Update on Ranked Warzones in Game Update 1.2

[daiddu]

I love that people think that BW are doing us a favor.

 

We are paying customers, we have the right complain about a product that we are not happy with, we have the right to cancel our payments to a producer that (in our opinion) supply a sub-par product.

 

I will use the same example as I used earlier.

 

I subscribe to a cable company who gives me channel 1, 2 and 3 for €X per month.

After a few months, I am bored watching the same channels every day.

The cable provider then informs me that they will include channel 4 in my channel package, for the same price.

 

I think this is absolutely brilliant, and I think that channel four will be my favorite channel.

 

8 hours before the time when the cable company are supposed to give me channel four, they send out a message, saying that channel four might be included into my package in lets say a months time or so, they are not sure.

 

I will then of course cancel my subscription with said company as they no longer provide the service I am looking for, nor are they providing a service they indicated that they would when they were running commercials about their new channels they would give out to their paying customers.

 

I might return to the company in question if they include the channel that I am looking for, but I am not going to watch free re-runs just because it's free for a month.

 

feature wasnt ready in their opinion. They tried to comp you with a free 30 days for your inconvenience. Don't like it, then leave, simple as that. read about 10 pages of entitlement and nearly lost my appetite. All the "unsubbed" commenters should just cancel their forum accounts too and go...

 

have a great day.

[Sengie]

So you think they arnt by putting not putting in a system they know is broken. so under your logic they would have been doing us a favour by putting in the broken system.

 

 

Well, they should not have announced it up to 8 hours prior to patch - that is false advertising and that is not doing us a favor.

 

If they would have gone out, lets say a week ago and said - "Damn, we are sorry - everything in 1.2 is ready but we have issues with RWZ and can not include this without delaying the whole thing" - I would have accepted that and said fair enough lads, as long as it is coming.

 

I am sure they knew before 11pm CET yesterday that they would not be able to include this, yet they waited til the very last minute to inform the players (the ones paying their salary) about this, even though they knew loads people were coming back to the game for this reason alone.

 

That pisses me off, and that shows that BW is nothing more than a greedy corporation who gladly sacrifice their player base to make a quick buck.

[Shingara]

Well, they should not have announced it up to 8 hours prior to patch - that is false advertising and that is not doing us a favor.

 

If they would have gone out, lets say a week ago and said - "Damn, we are sorry - everything in 1.2 is ready but we have issues with RWZ and can not include this without delaying the whole thing" - I would have accepted that and said fair enough lads, as long as it is coming.

 

I am sure they knew before 11pm CET yesterday that they would not be able to include this, yet they waited til the very last minute to inform the players (the ones paying their salary) about this, even though they knew loads people were coming back to the game for this reason alone.

 

That pisses me off, and that shows that BW is nothing more than a greedy corporation who gladly sacrifice their player base to make a quick buck.

 

Its only false advertisement if they knew it wasnt possible until 8 hours before launch, as it stands they have said it looked possible but when it got to 8 hours before launch they decided it wasnt going to work for 1.2 patch launch.

 

So in the end all the people that have unsubbed over this and uninstalled have done that because they cant have a broken system, also a system that by the sounds of it is nearly ironed out. that could drop at anytime and that would have been in pre season right now anyhows.

 

And im sure the only people who know the truth are bioware and they have spoken.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Shingara

[Sengie]

feature wasnt ready in their opinion. They tried to comp you with a free 30 days for your inconvenience. Don't like it, then leave, simple as that. read about 10 pages of entitlement and nearly lost my appetite. All the "unsubbed" commenters should just cancel their forum accounts too and go...

 

have a great day.

 

 

Hey, if the content that I am waiting for comes within the 30 days of free play, grand. I will try it. But I don't want to grind WZ, I don't want another OPS, I couldn't care less about legacy.

 

For me the full 8 group PVP and ranked Warzones was the only thing keeping me in the game, they tricked people to resub, loads of people (me included) stayed in the game just for this, they announced 8 hours before patch that this will not be included and ~22 hours after seeing that the community got angry as hell, they throw in 30 days free playtime for a product that is not offering us what we want (e.g. the items in the patch that they omitted)

 

I don't care about the 30 days free game time in a game that do not give me the content that I want, however I am more than willing to pay for a product that I gives me what I want.

[Shingara]

Hey, if the content that I am waiting for comes within the 30 days of free play, grand. I will try it. But I don't want to grind WZ, I don't want another OPS, I couldn't care less about legacy.

