Will You Trust Bioware Again?

[JeramieCrowe]

No it does not. People are just spread out across way too many servers. If they shut down and merge the servers, there would be 5 servers just as high population as the fatman minimal. Is that world of warcraft population? No but I am fine with that. With every new mmo the game starts out with a huge player base then the game dips to its solid players. The problem is the game released with way too many servers, so when the dip happened it made the game seem dead.

 

There would be a lot more than 5 with Fatman populations. My server is 16th on the list, and well populated. Just about perfect, actually. Just enough to get a group anytime I want (100-150 on the Fleet daily), yet I don't have to constantly wait on respawn when questing or doing dailies.

[msales]

I think that it was less of an argument per se and more leaning towards having a little bash at those screaming at BW to fix everything right now.

 

I claim with assertiveness that I have a high fluid intelligence (but that's backed by a high score in Ravens Matrices and having Aspergers Syndrome), but I'm not that very objective. I am biased against anyone who opposes me . I would still presume that it would be possible, if not correct to to state that you are an objective person if you simply believe yourself to fall under the definition of being an objective, one who is always rational, logical, critical to an extent where to only gather information, and one who listens? Not too sure on the true definition, this is what I think it entails, regardless of whether I am correct on the definition I would like my point to remain open. Ah, 1 who is open minded.

 

Exactly, clearly making his post fundamentally subjective.

 

The whole issue of, as you put it “screaming at BW to fix everything right now” is what gets to me. I think that this is a very dismissive way of dealing with people who are raising legitimate points. Of course people want issues addressing ASAP, we aren’t beta testers and we aren’t playing for free, we are paying customers. Also don’t forget that the game has been out now for nearly half a year. The funny thing is that a lot of people back in January were saying “if BW don’t get more features added quickly then the servers will be like ghost towns in 6 months time.” A lot of other people then rallied to BWs defence much like some people in this thread have done. BW and the fanboys should have listened back then.

 

There are currently issues with the game, the most obvious being server population resulting from a multitudes of issues. People are giving feedback in these forums and that is a good thing. Yes some people are becoming frustrated, this frustration is exacerbated by BW/EAs unwillingness to acknowledge that there are problems. BW are giving the impression that they don’t really understand how to keep subscribers and have bitten off more than they can chew with SWTOR.

 

Remember the bottom line is, the people “complaining” are the people who enjoy the game but want it to meet its full potential. Also BW are a professional company and don’t need people to stick up for them in the forums, they need honest feedback.

[iheartnyc]

This is your perspective, from your point of view. Your personal assumptions and desires. I can respect your right to your opinion, but I find your analyses to be silly.

 

I'm enjoying the game very much. It is new. There are expectations for the future, as there always are in a new MMORPG. However, "big game feel", whatever that is suppose to mean, is not even on my priority list. LOL Hurt feelings or trust, are not even within the realm of consideration. I'm not even sure that someone would come forth with such an odd statement.

 

For the price of a pizza and a beer (estimated enjoyment time of 1 hours), we have unlimited access to this game. Not sure where such issues as betrayal and damaged feelings would enter into that.....but then again, I see it as a game to be enjoyed for a number of hours per week, not an extension of my life. ;p

 

Your nonchalant attitude is really what is the problem here. I never used to gripe about this game until recently. There were HUNDREDS of posters, if not thousands, who expressed concern about the very same issues I raised, in JANUARY. Given that these issues were never resolved, they have all since left the game. Sub numbers have declined. As of last count it was 1.3 million, still a good number.

 

But tell me, how is the game better off, when thousands of people, who are concerned about the same issues as me, leave this game? How is it better for you? It's a snowball effect...a critical mass of people leave one server, and everyone left on that server suddenly find it hard to find groups and stop enjoying the game. Without their subs, developers have less money to develop more content. Which causes more people to want to leave.

 

Casual gamers such as yourself, who lack any kind of devotion or commitment to a product, is what's leading this game to fail. "Oh if I stop having fun I will just leave or stop playing." Some of us care enough about this game that if there are problems, we will raise them and raise them again and again to make it work. There were HUNDREDS of pages on a single thread regarding one single issue (high-res textures) starting in late December lasting for a few months. When that issue was not addressed, compounded by other problems, many subscribers left the game. How is this good for your long-term enjoyment of the game? I'm glad that quitting a game is so easy for you. For some of us, who really looked forward to SWTOR, who really spent our time and eneregy getting to know this game, don't want to give it up without at least a fight.

