Kalfear Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 When specific dates are announced or stated, and things dont go according to plan people get pissy. Thats why we never see anyone more then "soon" yup specific dates a no no but gotta agree with others, dont see why they cant tell us whats coming out in order of importance For example, If I know Paazaak upcoming next in list when my time runs out id probably reup because thats what im waiting for but as they will not tell us, if its not out by time paid time done. Ill just let account lapse and move on to something else A (not time line but) list in order of priority for additions would probably save them allot of headaches down the road. just how I see it. As it stands, when my time up and Paazaak/Swoop racing/pit fighting (ala KotOR1) not in game, im done. Not a ultimatum, just the truth. Should have been in game from launch (and I know you remember discussing it day one of the forums back in 08 Darka, heh). Hiding whats upcoming never works out well for companies. Again, no hard date promises, just a list of things upcoming before the first paid expansion (wide time window) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieAlteHexe Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 Blame yourselves dear community. The outcry about ranked battlefields not making it into 1.2 should be reason enough why developers don't give timelines. If you - the community - acted with a little maturity you might find the developers were willing to hold a better discourse with you because they would know you understood that sometimes deadlines slip. Unfortunately as you - the community - can't act like adults but instead /ragequit like little children throwing a tantrum in the candy aisle when something isn't given to you on time, it's safer to be vague. Yup. Folks just don't understand that at the level of complexity this code is...well, it ain't just plug 'n' play. Things happen, deadlines slip and anyone who wants to indulge in an MMO should get used to this or end up bald from tearing their hair out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth-Malice Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) Soon ™ Bioware has patented this Edited April 21, 2012 by Darth-Malice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princey Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) Soon ™ Bioware has patented this No, they're just licensing it from Blizzard. Why do you think the game was so expensive to produce? Edit to edit below: Ha! Edited April 21, 2012 by princey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhaers Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) Soon ™ Bioware has patented this They can't. Blizzard holds the patents on Soon™. I would say instead that Bioware pay a licensing fee on Soon™ to Blizz in order to share the technology. Not that there is anything wrong with that. Edit: Beaten by "that" much! Edited April 21, 2012 by Bhaers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llesna Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) I feel that a lot of the discontent by players, which adds to the irritation by ambigious commitments, is that SWTOR -- for all its splendour -- launched without a lot of the features that MMORPG gamers take for granted in the current gaming climate and is currently playing catch-up. For more casual gamers, this is less of an issue as such gamers have less time to play and aren't bothered about such issues or may even be aware that an issue is there. For the self-titled "pros", they want to be able to do in a guild in SWTOR what they were doing elsewhere and not being able to do that has pushed them often into leaving the game or crying out bitterly against it. Personally I'm enjoying the game overall, but then again I'm not a massive fan of PvP. That said, it does irk me the sheer number of bugs introduced by 1.2 and I really hope that a super patch is on the cards for Tuesday's maintenance to fix all the new ones they introduced or at least a sizeable proportion of them. Obviously big patches like 1.2 are going to contain a lot of bugs and need a lot of testing, but the number of little, irritating bugs that got through is quite unsettling. Outside of bug fixes, the game engine itself is in need a massive overhaul. In addition to the poor way that the game stops rendering whilst it's waiting to load data from your drive (be it HDD or SSD), causing mini-freezes and jerky rendering, the engine is highly inefficient in places, such as Balmorra. To further this problem, there are situations in the game where the game will actively stop using all your GPU and frames will drop massively. (Please note that this GPU issue might happen for some people due to overheating, but it will actually STILL happen for people whose graphics card is NEITHER overheating NOR experiencing a power issue.) Some players say to be patient, but I think it's quite right to ask where and when the game is going to get features that should be in a triple-A MMORPG in 2012. As paying customers, not just players, it's right of us to ask the devs such questions and to wish for a rough estimate at least. Heck, even a simple, "We're aiming for..." would often be better than nothing. I'm not after solid promises, just an approximation. The little things can add up too for many people, such as the lack of information on: • Server merges and character transfers. • More character slots. • SGRA (same gender romance arcs) with same-gender flirt options. Many wish for this to be opened up for existing companions, not just new ones that will be introduced months down the line. • More legacy connections (as the current limited relationships don't allow for much creativity). • Lack of some basic functions for RPing (such as sitting in a chair/seat). • Fixing crafting bugs (especially the ones causing crashes). • LFG tool. • Global chat (cross worlds). • Hood toggle. • Hide companion head slot. • Unify colours for companions. ... and so on. I can't comment on the PvP issues, so I won't. I can only say that I do very much enjoy this game, but that the devs need to understand how important all of the issues are to many paying customers and empathise with them that the current slippery language comes across as an insult to their intelligence. Kind regards llesna Edited May 3, 2012 by llesna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Ravenhurst Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 I want a more complete entertainment experience, therefore I promised to myself not to come back to the game before version 2.