1.2 = best pvp gear for free, and no reason to play rated. people are quitting

[Sugarray]

No for pvpers beating other pvpers is a much greats sense of accomplishment then beating a raid boss.

 

I couldn't agree more. But the satisfaction has DR when you've done it 100+ times

[Eryale]

Peoples over all problem is that the new War Hero gear requires no valor rank. You can turn a fresh 50, and go right into rated Warzones and win or loose start earning comms for the new gear. I suspect most of us will all have full sets within a couple weeks, maybe less.

 

It will get uber boring really fast with no gear progression to grind. You can only play "for the fun of playing" the same 4 warzones only so long with no incentive outside of colored gear.

 

As a result those of us PVPers who haven't given up on this game yet will for the most part, finally do so once the shiny 1.2 changes grow stale. I give it two months maybe less after 1.2 for mass PVP exodus.

 

To be fair what would have happened if they kept valor requirement to new tier gear.

They prob would have set all valor back for all to 0.

Because in no game with progression for gear means the time you spend grinding in 1 tier.

Will give you a significant advantage over other players when the next tier comes out.

 

The grief I read most is that they gotten rank 70 and thought yay I can buy warlord gear when it comes out.

And now are disappointed to see that won't happen.

 

And if you say than they should have left us "unique" titles.

 

You still have you're titles and you will even get faster to the title for rank 80 and 90 than others will. Becuase you grinded the valor in tier 1.

That will be the only advantage you have over those that not grinded in 1st tier.

[Dego_Locc]

To be fair what would have happened if they kept valor requirement to new tier gear.

They prob would have set all valor back for all to 0.

Because in no game with progression for gear means the time you spend grinding in 1 tier.

Will give you a significant advantage over other players when the next tier comes out.

 

The grief I read most is that they gotten rank 70 and thought yay I can buy warlord gear when it comes out.

And now are disappointed to see that won't happen.

 

And if you say than they should have left us "unique" titles.

 

You still have you're titles and you will even get faster to the title for rank 80 and 90 than others will. Becuase you grinded the valor in tier 1.

That will be the only advantage you have over those that not grinded in 1st tier.

 

In a perfect game with more PVP content then currently offered here it would be enough for most ppl who only PVP. But that ain't the way it's going to work here, and soon you will all see. Remember these threads when the subs start to dwindle because playing PVP just "for the fun of it" is not gonna be enough of a reward system for a subscription based MMO. It just wont be. Period.

[Ainew]

Please stop talking about skill in mmo's ....The only skill that it takes is LoS and learning when to use your abilities. Its a buzzword for people who believe video games take ability beyond practice.

[Dafroog]

It is not in my place to comment a lot about GW cause I didnt play it, but to my knowledge it wasnt a part of esport and obviously wasnt as big as WoW - these are basic assumption but you'd think that if GW pvp was so great people would go there

 

You think gear makes for a good esport?

[Dafroog]

In a perfect game with more PVP content then currently offered here it would be enough for most ppl who only PVP. But that ain't the way it's going to work here, and soon you will all see. Remember these threads when the subs start to dwindle because playing PVP just "for the fun of it" is not gonna be enough of a reward system for a subscription based MMO. It just wont be. Period.

 

Yet LoL is a huge game, thats been going for years, is pvp only has no gear and has a grand total of 3 maps

[Dego_Locc]

Yet LoL is a huge game, thats been going for years, is pvp only has no gear and has a grand total of 3 maps

 

But, its completely F2P, and in a different game genre all together, so your argument is pointless.

[Evuke]

PvP gear, even if obtained by winners faster, needs to obtainable by everyone.

 

It would make zero sense to give the best engine to the winner of each indy car race.

 

Excellent analogy, and great point.

 

Great players will roflstomp noobs even if they have crappier gear than the noobs, the last people that need uber gear are the best players.

