Is SWTOR dying?

[kckkryptonite]

Population has definitely dropped on my server as well, there would usually be 180+ people on at peak hours for Repub, it has since dropped by around 50% to 70-90. Should've known better than to play a game that Gabe Amatangelo was involved with.

[Aribethx]

Did someone really try to assume that because a term is popular on the internet it is part of the English language? I'm getting in on this.

 

Wait... wait.

 

 

Cackasauruslulz

 

noun - A chowderhead found mainly on the internets, once thought extinct. Found again somewhere in a galaxy far, far away in the year 2012. Note the bright orange fingers from Cheeto residue and the humplike fatty deposits on each side of its posterior. Known for charging its prey with wild and unpredictable claims and unfounded accusations.

Edited March 2, 2012 by Aribethx

[Sookster]

It's not outlandish. In fact, it's truth.

 

I've played many MMO's since the mid 90's, SWTOR certainly isn't growing fast, infact activity on my server and several others has been reduced dramatically recently. As I said in my previous post, EVE online is about the only game I can think of post WoW that grew at a good rate, even if SWTOR is growing, it's not enough to even notice.

 

My sub ends on March 19, I ended it over a week ago but it was already past renewal period. If 1.2 comes out before March 19 I'll see if it changes my mind or not.

Edited March 2, 2012 by Sookster

[Sookster]

I take it you never played Aion or you'd think biowares customer service is great

 

He's kinda right, pretty much any game EA is involved with are trashy on support, they ban people on Battlefield's battlelog for saying "epeen" and whatnot, they do stupid bans with no care.

Edited April 20, 2012 by LexiCazam
Discussing moderation/old post

[Zhentarion]

Swtor will last for years to come i am a sith only fan but the fact is all in the forum about ppl whining about the game in genaral are ppl who are wow junkies no mater what game comes out they will still play wow and badmouth every game swtor is swtor not wow!

[longgrassgrows]

Swtor will last for years to come i am a sith only fan but the fact is all in the forum about ppl whining about the game in genaral are ppl who are wow junkies no mater what game comes out they will still play wow and badmouth every game swtor is swtor not wow!

 

lol ^this

[Caeliux]

No, you're basing your opinion on, well, your opinion. An opinion that most of the game doesn't share. Most people don't burn through content at the speed the people on these boards do.

 

I have several friends who have never played an MMORPG before who are trying this because it's Star Wars, and absolutely loving it. They're not even near level capped yet because they have lives, and are blissfully ignorant to the rampant tear-jerking going on on these forums packed with laughable trolls, sir. The people like that are going to keep this game alive, alongside the people who actually enjoy it.

 

It's just funny to me that you're projecting your dislike of the game on a massive population of people and assuming that it holds across the board. But I'm the one with my head in the sand.

 

XFire numbers, really? Because so many normal people use XFire. Most people don't even know it exists, and many gamers stopped using it because they didn't care years ago. All XFire numbers tell you is how the overzealous gamer population is faring. The rest of us have phones to keep in touch with our friends.

 

"Elite gamers" are the minority, and that's a good thing. Countries would crumble to pieces in a day if everyone became an "elite gamer", and all basements would have to be outfitted with loading docks where Funyuns and IV Mountain Dew could be emergency shuttled into people's houses because they can't open the door and walk outside to interact with the real world.

 

The writing on the wall says "Get a Hobby". This is the most balanced, enjoyable MMORPG many people have played in its infancy.

 

Guilds always fall apart, friends always leave in the early stages of every MMORPG, especially "online friends" which aren't always as close as you think they are.

 

I don't buy the "This is 2012" argument, when you're expecting an entire industry to ignore all precedent and the complexity involved in creating and deploying a quality MMORPG.

 

The reason games don't launch with the features of a 7-year MMORPG is because it takes SEVEN YEARS to create, test, and deploy that much content- and that's not counting the time it requires for initial development.

 

Like I said, the game is going to vastly improve in the next year, and many of the people who leave will come back when they realize everyone's still playing this one, and it's gotten so much better - just like the people with too much time on their hands did with every other game.

 

I understand that it may not be worth YOUR time and effort. But you're not the Lorax of gaming, and you don't speak for everyone. The dollars EA is raking in do. Don't like TOR? That's fine, go, but stop trying to tell everyone the game is dead when it's a newborn and growing faster than any other MMORPG has.

 

Very well written, and full of knowledge and truth. +1

[Stonewall_Jack]

Swtor will last for years to come i am a sith only fan but the fact is all in the forum about ppl whining about the game in genaral are ppl who are wow junkies no mater what game comes out they will still play wow and badmouth every game swtor is swtor not wow!

