you thought tank sins were op? you havn't seen operative hybrid in action

[Payneintherear]

You've never pvped before have you? Killing someone is more valuable than tickling them for three minutes- and with the intense time restraints in VS and Alderaan due to respawn times- burst damage is artificially far more important in this game than it has ever been in any other in pvp.

 

They've essentially made a game that must rely on burst damage- which means that classes without burst are more useless than they should be. It also means that healing makes more of a difference short term than it should.

 

The word "burst" is used so loosely anymore, that people think it means anything more than it is. Take an Infiltration Shadow and a Balance Shadow The Infiltration Shadow has burst, while the Balance Shadow has more sustained damage. Do you know which one of these two is easier to neutralize in competitive play? (not that either are a good choice, but they make a prime example for my argument).

 

Any class in this game is capable of putting out respectable damage. You do not need a class that will drop 12-15k damage in 3 GCDs to kill somebody, because the non-burst classes will still deal 10k in these 3 GCDs and at the same time they will deal more damage between bursts, keeping the pressure high, be less squishy, thus having higher combat-uptime etc.

[justntrue]

The word "burst" is used so loosely anymore, that people think it means anything more than it is. Take an Infiltration Shadow and a Balance Shadow The Infiltration Shadow has burst, while the Balance Shadow has more sustained damage. Do you know which one of these two is easier to neutralize in competitive play? (not that either are a good choice, but they make a prime example for my argument).

 

Any class in this game is capable of putting out respectable damage. You do not need a class that will drop 12-15k damage in 3 GCDs to kill somebody, because the non-burst classes will still deal 10k in these 3 GCDs and at the same time they will deal more damage between bursts, keeping the pressure high, be less squishy, thus having higher combat-uptime etc.

 

couldn't agree more.

 

I play a GS and a vanguard (similar to taugrims iron fist spec with a few personal changes)

 

GS is obviously the burst champion, while, the vanguard is probably the worst prof for either sustained or burst DPS. the best bursts I can do are when stockstrike (SS) crits, HiB crits and procs another SS crit for about 8000 damage in 3 GCD's thats with no relics or other stims, so non-competion level damage.

 

But, the point is that the vangaurd, played properly will produce just as many kills as a GS.

 

The trick is playing smart, and choosing targets carefully. tab+pew pew is for the gimps.

 

target select, HP check, immobilize in enemy territory and attack is FTW.

 

Your point about sustained pressure couldn't be more correct. Especially against healers and casting profs who are unable to achieve proper DPS due to havign consistently interupted attacks + 4 second lockouts applied to their normal chains.

[eGraced]

Operative is OP!!!!

 

 

And Powertech is PT! And Sorcerer is SORC!

Horray abbreviations!!!

 

Sorry, I couldn't resist!

Edited April 10, 2012 by eGraced

[Ich_Bin]

An Assassin complaining about Operatives being OP... That's hilarious

 

(I play both an Operative and an Assassin myself)

[Affics]

As a hybrid i can beat everyone in a 1vs1 situation, besides hybrid healers and pure healers.

But in a group situation 1 good dps can disable me from healing team and 2 will give me lots of trouble, if 2 burst class like PT and jugg - i'm done.

400k/400k is ********, coz only way u can doing this is team full of healers and ****** dps against u and in ur team u are the only healer. As hybrid i heal much more than doing damage, coz if i wanna do damage i spec to scrapper. I have several SS where i done 700k, 800k healing as hybrid. But i dps only if needed, coz against premade doing 300 k damage as hybrid is unreal even 200k is really hard, coz u main priority is healing.

[BDutch]

If 1.2 notes make you feel any better about it, concerning hybrid Scoundrels...

• Back Blast now has a 12-second cooldown and deals approximately 5% more damage.
  
• Sucker Punch now costs 10 Energy (down from 15) and deals approximately 10% less damage.
  

 

Those nerfs aside, trinket the Flash Grenade if they're low on health. Unfortunately, dueling hybrids take:

Fight or Flight

Passive

Dodging or resisting an attack restores 1 energy. In addition, Disappearing Act no longer reduces healing dealt and received.