[Eryale]

In a perfect game with more PVP content then currently offered here it would be enough for most ppl who only PVP. But that ain't the way it's going to work here, and soon you will all see. Remember these threads when the subs start to dwindle because playing PVP just "for the fun of it" is not gonna be enough of a reward system for a subscription based MMO. It just wont be. Period.

 

Those people better not pay for any gear progressing game anymore than.

 

Because this will happen in any game.

 

The grind you done for the the highest gear will mean nothing when a content patch with even higher lvl gear comes out.

 

The games that would make it so that when you grind and keep a permanent advantage over new players. Will stop exsisting because no new player can ever get on the same playing grounds with them. Even after new content patch.

Thus they will not get new players and player base will dwindle.

[Trevalion]

In a perfect game with more PVP content then currently offered here it would be enough for most ppl who only PVP. But that ain't the way it's going to work here, and soon you will all see. Remember these threads when the subs start to dwindle because playing PVP just "for the fun of it" is not gonna be enough of a reward system for a subscription based MMO. It just wont be. Period.

 

 

bad troll is bad?

 

Seriously bro, your complaining and making dire predictions about content that hasn't even been released yet.

 

Not only that but your fundamental premise that gear is important to the PvP community is obviously proven false by the majority of the posters in this thread... yah, the one your posting in.

 

Let me clarify one more time. PvE gear progression is part of the carrot that keeps us playing. For PvP gear progression was a poorly implemented linear system with no PvP meta-game depth and required ONLY time to achieve the highest levels. In SWTOR it has never been an indication of skill.

 

Bioware is doing the right thing in expanding the possibilities for the pvp meta-game and as part of that, the BASELINE pvp gear is being made available to all. For players who currently are 60+ valor ranks, the time was well spent. If it was not, why the hell did we do it? The protestation that people should have some reward for this "work" is just silliness. If it was perceived as work for them to do it, they were doing it wrong.

[Dego_Locc]

Excellent analogy, and great point.

 

Great players will roflstomp noobs even if they have crappier gear than the noobs, the last people that need uber gear are the best players.

 

This ain't a Nascar race, it's an MMO. Stop trying use real life analogies to attempt to stake some sort of point in how this MMO can work and keep subs going, with out endgame PVP gear progression.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dego_Locc

[Sugarray]

You think gear makes for a good esport?

 

How dd you come to that conclusion lol

[Dego_Locc]

Those people better not pay for any gear progressing game anymore than.

 

Because this will happen in any game.

 

The grind you done for the the highest gear will mean nothing when a content patch with even higher lvl gear comes out.

 

The games that would make it so that when you grind and keep a permanent advantage over new players. Will stop exsisting because no new player can ever get on the same playing grounds with them. Even after new content patch.

Thus they will not get new players and player base will dwindle.

Are you even reading any of this? I fully expect new gear to come out better than BM, I don't expect however any joe who just turned fresh 50 to wear it. I took my lump on my way up, your turn to take yours.

[Dego_Locc]

bad troll is bad?

 

Seriously bro, your complaining and making dire predictions about content that hasn't even been released yet.

 

Not only that but your fundamental premise that gear is important to the PvP community is obviously proven false by the majority of the posters in this thread... yah, the one your posting in.

 

Let me clarify one more time. PvE gear progression is part of the carrot that keeps us playing. For PvP gear progression was a poorly implemented linear system with no PvP meta-game depth and required ONLY time to achieve the highest levels. In SWTOR it has never been an indication of skill.

 

Bioware is doing the right thing in expanding the possibilities for the pvp meta-game and as part of that, the BASELINE pvp gear is being made available to all. For players who currently are 60+ valor ranks, the time was well spent. If it was not, why the hell did we do it? The protestation that people should have some reward for this "work" is just silliness. If it was perceived as work for them to do it, they were doing it wrong.

 

Nothing dire about predicting how the inclusion of 1(big whoop) extra warzone, and rated warzones for the three we have already played to death is a fail recipe for continued paid subs from PVPers who will nothing to do in the long run. Most people acknowledge the PVP in this game is ***, and if you can't see that the PVP is really lacking in this game then you are blind or in denial.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dego_Locc

[Eryale]

Are you even reading any of this? I fully expect new gear to come out better than BM, I don't expect however any joe who just turned fresh 50 to wear it. I took my lump on my way up, your turn to take yours.