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieAlteHexe Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) Soon ™ Bioware has patented this Heh, no way. Blizzard had this one patented LONG before BW even started developing this game. Hell, long before WoW even. ETA: Aced. Twice. Heh. Edited April 21, 2012 by DieAlteHexe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasgallant Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 Every Q&A we are getting more of this - "At some point, this will be possible. No ETA yet, but we have a design fleshed out." "This is totally in the plan, but we are unsure at this time when it will get to you." "We have a plan for this. However," "in a future game update." It seems like we a suggestion is made or a question asked thgey are not supposed to say no... they really arent stringing anyone along with wording like that..its marketing and planning.. they havent made 100% clear decisions on some things yet, and as we have seen these forums are pretty unforgiving. I think if they said we havent decided yet. people would freak out.. much like people freak out about words like in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricktur Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 I feel that a lot of the discontent by players, which adds to the irritation by ambigious commitments, is that SWTOR -- for all its splendour -- launched without a lot of the features that MMORPG gamers take for granted in the current gaming climate and is currently playing catch-up. For more casual gamers, this is less of an issue as such gamers have less time to play and aren't bothered about such issues or may even be aware that an issue is there. For the self-titled "pros", they want to be able to do in a guild in SWTOR what they were doing elsewhere and not being able to do that has pushed them often into leaving the game or crying out bitterly against it. Personally I'm enjoying the game overall, but then again I'm not a massive fan of PvP. That said, it does irk me the sheer number of bugs introduced by 1.2 and I really hope that a super patch is on the cards for Tuesday's maintenance to fix all the new ones they introduced or at least a sizeable proportion of them. Obviously big patches like 1.2 are going to contain a lot of bugs and need a lot of testing, but the number of little, irritating bugs that got through is quite unsettling. Outside of bug fixes, the game engine itself is in need a massive overhaul. In addition to the poor way that the game stops rendering whilst it's waiting to load data from your drive (be it HDD or SSD), causing mini-freezes and jerky rendering, the engine is highly inefficient in places, such as Balmorra. To further this problem, there are situations in the game where the game will actively stop using all your GPU and frames will drop massively. (Please note that this GPU issue might happen for some people due to overheating, but it will actually STILL happen for people whose graphics card is NEITHER overheating NOR experiencing a power issue.) Some players say to be patient, but I think it's quite right to ask where and when the game is going to get features that should be in a triple-A MMORPG in 2012. As paying customers, not just players, it's right of us to ask the devs such questions and to wish for a rough estimate at least. Heck, even a simple, "We're aiming for..." would often be better than nothing. I'm not after solid promises, just an approximation. The little things can add up too for many people, such as the lack of information on: • Server merges and character transfers. • More character slots. • SGRA (same gender romance arcs) with same-gender flirt options. Many wish for this to be opened up for existing companions, not just new ones that will be introduced months down the line. • More legacy connections (as the current limited relationships don't allow for much creativity). • Lack of some basic functions for RPing (such as sitting in a chair/seat). • Fixing crafting bugs (especially the ones causing crashes). • LFG tool. • Global chat (cross worlds). • Hood toggle. • Hide companion head slot. • Unify colours for companions. ... and so on. I can't comment on the PvP issues, so I won't. I can only say that I do very much enjoy this game, but that the devs need to understand how important all of the issues are to many paying customers and empathise with them that the current slippery language comes across as an insult to their intelligence. Kind regards llesna there is so much truth in this post i almost cried. i agree 100% with everything in this and i hope a developer sees this or it is forwarded to one with influence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickRedOne Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 Wasn't the same answer given with regard to mods as well? I haven't paid attention but thought I saw that they said: Nunh unh to add-ons? What they said was, "not for quite some time". And we don't have addon's yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shepardcomander Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 If they do actually have stuff in the works they can't stop talking about it. I.e. all the legacy system hype we saw. If they aren't "willing" to talk about future content, it means said content is still just a a few dry erase marker scribblings on the wall of crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCBull Posted April 21, 2012 Author Share Posted April 21, 2012 Yup. Folks just don't understand that at the level of complexity this code is...well, it ain't just plug 'n' play. Things happen, deadlines slip and anyone who wants to indulge in an MMO should get used to this or end up bald from tearing their hair out. I've played mmos for 7 years.. 