[iheartnyc]

????? Really? You totally and completely missed the point. I don't even...

 

I don't even know what to say.

 

You can't create an analogy about the need to eat, one time, at a restaurant. That's not even remotely close to what I was talking about. You are talking about the need to eat (one time payment, sustains LIFE) versus what I was trying to make a point about (completely voluntary subscription). Its not at all like what you were trying to describe.

 

If you are trying to tell me that people subscribing to this game (in a market filled with options) is exactly like the need to EAT, then God help us all.

 

You're dismissing the logic of the analogy because you disagree with the premise?

 

Just change food and restaurant to any other activity and offering (say playing soccer with people you reallyt don't like, but you drove 1 hour to get there so you might as well play for the time being). Same logic applies then.

[iheartnyc]

I agree with you. The more people like the op that leaves this game, the better if you ask me. I hope they leave for good the game is better without them.

 

You've got to be kidding me, you are so blind. Many like me have left. But you know what the scary thing is? Many more who feel the same way, but don't post on the forums, have left silently without saying anything.

 

You know, a lot of the people who organized raids, the best crafters, the people who wrote the guidebooks, put up the youtube videos showing us how to defeat content, the people who basically blazed the trail for us? Yeah, a lot of them have just given up as well. And how is this good for you?

 

I am sad that some of the great guilds and guild leaders that were always so helpful and helped make the game feel epic, have long since left the game. And if you think somehow we are all better off because we have Joe Pug still playing, then you are fooling yourself.

[Azumio]

No, not a chance.

 

I bought/played Bioware games for their story primarily.

 

Since they've been take over by EA, their writing and games have been pretty bad story-wise and gameplay wise

 

Their games became bland and boring, with terribly simplified systems and streamlined out the buttocks.

 

They aren't the company or team they used to be. Not even close.

[Merwanor]

SWTOR was marketed with trailers showing better graphics and hood down JK.

The graphics has been improved since release, but the hood toggle is yet to be introduced. And they still advertise with cool looking JKs with their hood down.

 

Slight Mass Effect 3 spoiler ahead, you have been warned.

 

 

ME3 was advertised with the promise that our decisions would have a big impact on the ending, and most of you probably know how that turned out, one of the worst endings ever made for a game. And not as advertised.

Also lots of great details from the previous games was taken out, the game was good, but it felt rushed and unpolished compared to their previous games in the series.

 

 

 

DA2:

Obviously a rushed game, the rehashed enviroments destroyed the replayability for that game. Playing it to the end 1 time felt like replaying it 3 times. Also I had to wait 3 months before I could actually play the game without game breaking bugs. I liked the game when I played it, but because of the rehashed enviroments, it is a worse game than DAO.

 

So how can I trust a company, that obviously release unfinished games and markets their games with lies?

I have been a loyal supporter of Bioware, I even defended DA2 because I thought it was better than most people said. But with SWTOR and ME3, they have disappointed me to much, is it EA that makes them release their games unpolished, who knows... I just know that Bioware has lost some of my support and trust because of their recent releases.

[Cherly]

What scares me is that I'm starting to feel that SWG NGE > SWTOR. I never thought that I would ever feel that way after SOE destroyed 2 of my favorite games (SWG and PS). But at least SWG was playable, sand box, and had real space fighting.

 

Amen brother!

[Goretzu]

First attempt at an MMO with constraints by Lucas and EA. I won't hold SWTOR against BW if it never pans out. Flops happen and we get past them. Looking forward to a Balder's Gate or a new KOTOR!

 

\I do believe that I am about done with the MMORPG paradigm/genre as it is envisioned by developers at this time. I swore off MMORPGs after WoW, and was sucked back in by the promise of SWTOR..

 

I hate to think how much it would cost to develop a new Balder's Gate of a new KOTOR.

 

Although really with the success of the Elder Scroll/Fallout format it's a bit surprising they haven't.

[JollyRogers]

Casual gamers such as yourself, who lack any kind of devotion or commitment to a product, is what's leading this game to fail. "Oh if I stop having fun I will just leave or stop playing."

