bionamaster Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 You're wrong, and been proven wrong already once in a different thread. Everything you say is clearly bias because you like the Dark Side for some reason. Nothing you say actually matches up with the EU Lore. In the end, no matter how you try and spin it, the light side won. The Emperor and Vader both failed and Luke saved the Galaxy... How exactly can the dark side be stronger if it keeps losing every single time? Every Sith Empire in the lore has fallen at one point or another, yet the Republic keeps going and going, every time the Sith rise to power the light side Jedi beat them back down again. Finally George Lucas himself has said that the Dark Side is not stronger, so that's pretty much the end of the debate right there. I concur. If the darkside is so vastly powerful, then why: |were the Sith wiped out on Yavin 4? |Did Vader realize the dark side was not the answer and kill Palpatine? |Was the death Star blown up....twice......? |Was Malgus buried underneath half a mountain in the Republic selection screen? |Did the Sith lose pretty much every battle? |Did Anakin lose the duel on Mustafar? |Do the Sith have only two choices of Saber colors, where as Jedi have thousands? I could keep going, but I think you get the point. No offense to our Imperial community, seeing as while the Sith aren't the strongest, they still get pretty cool force lightning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohunMorlish Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 (edited) As stated in the "Book of Sith" - "The Darkside is not more powerful. It burns bright, but quickly burns out." Edited March 10, 2012 by JohunMorlish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamHenry Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 To put this as simply as possible.... The creator of star wars and everything you are talking about is George Lucas. George Lucas says that the dark side is not more powerful. So guess what? It's not more powerful. Creator of the universe beats guy from the internet. You are 90% correct, howerver Lucas's first writing titled "The Star Wars", was a loose remake of Akira Kurosawa's The Hidden Fortress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Haha, Hahaha. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really, the only appropriate response to this is laughter, because it is SO DAMN FUNNY! Thanks for the morning joke, I needed that. This is what happens when you have no argument Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticoccus Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 (edited) The best example of the Darkside being stronger can be seen in this game, Shatela shan the Grand Master of the Jedi Order and perhaps the strongest jedi in THIS era nearly got killed by Darth Malgus in the trailer Returned. She only survived by a saber throw from her MAster and even then Darth Malgus slaughters her MAster and His own by himself ROund two: the trailer HOPE Darth Malgus is blown to hell from a persistant trooper, despite this he severs statela shans saber and nearly kills her. Hes then blown up again and finally defeated but survives. Now Darth Malgus was a powerful Sithlord for sure but pales in comparison to Darth Viatate the Emperor Who crushed and absored a planet of Sithlords and achieved Immortality. IF Darth Malgus has proven to be more powerful than the Greatets Jedi in this era, What comparion can there be when Malgus is nothing to the Most powerful SITH, the Emperor? Thus the Darkside is STONGER. The Darkside IS STRONGER, the only disagreements are from fan boys or players who are mad they choose a jedi. Darth Sion was immortal he could not die in battle, the only way he was defeated was to be convinced to let go of his pain. NO JEDI EVER had such a power. Darth Nihiliuos DEVOURED ENTIRE frackin planets, he devoured thousands of jedi without even needing to draw his lightsaber. he was only defeated for his "connection" or love for his apprentice, in other words his last straw of humanity. He was the Dark Side made manifest. NO JEDI EVER came close to such a power Darth Revan a Jedi Master turned to the Dark Side and became MORE POWERFUL, had he remained a Jedi he would be too weak and indeed the republic would have remained too weak too resist the madalorians or the True Sith Empire. Lastly look at all the fights in the movies, Darth Maul is taken down by TWO jedis, and he kills one Darth Sidious kills three Jedi Masters and draws with Mace although it can be argued he lost its very obvious it was a ruse to turn Anakin to the Dark Side. Count Dooku defeats anakin and obi wan and holds his own againt yoda, It then takes a much more experence obi wan and anakin to beat him and ONLY after anakin used his anger (darkside) to overwhelm him. Quoting Yoda that its more seductive but equal is not accurate as he was a champion of the Light, Had he admited it was stronger Luke would probally just joined his Father and Ruled the Galaxy as Father and Son. Jedi have temptation to go towards the Darkside because ite more powerful, Do Sith Lords have any such temptation to learn from the Light? No because they are more powerful and do not require inferior and weaker arts. The emperor basically consumed the force from the entire Nethema system, the planet just got the worst of it. The Sith lords were just a bonus. Darth Nihilus on the other hand did not even use the dark side, he used the damage dealt to his force connection, more severe than the damage dealt to the Jedi exile because she cut herself off, and because he kept using it, as a force vacuum. You