5 in WoW, 1 in Rift now swtor. In niether rift or wow do I recall such a major feature being announced cut the night before it was to go live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCBull Posted April 21, 2012 Author Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) If they aren't "willing" to talk about future content, it means said content is still just a a few dry erase marker scribblings on the wall of crazy. This is the feeling I get from their responses. Don't pee on my and tell me it's rain ie we cut rwzs to protect you from there bad design... That's pee, not rain. Then on one hand tell me everything will be gtg soon, then tell me "we don't have the tech." in the other. Edited April 21, 2012 by BCBull Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kubernetic Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 Um.. why can't they say we are going to do this then do it like most companies I pay money to? OT - Why not just say "Neat idea, but we have no plans at this time." instead of trying to string people along. They are not going to announce a specific date to release something because that is a disaster for people trying to program something. Things happen in the design cycle that push dates back, because the option to just "go ahead and release it anyway" is a horrific one. So if they announce a day, then miss it, every gamer on this forum who has zero comprehension as to how development can take a turn for the worse sometimes will be flaming and QQing like no tomorrow. So they say, "We're thinking about something like that" or "This is coming" and then add "but there is no current ETA on its arrival." I have, in fact, seen them say a few times that "There are no plans currently to add this to the game." They do exactly what you're asking for when the suggestions are outlandish or outside their scope of intended building. Perhaps you're complaining because they really do see such potential in a lot of the ideas given? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerion Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 (edited) They can't. Blizzard holds the patents on Soon™. I would say instead that Bioware pay a licensing fee on Soon™ to Blizz in order to share the technology. Not that there is anything wrong with that. Edit: Beaten by "that" much! As with everything Blizzard has done, they didn't invent this little industry joke either. It predates WoW by a number of years. I first began seeing it in the forums of World War II Online. Not saying this MMO invented it either, but it certainly wasn't Blizzard. Anyway, back on topic...well, everyone else has covered the reasons why Devs must be vague. The cries of 'you promised!!' and incessant foot stompings by the community have made it so. Edited April 21, 2012 by Cerion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerion Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 I feel that a lot of the discontent by players, which adds to the irritation by ambigious commitments, is that SWTOR -- for all its splendour -- launched without a lot of the features that MMORPG gamers take for granted in the current gaming climate and is currently playing catch-up. For more casual gamers, this is less of an issue as such gamers have less time to play and aren't bothered about such issues or may even be aware that an issue is there. For the self-titled "pros", they want to be able to do in a guild in SWTOR what they were doing elsewhere and not being able to do that has pushed them often into leaving the game or crying out bitterly against it. Personally I'm enjoying the game overall, but then again I'm not a massive fan of PvP. That said, it does irk me the sheer number of bugs introduced by 1.2 and I really hope that a super patch is on the cards for Tuesday's maintenance to fix all the new ones they introduced or at least a sizeable proportion of them. Obviously big patches like 1.2 are going to contain a lot of bugs and need a lot of testing, but the number of little, irritating bugs that got through is quite unsettling. Outside of bug fixes, the game engine itself is in need a massive overhaul. In addition to the poor way that the game stops rendering whilst it's waiting to load data from your drive (be it HDD or SSD), causing mini-freezes and jerky rendering, the engine is highly inefficient in places, such as Balmorra. To further this problem, there are situations in the game where the game will actively stop using all your GPU and frames will drop massively. (Please note that this GPU issue might happen for some people due to overheating, but it will actually STILL happen for people whose graphics card is NEITHER overheating NOR experiencing a power issue.) Some players say to be patient, but I think it's quite right to ask where and when the game is going to get features that should be in a triple-A MMORPG in 2012. As paying customers, not just players, it's right of us to ask the devs such questions and to wish for a rough estimate at least. Heck, even a simple, "We're aiming for..." would often be better than nothing. I'm not after solid promises, just an approximation. The little things can add up too for many people, such as the lack of information on: • Server merges and character transfers. • More character slots. • SGRA (same gender romance arcs) with same-gender flirt options. Many wish for this to be opened up for existing companions, not just new ones that will be introduced months down the line. • More legacy connections (as the current limited relationships don't allow for much creativity). • Lack of some basic functions for RPing (such as sitting in a chair/seat). • Fixing crafting bugs (especially the ones causing crashes). • LFG tool. • Global chat (cross worlds). • Hood toggle. • Hide companion head slot. • Unify colours for companions. ... and so on. I can't comment on the PvP issues, so I won't. I can only say that I do very much enjoy this game, but that the devs need to understand how important all of the issues are to many paying customers and empathise with them that the current slippery language comes across as an insult to their intelligence. Kind regards llesna Except the Devs HAVE addressed a number of the issues you've mentioned. How much more open can the devs be if they've already addressed, for example, the issue of Character Transfers but players refuse to read the information that's being released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickRedOne Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 I've played mmos for 7 years.. 