 

Sorry, but I'll have to disagree with you on that one. Or, maybe we each have a different definition of a 'casual' player or play style. I'm referring to the "casual player" that can only play an hour or so a weeknight if they're lucky. And maybe a few hours in a block on weekends. The below is referring to these casual players in a general sense.

 

We work jobs during the week, and we have families. We play for entertainment, fun, and to relax. And, I think you'll find the majority of the casual players of this type can be very loyal to something, as long as they're having fun. The casual players tend to avoid the forums for the most part, as modern day games pretty much have cesspools for forums, and SWToR is no different. They typically have a greater understanding and tolerance than the "OMG FIX IT NOW OR ELSE!" crowd. We understand how businesses run, and how the internal workings of large companies can go. We understand that developers are people too, and don't expect them to be chained at their desks 24 hours a day, to be at our beckoned call.

 

We also have disposable income. We can (and do) buy multiple accounts for games for family members to play with us. We buy the 'frilly' things that can be offered as extras for cash in games that offer it. Dropping $25 for a flashy, cosmetic pet or mount, per account in our households isn't a major issue for us. Or, if character slots get filled, we don't have an issue of firing up a second account to serve as our banks, expanded alts, etc...

 

We have friends and network with people at our jobs who are like minded and play with them, introducing additional players to the game of the same type. Even if we can run just a single flashpoint over a weekend, but have fun with our friends, that is good for us. We might even wipe a few times, and laugh amongst ourselves about some of the comical things that happened when we screw up.

 

We don't get upset if someone isn't "geared" to play with us. We remember we all were like that player, and that having fun was more important. We don't think it's fun to purposely and negatively impact other players by stealing their nods or quest items in an area we may be in as well. We're not the hot heads who will quit and run off to the new, shiny game the moment our immediate issues aren't met.

 

So no, casual gamers are typically not the ones who cause a game to fail. Casual gamers tend to be the 'bread and butter' and provide a steady income to companies who provide a sufficiently entertaining product. We don't have large demands, or expect the game code to be re-written to meet our demands. Casual gamers are the ones keeping the lights on (and the developers employed) long after the fly-by-night crowd has moved off to the next hot thing.

[Ashlian]

Sorry, but I'll have to disagree with you on that one. Or, maybe we each have a different definition of a 'casual' player or play style. I'm referring to the "casual player" that can only play an hour or so a weeknight if they're lucky. And maybe a few hours in a block on weekends. The below is referring to these casual players in a general sense.

 

We work jobs during the week, and we have families. We play for entertainment, fun, and to relax. And, I think you'll find the majority of the casual players of this type can be very loyal to something, as long as they're having fun. The casual players tend to avoid the forums for the most part, as modern day games pretty much have cesspools for forums, and SWToR is no different. They typically have a greater understanding and tolerance than the "OMG FIX IT NOW OR ELSE!" crowd. We understand how businesses run, and how the internal workings of large companies can go. We understand that developers are people too, and don't expect them to be chained at their desks 24 hours a day, to be at our beckoned call.

 

We also have disposable income. We can (and do) buy multiple accounts for games for family members to play with us. We buy the 'frilly' things that can be offered as extras for cash in games that offer it. Dropping $25 for a flashy, cosmetic pet or mount, per account in our households isn't a major issue for us. Or, if character slots get filled, we don't have an issue of firing up a second account to serve as our banks, expanded alts, etc...

 

We have friends and network with people at our jobs who are like minded and play with them, introducing additional players to the game of the same type. Even if we can run just a single flashpoint over a weekend, but have fun with our friends, that is good for us. We might even wipe a few times, and laugh amongst ourselves about some of the comical things that happened when we screw up.

 

We don't get upset if someone isn't "geared" to play with us. We remember we all were like that player, and that having fun was more important. We don't think it's fun to purposely and negatively impact other players by stealing their nods or quest items in an area we may be in as well. We're not the hot heads who will quit and run off to the new, shiny game the moment our immediate issues aren't met.