 

For me the full 8 group PVP and ranked Warzones was the only thing keeping me in the game, they tricked people to resub, loads of people (me included) stayed in the game just for this, they announced 8 hours before patch that this will not be included and ~22 hours after seeing that the community got angry as hell, they throw in 30 days free playtime for a product that is not offering us what we want (e.g. the items in the patch that they omitted)

 

I don't care about the 30 days free game time in a game that do not give me the content that I want, however I am more than willing to pay for a product that I gives me what I want.

 

 

This is the term i dont understand that is being thrown about now, you dont want to grind pvp. If you liked pvp you would pvp for the pvp not just to attain the gear. and everyone is in the same spot as you gear wise so there is no advantage.

 

People who love pvp dont pvp for gear, they pvp to pvp.

[georgelue]

It's amusing when BioWare is going to release something but then they remove it the last minute because they have last minute issues that they remembered from a while ago. I don't really mind since they gave me one month for free for level 50 players but this is a sign of SWTOR going a bit down

 

(I know I'll get flamed for this but that's what my opinion is)

 

I bet it is like this:

 

Worker A: Yo I think we have enough for 1.2

 

Worker B: Yeah... let's just let the glitches remain and fix them in 1.3. Players have enough for 1.2

Edited April 12, 2012 by georgelue

[Sengie]

This is the term i dont understand that is being thrown about now, you dont want to grind pvp. If you liked pvp you would pvp for the pvp not just to attain the gear. and everyone is in the same spot as you gear wise so there is no advantage.

 

People who love pvp dont pvp for gear, they pvp to pvp.

 

3 (now 4) warzones of pugging is not fun, I was looking forward to a full guild PVP group, all on mumble facing the challenge.

Yes, I wanted the gear that comes with it, I wanted to stomp rep's in warzones with the guild, I do not however feel that I have to pug ~900 warzones for gear.

 

Bioware have over and over c.rapped in the lap off the PVP community while expecting us to saying it is chocolate icecream.

 

I guess this time the community caught up and said: Hey this is c.rap even though they tried to hide the c.rap with some caramel sauce in the end (by giving us 30 days free play)

[Shingara]

3 (now 4) warzones of pugging is not fun, I was looking forward to a full guild PVP group, all on mumble facing the challenge.

Yes, I wanted the gear that comes with it, I wanted to stomp rep's in warzones with the guild, I do not however feel that I have to pug ~900 warzones for gear.

 

Bioware have over and over c.rapped in the lap off the PVP community while expecting us to saying it is chocolate icecream.

 

I guess this time the community caught up and said: Hey this is c.rap even though they tried to hide the c.rap with some caramel sauce in the end (by giving us 30 days free play)

 

So all this is over the fact that you can only group with 4 people and not 8. omg call the cops.

[dsingh]

Can I get $15 instead of free time? Thats one sloppy ******* in Baltimore, I would really appreciate it!

[Sengie]

So all this is over the fact that you can only group with 4 people and not 8. omg call the cops.

 

Haha, I am guessing you are not a pvp'er.

 

Like I mentioned earlier, I don't care about OPS, I don't care about legacy etc.

I wanted PVP, and 1.2 up til this time yesterday was announced to be THE best thing happening to PVP in game so far.

 

They failed that, and yet they expected us to pay and subscribe to the game.

 

That they now come with hat in hand and say "In order to celebrate 1.2 we give you a months free gametime" (e.g. read: Of **** the community is not going to let this one slide, we better appease them somehow) doesn't mean crap.

 

I am not willing to pay for a product that is not offering me what I want and what they said they would provide.

[Shingara]

Haha, I am guessing you are not a pvp'er.

 

Like I mentioned earlier, I don't care about OPS, I don't care about legacy etc.

I wanted PVP, and 1.2 up til this time yesterday was announced to be THE best thing happening to PVP in game so far.

 

They failed that, and yet they expected us to pay and subscribe to the game.

 

That they now come with hat in hand and say "In order to celebrate 1.2 we give you a months free gametime" (e.g. read: Of **** the community is not going to let this one slide, we better appease them somehow) doesn't mean crap.

 

I am not willing to pay for a product that is not offering me what I want and what they said they would provide.

 

Actually i am a pvper, and you know what, coast is freaking awesome so dont mind if i dont spill tears for something that would have been in pre season anyhows and i dont want in yet if its broken.

[Sengie]

Actually i am a pvper, and you know what, coast is freaking awesome so dont mind if i dont spill tears for something that would have been in pre season anyhows and i dont want in yet if its broken.

 

 

For me a new WZ aint enough.