might say that he didn't really use the force at all, he just *ate* it. And every time he used his ability the damage done to him got worse, making the ability more powerful as the wound in the force grew. As for the "anticlimactic battle", the jedi exile was a wound in the force as well, no force for Nihilus to drain means he's as weak as a kitten, compared to if he'd faced someone like the Emperor. Like I said, Nihilus can't draw on the force naturally, he needs to feed on it from another living being and then use what he gets. Thus, the more powerful his opponent is in the force, the stronger he is and the weaker they get, which is in line with what the entire game is about, that a Jedi loses as much from overly relying on the force as she gains. Luke Skywalker, taught by Yoda, also follows that philosophy. Very Weatherwax of him. Edited March 11, 2012 by Morticoccus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 (edited) This is what happens when you have no argument No, this is what happens when you seen an "argument" so laughable that it cannot possibly be serious. Again, thank you for amusing me with such humor! Edited March 11, 2012 by ErikModi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 No, this is what happens when you seen an "argument" so laughable that it cannot possibly be serious. Again, thank you for amusing me with such humor! Except your wrong as usual. Lucas > Yours. Even in the EU: "If Yoda ever turned that way. Sidious himself would be annihilated. The universe had yet to comprehend the kind of evil that a Jedi Knight of nearly nine hundred years could wield... " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Yes, Lucas > than you. Try actually listening to him sometime. You might learn something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 (edited) Except Lucas said the Dark side is stronger. There is no argument. Still waiting for a link to either the print interview or the TV interview where he states that the Dark Side is more powerful than the Light. Bro, if you can't back up your argument, please don't post absolutes like that. I'm with Erik on this. Edited March 11, 2012 by Captain_Zone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 He's been consistently proven wrong over the last 49 pages, yet continues to rehash the same argument in the hopes that this time we'll all bow down before his awesome rightitude. Really, at this point, the topic serves no purpose other than two or three die-hard Dark Siders trying to justify kicking the puppy. In-game, do what you like, play how you like, no one's going to judge. But in the world of Star Wars fiction, Evil loses, Good wins, end of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rashencyberspeed Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I'm ending this. For good. Here's an interview with George Lucas about episode 2, where he discusses the true nature of the force and which side is stronger. http://www.starwarsepisode2.com/star-wars-2-attack-of-the-clones/george-lucas-interview-interviews.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I'm ending this. For good. Here's an interview with George Lucas about episode 2, where he discusses the true nature of the force and which side is stronger. http://www.starwarsepisode2.com/star-wars-2-attack-of-the-clones/george-lucas-interview-interviews.html You know Supershadow is a load of **** right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobStrongo Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Saying that the dark side is stronger than the light is like saying the cold is stronger than the heat. They are balanced perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Still waiting for a link to either the print interview or the TV interview where he states that the Dark Side is more powerful than the Light. Bro, if you can't back up your argument, please don't post absolutes like that. I'm with Erik on this. AOTC commentary Shmi Burial Scene. Erik is in denial, other posters here have already accepted Lucas's words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 AOTC commentary Shmi Burial Scene. Erik is in denial, other posters here have already accepted Lucas's words. And the funny just keeps on coming! Seriously, man, thank you for being so humorous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) And the funny just keeps on coming! Seriously, man, thank you for being so humorous! What exactly is there to misinterpret? "We're cementing his determination to become the most powerful Jedi. The only way you can really do that is to go to the dark side. Because the dark side IS more powerful. If you want the ultimate power, you really have to go to the stronger side which is the dark side. But ultimately, it'll be your undoing." Edited March 12, 2012 by Girdeux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) First, you have continually and consistently been proven wrong, and when people disagree with you, you attack them. Second, you claim "everyone" agrees with you, when in reality, there are THREE posters in this ENTIRE 50 page thread who support your point of view. Everyone else is thinks they are equal, or that the Light is unequivocally stronger. Third, you keep raising the same point, despite it having been disproven backwards, forwards, inside out, upside down, and in every other conceivable manner, yet continue to claim it means something it does not, despite all evidence to the contrary. And then you have the nerve to call people who have systematically taken your argument apart "deluded." I can only conclude that you are being satircal, and deliberately posting