 

 

LMAO

 

I never played wow, swtor is my first MMO in this style (Played eve-o a few years back). The end game is bad.

 

There is now no decent way to catch up with a BM, you can earn about 1k (= average) valor per warzone, that is it... First we let players cheat to BM in basically one day, than we reduce it, but for those with a decent server balance the cheaters can be caught up with normal Ilum PvP.... so we kill off Ilum PvP. NOTE: Ilum was working on The Progenitor, I had several large clashes with republic or empire holding the center.

 

FIX: It is boring to be overpowered and it is no fun being underpowered, the gear gaps in PvP should be as small as possible. Centurion/ champion/ BM should not be about better gear, but perhaps about having the options to more looks and more varied relics

 

PvP was bad because of medal farmers or so many whined, so we nerf that, but for many classes and players a lot of medals are gained playing the objective. To satisfy the whiners here you need TEAM BASED PvP.... there is none and all the pvp-ers have left before it even starts.

 

FIX: Rated and team games, this gives the quality people are looking for and still aloows randoms to freely play their medal games in randoms. Increase options do not give on side all and take away from the other crowd. Try and please both.

 

Moment after moment only the worst has been done to "improve" PvP. Like at each stage of a sick person they manage to adminster the wrong drug/ medicine.

 

FIX: Unless you get a proper player feedback system do not implement changes based on rant posts. The whole "bad warzone games" mentality that many have is not due to medals, but more due to missing teh option for organised play. In FP you got your pro servers and pirvate servers to cater both crowds

 

PvP is getting worse because the better PvP-ers have left and I will leave too when my sub runs out. In fact many many players will let their sub run out that took the +2 month package.

 

FIX: A lot more content. I will resub if there will be enough new content to play or interesting PvP and crafting mechanics are implemented. It is perhaps nice to have a cross-server PvP option for warzones.

 

People that got the one day BM you almost never see on anymore. It gets boring when things become easy and the new lvl 50 influx is just not capable to compete and there is no way for a decent 8 man premade.

 

FIX: The gear in PvP is to heavy weight, new 50s are easily crushed which is just as bad as an experience for me as it is for them.

 

From day 1 the market was a dead market with little use and crafting excludes any and all interaction with the community. There are no server forums, there is no decent way to RP with the opposing faction, let alone RP with your own faction. Players can do "4 things" that interact with other players:

 

2 OPS

3 Warzones

FP (to easy, many find uninteresting)

Ilum ( do I need to say more? )

 

Unless you enjoy levelling multiple characters there is not a lot to do and guess what? There are single player games with a lot better missions and stories out that will only require you to pay 1 time. The personal story lines are not that great compared to many solo player games and the bounty hunter STILL has no decent ending.

 

Tanks in this game have no mitigation in PvP… ok fine we understand but our dps and our energy system are tied into our tanking stats/ mechanics, none of it works without procs. No dps and no tanking it ruins chances at decent 1v1, the only people you can take on are the bad players.

 

FIX: Give shield specialized players a chance to proc their damage and energy based skills.

 

The only decent change they have implemented is the DOT objectives for warzone. They fix carbonize only to break it again one patch later (if you use it often you will see it does not always work). So once more we can do the one thing we are all here for and that is bug report. There is more bug reporting than endgame content.

 

FIX: There needs to be better communication or a better management for the DEV team. there is no reason for old bugs to come back into the game.

 

I wanted this game to work, it is my first MMO, but the multiplayer concept is completely broken. Costumer support has been non existant, but this is to be expected from a Bioware game.

 

WHY: A harsh statement, but a lot of the Mass Effect 2 DLC was not properly working and some of it never ever was patched even excluding several regions from DLC, because it did not work for their region or lacked the content. So ME2 patching/ support never impressed me

 

Maybe one day I come back after my sub has run out. The first bits of levelling was fun and the game isn´t a bad game, but it just is not great and it just is not a proper multiplayer game yet.

Edited March 3, 2012 by Stonewall_Jack

[Jagerinho]

LMAO

 

I never played wow, swtor is my first MMO in this style (Played eve-o a few years back). The end game is bad.

 

There is now no way to catch up with BM, you can earn about 1k valor per warzone, that is it... First we let players cheat to BM in basically one day, than we reduce it, but for those with a decent server balance the cheaters can be caught up with normal Ilum PvP.... so we kill off Ilum PvP.

