A Healer's 1.2 Grievances: The story of why healers are upset

[SpoeMeister]

If you can't keep a person alive in a 2 vs 1 situation, it's an L2P issue, either from you or your DPS'er... simple as that

 

I do agree that it's difficult to win a 2vs2 encounter where your opponents are two DPS'ers smashing on your DPS'er and you are trying to heal through it. But I tend to stall for time by using my stuns. If I kick debilitate my opponent I have either gained 4 or 8 seconds of healing. (4 if he keeps his freebie card for my 8 second mez, 8 if not). These seconds are very important for adding extra survivability, effectively turning my 1 partner into a 1,3 partner)

 

I am Imperial Agent, 1.2 has benefited me in a lot of ways. These nerfs don't affect me as much because of my mobility. I do feel very sorry for my turret colleagues!

[Khoraji]

If you can't keep a person alive in a 2 vs 1 situation, it's an L2P issue, either from you or your DPS'er... simple as that

 

I do agree that it's difficult to win a 2vs2 encounter where your opponents are two DPS'ers smashing on your DPS'er and you are trying to heal through it. But I tend to stall for time by using my stuns. If I kick debilitate my opponent I have either gained 4 or 8 seconds of healing. (4 if he keeps his freebie card for my 8 second mez, 8 if not). These seconds are very important for adding extra survivability, effectively turning my 1 partner into a 1,3 partner)

 

I am Imperial Agent, 1.2 has benefited me in a lot of ways. These nerfs don't affect me as much because of my mobility. I do feel very sorry for my turret colleagues!

 

Dont feel sorry for me (merc healer), we are still perfectly fine, dont listen to the QQ.

[Darth_Philar]

This again?

 

Expertise gives healers a huge boost compared to DPS.

 

Expertise may give healing a bigger percentage, however healing overall was nerfed and is subject to trauma while DPS was buffed leading to a net DPS gain over healing.

 

Plus the Sorcerer healer dynamic has changed and healing output has plummeted as a result, and that's when freecasting. If you have a DPS on you you can't get a single heal off.

[Khoraji]

Expertise may give healing a bigger percentage, however healing overall was nerfed and is subject to trauma while DPS was buffed leading to a net DPS gain over healing.

 

Plus the Sorcerer healer dynamic has changed and healing output has plummeted as a result, and that's when freecasting. If you have a DPS on you you can't get a single heal off.

 

Trauma should never be in this discussion. It has been around since launch. Trauma is there ONLY because PvE healers need to heal through boss dmg, it is NOT meant to balance DPS/Healing in pvp.

 

Sorc healing may be broken... i dont know about them. But OPS and Mercs are still out-healing any dps.

 

We were OP before. Now it is a bit more difficult.

[SpoeMeister]

Dont feel sorry for me (merc healer), we are still perfectly fine, dont listen to the QQ.

 

I have seen Sorcs and Mercs (or the Rep counterpart) that still outheal me at times, so off course I will take everything with a grain of salt. :-) I just wanted to show my sympathy to people that didn't really had to work pre 1.2, but now they do.

 

I have worked my butt of learning to play with my Agent, and they need to bring on big nerves before I really think I can't do my job.

 

As I said, turning 3 players into 5 players via healing, that's my job. If the receivers can't use that bonus well, that's not my fault. If I can't make that transformation, it's my fault... simple as that.

[Darth_Philar]

I have seen Sorcs and Mercs (or the Rep counterpart) that still outheal me at times, so off course I will take everything with a grain of salt. :-) I just wanted to show my sympathy to people that didn't really had to work pre 1.2, but now they do.

 

I have worked my butt of learning to play with my Agent, and they need to bring on big nerves before I really think I can't do my job.

 

As I said, turning 3 players into 5 players via healing, that's my job. If the receivers can't use that bonus well, that's not my fault. If I can't make that transformation, it's my fault... simple as that.

 

I can still top the chart on healing done with my Sorcerer but the problem is that if you have less than 50% health, it doesn't matter how many Sorcerers are on your team they aren't going to get a heal off in time to save you thanks to the long cast times that we used to be able to shorten through Bending. If I can keep all my allies at 80% and higher we live forever (so long as no one focuses me or if I have a tank protector). If they start to drop below 80% then it is basically a turtle until I run out of force and my friends quickly die.