 

I wouldn't want it broken either, but the lies (yes I use the term lies because I am certain (being in software development myself) that they knew long before yesterday that this was not ready for release seeing that they already had alternatives set up) pisses me off.

 

That is where they went down the wrong path.

[iReach]

I speak in regards to PvP in SWTOR as a veteran of MMO's dating all the way back to EQ1's release:

 

While its expected that an MMO won't be completely polished with a perfect end-game upon release, at least most newer MMO's have been quick to release content and continually work to improve the existing game at a much faster rate. Patches in this game have made little difference to date and have added no substantial content (again, in regards to PvP.)

 

In the beginning, Devs stated that they were happy and surprised by the amount of interest in PvP and emphasized that they'd be improving upon it. Instead they delayed 1.2 repeatedly, completely killed Illum (which was already in bad shape due to the poor gaming engine and Illum's zerg vs zerg design), and then one day prior to release announced that ranked PvP is not even ready to enter preseason without giving an ETA. If holding onto that last bit of news until the last minute isn't a ploy to maintain subscriptions I don't know what is.

 

I canceled my subscription a few months ago (I was working on a second set of BM gear) and was thinking about coming back with 1.2 until D3 or GW2 releases. Man am I glad that I didn't renew a few days ago to shake off the rust.

 

Everyone on this thread who is arguing that they'd rather have a smooth release of the ranked PvP than a choppy one, I agree. However, I for one have lost faith with the developers. If/when additions are finally released to the PvP, the majority of the PvP community will be long gone. Those of you who are accepting PvP the way it is now are either extremely casual, don't PvP at all, or are just plain settling for less than almost every recently released MMO has offered. If grinding the same 3 - 4 Warzones for an undetermined, maybe indefinite, amount of time is your thing, have at it.

 

-Reach

[Sengie]

right so what your saying is you want illum all over again, cool logic there.

 

 

We can take the Ilum discussion elsewhere (Ilum was a good idea, they should have focused on making people fight all over the zone, e.g. get rep's to use speeders out of the base instead of getting farmed, and force imps to guard all capture points all the time instead of having a blob of imps camped outside rep base), Ilum was a good idea, but with some work they might have pulled that off.

 

Nort sure what you mean however that I want Ilum all over, I would have liked that wouldn't have lied and said RWZ will be in the patch up to 8 hours prior to patch - that was a lie, and the fanboys here will continue to say that "they didn't know until then" which everyone who works with some sort of development, bugtesting etc knows is a lie.

[Shingara]

We can take the Ilum discussion elsewhere (Ilum was a good idea, they should have focused on making people fight all over the zone, e.g. get rep's to use speeders out of the base instead of getting farmed, and force imps to guard all capture points all the time instead of having a blob of imps camped outside rep base), Ilum was a good idea, but with some work they might have pulled that off.

 

Nort sure what you mean however that I want Ilum all over, I would have liked that wouldn't have lied and said RWZ will be in the patch up to 8 hours prior to patch - that was a lie, and the fanboys here will continue to say that "they didn't know until then" which everyone who works with some sort of development, bugtesting etc knows is a lie.

 

But the illum discussion is central to this, ranked is a great idea, but the concept was flawed, as such if they had pulled illum out before launch would it have been better for the playerbase for it not to be live then live and broken.

 

The same is in effect with the ranked, if it is broken and would do more harm then good on live RIGHT NOW, what is better. to pull it back until its actualy working correctly or ship it to live and hope for the best.

[Beneviolence]

I see a whole lot of complaining but I can only imagine how NOISY the complaining would be if they released Ranked Warzones and *gasp* it wasn't ready.

 

It really is funny to me how much noise is made about TOR being broken - clearly from people who have never played any mmo in the first year - and then when they delay a HUGE game component so they can get it right, noise is still made.

 

I would much rather the system be put on hold until it is workable. If for no other reason but to save 1000 pages of crying in the forums.

 

Roll an alt already and calm down.

[Sengie]

But the illum discussion is central to this, ranked is a great idea, but the concept was flawed, as such if they had pulled illum out before launch would it have been better for the playerbase for it not to be live then live and broken.

 

The same is in effect with the ranked, if it is broken and would do more harm then good on live RIGHT NOW, what is better. to pull it back until its actualy working correctly or ship it to live and hope for the best.

 

Well, still the same as I said earlier, they should not have tried and duped the whole PVP community (especially the ones resubbing for this release)

 

Like I said earlier, if they would have gone out a week ago stating that "Sorry lads, we have everything except RWZ ready, we really want to get everything else out, but RWZ needs to be held back, so we will go with 1.2 without the RWZ for now"

 

I am sure that you would not have seen this outcry of disgust.