 

So even if you do trinket Flash Grenade, he still has a chance to heal up by using Disappearing Act (vanish), Tranquilizer (sap), then healing... as one of those videos showed. Fortunately that can only happen once every 3 minutes as a hybrid.

 

Other than that, I just see a geared veteran healer hybrid doing what they do in MMOs.

Edited April 10, 2012 by BDutch

[anticept]

Your situations, though, don't have anything to do with sustained vs burst. Burst classes/specs can do that stuff just as easily. It's all about control, not damage. I can do all of that AND do burst. Burst classes are better in almost all situations, but those situations are not something you specifically need sustained damage for. I have mass burst on my Sent, but I can CC them for 6 seconds and spam my snare without doing damage. Same with a focus Guardian, 5k AoE crits AND AoE snare spam.

 

Simply put, burst classes don't HAVE to burst when the situation demands otherwise.

 

What you´re mistaking is that there is only one type of control - CC be it snares or crybabys on the floor like your class can do but there is also damage which makes the healer heal or the tank to taunt you or try to cc you of his/her healer or teammate here one dps can bind 2 players for a certain amount of time and when you´re starting to lose the fight you apply your cc´s if you have friends backing you you can bind majority of their team.

My post was about that guy´s post i quoted that burst is allmighty and you need to kill everything you see and my examples were specific to the situations sure you can go for a 3cap in alderaan if you want to run around saving turrets or kill the opposing team after first door in VS to have them spawn at you team on the 2nd set of doors or spawn to take out your BC in huttball. I´ll admit that my post was unclear on the part that the sustained dps doesn´t mean autoattacking someone for 15mins but it needs to be bursty but not in a way that you kill more people than your team can handle on the next obstacle.

[da_krall]

you can watch this vid

 

 

this guy is soloing 2 shadow tanks while eating dinner.

 

You cannot use video as an example of why some class is OP. Video by their nature will always show the best highlights from a lot of footage. Chances are pretty high that if you play the game for 200 hundred hours their going to be 5 minutes footage of you doing truely staggering stuff.

[Affics]

you can watch this vid

 

 

this guy is soloing 2 shadow tanks while eating dinner.

 

12k and 14k are not really tanks - there are meat on the field, as scrapper i will kill them much faster than him...

Edited April 10, 2012 by Affics

[Souju]

they are doting, hoting and direct healing. sry but every healer class can spec a bit dot damage. @host you just forget that this damage does not matter, nobody is dying cause of it.

 

thx to this mythic "people with no knowledge" for inventing this damage score.

Edited April 10, 2012 by Souju

[JediDuckling]

An Assassin complaining about Operatives being OP... That's hilarious

 

(I play both an Operative and an Assassin myself)

 

depends what spec they are a pure deception spec is fairly gimped.

[Ich_Bin]

depends what spec they are a pure deception spec is fairly gimped.

 

Not really, if you compare it to the popular Operative Concealment spec. Darkness is way better than Deception, but Deception is still much better than Concealment.

[Wohast]

this thread made me lol

[Payneintherear]

 

The vid was never intended for '****imsoleet' gameplay, but more to show some fun footage of how a hybrid operative plays... I probably would've keybinded a few more things before recording, and excluded clips where I let my teammates die, if that was the case.

 

The clips I had of 1v1's against fully min/maxed chars looked rather bland to me, and that's not really what the game is about.

 

I am curious at this point. Are the shadows in your video the best on the server?

[alcek]

I have seen 400k dmg, 400 k heal against me by a imperial hybrid OPness. No way to even get close to killing that guy, at least not if less that 3v1.

[Agonisis]

operatives hybrid healer/dps are out of control now, every operative right now is playing some kind of hybrid spec that allows them to do 400k damage and 400k healing done in warzones.

 

this is getting ridiculous and they needs to be nerfed.

 

Translation: I am really horrible at pvp and this class needs to be nerfed so my level of badness doesn't show.

 

Do you know how easy it is to beat an Op after he opens, play one and learn, stop crying cuz your OP cookie cutter class got beat by a good player. Maybe you should ask bioware to nerf good players? or people with an iq over 50?

