Subs down 25%

[Ironleg]

As of tomorrow i am Initiating racechange Inquisitor > Barbarian:D

 

hahah same. I'm rerolling Witchdoctor tomorrow.

 

I'll keep checking back here for news though.

[unseenmaji]

You have been religiously following this thread since the news broke.

 

Who are you trying to convince bro?

 

You clearly want everyone to believe a 25% loss means nothing.

 

To be honest, its sadder that you aren't an EA employee at this point. At least then you would be being paid to make these statements that defy common sense.

 

The real drop is 65% they have covered it up, the truth is the free subs and trials were used to buff report numbers but the active players in game shows truly that the game is almost dead.

[SpacePiglet]

1.2 was a fail.

Class balance was a fail. They made ok and playable classes retarded. So players quit.

You think when you made the classes fail, players are all going to re-roll and spend more time grinding in the game? If your answer is yes, you need a life or a better brain.

Legacy system was a fail. Why the heck would players level all those characters when they don't have the time to? Yet if they don't do that they are losing out from the benefits. So players quit.

My in games friends went back to WOW. Even though I told them I like this game more.

 

Now I am disappointed with the game too. I LOLed at some bugs 'fixes'. The sage 'bug' 'fix' turned my guild sages either not coming online or re-rolled scoundrels. I joined a few operations last week. And the operation leaders asked for commando healers or scoundrel healers. They prefer their heals instead of sages' because their heals are more efficient (according to people in the raid).

 

Sound bug that was introduced since 1.2 is just annoying everyone left right centre...when just when can that be fixed? Doing quests with cut scenes it's like watching mime shows. Going into warzone, flashpoints, spaceship.... wow just pretty much everywhere the sound is just noise.... I know turn off the sound is an option but....players like to switch on the sound for many reasons...

 

I'm on subcription...Therefore I am stil here...But everyday I thought to myself....damn...why did I paid for that subcription... ><

I am only playing because of some in game friends now. Once they all quit (which they will once their subcriptions are over) I might consider quit too.

 

BTW if SWTOR is F2P, I would not even consider playing at all in the first place. I run away from F2P MMOs...

[Vankris]

1.2 was a fail.

Class balance was a fail. They made ok and playable classes retarded. So players quit.

...

 

If no one was able to play those class efficiently, i would agree but that is wrong. I see in my guild, healers have had a small adaptation period to get use to the managing ressource, but eventually, there were able to regain a great efficiency with their class. If anything, they say now the class is more interesting to play and they learn more about their class in a week than in 4 month playing it.

 

therefore, i disagree, class balance was globally positive in 1.2. but class balance is never done

 

PS: wow changes class al the time: paladin, warlock, druid, they play nothing like they use to at release.

[Satanski]

I had some spare time yestarday and decided to play for a while. It was mid sunday and there were 54 characters in imperial fleet, on Lord Calypho server. I logged out and bought Tera, despite the fact that i really hate its eastern art style. I refuse to pay for single player, bugged game with crappy engine and no *********** chat bubbles. Another SW game is going to waste becouse of inept developer :-/

[Goretzu]

I had some spare time yestarday and decided to play for a while. It was mid sunday and there were 54 characters in imperial fleet, on Lord Calypho server. I logged out and bought Tera, despite the fact that i really hate its eastern art style. I refuse to pay for single player, bugged game with crappy engine and no *********** chat bubbles. Another SW game is going to waste becouse of inept developer :-/

 

Depressingly that's a server that still has (or had up until recently) a reasonable population.

[JeramieCrowe]

If no one was able to play those class efficiently, i would agree but that is wrong. I see in my guild, healers have had a small adaptation period to get use to the managing ressource, but eventually, there were able to regain a great efficiency with their class. If anything, they say now the class is more interesting to play and they learn more about their class in a week than in 4 month playing it.

 

therefore, i disagree, class balance was globally positive in 1.2. but class balance is never done

 

PS: wow changes class al the time: paladin, warlock, druid, they play nothing like they use to at release.

