TzachNahRood Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 While we are at it please remove range from warzones. This is unfair to melee. Also please remove healing powers as this is unfair to dps. In fact i recommend we move to a simple single pvp power. Who ever hits five times first wins. That way i would never need teammates in an mmo pvp match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rizBRAH Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 mind=blown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MMOgamer Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Almost as stupid as baddies whining about marauders. Yes, getting opened by a stealther sucks but it is a part of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Is...is the op for real? Please tell me he's just trolling...He can't be serious lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNotorius Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 (edited) The downside of having stealth, is that, outside it, stealthers (probably not Assassins) are really weak. Edited April 28, 2012 by TheNotorius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zunayson Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 The OP's team isn't bright to let only one person guard. You 8 second mezz and cap. Then they're forced to blow their CC breaker (If it's not up, then the cap is done). then we 8 second flashbang them, and THEN the cap is done. 15 seconds for help to arrive. It did and they got me right after I got done. Then the whole team procedes to nuke me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smuglebunny Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 The op is rediculous and if not trolling I suggest a better education. Get laughed off the forum lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surbatu Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Ah yes, I figured out what should be done about your problem: 1. Delete stealth, it's silly and takes away the element of surprise. We don't want surprises in an MMO do we? 2. When that is done, we can move on anf make a rule that an opponent (or more then 1) let's you know 30 seconds prior of moving towards the point you are defending, they are coming. This will give you plenty of time to rally your teammates and defend a node. 3. Or BW can make an ops frame next to your teammates with a full list of opponents AND how far away they are from your position, standard. But I can imagine that would be a little too difficult, since we don't want any fuss in wz's, yak! 4. Increase the range for players to see opponents health bar (even through walls etc please), and make the healthbar 3 times the size it has now and clickable. 5. Can we also cut the abilities we have in atleast half? I mean, it's hard enough as it is! Any other suggestions that will make this game more predictable then hello kitty adventure island are more then welcome. Nice one! But I like surprises. Everyone have CC breaker, so everyone should have a stealth breaker too! What a surprise for an operative in the middle of the fight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zunayson Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Nice one! But I like surprises. Everyone have CC breaker, so everyone should have a stealth breaker too! What a surprise for an operative in the middle of the fight! It's called an AoE. In fact, every AC BUT the operative has a ground placed instant AoE/Knockback that does damage and will unstealth. The irony, I know right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surbatu Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 It's called an AoE. In fact, every AC BUT the operative has a ground placed instant AoE/Knockback that does damage and will unstealth. The irony, I know right? No way! Radius is too small - it needs to be at lest 100 meters and deal damage to all stealthers by half of their health - we are all for a fair play here, don't we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zunayson Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 No way! Radius is too small - it needs to be at lest 100 meters and deal damage to all stealthers by half of their health - we are all for a fair play here, don't we? You're right. And it has to kill all non stealthers in the radius too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shlamorel Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Your goal isn't necessarily to kill the stealther, it's to live long enough for help to come. ) Can we get this in a sticky, please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShannaRZ Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Amazing. This game has the weakest, most easily detected (and therefore broken) stealth in any MMO I've ever played. In EQ1 (on Rallos Zek, the open pvp kill-anyone-anytime server) I fell asleep once on my rogue in the middle of a heavily used dungeon on the main pathway. Players, mobs, and numerous high level trains ran right over-top of me for hours. I woke up and was amazed I was still alive. It used to be stealth was undetectable until the stealther made his opening move, hopefully catching you completely off guard. SWTOR made it so you can see them, can target them, and/or can AOE them out of stealth and therefore out of their advantage. If you can't make that work for you, don't blame the stealther. L2P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aebrynis Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Amazing. This