 

Yes I am reading it.

 

And again BM gear was also available for everyone,

it just needed a surten ammount off time played.

So any joe could still get it.

 

I got full set BM long time before a lot off players got theirs.

 

I will also get the new tier gear faster than the others who play pvp casual.

And if you grinded and do it aswell next tier.

You will also have it faster than most.

 

It just won't mean having better gear than most for almost the whole 1.2

like what happened in 1.1

 

The only exception here is that with the rating you can show off with some different colour gears.

[TipsyDrow]

Then MMO's aren't for you........

 

Sadly Bioware is not really making an MMO here, so you will fit in just fine. Enjoy yourself. I'll be trying GW2, and/or quitting MMO's all together because casuals who whine ruin MMO's

 

You got school and work and can't level as fast as someone else? So do a lot of us, put in your time like the rest of us to "earn the right " to make it up there on a even playing field. You want something more level, and less time invested, go play an FPS like COD, True MMO's are about grinding and time put in, if you can't deal with that, why can't you casuals go play another type of game, because the playstle of MMO's is CLEARLY not for your tastes of not having enough time to play.

 

You couldn't be more wrong. The days of MMO's catering to so called hardcore players who have 16 hours a day to play are over. Long long over. You're type are obselete for this genre. Bioware and any other MMO that wishes to be profitable WILL cater to the masses who help them hit green. You understand this is NOT going to change. Get over yourself. It is not for you to say and who isn't for an MMO or any other game. The more you post, the more you come across as a self righteous pompous arse.

[Dafroog]

But, its completely F2P, and in a different game genre all together, so your argument is pointless.

 

Hardly pointless when your point was that pvpers cant be entertained by 3 maps without gear as a reward, LoL is a game thats been around for years and only got its third map recently. It doesnt matter how many maps you have as long as its fun people will keep playing

 

swtor is only 3-4 months in and is already adding a fourth map with more on the way, i think it will be fine, infact with the playing field being more even after 1.2, I think pvp and the ranking system will show who is actually good at pvp and on the whole give people more incentive to play because wins/losses will actually mean something.

[Dafroog]

How dd you come to that conclusion lol

 

It's pretty clear in what I quoted tbh

 

 

someone said gw doesnt have gear progression in its pvp, you said "but to my knowledge it wasnt a part of esport and obviously wasnt as big as WoW", so in order to be an esport thats as big as wow you need to have gear progression, no?

[Ozzone]

They are getting a reward they've said higher Valor ranked players will get different coloured PVP gear, as to what colours, well we shall see.

 

Different colored pvp gear is a joke of a reward. Wait and see. I will say no more.

[Dego_Locc]

Yes I am reading it.

 

And again BM gear was also available for everyone,

it just needed a surten ammount off time played.

So any joe could still get it.

 

I got full set BM long time before a lot off players got theirs.

 

I will also get the new tier gear faster than the others who play pvp casual.

And if you grinded and do it aswell next tier.

You will also have it faster than most.

 

It just won't mean having better gear than most for almost the whole 1.2

like what happened in 1.1

 

The only exception here is that with the rating you can show off with some different colour gears.

Except they award War Hero gear comms for every ranked warzone, win or Loose. Do you not see the problem with that? Yea we might get it first for a day, in a week or two all who que up daily will probably have a full set that they can wear.

 

Which is all good for an even playing field type of F2P game.

 

All around a bad thing for ppl who pay $ every month for a sub based game. Ppl will start to ask themselves why they are playing the same 4 warzones(?) over and over, for what? Not for fun, 4 warzones, fun with that ended a while ago for 3 of them already. For colors?! Sorry but that will just not be enough to keep ppl paying the sub only for PVP. For bragging rights? No one will care because this games pvp consists of 4 lonely 8 v 8 small instanced area warzones, no World PVP whatsoever, in fact it almost seems to be discouraged to go and have big battle in the open world of this game because the hero engine struggles with this game.