 

Another thing that shows the success of 1.2 is the fact that there is normally about 70 on Coruscant, 60 onTaris on Republic side, more on the starting planets Imp side. These are all mostly level 50s that have rolled alts just as 1.2 encouraged.

[Mashy]

hahah same. I'm rerolling Witchdoctor tomorrow.

 

I'll keep checking back here for news though.

 

I'm hearing that dude! Witchdoctor all that way baby!

[Crimescene]

Like rats off a sinking ship.

 

1.2 has ruined pvp balance.

 

Free to play by years end.

I'm not wasting another cent on the shallow pvp this game has.

[Wolfeisberg]

Another thing that shows the success of 1.2 is the fact that there is normally about 70 on Coruscant, 60 onTaris on Republic side, more on the starting planets Imp side. These are all mostly level 50s that have rolled alts just as 1.2 encouraged.

How do you know they are mostly 50s? Perhaps they came from other servers looking for a better populated server. Also, there is hardly anything fun to do at 50, especially if you are not a raider (which most people are not), so it isn't so much that 1.2 is encouraging making alts, it's more to do with there is hardly anything to do at 50 that isn't some boring grind.

[ross_deutsch]

Monk!!!

[Stalkobot]

Like rats off a sinking ship.

 

1.2 has ruined pvp balance.

 

Free to play by years end.

I'm not wasting another cent on the shallow pvp this game has.

 

Unlikely got free to play, Warhammer has been losing money hand of fist for years and is still subscription based.

[murgatroid]

there is a thread like this every week in every MMO. Every MMO I have ever played has had this thread, and everyone I have ever played is still active years later.

[Frostvein]

there is a thread like this every week in every MMO. Every MMO I have ever played has had this thread, and everyone I have ever played is still active years later.

 

I don't think anyone can or will try to make an intelligent argument that this game won't exist in some form for quite some time.

 

However, losing just shy of 50% of your playerbase just 4-5 months in doesn't bode well.

 

(And before I get the semantics police on me, 2.4 million initial sales down to 1.3 million subs is just shy of 50%)

Edited May 14, 2012 by Frostvein

[SirMannii]

OP: Do you miss those guys who left?

[RedWolfs]

OP: Do you miss those guys who left?

 

I do while I hear crickets chirp on the fleet, and my empty guild on Ieldis. There were 7 on the republic fleet yesterday morning including myself. That's right SEVEN, there were not enough 50's logged in for a pvp match or op or much of anything. That is how you spell trouble.

 

So rather than wait for a PVP match that would not happen, got the boat out and enjoyed some great weather, then came home and watched TV. That is the first step for me to unsub from a MMORPG, when I no longer want to be on because it depresses me.

[Sithmud]

I just re subscribed ...

I unsubbed back in Jan because it did not feel like a MMO only kotor2 with a multiplayer splash, bought a new computer and though I will see how it runs this game log in ..... hoth 4 peeps .

Just is not worth 15/month for a great single player game .

 

Now I wish I had not re subbed..

[Sanxxx]

Another thing that shows the success of 1.2 is the fact that there is normally about 70 on Coruscant, 60 onTaris on Republic side, more on the starting planets Imp side. These are all mostly level 50s that have rolled alts just as 1.2 encouraged.

 

The 'success' of 1.2 lasted apprx 10 days, then pops reverted to pre 1.2 levels.

[asbalana]

OP: Do you miss those guys who left?

 

Not OP, but yes.

 

A month ago 100+ on fleet at most times. Two weeks ago dropped like a rock to 60 and I wss told not to be too concerned because it was probably a blip. Yesterday baredly holding 50 and yoyoing up and down with 25 as the bottom during prime time. I am seeing a steady sustained drop in fleet and all worlds.

 

I am manily a soloist, but strangely enough I do miss each and ever player who has left. I logged on to Harbinger where I have two lower level alts and even though at prime time yesterday it was shown as Standard, it felt good to see 106 people on Empire fleet.

Edited May 14, 2012 by asbalana

[Grymtusk]

It's Jeramie, first of all...

