfed PvE much worse than PvP. In long fights PvE assassins will go down much quicker than any other tank class now. They are raging just as much on the pve side as the pvp side about how poor these changes are.

 

The changes to threat mechanics have no impact on PvP at all. Basically they nerfed a tank class for all the wrong reasons.

[Ballisticbryan]

so Bioware is basically saying that tank shadows/sins should no longer be tanks, but we should be pigeonholed to just protecting our healers in PVP, and being a non factor in PVE.. sweet...

 

Plus i heard they also nerfed the adrenals , and rakata stims ... is there any documentation where i can read about this?

[Richoshist]

Shadow was never my main class in the first place. Sometimes a suggestion is made for the good of the game and not because of a cheap ploy to avoid having to learn to play.

 

So you're calling for buffs to a class that you barely made it to 50 with? Maybe you should learn to play it before you make comments calling for buffs to specs you barely play.