 

I mean are you blind to the writing on the wall or what?

 

This game just doesn't like PVPers on the whole. And that part of the game is going to die hard sadly.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dego_Locc

[Dego_Locc]

Different colored pvp gear is a joke of a reward. Wait and see. I will say no more.

 

Exactly, all these "pvp for the fun and the skill of it guys" Yea, sorry but not in a game like this lacking with PVP content. The colors simply wont be enough, or the mounts, (which PVPer's hardly use any damn way because of no world PVP).

 

Same few wz's over and over for colored gear wont be enough for most PVPers to justify a monthly sub me thinks.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dego_Locc

[Dafroog]

Except they award War Hero gear comms for every ranked warzone, win or Loose. Do you not see the problem with that? Yea we might get it first for a day, in a week or two all who que up daily will probably have a full set that they can wear.

 

Which is all good for an even playing field type of F2P game.

 

All around a bad thing for ppl who pay $ every month for a sub. Ppl will start to ask themselves why they are playing the same 4 warzones over and over, for what? Not for fun, 4 warzones, fun with that ended a while ago for 3 of them already. For colors?! Sorry but that will just not be enough to keep ppl paying the sub only for PVP. For bragging rights? No one will care because this games pvp consists of 4 lonely 8 v 8 small instanced area warzones, no World PVP whatsoever, in fact it almost seems to be discouraged to go and have big battle in the open world of this game because the hero engine struggles with this game.

 

I mean are you blind to the writing on the wall or what?

 

Yet stuctured pvp in gw2 is 4 maps (maby 5) and i think there all 5v5 too but not 100% on that

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dafroog

[Dego_Locc]

Yet stuctured pvp in gw2 is 4 maps (maby 5) and i think there all 5v5 too but 100% on that

 

But that game has world pvp on a massive scale. warzones suck in general for the most part, It's all about big battles and keep sieges IMO, that is fun, 100's of ppl battling for a real cause.

 

And BTW, there will be a form of gear progression in the WvWvW part of the game believe it or not.

 

Don't get me wrong, GW2 probably wont live up to the hype either, but I bet the PVP will be all around better than this, and with much more to do and experience.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dego_Locc

[Sugarray]

You couldn't be more wrong. The days of MMO's catering to so called hardcore players who have 16 hours a day to play are over. Long long over. You're type are obselete for this genre. Bioware and any other MMO that wishes to be profitable WILL cater to the masses who help them hit green. You understand this is NOT going to change. Get over yourself. It is not for you to say and who isn't for an MMO or any other game. The more you post, the more you come across as a self righteous pompous arse.

 

you are just as wrong. MMO caters for large audience, casual and hardcore are both a part of this, so you need both. Essentially one cannot live without the other for very long periods of time, since the developers will not make enough money.

[Dafroog]

But that game has world pvp on a massive scale. warzones suck in general for the most part, It's all about big battles and keep sieges IMO, that is fun, 100's of ppl battling for a real cause.

 

And BTW, there will be a form of gear progression in the WvWvW part of the game believe it or not.

 

From what Ive read WvWvW rewards are just buffs for your server to things like crafting and hp, not gear progression at all, unless the guild wars wiki linked from their site is wrong

 

I grant you that world pvp is in a mess in swtor, no argument from me, but removing gear from instanced pvp is not a bad thing as the only reason pvp gear was needed in the first place was to prevent raiders from facerolling pvper's, gw2 is removing it completely by having instanced pvp pretty much unrelated to you ingame toon and swtor is removing a lot of the negative impact that gear has on pvp by making the gear fairly easy to obtain, both games will be using a way to see how you stack up against other players as thier pvp carrot along with unlocking cosmetic things like a different gear skin, title or mount

 

The only meaningfull progression in pvp is how you stack up against other players (clue is in the name) and you dont need stats to do that