game has the weakest, most easily detected (and therefore broken) stealth in any MMO I've ever played. In EQ1 (on Rallos Zek, the open pvp kill-anyone-anytime server) I fell asleep once on my rogue in the middle of a heavily used dungeon on the main pathway. Players, mobs, and numerous high level trains ran right over-top of me for hours. I woke up and was amazed I was still alive. It used to be stealth was undetectable until the stealther made his opening move, hopefully catching you completely off guard. SWTOR made it so you can see them, can target them, and/or can AOE them out of stealth and therefore out of their advantage. If you can't make that work for you, don't blame the stealther. L2P Normally, I consider 'L2P' to be one of the most offensive things people can say to another player (TOS-banned things notwithstanding). And while I wouldn't use it myself, in this instance, I do support the sentiment behind it. There are a lot of things I can't do in this game. I've accepted the fact, and moved on. This issue should be no different. They aren't going to make any fundamental changes to Stealth abilities simply because a few people are getting roflstomped by stealthers in a warzone (or on a PvP server, perhaps - I loathe open-world PvP, so I do not play on those server types). Should I one day make a Scoundrel or an Operative, I want the ability to work 'as intended'...and I can't do that if it's been nerfed in the name of 'fairness', can I? 'Fairness' has screwed up more than one MMO, and this one doesn't need the same thing happening here...BioWare already has enough garbage to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naizgrel Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Oh those little dirty smugglers burn down pretty quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerangedOne Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 This cant be for real, if you are a trooper guarding s node why arent you useing your stealth Scan probe thing ? Allso if i get popped you alot Of ways to get out alive bounce them back pr shock strike them back, you could cryo grande or use the one where they are mezzed for 10sec you have heals even in dps spec and a damage reduction shield its not like you cant do anything, when my commando gets jumped i break bounce em back drop stealth probe use a medpack if needed and from there on its not normaly an impossible fight. I hope you are trolling though, there is NO way stealth should be removed from anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShannaRZ Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Normally, I consider 'L2P' to be one of the most offensive things people can say to another player (TOS-banned things notwithstanding). And while I wouldn't use it myself, in this instance, I do support the sentiment behind it. I apologize if it came across incorrectly, however, I do think it is an education issue more than any kind of an imbalance, and its certainly not a "bug" or something to be "fixed". There are a lot of things I can't do in this game. I've accepted the fact, and moved on. This issue should be no different. They aren't going to make any fundamental changes to Stealth abilities simply because a few people are getting roflstomped by stealthers in a warzone (or on a PvP server, perhaps - I loathe open-world PvP, so I do not play on those server types). Open world PVP doesn't happen on PVP servers either, so you're not missing anything. But as for things we can't do in the game... stealth is considered a gap-closer, and while that DOES work in PVP, it falls flat on its face in HM Flashpoints or Operations, where stealth is a "beacon" to the enemy mobs -- they literally see you 150% farther than players who are not stealthed. Should I one day make a Scoundrel or an Operative, I want the ability to work 'as intended'...and I can't do that if it's been nerfed in the name of 'fairness', can I? 'Fairness' has screwed up more than one MMO, and this one doesn't need the same thing happening here...BioWare already has enough garbage to deal with. Indeed. I am never quick to pick up the "Nerf Bat" and cry for changes, as undoubtedly those nerfs will come around and bite me later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belgiangrump Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Not gonna bother reading the whole topic, but why complain about stealth is beyond me. Why? Unless they use a minute CD you'll see them quite far away (i've played both stealth class -op- as a non stealther -sorc- at lv50). My sorc can easily notice stealthers before they strike me. What can possibly happen? 