Redmarx Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) Fixed it for ya. No. In baby PVP with terribad zero-skill clueless puggers, ranged seem better. In real PVP with skilled players on both sides: Melee > ranged. By far. Edited March 4, 2012 by Redmarx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 No. In baby PVP with terribad zero-skill clueless puggers, ranged seem better. In real PVP with skilled players on both sides: Melee > ranged. By far. Ah, so in a tiny fraction of "pro" PVPers, melee *could* be OP, so balance around that. Don't balance around the PVP that the vast majority of people will be playing. Makes total sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellFlame Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 marauder / sentinel dps is just insane and you cant even evade (except stealthers) if your low hp... they gonna charge after you and get even more resources to burn you down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctournys Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Ah, so in a tiny fraction of "pro" PVPers, melee *could* be OP, so balance around that. Don't balance around the PVP that the vast majority of people will be playing. Makes total sense. so you're suggesting that balance be based around the fact that people are god-awful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Rated warzones will be dominated by heal/melee-zerg stacked teams. /thread QFT. There won't be any TM spammers that's for sure. Too easy to destroy them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kweassa Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 You can't make a tank guard you, or a healer heal you, as much as you'd like it. Being an elitist clown doesn't further your point. Then you are playing with a bad healer and a bad tank. It's a team tactic issue, and nothing to do with range vs melee. Stop trolling the complaint on something that's fine, and complain to your teammates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Oh look, bad melee classes that don't know how to team play complaining. Try remembering this is a team game- get a tank to guard you, a healer to heal you- BAM, marauders are most OP class in the game by a long shot. It's not BW's fault you don't play to your class's strengths, and no, the game should never be balanced around bads, that just makes the game terrible. Good players already are all rerolling marauders because of how OP there are. Bah they aren't OP. There was just a group of Sents/Marauders who have played the class since day one and in beta who knew it was a good class, and educated these so called "Good" players. They mostly make crappy marauders though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seriasx Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 so you're suggesting that balance be based around the fact that people are god-awful? I think that is exactly what he wants. Games should always be balanced from the top all the way down so you can accurately gauge every classes potential. Also for those who are new to mmo pvp the game is not balanced around 1v1 combat or else we would all be playing the same classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 melee is not hard to play. You're not talking to a "dev" when you submit a ticket, you're talking to a customer rep that is most likely outsourced and has no idea how to play the game. Casters are difficult to play because you have to worry about your positioning so you don't get destroyed by every melee in the warzone, getting interrupted etc melee is extremely easy to play, i've always played melee classes. You don't need the best computer/internet connection in the world to play melee. gw2 will not save you guys, go check out mesmer/elementalist videos. h3h3 cy@ lol qft!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Fixed it for ya. Oh boy, bad players complaining about melee needing a guard and heals again. This is only as new as last August. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfVey Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 The Sorc/Merc spam teams can be annoying but honestly I think melee has a minor advantage in both civil war and void star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltra Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 This thread is funny, considering that 2 out of 3 of the most op classes in pvp are melee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripamorame Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Pro tip roll with a pt if you're a war their grapple combined with my leap just nukes any kind of healer and pull them off of their group melee isnt hard to play its just rolling with the right people who understand how to do well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 so you're suggesting that balance be based around the fact that people are god-awful? No, it should be balanced people that merely good, not the top 1-2%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellFlame Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 No, it should be balanced people that merely good, not the top 1-2%. and thats the problem with every game.. it gets "fixed" for the mass not for the top players. as it would have impact for ppl who dont know how to play their class. Where eSports is there is money involved and that usually contains the top 1-2%. it just takes away the learning process from players if the game gets balanced for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 and thats the problem with every game.. it gets "fixed" for the mass not for the top players. as it would have impact for ppl who dont know how to play their class. Where eSports is there is money involved and that usually contains the top 1-2%. it just takes away the learning process from players if the game gets balanced for them. Because this game can be an esport... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 and thats the problem with every game.. it gets "fixed" for the mass not for the top players. as it would have impact for ppl who dont know how to play their class. Where eSports is there is money involved and that usually contains the top 1-2%. it just takes away the learning process from players if the game gets balanced for them. Not having a dedicated team to back your every move isn't a L2P issue. The point is, to be truly effective, a melee needs support. Whereas, a ranged can find a perch and pick people off and be pretty damned effective doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Not having a dedicated team to back your every move isn't a L2P issue. The point is, to be truly effective, a melee needs support. Whereas, a ranged can find a perch and pick people off and be pretty damned effective doing it. Be quiet. I pug all the time, and I rarely have a guard/healer helping me. Guards need to guard healers, not DPS. (typically). You just need to L2P. I'm sorry it hurts your feelings, but it's the reality. Melee classes have the best single target DPS in the game (long with Sniper/GS). Stop being bad. Can you please elaborate on your experience in the game, what character you have and what spec you are using? Also what server? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Not having a dedicated team to back your every move isn't a L2P issue. The point is, to be truly effective, a melee needs support. Whereas, a ranged can find a perch and pick people off and be pretty damned effective doing it. What kind of melee are you playing? I do damn fine without support. Ranged can perch? Use your freakin gap closer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 A quick look at Jes' thread creation history tells the tale. One of his comments. "They have more survivability and mitigation, and yet they hit like trucks compared to Shadows. Just in a game where a Marauder hit for 6.5k...how is that even balanced? Anyone else feel like we're getting hosed in the damage department?: Marauder hit for 6.5k? LOL. You are smoking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cereyeth Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 If allowed to stand around and statue cast, yes ranged dps will dominate a warzone. From my experience 90% of ranged players i come across are just grav round/lightning spammers. Simply interrupting them once is all it takes to completely fluster them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellFlame Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Because this game can be an esport... its in general speaking for all games and even for swtor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 A quick look at Jes' thread creation history tells the tale. One of his comments. "They have more survivability and mitigation, and yet they hit like trucks compared to Shadows. Just in a game where a Marauder hit for 6.5k...how is that even balanced? Anyone else feel like we're getting hosed in the damage department?: Marauder hit for 6.5k? LOL. You are smoking. No, I am not. I'll screenshot the next one I see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 No, I am not. I'll screenshot the next one I see. I'm sure it was a focus bomb on undergeared targets. In that case, why aren't you complaining about Guardian/Juggs? You're complaining about Shadows being UP? Shadow is one of the best classes for WZ in the game. You really need to L2P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kweassa Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) Not having a dedicated team to back your every move isn't a L2P issue. The point is, to be truly effective, a melee needs support. Whereas, a ranged can find a perch and pick people off and be pretty damned effective doing it. Bullshi*. The balance between ranged and melee is only meaningful when it is viewed under a 1-vs-1 context where the secondary, tertiary, etc.. conditions are fair for both players... and as it turns out, anyone who has just about experience to turn lv50 will quickly realize the so notorious ranged classes aren't particularly difficult to chase down as a melee. (If you really want to see an example of ranged dominating melees, go look at ice mages in wow, and then come and see if melees are imbalanced against ranges in this game. ) The problem you are mentioning has nothing to do with a melee-range balance and is strictly a team composition/tactics issue. I see this problem all the time when enemy forces are comprised of almost all ranged, and when our forces are melee-range balanced. Considering the competitive and capable nature of ranged classes in this game, who they target in what fashion is extremely important, and as it turns out, people who play ranged classes but lack enough experience in PvP hardly really focus fire the important targets. When it's something like all-ranged team of troopers+consulars, its easy to focus fire since when people target the closest enemy and attack, that naturally becomes focus fire. However, a melee-range mixed team needs a certain amount of coordination, and its this people don't get. However, when they do get it right, a lop-sided team of all-ranged classes are simply crushed like a rotten pumpkin. It is this you are experiencing, not a melee-range imbalance. Edited March 4, 2012 by kweassa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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