Awayy Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 This is already being worked on... watched one of those guild summit vids one day while bored at work and they're re-working Ilum from the ground up. Oh that is good news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocSinn Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 MMOs in general are dying. The problem is the MMO industry as a whole, not just one game. MMOs have became stagnant, stale copies of themselves. Sure some of them have a few different bells and whistles, but for the most part MMOs are one big "been there done that" experience. The complacency of MMO developers is driving the industry downward. They are slowly but steadily killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Look at the evolution of PC, Console, and Handheld games over the past decade. Gaming in 2012 looks nothing like gaming 2002. Games today are light years ahead of games 10 years ago. Now look at MMOs. Virtually nothing has changed. It's the same experience you remember from 10+ years ago. Fetch it quests. Predictable instanced raids that are little more than gear vending machines. Grind oriented progression. Imbalanced PvP bound by the PvE trinity(tank/healer/dps). This is the state of virtually every MMO on the market. You arent going to see the type of players WoW enjoyed in its prime from ANY GAME(including WoW itself) until developers show some stones and do something new. MMOs are on their way to being a nich genre again and that wont change until someone breaks out of the same old same old mentality and start pushing the boundaries of the industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numerii Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 I think this is a case of poor management and weak executive descisions coulpled with bad prioritization. I believe if the game had LFG, X-Server PVP and dual+ Specialization from launch the number of subs would look quite a bit healthier then it does now regardless of D3, GW2, diffusion or any other attrition including death by sockpooping. ^^ 5-char Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaar Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 (edited) This is already being worked on... watched one of those guild summit vids one day while bored at work and they're re-working Ilum from the ground up. By the time they come out with whatever they think ilum should be, this game would be long dead. Not to mention the cheap game engine they opted for just cannot handle it. It does not matter what they do to ilum if the game engine cannot handle more than 20 people on screen at a time and there is no one left to play it....... Edited May 29, 2012 by Archaar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UGLYMRJ Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 (edited) By the time they come out with whatever they think ilum should be, this game would be long dead. Not to mention the cheap game engine they opted for just cannot handle it. It does not matter what they do to ilum if the game engine cannot handle more than 20 people on screen at a time and there is no one left to play it....... So far 1.3 million subscribers disagree with you... There's plenty to keep me occupied in the meantime. I wonder though... if the game is that bad... why are you here? Edited May 29, 2012 by UGLYMRJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awayy Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 (edited) So far 1.3 million subscribers disagree with you... There's plenty to keep me occupied in the meantime. I wonder though... if the game is that bad... why are you here? You gotta admit that he has a point with the engine. Edited May 29, 2012 by Awayy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timadan Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 MMOs in general are dying. The problem is the MMO industry as a whole, not just one game. MMOs have became stagnant, stale copies of themselves. Sure some of them have a few different bells and whistles, but for the most part MMOs are one big "been there done that" experience. The complacency of MMO developers is driving the industry downward. They are slowly but steadily killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Look at the evolution of PC, Console, and Handheld games over the past decade. Gaming in 2012 looks nothing like gaming 2002. Games today are light years ahead of games 10 years ago. Now look at MMOs. Virtually nothing has changed. It's the same experience you remember from 10+ years ago. Fetch it quests. Predictable instanced raids that are little more than gear vending machines. Grind oriented progression. Imbalanced PvP bound by the PvE trinity(tank/healer/dps). This is the state of virtually every MMO on the market. You arent going to see the type of players WoW enjoyed in its prime from ANY GAME(including WoW itself) until developers show some stones and do something new. MMOs are on their way to being a nich genre again and that wont change until someone breaks out of the same old same old mentality and start pushing the boundaries of the industry. This is truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UGLYMRJ Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 You gotta admit that he has a point with the engine. It's an MMO with less than 6 months under it's belt... Personally, I don't see what every one else seems to complain about. It's by the most fun I've had with an MMO. It has it's issues, as does every MMO since the beginning of MMO's. The game now is good and it has the potential to be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UGLYMRJ Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 MMOs in general are dying. The problem is the MMO industry as a whole, not just one game. MMOs have became stagnant, stale copies of themselves. Sure some of them have a few different bells and whistles, but for the most part MMOs are one big "been there done that" experience. The complacency of MMO developers is driving the industry downward. They are slowly but steadily killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Look at the evolution of PC, Console, and Handheld games over the past decade. Gaming in 2012 looks nothing like gaming 2002. Games today are light years ahead of games 10 years ago. Now look at MMOs. Virtually nothing has changed. It's the same experience you remember from 10+ years ago. Fetch it quests. Predictable instanced raids that are little more than gear vending machines. Grind oriented progression. Imbalanced PvP bound by the PvE trinity(tank/healer/dps). This is the state of virtually every MMO on the market. You arent going to see the type of players WoW enjoyed in its prime from ANY GAME(including WoW itself) until developers show some stones and do something new. MMOs are on their way to being a nich genre again and that wont change until someone breaks out of the same old same old mentality and start pushing the boundaries of the industry. Agreed this is truth as you said... I think with the money it takes to get an MMO off the ground all the developer's are scared to take huge leaps and bounds away from what they know works and sells. They are all cookie cutter images of each other right now and I look forward to the day that someone breaks into something new and actually does it well. Unfortunately WoW made such a huge impact on the MMO world that I don't think anyone will be able to break away from that any time soon. Over 10 million people (and that might be under estimated) have got used to and know this as the base for an MMO. They are complicated enough as is and then to break away from that entirely would be similar to a car company breaking away from tires and a steering wheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 (edited) MMOs in general are dying. The problem is the MMO industry as a whole, not just one game. MMOs have became stagnant, stale copies of themselves. Sure some of them have a few different bells and whistles, but for the most part MMOs are one big "been there done that" experience. The complacency of MMO developers is driving the industry downward. They are slowly but steadily killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Look at the evolution of PC, Console, and Handheld games over the past decade. Gaming in 2012 looks nothing like gaming 2002. Games today are light years ahead of games 10 years ago. Now look at MMOs. Virtually nothing has changed. It's the same experience you remember from 10+ years ago. Fetch it quests. Predictable instanced raids that are little more than gear vending machines. Grind oriented progression. Imbalanced PvP bound by the PvE trinity(tank/healer/dps). This is the state of virtually every MMO on the market. You arent going to see the type of players WoW enjoyed in its prime from ANY GAME(including WoW itself) until developers show some stones and do something new. MMOs are on their way to being a nich genre again and that wont change until someone breaks out of the same old same old mentality and start pushing the boundaries of the industry. Pretty much every game since WoW, with the notable exception of some spectucular failures, are just WoW with another facelift. There's really no innovation and this is why something like Diablo 3 hurts all MMORPGs, including WoW, just because it's something different. By the way, Blizzard would much rather you play WoW over D3. As much hope as they've riding on RMAH, it's virtually unthinkable you'd rack up $100 to $150 worth of transaction fee on their RMAH each year for the average player, while you obviously pay that much for an year of subscription to WoW. And since no game really sets apart from each other you basically just see the population gets more and more diluted, though to be fair having 100K subscribers at $15/month generates $1.5 million/month or $18 million an year, and nobody will say no to an extra $18 million an year. It certainly costs nowhere near $18 million an year to support a MMORPG with 100K subs. So MMORPGs are still successful financially but I think you won't ever see a game like WoW that basically controlled the entire market unless someone else made another revolutionary breakthrough in MMORPG gaming. Edited May 30, 2012 by Astarica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Agreed this is truth as you said... I think with the money it takes to get an MMO off the ground all the developer's are scared to take huge leaps and bounds away from what they know works and sells. They are all cookie cutter images of each other right now and I look forward to the day that someone breaks into something new and actually does it well. Unfortunately WoW made such a huge impact on the MMO world that I don't think anyone will be able to break away from that any time soon. Over 10 million people (and that might be under estimated) have got used to and know this as the base for an MMO. They are complicated enough as is and then to break away from that entirely would be similar to a car company breaking away from tires and a steering wheel. Well FF14 tried to be really different from all the other MMORPG and looked at what happened. I don't think WoW's the end of the evolution of MMORPG but if there's a next level of MMORPG gamign experience, certainly nobody has figured it out, and whoever figured it out is going to be really rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Seems patch 1.2 and the class balance fiasco has done to WoW what Blizzard could not do and that's is actually grow sales as well as secure a phenomenal 6.3 million sales for D3. If that was not enough GW2 the follow up to GW1 which sold over 6,5 million has had more box sales then actually players logged into SWTOR right now! PvP balance or lack of as well as lack of PvP content has driven this game into a rut. The best thing these guys at BW could do is revert class balance to pre 1.2 unless of course its true that game designers are playing Marauder! Because, as we just learned from SWTOR, box sales means everything about how awesome the game will be, right? How many people pre-ordered SWTOR again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Well FF14 tried to be really