 

So no, casual gamers are typically not the ones who cause a game to fail. Casual gamers tend to be the 'bread and butter' and provide a steady income to companies who provide a sufficiently entertaining product. We don't have large demands, or expect the game code to be re-written to meet our demands. Casual gamers are the ones keeping the lights on (and the developers employed) long after the fly-by-night crowd has moved off to the next hot thing.

 

Are you sure you're not secretly in my guild? I think you described virtually all of us, and more eloquently than I ever could. Except half my guild did buy D3....and not one unsubbed to do it. They're just popping into our Mumble server's BF3 channel to play D3 instead of BF3 for a change. But no....none of us are "grass is greener" people. I find it beyond amusing that the new FOTM is Elder Scrolls Online. Because you can't tout an MMO unless it's months or years from open beta. There's no fun if you have to discuss its actual features, not just the devs' fantasy release wishlist.

[janne_josefsson]

Trust? really?

 

The general forum is full of rethorical bullcrap that emphasizes on really wierd stuff at the moment.

 

"Will bla bla Tera GW2 ALLOW Swtor to establish itself?"

"Will you TRUST Bioware again?"

"Can Swtor be SAVED?"

 

Seriously, just quit the game and become wannabe politicians allready!

 

[edit]

 

I know a thing or two about rethorics.

Edited May 22, 2012 by janne_josefsson

[Lunga]

Trust? really?

 

The general forum is full of rethorical bullcrap that emphasizes on really wierd stuff at the moment.

 

"Will bla bla Tera GW2 ALLOW Swtor to establish itself?"

"Will you TRUST Bioware again?"

"Can Swtor be SAVED?"

 

Seriously, just quit the game and become wannabe politicians allready!

 

Quoted for mojo-effin' truth!!!

[TheOnlyKyrenS]

bye,

 

/5char

[Florial]

A lot of us bought this game believing that Bioware would come through with a great game. Plus it was Star Wars. Then we started seeing the warning signs within a few weeks of launch:

 

In an MMO, it's not as simple as, "well at least we got our 6 months of playtime, well worth the money." MMOs don't work like that. We grind and we continually run the same boring content over and over again because of the future promise that we are building something for the long-term. That this will be our character for the next 2-5 years. With the game showing absolutely no progress on the major issues, what is our incentive to continue grinding, if by the time we have all BiS gear and clear all content, the game dies? We grind in the hopes of being best prepared for the next stage of the game, the new content and ranked content.

 

I am seriously disgusted at Bioware right now. My subscription ends at the end of July (I did the 6 month subscription). Next time Bioware releases a game I think I will wait 3 months after reading all the reviews and forums before investing my time and energy into their product.

 

Will I "trust" Bioware again? Sure, I will buy a BioWare game if it looks interesting and play it. I usually get my money's worth out of most games. Would I play another BioWare MMO? If it looked promising, sure. Just as I'm picking up Secret World, even though I was disappointed by Ages of Conan. I don't share any great angst towards any gaming company in particular. Where they would earn my distrust is if they mismanaged things like my credit card or constantly had some horrible security breaches. For this reason, this is why I picked up a game card for an old EQ2 game. I worry about SOE's security and I don't want them to have my credit card on file.

 

I would certainly love to find an MMO that I could happily play for years. I've found a few of them along the way--Asheron's Call 1, EQ2, LoTR were some longer term ones for me. Sure, they had their flaws but I was pretty happy playing them for a few years. More recent games though have had a shorter shelf life for me unfortunatly. From the moment I launched SWTOR, I had a suspicions that this would be a six month game for me and I was right. My sub runs out in June. Do I loathe BioWare? Absolutely not. I had fun. I will return to SWTOR one day when there is more content, more fluff like being able to customize my ship or have personal housing, more companion stories, etc. I also have the Republic side to play and I don't want to see that side yet since I'm a bit burned out with the overall environment.

 

I do have a bit of sympathy for those real Star Wars fans who saw the closing of their beloved SWG and came here thinking this would be a replacement. I do like Star Wars but this isn't the second coming for me.

[Tasburath]

 

Here I come Guild Wars 2. Don't let me down. I've been hurt in the past.

 

Prepare to be let down again.

[AnimalMotherr]

This game is great. Why wouldn't I buy another Bioware game? They've put out some great fun games. I like fun, don't you?

[AnimalMotherr]

Prepare to be let down again.

 

P.S. ^^^^^^ This.