1) the stealther does use his cooldown and opens up on you. So you'll have a close fight coming, unless you don't know how to fight them. Cause concealment's dps is pretty bismal if you're equally geared. but yes he gets a health advantage cause he opened on you, but for that he had to pop a cooldown that's not always up. 2) the stealther doesn't use his cooldown but uses the stealth incapacitate. The stealther just gave you 800 free resolve. When he opens on you, you'll either be white or close to. In that case you're still in advantage cause after the opener you can easily "trinket" the next cc he'll toss up on you. 3) the stealther tries to open up on you and must approach, due to the fact you're not cc'd you now have to avoid turning your back to him (unless you're not a clicker) you can quickly turn your char and throw an aoe or be swift on reaction to use nearest enemy/next enemy and a targetted attack, and the stealther loses his opener and the fight will be a lot harder for the stealther cause he lost his momentum. In short, TOR's stealth is one of the WORST stealths i've ever experienced in an MMO (coming from a nightshade in DAoC and a rogue in WoW). Also the damage a scrapper has from his momento attack is lousy and the damage from open combat attacks is mediocre at best, if you handle cooldowns well. Can't just judge for an assassin or shadow just yet, my shadow is too low level to get the momento attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Migrayn Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Stealth is an unfair advantage, everyone knows it and still people ask for additional gap closers to their classes and always underestimate both its tactical and game-mechanics oriented strenght, however you just made a not-so-well constructed post and stated the obvious truth, you didnt suggest anything or asked for any help towards anything. Considering this is a team vs team game and both sides have access to the same number of stealth classes it is balanced. Now if only one side hax a stealth class i could see your point. Stealth does not help win a fight or help in the fiht at all. Itz only good to position yourself for the fight. Once the fight starts should you can use your bubble or your high damage missle spam or your knockback stun lightning death. Stealth in this game is very easy to see through. It is very easy to aoe people out of stealth. Welcome to MMO's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMESUN Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 yeah my stealth is so grand it breaks on everything, almost any class can easily see you.. hmmm but on a side note, my healing sucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adzzy Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 (edited) Considering this is a team vs team game and both sides have access to the same number of stealth classes it is balanced. Now if only one side hax a stealth class i could see your point. Stealth does not help win a fight or help in the fiht at all. Itz only good to position yourself for the fight. Once the fight starts should you can use your bubble or your high damage missle spam or your knockback stun lightning death. Stealth in this game is very easy to see through. It is very easy to aoe people out of stealth. Welcome to MMO's *shakes head* nothing quite like butchering logic, let's create an extreme example to demonstrate the point Considering this is a team vs team game and both sides have access to the same number of insta-kill classes it is balanced. Now if only one side hax an insta-kill class i could see your point. The issue with stealth isn't stealth per se though, it's the impact it has when 2 of the 4 wzs are 8 second uninterrupted channel cap, Edited April 28, 2012 by Adzzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gjorind Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 This game has the least "scary" stealthers compared to other MMO's that I''ve seen. They're easier to find, their alpha burst is less, and their escape/survival mechanisms are more limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vimm Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I give up. Nuh uh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eszi Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Let's remove all abilities from all the classes, since they give unfair advantage! Let's remove all the weapons, since having a better one gives unfair advantage! Let's remove all equipment, since having better items gives unfair advantage! Otherwise, /unsub Also, OMGOMGOMG WOW IS SO MUCH BETTAHR AND GW2 WILL KILL DIS GAME, F2P IN A WEEK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xinika Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 The stealth ability used in PVP Warzones or PVP in general is an unfair advantage to a non-sleathing class. Yes I do have an ability to break that sleath if I can see him in time, but its so fast my human reactions can't act as fast to unsleath him. Even if I do cast my unsleath AOE ability, the sleather just waits till its gone. Example, Im a trooper Gunnery guarding a node in Civil War WZ, alone no one around for miles. We got two caps, im chilling alone, then a sleather comes up out of no where. Then proceeds to CC and unload on me, then I have to play catch up to DPS him down before he gets me down. Well 90% I end up dying and face on the floor and lossing the node. So the point for calling for help is out of the question, because the node is gone by then. It is also unfair ability that not both parties have sleathers so with the group having sleath has advantage on taking nodes compared to non-sleathers. So Bioware please hinder the use of sleath in PVP, because with the human reaction and button smashing reaction time is not fast enough to do anything about getting CC then being burned down to the ground. Correct me of Im wrong, but when you sleath is your walking reduce by half, if so ok, Also being in sleath you shouldn't be able to recover ammo because you already having the advantage for sneak attacking your target. This is not QQing, I just want some balance in the "FARCE". Hahahahahahahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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