[PeachyKeen]

Tank, DPS, Healer - the holy trinity of MMORPG's.

 

If you want perfect balance in PvP, imo, it needs to work like this.

 

Given Equal Gear/Skill

 

Tank VS DPS

 

It should be a tossup each time they confront eachother, the tanks greater armor absorbing the dps's attacks and the tanks lesser damage not hurting the DPS as badly. That leaves it up to lady luck depending on who gets more crits/parrys/dodges/etc.

 

Tank or DPS VS Healer

 

If the healer does nothing but heal themselves it should be a stalemate for a good long while if not indefinatley. The damage and interrupts should be high/frequent enough to make the healer need to focus their healing entirely on themselves to survive. They should cancel eachother out.

 

Doing nothing but healing myself (a sage 31/6/4) against my watchman spec sentinel friend yesterday with him only wearing his BM sabers I lasted around 1 minute wearing my full BM set.

 

Call it QQ, but this is a very discouraging time to be a healer in PVP.

[RStoney]

Will fully admit I am not a MMO veteran by a long shot. That being said, I leveled a full-spec'ed Sage healer, just for the aspect of *healing* and support. No great stretch of the imagination there, huh? Now, considering it was a long leveling process, a REALLY long gearing process, since I mainly relied upon the good graces of others (MVP votes) to get commendations - leveling a full healer is a test of patience and endurance. Not the instant gratification pathway.

 

Pre 1.2, Lvl 50 WZ. I could pretty much determine how the WZ would go by 1) Did the other team know I was a healer, and focus on me? 2) Did my team stay in some semblance of order for me to heal ? #1 being key - If I gained the attention of a dps type, or worse - two dps types - Yes, I could stay alive for some time. But I had to focus all my heals on ME. And that was a valid tactic! Find the healer - harass and kill them.

 

This means, I was not healing my teammates. I could not do my job. (supporting them) Effectively - ONE dps could seriously impact my ability to support others. As it should be.

 

Post 1.2 Lvl 50 WZ - seriously - I have dps types following me entire matches for the easy kill numbers. They are strictly medal-hunting, and I am so easily dispatched it isn't funny. Healing teammates? Rarely. Hard to do from the other side of the barrier.

 

Great - my WZs are now reduced to run in, die, respawn, wait at barrier, run in, die, lather rinse repeat. And am rapidly noticing that I am among the dwindling few Sage healers that will even show up. And seriously - considering the 'no-fun-zone' - probably will be one less Sage shortly. Quite simply - zerging = zero fun

 

btw - thanks BW - for that marker above my head announcing what I do. Not like everyone else with a brain could figure it out, I needed a billboard.

Edited April 16, 2012 by RStoney

[JattaGin]

I think all discussions here will become obsolete soon - because there won't be proper warzoning going on anymore.

 

Even with the currently free play options, there are less and less players on my server going into warzones. I posted some screenshots yesterday to show the results you get these days on my server as a proof.

 

Most of my guildies stopped warzoning, although they are experienced PvPers. It was only a hunt for medals during the last days. No one even trying to win, because it was already clear after a minute that the 6 operatives (is this what this now overpowered class is called? - Respect to the Imp players to adjust so fast to this change; before 6 Sith, now 6 operatives) + 2 Sith would slay us.

 

I tried until yesterday to at least get my 3rd daily win. The last win I had before 1.2! I tried since Thursday evening and failed heavily. When I tried to win the game, I had a hard time getting 3 medals. This is not how I want to play. So I won't play anymore.

 

What I did was starting a new character. Guess what, it's a healer. I thought it would be nice to play such a character. Then I saw this thread. My conclusion: Playing my main at lvl 50 doesn't make any sense anymore (given my style of play). Playing a Jedi bored me, so I stopped this try. My new commando healer seemed promising, but I already know now that I will only do PvE with him. A pity. What else could I do? I could join the Imp side, use only 3 buttons from now on, get all the warzone wins due to overwhelming powers (quantity, gear...) and tell the Rep players on the board that they should stop whining, because it's all just L2P. But that would make me a bad player - which I am not.