 

Secondly, let me reiterate what I've already posted several times ad nauseum. TOR's current numbers are well above the typical MMO curve. Just last year, Rift's 6-month decline was 58%, a far cry from 24% that we see now.

 

This is all typical, and even EA stated that it's "on target".

 

What is atypical, however, is an increase from this point on. I'm not optimistic that BioWare can achieve this atypical trend of increasing subs. It'd be nice, but it would depend on several things:

 

1) A server transfer/shut-down culling of servers THIS MONTH

2) Implementation of Ranked Warzones THIS MONTH

3) Endgame solo content added soon

4) At least let us know what's being currently revamped for open-world PvP.

 

This would go a long way to not only keep subs from declining, but maybe even help them to increase.

 

The FIRST sensible thing I've ever seen you post. Until they address the queue times for PvP and server population the current trend of subscription number will increase. I see this game, in its current direction stabalizing around 500k subs. Not bad really but certainly not enough income to support that bill they will be getting for the electricity and bandwidth the number of server they now have.

[ZudetGambeous]

Subs are down 25%, that has nothing to do with the player retention rate that people seem to love to quote.

 

Player retention rate for the first YEAR of an MMO is the amount of players who have bought the game in that year compared to the amount of people still subscribing at the end of the year. So far SWTOR has sold 2.4 million copies and the current subscribers are 1.3 million. This means that TOR has a retention rate of 56%, slightly above the standard 50% of the "typical" MMO. However TOR has only been out 5 months, not a full year. You can't really compare until we see what sub numbers are like in another 6 months.

 

Based on the current trend, TOR will have sold ~3million copies and have about 800k subscribers in 6 months, which gives a retention rate of 27%, which is much much worse then the 50% standard. Of course the devs could completely turn the game around in that time and we could see a positive trend start in subscriptions.

 

However with the release of several new MMO's in the coming months, I don't see the trend reversing.

[DarthVindictus]

there is a thread like this every week in every MMO. Every MMO I have ever played has had this thread, and everyone I have ever played is still active years later.

 

There's 2 levels of dead in an MMO.

 

There's what normal people consider a "dead" MMO, and what rabid fanboys consider a "dead" MMO.

 

Normal people consider an MMO to be dead when it's bleeding subs, it's hard to find people for PUGs for group content, PVP queues are long, and most the areas are ghost towns for both PVE content and open world PVP.

 

Rabid fanboys won't call dead until the servers are shut down.

 

Now you might argue it's not dead till there's no pulse, no respiration, but even in the medical field we'll call something dead while it's still walking and talking (though more likely screaming or moaning). We just have a nicer term for it in triage, called "expectant". Expectant means "they're already dead, they just don't know it yet". IE 3rd degree burns over 50% of the body or more, or exposed dura matter (you can see their brain). Or brain dead in a coma. I guess that's more truly analogous to an MMO that's unofficially "dead" like Age of Conan, Rift, or Warhammer. It's in a coma and it will never wake up. The servers are still up, but there's few people that play it, and actually having enough on to do things is a struggle. Last night was messing around in AoC (since it's F2P and I was bored) and there were people using the "New Player Help" channel to BEG people to queue up for PVP. over 2 hours and he couldn't get enough people to have a match.

 

If that's not comatose and never expected to wake up... I don't know what is.

[Anelitt]

D3 Intstaller is unlocked since 1H 43 min in europe.

Watching the Cinematic before the loginscreen made me remember why i love gaming:D

 

Thank you swtor for some light entertainemt through some weeks, its time to vanquish the burning forces of hell now.

 

 

No seriously i wish swtor all the luck to improve in the future, seeing the current state of the game though that does not even seem possible to me.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Anelitt

[Nicain]

How are all those changes that were made to suit the 'casual' players and make the game less 'hardcore' friendly working out for the game?

 

Oh, subs down 25%? Nice. Wonder if all those players will be picking up D3 with me tonight. Just wanted to swing by and see what's become of a game that drove itself into a wall to suit the vocial minority.

 

Live and learn, eh EA?

