How is this possible? Doesnt make sense.

[Dabrixmgp]

I play on Jedi Covenant. I have a 50 assassin that Im starting to gear out. Have 5 pieces of BM so far and I started with the recruit set I tried to help a little. From 10-49 we almost always won and most of my losses were to other Imp teams. But we hardly ever seem to win at 50. Im lucky if out of 4-5 hours playing I get 3-4 wins.

 

So I recently started a Sentinel, not to reroll, but so I could get the Legacy Buff. We hardly ever win in the 10-49 bracket. I just capped out my WZ commendations and I have 5 wins. Can someone please explain to me how these people, that are so bad from 10-49, automatically become Chuck Norris PvP Juggernauts at 50?

Edited May 13, 2012 by Dabrixmgp

[Maurdiib]

Level 10-49 reveals class imbalances the most. There's no expertise gear worth mentioning. Thus, it comes down to class imbalance, and then finally skill.

 

Level 50 WZs rely on a gear check. Whoever has the most cumulative BM/WH gear on a team wins. Skill is second to the amount of expertise you have.

 

Chances are the Rep players on your server have more WH gear.

[Dabrixmgp]

Chances are the Rep players on your server have more WH gear.

 

So even though most of the ones on I play with on my Republic character are backpedaling bads when they hit 50 they magically become awesome just from gear?

Edited May 13, 2012 by Dabrixmgp

[Vudu]

Good players learn from their failings and the failings of their team. They adapt, are better for their hard fought, far and few between victories. They stuck with it, because they wanted to see better days. They worked hard for their successes.

 

To the contrary, in your case, you had it easy, early on. It tends to make people soft when they have it easy. There is more allowance for mistakes when the consequences aren't realized, other than another win. Losing, constantly, is unforgiving and refined techniques are developed that become habit.

 

Learn to hate losing, unlearn to expect winning.

[LiveandDieinLA]

Sents / Maras are weak until they get their 31 point abilities.

[Maurdiib]

So even though most of the ones on I play with on my Republic character are backpedaling bads when they hit 50 they magically become awesome just from gear?

 

Yeah, dude. Don't you know what expertise does?

[flem]

I play on Jedi Covenant. I have a 50 assassin that Im starting to gear out. Have 5 pieces of BM so far and I started with the recruit set I tried to help a little. From 10-49 we almost always won and most of my losses were to other Imp teams. But we hardly ever seem to win at 50. Im lucky if out of 4-5 hours playing I get 3-4 wins.

 

So I recently started a Sentinel, not to reroll, but so I could get the Legacy Buff. We hardly ever win in the 10-49 bracket. I just capped out my WZ commendations and I have 5 wins. Can someone please explain to me how these people, that are so bad from 10-49, automatically become Chuck Norris PvP Juggernauts at 50?

Uh, they're not the same people?

 

50s bracket probably has a core of Conquerors and War Heroes who've been playing and improving since launch. The lowlevel bracket is just random guys getting some killing in.

[Bogdanzeborsky]

Level 10-49 reveals class imbalances the most. There's no expertise gear worth mentioning. Thus, it comes down to class imbalance, and then finally skill.

 

Level 50 WZs rely on a gear check. Whoever has the most cumulative BM/WH gear on a team wins. Skill is second to the amount of expertise you have.

 

Chances are the Rep players on your server have more WH gear.

 

On my server its the other way around, IMPs usually stomp us. I agree with this guy. I have over 900 exp. yes there are still lots of players who have full BM/aug gear that I can't even touch. I might as well be a lvl 40 trying to kill a 50. There needs to be cross realm pvp with a bracketing system Right now SWTOR pvp is about how much time one puts into a char and the gear they have, the only skill plays a part is in hut ball and even then its like playing the globe trotters against a bunch of varsity noobs.

[Dabrixmgp]

How big is the gap between full BM and full War Hero?

[flem]

How big is the gap between full BM and full War Hero?

Either not big (pure numbers) or really big (everything else).

 

BM = rank 140. WH = rank 146. Expertise is 10 or fewer points per piece (if you replace BM+Power crystals with +Expertise). So it's not much bigger than the near-negligible Champ/oldBM gap.