 

So, I thought and thought and then found the solution: I unsubbed. I'm pretty sure that some weeks after I stopped playing TOR completely, I won't feel frustrated anymore. And this is exactly what many players did, do and will continue to do. Simple as that.

[Aikagi]

It's definitely changed how warzones are played. As a tank, I die quite a lot now even when rolling with an healer. Just because they can't keep me up through protecting them unless it's only one person attacking them. I'm not sure I like it, either. It reduces the reason for me to even be present. Yeah, I can defend an healer to an extent, but, you may as well bring DPS now to stomp everything.

[Calenei]

Tank, DPS, Healer - the holy trinity of MMORPG's.

 

If you want perfect balance in PvP, imo, it needs to work like this.

 

Given Equal Gear/Skill

 

Tank VS DPS

 

It should be a tossup each time they confront eachother, the tanks greater armor absorbing the dps's attacks and the tanks lesser damage not hurting the DPS as badly. That leaves it up to lady luck depending on who gets more crits/parrys/dodges/etc.

 

Tank or DPS VS Healer

 

If the healer does nothing but heal themselves it should be a stalemate for a good long while if not indefinatley. The damage and interrupts should be high/frequent enough to make the healer need to focus their healing entirely on themselves to survive. They should cancel eachother out.

 

Doing nothing but healing myself (a sage 31/6/4) against my watchman spec sentinel friend yesterday with him only wearing his BM sabers I lasted around 1 minute wearing my full BM set.

 

Call it QQ, but this is a very discouraging time to be a healer in PVP.

 

 

Couldn't have said it better myself. I know for a fact that I won't be hanging around playing a healer very much longer. You Literally get blown apart as soon as you step out into a warzone these days. The Damage Output has been tuned to high and healing output has been tuned too low. Making it a much larger gag to the perfect balance.

 

I am very disappointed in the state Warzones are now in for healers. Long live the Zerg

[Balmuck]

Only thing healers deserve in this game is to die and as long as 1.2 continues, they're gonna die. That's what you get for pushing 4 buttons. It's not like it takes skill to heal.

[SpoeMeister]

Only thing healers deserve in this game is to die and as long as 1.2 continues, they're gonna die. That's what you get for pushing 4 buttons. It's not like it takes skill to heal.

 

Oooh, did the little mara feel powerless before 1.2?? Sad you couldn't kill the Operative while he was laughing in your face?

 

I bet you probably still can't :^)

[Guiken]

Honestly, i'm fine with healers not out healing a dps indefinitely. That being said, they should have some damage to counter with. You can't nerf survivability, AND heals across the board, and specific healers, and raise damage AND still expect healers to be offensively neutered.

 

It just leads to a class that very few people WANT to/Enjoy playing. Those that like the attention and the feeling of being "needed" and praised for saving the team that's obtained by playing a healer will continue to do so.

 

Many of those who want a fair shot at defending themselves, especially in open world, wont bother.

 

Yes they're still needed, but it's gone from a class that many can enjoy, to one that very few do. If you dont want so much healing in the game, at least give healers a viable spec to defend themselves.

 

With a Sentinel in recruit gear, most healers, even in battle master are free kills for me. It's ridiculous.

[Vetril]

Oooh, did the little mara feel powerless before 1.2?? Sad you couldn't kill the Operative while he was laughing in your face?

 

I bet you probably still can't :^)

 

to be fair he's not the one ************ on the forums right now.

[goulet]

as a healer is the only class role i dont play i can only provide my perspective from the other sides.

 

i think the majority of issues come from the fact that in addressing and buffing certain areas it only exacerbated the problems they didnt get to. the other thing i've noticed and this is just my opinion, but some balancing seems to be centered around class cooperation (ie they assume healers will be guarded)

 

DPS

Marauders are evidently the benchmark for basing all dps, which on its face isn't problematic as aside from snipers their the only pure dps class. The problem is other classes aren't parsing where their supposed to be relative to marauders. Case in point operatives we're told prior to the patch we're supposed to be within 5 % of marauder dps, yet the best anyone has been able to pull averages about 200 dps lower then marauders (which is more like 15%).

 

problem: certain classes are detrimentally affected at killing people at the pace they need to. which further jeopardizes the groups survivability. As far as affecting healers, they also buffed classes dps that have faster interrupt cds then other classes. So a marauder can still shut down your casting really well and has increased dps.