5 in WoW, 1 in Rift now swtor. In niether rift or wow do I recall such a major feature being announced cut the night before it was to go live. That's right you haven't seen that. They would just let it go live, broken, and maybe fix it 3 to 4 months later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaManoNera Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 Hey let's make a drinking game! Whenever CS or the Dev team says one of those, we take a drink! Wait... I think we will drink ourselves blind or get alcohol poisoning... maybe this is a bad idea... I played that game before the game was released, back when it was "we can't talk about that yet". Still can't remember my own name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llesna Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 (edited) Except the Devs HAVE addressed a number of the issues you've mentioned. How much more open can the devs be if they've already addressed, for example, the issue of Character Transfers but players refuse to read the information that's being released. Okay, please quote me where and when they've outlined PRECISELY or even ROUGHLY when these are going to be implemented. If you can show that you've actually understood the crux of this thread (i.e., that we're annoyed by the lack of even rough time estimates on these) and can show me where they've outlined a time (read: not a vague time like "this year" either), then I'll retract my comments. Otherwise please understand WHY we're so irritated with Bioware devs right now. It's an insult to paying customers when devs constantly avoid the questions being asked of them or give answers in vague terms, like "we're looking into it" or "sometime in a future patch". We pay to play the game and have a right to be kept informed rather than kept in the dark. Edited May 3, 2012 by llesna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TZHX Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Well, they're not picking the questions for the Q&A at random. If the answer would simply be "we have no current plans on that", then they're not going to pick that question... I don't see why people would assume it's a conspiracy on Bioware's part... they're just being selective with the questions. And they've learnt, I think, not to give rough timescales anymore. After everyone crying that they "lied" about the Australian transfers being in late April in early April. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickRedOne Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Okay, please quote me where and when they've outlined PRECISELY or even ROUGHLY when these are going to be implemented. If you can show that you've actually understood the crux of this thread (i.e., that we're annoyed by the lack of even rough time estimates on these) and can show me where they've outlined a time (read: not a vague time like "this year" either), then I'll retract my comments. Otherwise please understand WHY we're so irritated with Bioware devs right now. It's an insult to paying customers when devs constantly avoid the questions being asked of them or give answers in vague terms, like "we're looking into it" or "sometime in a future patch". We pay to play the game and have a right to be kept informed rather than kept in the dark. The are NEVER, EVER going to give any kind of dates again (and are smart not to). Since even the slightest hint of a date is turned into "You Promised" and a flood of posts if the date is missed by even minuets. Go check Blizzard, and see just how many times they have announced a date for something way in advance. Just when is MoP coming out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llesna Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 (edited) The are NEVER, EVER going to give any kind of dates again (and are smart not to). Since even the slightest hint of a date is turned into "You Promised" and a flood of posts if the date is missed by even minuets. Go check Blizzard, and see just how many times they have announced a date for something way in advance. Just when is MoP coming out? If they take that line, then those sensible ones amongst us who accept that rough estimates are just rough estimates are going to keep on them for this attitude. About the only other organisation that I can think of which can get away without giving even approximate timescales is the Public sector. In normal business practice, it helps to treat your customers with some modicum of respect and keep them at least somewhat in the loop, rather than stringing them along with features that may or may not arrive for a protracted period of time. Bioware isn't Activision Blizzard (fortunately!) so I'd rather treat Bioware as a grown-up enough company to make its own decisions rather than just doing what others are doing. If people complain that you missed an estimated or rough date, that's their stupidity for not understanding the words estimates or rough, but it's unfair on the rest of the paying customers to be kept on the dark on features that were missing from the game at launch. Edited May 3, 2012 by llesna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickRedOne Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 (edited) If they take that line, then those sensible ones amongst us who accept that rough estimates are just rough estimates are going to keep on them for this attitude. Unfortunately there are too few of us that are sensible on this forum. Take the 1.2 release date, they said "we hope to release it in early April ". On the 10th of April the forums lit up with posts about how BW lied, promised early April, and did not fulfill those promises. But when the patch came on the 12th (which was still Early April), did anyone post that they were sorry and that BW did meet the expatiation of Early April, no they did not. So yea the sensible of us would like a date, knowing that is it not cast in stone, and could change. The realistic of us know that we will not get it. Because of the others on this forum. Edited April 23, 2012 by RickRedOne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llesna Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 (edited) Unfortunately there are too few of us that are sensible on this forum. Take the 1.2 release date, they said "we hope to release it in early April ". On the 10th of April the forums lit up with posts about how BW lied, promised early April, and did not fulfill those promises. But when the patch came on the 12th (which was still Early April), did anyone post that they were sorry and that BW did meet the expatiation of Early April, no they did not. So yea the sensible of us would like a date, knowing that is it not cast in stone, and could change. The realistic of us know that we will not get it. Because of the others on this forum. It's sad that whiners and idiots stop the legitimately-interested consumers from being kept in the loop. Le sigh. Edited May 3, 2012 by llesna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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