such inept attempts at reinforcing a lost argument for the amusement of others. The only other conclusion would construe a personal attack against you, and that is a level to which I will not stoop. Edited March 12, 2012 by ErikModi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 First, you have continually and consistently been proven wrong, and when people disagree with you, you attack them. Second, you claim "everyone" agrees with you, when in reality, there are THREE posters in this ENTIRE 50 page thread who support your point of view. Everyone else is thinks they are equal, or that the Light is unequivocally stronger. Third, you keep raising the same point, despite it having been disproven backwards, forwards, inside out, upside, and in every other conceivable manner, yet continue to claim it means something it does not, despite all evidence to the contrary. And then you have the nerve to call people who have systematically taken your argument apart "deluded." I can only conclude that you are being satircal, and deliberately posting such inept attempts at reinforcing a lost argument for the amusement of others. The only other conclusion would construe a personal attack against you, and that is a level to which I will not stoop. Lucas isnt wrong. You can disagree all you want and talk it over in your own fanon universe along with your buddies. Arguing with the creator of his universe and star wars? rofl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) You're right, Lucas isn't wrong. You're dramatically misinterpreting what he's saying, though, and this has been proven time and time again. You claim Lucas says the Dark Side is stronger. First of all, the bit you're quoting is CLEARLY referring to Anakin's perception, NOT objective truth. The objective truth comes from Lucas himself stating that "Bringing balance to the Force" means DESTROYING THE DARK SIDE. If the Dark Side is destroyed to bring balance to the Force, it CANNOT be more powerful. That is all. Anything else you have to say on the matter is purely your own "fanon universe." Edited March 12, 2012 by ErikModi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 AOTC commentary Shmi Burial Scene. Erik is in denial, other posters here have already accepted Lucas's words. I've watched it, and he specifically says that Anakin PERCEIVES the Dark Side to be stronger. It's quicker and easier, but not stronger. Watch it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayla_Felana Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Erik is in denial, other posters here have already accepted Lucas's words. Just in case you were including me there, I was being sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordZanos Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 You're right, Lucas isn't wrong. You're dramatically misinterpreting what he's saying, though, and this has been proven time and time again. You claim Lucas says the Dark Side is stronger. First of all, the bit you're quoting is CLEARLY referring to Anakin's perception, NOT objective truth. The objective truth comes from Lucas himself stating that "Bringing balance to the Force" means DESTROYING THE DARK SIDE. If the Dark Side is destroyed to bring balance to the Force, it CANNOT be more powerful. That is all. Anything else you have to say on the matter is purely your own "fanon universe." That's mechanically incorrect. If having no (or very few) Sith brings the force in balance with the many jedi, then that technically would mean that the dark side would HAVE to be more powerful. I posted my views earlier in this thread and don't support either side, but the argument presented in this particular post is not entirely logical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oonkeh_ Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Afaik the Dark Side is more powerful in a certain aspect. It grants on demand power; the typical "in exchange for a shorter run in life, you gain more power" bargain. The Light Side, in the long run, is more powerful at the cost of requiring more patience and self-disciplin. This is pretty much self-explainatory lmao. There is a "TL;DR" explaination for it but it's pretty much the same points. It's common sense; why would the Dark Side be more powerful when you cannot retain your own individual will when you die, and why (in the EU, that is) do Dark Siders go to the SW variation of 'Hell'? (The Chaos Realm). The former of what I just said is actually depicted in THIS game, giving elaboration as to why Sith still linger in the physical world in alot of scenarios even after death. It's the Star Wars variation of modern 'paranormal' spiritualism where a troubled, bad spirit is afraid of moving on/needs help moving on and finding their way (because it requires surrendering something. And in this case, very likely passion - the source of a Sith/Dark Siders power). Sith/Dark Siders refuse to die, because it goes without a doubt that they're afraid of losing their power. By doing that, they remain as a Dark Side Ghost. They're bound/clinging to whatever hopes they have of retaining their power, as opposed to Light Sided practitioners who openly accept their fate - which gives you insight as to why you see more Dark Side ghosts than you do light, though the irony encompassing that is that when you see a Light sided ghost they have TEN-TIMES the significance than 99% of Dark Sided ghosts. However, as is iterated and depicted, only light siders can attain a status of true immortality. But this requires ALOT of patience and esoteric knowledge, when they do achieve this state in the force they can, at will, call