 

Tanking

buffing dps without addressing the lack of contribution of defensive stats really shoots tanks in the foot, which in turn affects healers. prior to the patch it was overpowering, now i have to go mozart on the keyboard and razor mouse: switching targets to apply ccs/taunts/pushing, aoe taunting, aoe stuns, hopping around making yourself a target. The problem is i have to throw the kitchen sink at them every time to be able to survive. I blow almost all of my defensive cds every fight within a game, and i still drop like a stone, being in full bm gear. Having to dedicate so much time to keeping yourself alive minimizes your ability to use the little things to further reduce damage (intercede).

 

Healing

the things mentioned above play a huge role in the problems faced by healers. As far as the healer specific issues (class side) i trust you can piece it together with the numerous posts prior to this one.

 

that being said balancing healing is somewhat of a crap shoot, you won't balance around 1v1 and you can't balance around focus fired targets cause then the 1v1 situtation is screwed.

Edited April 16, 2012 by goulet

[Dreydin]

Only thing healers deserve in this game is to die and as long as 1.2 continues, they're gonna die. That's what you get for pushing 4 buttons. It's not like it takes skill to heal.

 

Your are ridiculous. And your trolling is ridiculous. That, or your just plain stupid. Its people like, that caused me to unsub days ago. Enjoy your 4 weeks of busier fleet. Cause after that, you will be back to 12 people standing around on an empty server.

 

In the end, Bioware can thank turds like yourself, for destroying the game.

[Evanox]

Not sure if this has been expounded upon, but my 2 credits...

 

To me, as a Sorc/Healer, the problem is a compound one. If the changes were made to healers, but not ALSO to the Medal award design, I think I could live with it. BUT, since now healers are meat, less effective and much easier to eliminate as a threat, getting the necessary medals in a pug or mid-stream match requires me to play the game in an un-sportsman like way. (standing around Consuming and Healing myself or worse, going dps). I have a real hard time understanding how this is included an "intended".

 

As such, I have unsubbed. PVP was the reason I bought and played... healing was my tact, and nerfing/buffing is part of the cycle, I fully comprehend that, however making it patently UNFUN, (no comms, mid-match facerolling, and difficulty in gaining awards while healing, [several matches where I stood center field in Huttball, had 3-500k healing and still no comms]) makes for a playerbase in exodus.

 

All of the healers on our pvp squad have either respeced dps or are moving on.

[Balmuck]

Your are ridiculous. And your trolling is ridiculous. That, or your just plain stupid. Its people like, that caused me to unsub days ago. Enjoy your 4 weeks of busier fleet. Cause after that, you will be back to 12 people standing around on an empty server.

 

In the end, Bioware can thank turds like yourself, for destroying the game.

 

I didn't destroy anything. It's the undeserving healers, standing around, pressing 4 buttons, making fights into a bore fest.. they're the ones that destroy this game.

 

I think that if you heal, you should automatically get your comms and warzone rewards cut in half. It's not like they're DPS'ing and killing people and decided the outcome of a fight. They just stand there, being useless and all.

 

Also, they should tweek Maras/Juggies/Melee Operatives just a tad bit more to allow them more mobility during fights. My Mara would really appreciate if those healers would just stay in one place so I can beat them over the head with my glow sticks. It's not like running away is going to change anything, they still gonna die, might as well speed up the process.

Edited April 16, 2012 by Balmuck

[ssbi]

to be fair he's not the one ************ on the forums right now.

 

You forgot ":D".

 

But hey you are still trying to make a point.

 

The good thing for you now healers are nerfed.

The bad thing for you that game is not like any other MMORPG, BW usually listen to whiners, its our turn to whine now, and they gonna change mitigation sooner or later. But plus to this they gonna nerf classes which are op now, to force ppl rerolling and stay in game.

 

Have fun, for now.

Edited April 16, 2012 by ssbi

[DarthKhaos]

I think some number tweeking is needed. Adjust the healing and dmg bonus a bit. Lower the dmg bonus from expertise a bit and up the healing bonus a little. Also perhaps reduce the power of the hots some to balance out the more mobile healers with the increase in healing bonus.

 

I think the problem is not with the dmg boost OR the healing nerf but both together. Give it a little time after getting live feedback. It's only been like 4 going on 5 days since the patch.