 

*But*.

 

BM armor/weapons still have crap DPS statting (no Surge, anywhere, except on Commando gun). And you can either have augments or set bonus, not both. WH fixes both of those. Also, weapon classes scale really well with just the base damage increase on the mainhand...

 

Overall the gap is a lot less than having a WZ adrenal vs not having one, but most (though not all) WH-geared folks have actually learned to play in that time as well.

Edited May 13, 2012 by flem

[Wubsie]

How big is the gap between full BM and full War Hero?

 

About 1.3% more PvP damage bonus from expertise [and less from the other two], plus it has 61 mods instead of 58. Different itemization though, and a horrible grind for min/maxers.

[Foxrynn]

It's like natural selection when it comes to war zones for many servers.

 

The Imperial side beats the hell out of the Republic side in 10-49 brackets. Those Republic players who persevere and become competent with their class finally hit 50 and are stuck with competent players as well work together and dominate the 50 bracket.

[Xerain]

Level 10-49 reveals class imbalances the most. There's no expertise gear worth mentioning. Thus, it comes down to class imbalance, and then finally skill.

 

Too bad you can't balance a level 10 to a level 49 so to complain that it reveals class imbalance is just stupid. Good thing 10-49 pvp doesn't matter and i can't wait for true leveling brackets of pvp.

[olagaton]

So even though most of the ones on I play with on my Republic character are backpedaling bads when they hit 50 they magically become awesome just from gear?

Saying that someone who backpedals is bad makes me wonder who the bad player really is, tbh.

[Foxrynn]

Saying that someone who backpedals is bad makes me wonder who the bad player really is, tbh.

 

They're only bad when they force speed back pedal against a juggernaut...

[Dabrixmgp]

Saying that someone who backpedals is bad makes me wonder who the bad player really is, tbh.

 

I have forced people to back pedal into the acid pit and fire traps and off of ledges so many times its not even funny. Please tell me how beck pedaling is good? It will never get you anywhere. Try running backwards outside right now. Then try running forwards. if something was chasing you and you wanted to get away which way would you choose?

[Crooching]

My server has a bit of a swing it seems. At the start, there was a massive imbalance of imps towards reps. Therefore, the few reps that pvp'd 50 learnt to play together and use tactics.

This meant reps started winning all games, there were good imps, but because they had the big imbalance, there was also a lot of crappy players that filled there ranks.

As soon as reps started winning, the reps became the heavy side, and now we have a lot of the crappy players.

 

More often than not, the outcome of a warzone rests upon how many bad players you have, rather than how many good players, seeing as you can only group queue with a max of 4 players.

 

Plus 1-49 bracket is very different from 50 bracket. The players in 1-49 are constantly changing, 50 is a lot more static, you get to know the other players and their tactics.

[Aetou]

Uh, they're not the same people?

 

50s bracket probably has a core of Conquerors and War Heroes who've been playing and improving since launch. The lowlevel bracket is just random guys getting some killing in.

 

This really. At Level 50 you'll have the strongest PVPers on the server who have been playing together since launch forming premades and communicating using voicechat. Below 50 you have different guys without the group experience or communication. Who dominates in the 50 bracket will generally come down to who has the strongest guilds. Who dominates in the lower bracket will come down to who bothers to play in that bracket and how the spread of characters is in that bracket (i.e., rolling a 4 man premade of good players all below level 20 and so lacking key skills like interrupts is a bad idea as we found out this week.)

[KBSIP]

I have forced people to back pedal into the acid pit and fire traps and off of ledges so many times its not even funny. Please tell me how beck pedaling is good? It will never get you anywhere. Try running backwards outside right now. Then try running forwards. if something was chasing you and you wanted to get away which way would you choose?

 

I've used backpedaling to trick inattentive players into LoSing themselves out of heals. When someone flat-out runs, or side strafes away, a good player hangs back in range of his healers. When its a backpedaller, many assume an easy kill and come in to fight, realizing too late they've LoSed out of heals against a very well played burst DPS class. Merry Christmas assumptions.