 

The way that BW handled it is what pisses me off the most (and I dare to say most off the people). For me it feels like they were trying to earn as much money as possible before breaking the news.

 

Now they waited til 8 hours before the patch and then released the news, yet expects us to bow and accept the patch and pay for it while saying "Thank you BioWare", that is where the most of the anger comes from.

[Beef_Curtains]

I see a whole lot of complaining but I can only imagine how NOISY the complaining would be if they released Ranked Warzones and *gasp* it wasn't ready.

 

Obviously you're ignorant to the case being presented. Its not about ranked warzones... Its about the ability to que with 8man teams.

 

I have no idea what the percentage of people that only do PvP; but In my guild; on my server, we make up the majority. And this was a flaw that was being SCREAMED from the day Beta first launched last year..... Some may stay; and grind all over again for a 4th tier set of gear; but many have had it and are leaving as a result.

[Sengie]

I see a whole lot of complaining but I can only imagine how NOISY the complaining would be if they released Ranked Warzones and *gasp* it wasn't ready.

 

It really is funny to me how much noise is made about TOR being broken - clearly from people who have never played any mmo in the first year - and then when they delay a HUGE game component so they can get it right, noise is still made.

 

I would much rather the system be put on hold until it is workable. If for no other reason but to save 1000 pages of crying in the forums.

 

Roll an alt already and calm down.

 

 

FYI: Played MMO's since EQ1, early in AO (now that was buggy, year after launch, but must say, still the best PVP MMO so far), beta tested AoC, Neocron and a few others, played EQ2 from launch, same with Vanguard which sucked from beta to far into live.

 

 

So yes, I know MMO's can be buggy, but the fact is still promising, launching videos about content etc and not keeping up to their end of the bargain while expecting paying customers to sit back and be happy - that is failing.

[Shingara]

Well, still the same as I said earlier, they should not have tried and duped the whole PVP community (especially the ones resubbing for this release)

 

Like I said earlier, if they would have gone out a week ago stating that "Sorry lads, we have everything except RWZ ready, we really want to get everything else out, but RWZ needs to be held back, so we will go with 1.2 without the RWZ for now"

 

I am sure that you would not have seen this outcry of disgust.

 

The way that BW handled it is what pisses me off the most (and I dare to say most off the people). For me it feels like they were trying to earn as much money as possible before breaking the news.

 

Now they waited til 8 hours before the patch and then released the news, yet expects us to bow and accept the patch and pay for it while saying "Thank you BioWare", that is where the most of the anger comes from.

 

This is the thing though, how did they dupe anyone, so they said it would be in 1.2, its not in 1.2 launch because of solid reasons, to dispute that its not in is to dispute that people want the system in even if its broken.

 

but ill let you into a little secret, they arnt infallible.

[Beratac]

Obviously you're ignorant to the case being presented. Its not about ranked warzones... Its about the ability to que with 8man teams.

 

I have no idea what the percentage of people that only do PvP; but In my guild; on my server, we make up the majority. And this was a flaw that was being SCREAMED from the day Beta first launched last year..... Some may stay; and grind all over again for a 4th tier set of gear; but many have had it and are leaving as a result.

 

This game won't go anywhere.. to many fan boys that will take whatever is put out.. the sad part is those of us that hold BW to a high standard expect to get what they promoted and they haven't delivered that as of 1.2 patch.

 

IF IT WASN'T COMPLETED IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER LAUNCHED. Thats putting out half a product and expecting us to say.."Ohhh wow.. cool.. i get the coloring book but no crayons until July.." thats not how you treat your client base.

[Sengie]

This is the thing though, how did they dupe anyone, so they said it would be in 1.2, its not in 1.2 launch because of solid reasons, to dispute that its not in is to dispute that people want the system in even if its broken.

 

but ill let you into a little secret, they arnt infallible.

 

 

The duping part is simple - they waited til 8 hours before patch which made loads return to the game only to find out that what the returned to is not there.

 

(Have to head to bed, almost 1am and work tomorrow, I will read replies etc and come back, but not for another 8 hours )

[TonyIommi]

This game won't go anywhere.. to many fan boys that will take whatever is put out.. the sad part is those of us that hold BW to a high standard expect to get what they promoted and they haven't delivered that as of 1.2 patch.

 

IF IT WASN'T COMPLETED IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER LAUNCHED. Thats putting out half a product and expecting us to say.."Ohhh wow.. cool.. i get the coloring book but no crayons until July.." thats not how you treat your client base.