[pathiss]

I didn't destroy anything. It's the undeserving healers, standing around, pressing 4 buttons, making fights into a bore fest.. they're the ones that destroy this game.

 

I think that if you heal, you should automatically get your comms and warzone rewards cut in half. It's not like they're DPS'ing and killing people and decided the outcome of a fight. They just stand there, being useless and all.

 

Also, they should tweek Maras/Juggies/Melee Operatives just a tad bit more to allow them more mobility during fights. My Mara would really appreciate if those healers would just stay in one place so I can beat them over the head with my glow sticks. It's not like running away is going to change anything, they still gonna die, might as well speed up the process.

 

Is that a troll or are you completely clueless?

[ChaosLenny]

Can healers heal post 1.2...yes. Is it fun..NO!

 

I think that's what healers are pissed at. One if you think it takes no skill to heal you've never healed, it's not a button spam it's about resources, finding LOS, avoiding the wave of death as soon as folks find out your healer. DPS is easy living if you ask me you can jump in a battleground and actually play rather than worry about keeping your team alive.

 

This brings me to my point. Healers got a major nerf and then the medal system. A good healer is not trying to capture objectives as a rule, he/she is moving with there team and keeping them alive. If I try to grab kills, objectives most times it's a choice between keeping folks alive or that. In my opinion it discourages healers from doing there job. An example last night I came into a game a late I got two medals and nothing for it...what I think is a joke is this was a pug and I still pulled 3 MVP votes. Three random people thought I did a good job but biowares medal system not so much. As a player it gets old seeing dps pull 15 medals and me do ten.

 

What has this done?...now I go in focused on medals rather than HEALING. That's not a good thing, not at all. Do I go for the win in a losing game and throw solid heals or say screw it so I can get an extra medal. Winning game where I still lose or lose and get a few comms..this is not a cool decision, doesn't come up that much but when it does...

 

My point with this healing is still doable but it's not fun anymore. Stressing about medals isn't fun...at all. Being a punching bad even less fun.

[Khoraji]

Can healers heal post 1.2...yes. Is it fun..NO!

 

I think that's what healers are pissed at. One if you think it takes no skill to heal you've never healed, it's not a button spam it's about resources, finding LOS, avoiding the wave of death as soon as folks find out your healer. DPS is easy living if you ask me you can jump in a battleground and actually play rather than worry about keeping your team alive.

 

This brings me to my point. Healers got a major nerf and then the medal system. A good healer is not trying to capture objectives as a rule, he/she is moving with there team and keeping them alive. If I try to grab kills, objectives most times it's a choice between keeping folks alive or that. In my opinion it discourages healers from doing there job. An example last night I came into a game a late I got two medals and nothing for it...what I think is a joke is this was a pug and I still pulled 3 MVP votes. Three random people thought I did a good job but biowares medal system not so much. As a player it gets old seeing dps pull 15 medals and me do ten.

 

What has this done?...now I go in focused on medals rather than HEALING. That's not a good thing, not at all. Do I go for the win in a losing game and throw solid heals or say screw it so I can get an extra medal. Winning game where I still lose or lose and get a few comms..this is not a cool decision, doesn't come up that much but when it does...

 

My point with this healing is still doable but it's not fun anymore. Stressing about medals isn't fun...at all. Being a punching bad even less fun.

 

Healers get Objective medals just as easily. A good healer will protect the objective rather than follow an idiot that runs away from them just to keep him alive. Healers should always get alot of defender medals.

[pathiss]

--before 1.2--

 

My operative was borderline OP before 1.2 because it took a lot to kill me.

 

My mercenary was OP before 1.2 because it took a lot to kill me AND I had pretty good healing output.

 

My sorcerer was practically worthless before 1.2 against competent players because if susceptibility to interrupts and being squishy. Was great against pugs though.

 

 

--after 1.2--

 

TTK went down as did general survivability across the board.

 

My operative got boosted, but is still only borderline OP because of the general increase in damage across the board.

 

My mercenary was nerfed but is about where it needs to be, providing the TTK and general increase in damage is dealt with.

 

My sorcerer is completely non-viable in PvP against competitive players. Borderline viable against pugs unless someone marks me.