[olagaton]

I have forced people to back pedal into the acid pit and fire traps and off of ledges so many times its not even funny. Please tell me how beck pedaling is good? It will never get you anywhere. Try running backwards outside right now. Then try running forwards. if something was chasing you and you wanted to get away which way would you choose?

There are quite a few situations in which backpedalling would be the optimal move. If you aren't using it in those situations, they you are the bad.

[upzie]

There are quite a few situations in which backpedalling would be the optimal move. If you aren't using it in those situations, they you are the bad.

 

Care to elaborate on those situations ?

 

Lets see strafe = faster movement speed and better/smoother manuverability vs backpedalling wich is slower and more clumsy on every account.

 

please to tell how its better, plz plz plz.

 

And as for op, ppl allready pointed out that its not the same ppl playing most of the time, so no wonder that ppl who put countless of hours into learning their class, might have come from another game with lots of pvp expirience are better than the 10-49. Not to mention that half the ppl in the 10-49 do not have all of their core abilities/talents yet.

Edited May 13, 2012 by upzie

[Maurdiib]

Too bad you can't balance a level 10 to a level 49 so to complain that it reveals class imbalance is just stupid. Good thing 10-49 pvp doesn't matter and i can't wait for true leveling brackets of pvp.

 

Except you can; and it does. In your vast experience and unlimited time spent playing this game have you ever heard of the Bolstering system?

 

Come watch as I take down level 45 Sages with my level 23 Sniper in mere seconds. Or perhaps spectate as I eat level 40 Arsenal Mercs with my level 20 Shadow in a 1v1.

[Crixaliss]

I have forced people to back pedal into the acid pit and fire traps and off of ledges so many times its not even funny. Please tell me how beck pedaling is good? It will never get you anywhere. Try running backwards outside right now. Then try running forwards. if something was chasing you and you wanted to get away which way would you choose?

 

Neither, I'd go for straife...

[olagaton]

Care to elaborate on those situations ?

 

Lets see strafe = faster movement speed and better/smoother manuverability vs backpedalling wich is slower and more clumsy on every account.

 

please to tell how its better, plz plz plz.

 

And as for op, ppl allready pointed out that its not the same ppl playing most of the time, so no wonder that ppl who put countless of hours into learning their class, might have come from another game with lots of pvp expirience are better than the 10-49. Not to mention that half the ppl in the 10-49 do not have all of their core abilities/talents yet.

 

Here is a very simple example. If you are being attacked by someone who comes up behind and attacks, what is the best direction to move to make it harder for him to hit you?

 

Move forward, and he can still see you, and is already facing that direction to follow you.

Strafe to the side, and he can still see/attack you, and at the most needs to turn a Max of 90 degrees either way to follow you.

Backpedal, and you opponent loses directional attack sight, must turn a full 180 degrees the opposite direction he is already facing, putting the need for action in his court, not yours.

 

I'm surprised more people don't realize the basic mathematical advantage this gives you. Is back pedalling always the movement of choice? Absolutely not, but it has its place among the common movements, and the exclusion of such an advantage is the act of a bad player.

[Crooching]

Here is a very simple example. If you are being attacked by someone who comes up behind and attacks, what is the best direction to move to make it harder for him to hit you?

 

Move forward, and he can still see you, and is already facing that direction to follow you.

Strafe to the side, and he can still see/attack you, and at the most needs to turn a Max of 90 degrees either way to follow you.

Backpedal, and you opponent loses directional attack sight, must turn a full 180 degrees the opposite direction he is already facing, putting the need for action in his court, not yours.

 

The player that attacks from behind will not be standing right behind you, dry humping you. he will still be at a fair distance. Assuming you are using your mouse to move, not click skills, the fastest way to get behind him is and instant 90degree turn (a slight movement of the mouse to one side) and a strafe. this allows you not only to use your first skill earlier, but gets you behind the player quicker.

 

If you were to slowly back pedal, and the player behind you isn't completely dead inside, and backpedals also to match your pace, that means he is landing 100% of his attacks on you, and you are landing none on him.

 

 

Simple maths?