different from all the other MMORPG and looked at what happened. I don't think WoW's the end of the evolution of MMORPG but if there's a next level of MMORPG gamign experience, certainly nobody has figured it out, and whoever figured it out is going to be really rich. FFXIV's failing wasn't that it was "too different" from other MMOs. It failed because it was still too much like FFXI, which is basically an Everquest-clone in fancy Square digs. The menu systems and macros were clunky back in 2000 when I played the game, and they're unpalatable to the current generation of MMO players now. They basically did not learn anything about how to make a clean, working UI system in the past decade, and the other mechanics weren't polished enough for people to ignore them. Hmm, I meant to check out what the new project leader did w/ it, he's had about a year to fix the mess that the original lead dev made of the project. Things should be panning out about now. : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awayy Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 It's an MMO with less than 6 months under it's belt... Personally, I don't see what every one else seems to complain about. It's by the most fun I've had with an MMO. It has it's issues, as does every MMO since the beginning of MMO's. The game now is good and it has the potential to be great. Well, its defiantly nice to hear happy customers time to time on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talarchy Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 GW3 looks great, if you want something for the meantime, try Tera, a little too asian for m tastes, but the graphics are jaw dropping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 GW3 looks great, if you want something for the meantime, try Tera, a little too asian for m tastes, but the graphics are jaw dropping I hope some former WoW players do not lose the irony in this sentence, especially when considering the thread that it's in. : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 FFXIV's failing wasn't that it was "too different" from other MMOs. It failed because it was still too much like FFXI, which is basically an Everquest-clone in fancy Square digs. The menu systems and macros were clunky back in 2000 when I played the game, and they're unpalatable to the current generation of MMO players now. They basically did not learn anything about how to make a clean, working UI system in the past decade, and the other mechanics weren't polished enough for people to ignore them. Hmm, I meant to check out what the new project leader did w/ it, he's had about a year to fix the mess that the original lead dev made of the project. Things should be panning out about now. : ) The UI sucked in FF14 not to mention the latency but core of the game is still very different from the generic WoW clone. If you pick the higher difficulty setting for the levequests or the few dungeonst hat existed, those guys are basically raidlike in their ability to completely demolish your party. I can only surmise the theory is that if you make stuff you have to kill to just get basic gear basically raid-like in terms of the punishment they dish out this fosters a community or something. Even EQ1 didn't involve mobs that do raidlike DPS just to level up. So FF14 was definitely very different from the generic MMORPG and it's not even all that similar to EQ1. It was definitely a very unique game in the wrong way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 GW3 looks great, if you want something for the meantime, try Tera, a little too asian for m tastes, but the graphics are jaw dropping Is this the Chinese version of GW2, kind of like how they have Diablo 5 two years ago? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Namesis Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 you just start your grind a few years ahead of time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criminalheretic Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Seems patch 1.2 and the class balance fiasco has done to WoW what Blizzard could not do and that's is actually grow sales as well as secure a phenomenal 6.3 million sales for D3. If that was not enough GW2 the follow up to GW1 which sold over 6,5 million has had more box sales then actually players logged into SWTOR right now! PvP balance or lack of as well as lack of PvP content has driven this game into a rut. The best thing these guys at BW could do is revert class balance to pre 1.2 unless of course its true that game designers are playing Marauder! Another nerf Marauders thread cleverly hidden as a general commentary on MMOs. Do you get like a special patch or something if you start 100+ threads on this subject? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Descent Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 (edited) The fact is that Bioware just isn't cut out for running and developing an MMORPG - all their "innovations" are tragically flawed for the genre, and their attempts to remedy it are equally laughable. Their development priorities are clearly all over the place, and the customer service is in disarray, not to mention that it already has a hideous reputation. SWTOR is turning out to be one expensive mistake. Edited May 30, 2012 by Descent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanana Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 GW3 looks great, if you want something for the meantime, try Tera, a little too asian for m tastes, but the graphics are jaw dropping The combat system is - finally - different from the usual auto-aim tab taregtting. You aim and dodge, block and maneuver to beat foes, you don't just stand and trust the dice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LexiCazam Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Hi everyone, We ask that threads made in our forums center on discussion of Star Wars™: The Old Republic™. We have closed this thread as the discussion primarily focuses on other games. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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