 

no matter what you ask for or how bad they prison **** operatives, we will unstealth, knock your *** down and beat you to death the nerf bat we now have to weild do to all the QQ. And still you will cry.

[SinnedWill]

Since Ops/Scoundrels won't be able to heal on the move (it's becoming channeled, I believe) with 1.2, you can consider a nerf to already be in the works for this. I also believe their strongest attack is getting nerfed. And don't blame Operatives alone, Scoundrels are mirror and can do the exact same thing.

[Wheelerific]

Since Ops/Scoundrels won't be able to heal on the move (it's becoming channeled, I believe) with 1.2, you can consider a nerf to already be in the works for this. I also believe their strongest attack is getting nerfed. And don't blame Operatives alone, Scoundrels are mirror and can do the exact same thing.

 

You sir are incredibly misinformed.

 

Op/Scoun healing is getting a pretty sizable buff, while their dps and burst is going down a bit.

 

There is nothing they are changing that is making Op healing channeled, they will continue to have only one casted heal necessary, and even then, they will have lots of TA procs that make them a moving healer 99% of the time.

[Xaearth]

You sir are incredibly misinformed.

 

Op/Scoun healing is getting a pretty sizable buff, while their dps and burst is going down a bit.

 

There is nothing they are changing that is making Op healing channeled, they will continue to have only one casted heal necessary, and even then, they will have lots of TA procs that make them a moving healer 99% of the time.

 

Operative/Scoundrels are the mobile healers...

 

If by "mobile healer" you mean the FEMA trailer of healers.

 

Sure, we can cast on the move... that doesn't mean those heals don't suck.

[teambff]

seems like an example of the one and only, the flawless... "gear gap"

if he puts up those numbers as a clicker it's just proof how ridiculous the gear gap is... cuz it if was equal ground no way a point and click player would be that successful with a melee.

 

clicking on a melee basically puts you 2 steps behind everyone else.

 

gear gap wins yet again.

[Vaipyr]

seems like an example of the one and only, the flawless... "gear gap"

if he puts up those numbers as a clicker it's just proof how ridiculous the gear gap is... cuz it if was equal ground no way a point and click player would be that successful with a melee.

 

clicking on a melee basically puts you 2 steps behind everyone else.

 

gear gap wins yet again.

 

No kidding

[playasaurus]

I am curious at this point. Are the shadows in your video the best on the server?

 

The first fight was against the highest valor rank on server, the 2v1 was vs poor opponents (in case you didn't notice ). The majority of 50's who PvP on my server are in full champ/BM gear - it's quite rare to find undergeared players, but quite common to find players who don't understand min/maxing mods.

Edited April 10, 2012 by playasaurus

[SlimsPicken]

i think ive come across this hybrid spec before.

 

not only can they heal stupidly well but they can also nearly 1 shot heavys. i dont know if anyone saw my other posts but this is what i was on about

 

 

show me on the doll where the hybrid touched you.

 

and yes... everyone has seen your other posts. please stop. No one one shots anything.

[Trauglodyte]

The one thing that people need to remember is that the only difference between a full heal specced Op/Scoundrel with a melee subspec and the hybrid we see here is that they're giving up Recouperative Nanotech (the AE heal) for Lacerate. The difference in play style and output isn't that massive.

 

But, what is massive is the disparity between the Op's gear in the vid and their opponents. Furthermore, how many times did you see the Orbital Strike get interrupted? I counted one time.

 

You can't call for nerfs of a class when a decent player takes advantage of poorly geared saps.

[SinnedWill]

You sir are incredibly misinformed.

 

Op/Scoun healing is getting a pretty sizable buff, while their dps and burst is going down a bit.

 

There is nothing they are changing that is making Op healing channeled, they will continue to have only one casted heal necessary, and even then, they will have lots of TA procs that make them a moving healer 99% of the time.

 

thank you. Might I ask for a link to where you're getting your Op/Scound heal change information? I can't seem to find the page where I could've sworn I read that the Instant Cast Heal Over Time ability was becoming a stationary channeled heal (with an increase to its value).