upon their individual will and affect the world around them with an INFINITE SOURCE (the Force) fueling their existence. This is why I always vouche for Jedi; Sith lost in the beginning. It's in their very nature to lose because they adhere to the primal aspects of instinct, rather than trying to hone and tame them like the Jedi do. The Dark Side, as much as it brings you instant gratifying measures of power, ensures that you wont hold onto it forever. As for alot of people seem to interpret (particularly the younger peers who like Star Wars), 'true immortality' isn't what the Sith Emperor has attained or the state of Abeloth's entity. As long as there's a way to kill you you're not really immortal, and what's more you can't kill Light Sided Spirits (Reference: Abeloth and her consumption of a Jedi Knight. There are dozens of better references than that, in which Sith have tried to vanquish light sided spirits but despite their efforts it was all in vain). You can disembody their spirit but they can simply reform - which is not the case for Dark Sided spirits (if you choose Dark Side for Revan and vanquish the spirit of Ajunta Pall I think it is as an example, you destroy his spirit for good. My view on that? He no longer has the mental strength enough to hold on, it was sapped by Revan killing him. Exar Kun's spirit was also vanquished for good with Luke's help and the new Jedi Order). tl;dr - Dark Side - short run. Light Side - long run. So yes, which is more powerful is up to perspective but as i've elaborated in my post I will always go for the Light - the Dark Side has too many flaws and its BIGGEST of them is the fact it backfires (and most of the Sith that happens to claim such things are incapable of them/believe that so. Arrogance. One such being a perfect example.. the most powerful Sith Lord ever. Darth Sidious). Not just that, but derp.. power in the Dark Side is temporary. That should be enough to sway you from it. I don't know about you, but the word "temporary" should cause contemplation on the spot. If it was possible for Dark Siders to attain ultimate power, there'd be accounts of it in Star Wars. There aren't; only Jedi/the Shamans that taught Qui-Gon etc have attained it. Edited March 12, 2012 by Oonkeh_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juggernautlord Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Light side might win in the book and story line but in this game when Sith outnumber the Jedi in most server, also not to mention the fact when you pick Dark Side points in Hard modes that those boss fights are historically harder I think that the Dark Side is battle hardened Veterans that the Light Side will have to step it up to match us being outnumbered and on the easy path. So I guess if all the Light side buddy's out there you can stick to knowing the Story Line and book will make a warm and fuzzy in your tummy knowing you will always win. But faced up with the real players on here not a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordOfMassacre Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 You have been deceived, as our powers over the Dark Side have blinded you.... So far I have seen the fail argument that Shan was an apprentice when she first fought Darth Malgus thus getting her butt handed to her and nearly slaughtered right then and there were it not for a timely save from her master saber throw justifies her weakness. Heres the deal, Malgus was an appretice when he fought shan as well as evident when he kills his Master, thats right he killed his master so he was apprentice too, also he killed shans master like a dog. Round two, he dominates the fight with her, he cuts her saber in half and has her on her knees stuggling for her life, this is after getting blown up ONCE by a tropper, then shan is SAVED yet again, luckily by the tropper who blows up Malgus AGAIN, and ONLY THEN is she capable of defeating him although not killing him. So yes Darth Malgus is more powerful than shan, he destroyed the whole dam jedi temple and slaughter countless jedi. It also seems the fan boys like to bring up that the Light prevails in the end so that somehow justifies its weakness???? Um, its a cycle. Jedi and Sith take over again and again and this makes story telling possible, that does not signify power. The unnatural powers of the Sith Lords to devour planets, achive immortality ( yes real immortality not just be some dam ghost), slaughter numerous Jedis and corrupt and seduce the Jedi is proof of "Power" Using GL for statements is flawed because he does in fact say the Dark Side is STRONGER, Yes he really does. No you dont need to interprete it or twist it to something else, he says the Dark Side is Stronger. Sidious beat your precious Yoda, he casted him down and laughed. Darth Vader saved your precious Luke, yes luke would have died if a Sith Lord didnt save him, he could not beat the emperor, he was on the ground crying like a baby like most jedi do Count Dooko beat TWO jedi alone and dueled Yoda and held his ground. He fled but guess what he just fought THREE jedi, one Master Yoda none the less and survived untouched. Luke used anger (darkside) to beat Vader Anakin used anger (darkside) to beat dooku Most importantly, the jedi are easily corrupted , seduced by the Power of the Dark Side. This is always the case. Lots of them. How many fiercesome Sith Lords go towards the Light for Power? just as many? half as many? one? two? Two: Revan and Vader both to be redeamed not for power because the Light isnt stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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