 

SO if it comes next week you'll be good? or the week after that you'll be good? Look for all you veterans of mmos that are somehow pissed about this you should have realized a long time ago PATCH NOTES ARE NEVER FINAL. Things change in the development process and sometimes things fall away.

 

As for it being last minute you can either accept their statement about it or rage endlessly about it. They likely worked on it till the last minute, looked up at the clock and said it's not happening and removed. As a project leader myself I can assure that that kind of decision is not made lightly and is not made easily. I'm glad they made the hard decision to remove it so they can get it right. The free time is a bonus imo and I'm glad for it.

 

The ONLY problem I have with what happened (and frankly every developer does this) is that they don't want to seem to give us some insight into what was wrong. I don't think they have much to lose by doing this and I think that it would help sate the frustration of some if we had a better idea of the challenge associated with what they were attempting to do. Also I'm just a naturally curious guy.

[Shingara]

The duping part is simple - they waited til 8 hours before patch which made loads return to the game only to find out that what the returned to is not there.

 

(Have to head to bed, almost 1am and work tomorrow, I will read replies etc and come back, but not for another 8 hours )

 

And yet again stating that they duped people by not putting in a broken system, But you know what they informed us, they didnt just let the patch drop and then go ow yes thats not in because it was broken.

 

Because i know a few mmos that would have put it in broken and then just disabled it saying it was broken or just let it run broken and dont anyone try and stand there and tell me they havnt seen that before in other mmos.

 

And the only thing and i mean litteraly the only thing that will come from this complaining is that no etas will be put on anything and that includes patchs. So gratzs to the complainers wanting a broken system /golfclap.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Shingara

[rekwilds]

I speak in regards to PvP in SWTOR as a veteran of MMO's dating all the way back to EQ1's release:

 

While its expected that an MMO won't be completely polished with a perfect end-game upon release, at least most newer MMO's have been quick to release content and continually work to improve the existing game at a much faster rate. Patches in this game have made little difference to date and have added no substantial content (again, in regards to PvP.)

 

In the beginning, Devs stated that they were happy and surprised by the amount of interest in PvP and emphasized that they'd be improving upon it. Instead they delayed 1.2 repeatedly, completely killed Illum (which was already in bad shape due to the poor gaming engine and Illum's zerg vs zerg design), and then one day prior to release announced that ranked PvP is not even ready to enter preseason without giving an ETA. If holding onto that last bit of news until the last minute isn't a ploy to maintain subscriptions I don't know what is.

 

I canceled my subscription a few months ago (I was working on a second set of BM gear) and was thinking about coming back with 1.2 until D3 or GW2 releases. Man am I glad that I didn't renew a few days ago to shake off the rust.

 

Everyone on this thread who is arguing that they'd rather have a smooth release of the ranked PvP than a choppy one, I agree. However, I for one have lost faith with the developers. If/when additions are finally released to the PvP, the majority of the PvP community will be long gone. Those of you who are accepting PvP the way it is now are either extremely casual, don't PvP at all, or are just plain settling for less than almost every recently released MMO has offered. If grinding the same 3 - 4 Warzones for an undetermined, maybe indefinite, amount of time is your thing, have at it.

 

-Reach

 

+1

also we have to add that from day one PVP in this game was not what most pvpers expected.. for opvpers is even worse.. illum was something but broken and bad design.. only thing that keep us in the game is the hope of one day real RVR/opvp and in the mean time at least the 1-2 hours we spend until we get bored of warzones is that lat least we get ranked.. since you know warzones is a sporty event and should be seen like that.. is not pure pvp is something WoW came up with to instance fights 8v8 so like in any sport you want it to count.. so not only did they rip the only opvp we had... :-( also they rip the update.. that is ok people is WRONG to think we are mad because they took it off we are mad that THEY DID NOT communicate, and remember we were already mad from day 1 because of lack of RVR/OPVP so this just add up to frustration so at some point it HAD to explode.. and YES we still in the forums protesting because im sure many of us dream with this game for month before December and to see how a wonderful LORE like is starwars and its potential for pvp were minimized into a pve game.. with the promess of more PVP... well the promess has been broke 3 times... 3 is enough we love the LORE we LOVE some aspects of the game but if we get bored at end game because there is no OPVP not even sporty PVP then... sorry but automatically SWTOR just made today more pre-orders of the secret world and GW2 than any other marketing campaign.

and we have the right to feel this forums with rage because as long we do not insult anyone we still have 7 days paid for and that includes posting in the forums and includes voicing our opinions.. in numbers is when the change happen and if it does not then is over.