[Alkiii]

I trust Bioware ... it's EA that I don't trust. I will not buy another one of their products again.

[Shibata]

I trust Bioware ... it's EA that I don't trust. I will not buy another one of their products again.

 

Bioware is just another Funcom. SWTOR is simply another AoC. Never again will I buy games from these companies unless they have proper reviews. Sad thing is, Funcom is now also with EA, so if AoC failed, I'm scared about their upcoming mmo ...

[ajanu]

SWTOR is the last EA/Bioware game im buying. There is enough free games on torrents.

[Skidrowbro]

I don't get some of you. Complaining about the fleet not having 300+ players. I play on the Swiftsure and I have not seen more than 70+ people on the fleet and groups have never been an issue. I'm starting to believe that most of you are talking out your *** and just don't like the game. Time to move on and trash talk your next mmo

[navocky]

My bet is that 3/4 of 'Ill unsub for 100%' people will not unsub ;PPPP

 

This said though - yes I wont buy a Bioware game before reading several reviews and forum comments anymore.

 

1)Dragon Age 2 aka 'the tale of 2 indoor enviroments and 4 enemy types' (which could be awesome -liked many parts of it - but was rushed)

2)Mass Effec 3 aka 'the tale of ******* you ending' (self describing sorry but after seeing that thing I cant even play mass effect 1 or 2 since whatewer I do makes -all in all - no sense)

3)SWTOR aka 'Its not that bad really but still was rushed. And is empty' (sorry but I actually like the game - I dont care that it was obviously rushed for chrismas, bugged and lacked endgame content thats being adressed. What I dont like is having 4 people max on each planet and 30/40 in the fleet)

 

To tell the truth I could live with all that (as I lived with DLC advertisments in Dragon Age origins masked as conversations) if not for the fact that instead of apologising and trying better people at Bioware installed new policy of lying right to your face. No idea why.

 

I mean how can you -when every single person you meet mocks your game (DA2) for being unfinished (and a game with indoor enviroments that differ through door locking and with 4 or 5 monster types is unfinished) stand up and say 'we were bold in our new direction and most people loved it' ? Or call Mass effect 3 ending 'artistic' when it is sloppy, ****** and full of plotholes?

 

I mean if those guys stood up and said:

'Lisen for financial reasons we had to release SWTOR early - its been 6 or 7 years people ! - its a little unfinished and we are sorry but we will do everything to fix that and to make your wait as fun as possible'

Id buy that.

 

I know why they didnt tell the full truth - PR.

But when you lie too much you eventually break the connection with you customer

 

I know why they released the game too early - money . And money is a good thing kids - dont bash the 'suits' for wearing suits there is nothing bad with wanting to earn as much as possible, youll learn when you start working. But when you release a game waaaay to early you breake it if its a MMO because today the ADHD kids want evertything 'RIGHT NOW NOW NOW ALL' and do not know how to wait.

 

So yes I do not trust Bioware anymore - I dont care if its EA or their own fault but they changed through the years Ive followed their games.

Dont know why - If I were to bet anything Id say EA will drain them for their potential and recognisable brand and than throw them away to someone when theyre done - but really dont know anything for sure.

 

That said I wont unsub I like playing with my friends and were bored of WoW ;P but to tell the truth thats the only reason

[Oscibi]

I don't get some of you. Complaining about the fleet not having 300+ players. I play on the Swiftsure and I have not seen more than 70+ people on the fleet and groups have never been an issue. I'm starting to believe that most of you are talking out your *** and just don't like the game. Time to move on and trash talk your next mmo

 

 

I would love to have 70 people on the fleet. actually i would love to have 70 people on the whole server at peak times

 

Join Kai-kan Go to the fleet - or search and you will see during peak times your lucky to get 5-10 on the republic. and about 8-15 on the imperial side (1-50)

[TUXs]

I don't get some of you. Complaining about the fleet not having 300+ players. I play on the Swiftsure and I have not seen more than 70+ people on the fleet and groups have never been an issue. I'm starting to believe that most of you are talking out your *** and just don't like the game. Time to move on and trash talk your next mmo

 

Leave your server some day and see what others see. You're blinded by your single server view of the game. Please don't suggest players "move on" either - that's just stupid!