[AeSaar]

I have been directed to this post for discussion. This post is about brand identity but a moderator insists that I place it here so here it is...

 

-----

 

11 Days Left On My Free Month

or

Why I Haven't Logged In Since A Long Time Ago

 

It isn't that the game is bad. The leveling experience is fun, despite the repetitive world designs. It is not for a lack of content. Though my preference for world PvP keeps me out of the warzones, I still have yet to clear any of the new content nor have I finished any nightmare modes. This is not because I find most of the boss fights dull and boring, tho I certainly do besides like the occasional gem like Mentor or Soa. It is not because I lack access to these for I found my way into a guild that runs everything. It is because the server is dead, and I expect a massive multiplayer experience.

 

I know some do not believe these dead servers exist. This belief is factually incorrect. These are the most recent headlines;

 

EA's The Old Republic Sees Sharp Drop In Subscribers -Forbes

EA loses Star Wars users, shares tumble – Chicago Tribune

Star Wars: The Old Republic's subscriber numbers fall -BBC

Last Call: Electronic Arts, Star Wars and a disturbance in the Force -CNBC

Electronic Arts's cuts to cost 40 million -San Francisco Chronicle

Electronic Arts Drops as Forecast Misses Analyst’s Views -Bloomberg

 

 

 

There is a factual observable drop in subscription numbers.

 

The single most important issue is the loss of players, and we know this is due too few people spread across too many servers. This is worsened by the verbal attacks of those playing on full servers who are not suffering from any debilitating issues and the lack of any true forum moderation. Compounded by a lack of concrete information on the when-and-where of server mergers and/or transfers, it has lead to a gut wound of a 400k loss in subscriptions. (see references)

 

There are two relevant guilds on my server, and there is only one for the republic. This is unacceptable for a game sold as a Massively Multi-player Online Game. This is false advertizement. Nowhere did Bioware or EA preface that the MMO experience would be limited to a few unmarked servers. This is the single issue plaguing the game, and without an immediate response I fear it will do irreparable damage.

 

As a long-time Bioware customer, this is how I feel....

 

I have purchased every game since Baldur's Gate 1 with the exception of Mass Effect 3 and Dragon Age 2. The lack of deep character creation turned me off to DA2, and my experience with SWTOR has barred me from purchasing ME3 or any future Bioware product. This brand use to mean something. It use to mean quality, but the only thing left that seems to be of any quality is the writing. I don't mind the cloned WoW game mechanics for it is fun, but it is not innovative and not exactly indicative of the quality I once expected from the brand.

 

However, where I am most disappointed is the lack of customer service. Bioware should remind people that the forums are for everyone, not just those who entirely love the game as it is, since their own server is full and their personal experience is good. When others report the factually accurate presence of dead servers, the moderators ignore the verbal abuse levied at the critic and lock the thread. This behavior severely disappoints me. The lack of information on a definitive date for the transfer and/or mergers disturbs me. The lack of any details as to how or where these population shifts will be directed unsettles me even further. When I combined this with the previous over-all customer disservice in the form of excessive DLC content, I find myself less enamored with the brand I had grown to trust.

 

Is Bioware dead?

 

A great single-player experience, due to the hard work of a good group of writers, is not enough to save a game billed as an MMO. They get you through the single-player RPGs, but the expectations are different now.

 

200$ x 2 people for two collectors edition boxes

15$ per a month x 2 people x 4months

 

 

That is 520$ dollars for a game. I expect more than a single player RPG. I am a paying customer and I have been since this company first started making RPGs. All of your customers, people just like me, deserve more information than you have currently given. We deserve more than to be left in the dark for who knows how long. If I and the person I bought this game to play with do not get an MMO experience at the end of these 11 days or at least some definitive information when that said experience can be expected, I doubt in my ability to remain loyal to this brand and resubscribe. You are asking for too much on faith. I'm sorry.

 

This brand has 11 days to give me more than Early Summer, for once I am gone I doubt my return, and If this game fails, I will never view the brand Bioware the same way again.