 

PvP was bad because of medal farmers or so many whined, so we nerf that, but for many classes and players a lot of medals are gained playing the objective. To satisfy the whiners here you need TEAM BASED PvP.... there is none and all the pvp-ers have left before it even starts.

 

Moment after moment only the worst has been done to "improve" PvP. Like at each stage of a sick person they manage to adminster the wrong drug/ medicine.

 

PvP is getting worse because the better PvP-ers have left and I will leave too when my sub runs out. In fact many many players will let their sub run out that took the +2 month package.

 

People that got the one day BM you almost never see on anymore. It gets boring when things become easy and the new lvl 50 influx is just not capable to compete and there is no way for a decent 8 man premade.

 

From day 1 the market was a dead market with little use and crafting excludes any and all interaction with the community. There are no server forums, there is no decent way to RP with the opposing faction, let alone RP with your own faction. Players can do 3 thins that interact with other players:

 

2 OPS

3 Warzones

FP (to easy, many find uninteresting)

Ilum ( do I need to say more? )

 

Unless you enjoy levelling multiple characters there is not a lot to do and guess what? There are single player games with a lot better missions and stories out that will only require you to pay 1 time. The personal story lines are not that great and the bounty hunter STILL has no decent ending, by now they need to give a compensation.

 

Tanks in this game have no mitigation in PvP… ok fine we understand but FFS our dps our energy system is all tied into our tanking stats none of it works without procs. No dps and no tanking it ruins chances at decent 1v1, the only people you can take on are the bad players.

 

The only decent change they have implemented is the DOT objectives for warzone. They fix carbonize only to break it again one patch later (if you use it often you will see it does not always work). So once more we can do the one thing we are all here for and that is bug report. There is more bug reporting than endgame content.

I wanted this game to work, my first MMO, but the multiplayer concept is completely broken. Costumer support has been non existant, but this is to be expected from a Bioware game. Bug resolving is very slow paced with even broken content and no updates are given on the bugs they work on. Some bugs get fixed only to come back 1 patch later, which shows that the development team has very poor management.

 

Maybe one day I come back, the first bits of levelling was fun and the game isn´t a bad game, but it just is not great and it just is not a proper multiplayer game.

 

Didn't bother reading the rest of your posts, but the bolded underlined bit has been addressed in patch 1.1.5. They are increase the valor gain significantly. can walk away with atleast 2K valor per WZ soon.

 

edit- medals are also being addressed in the next patch. you stop getting valor after 4 medals, but you get 500 valor per medal.

Edited March 3, 2012 by Jagerinho

[Stonewall_Jack]

Maybe it is bugged for me only, but I got 9 medals spread over objective, protection, dps and kills and the warzone wins, but only 1025 valor. 1025 has been my max since the last patch win or lose 1025...

 

For most without great gear and multiple PvP sets like me. 1000 valor used to be the best average to get out of a warzone and I doubt the average is now at 2k and so far I am now no longer able to go beyond the 1025.

 

There are multiple calculations to be found on the forums and even the very optimistic ones puts you on hours (days) of warzones to get from 50 to 60.

 

Here is a gist for you 2000 valor average. 10min warzone average (exlcuding the warzone waiting times, which would push this one way up) 250k from 50 to 60 assuming you can play this game 8 hours a day would put you on 3 days. Alas things are never this good, no the turth is an average of 20min per warzone and roughly a 7min waiting time 27. The average valor from warzones is 1000 valor and most people get maybe 4 hours done.

 

Doing that puts you on 28 days of your average gaming for 4 hours a day each day. This one here can tell you that it took 31- 33 warzones (bit of count mismatch) and 22 warzone wins to level up from 55 to 56.

 

Fact is PvP has gotten poor, the people who I play against and the people on my random team. Server stats says we're still one of the more active servers for the EU: The Progenitor.

Edited March 3, 2012 by Stonewall_Jack

[nakoda]

Ultimately I believe the downfall of BioWare here is that EA is in the back pulling strings and/or sitting on the chest full of gold coins.

 

this.

[nakoda]

swtor is swtor not wow!

 

of course not.

 

that is why it was more important for BW to get that JINX! apparel ready for sale than to add in a functional combat log.

 

or macros.

 

or a moveable ui.

 

or a consistent tab target.

 

or any other of the minor implements that EVERY MMO HAS HAD SINCE EQ.

 

One of the major problems here is that SWTOR seems to be a developmental REGRESSION rather than a progression.

 

Oh right, they have a unique system for Dialogue? K, thanks, but dialogue a compelling scene does not make. Even Aristotle (someone whom the PHD holding owners of BW must be familiar with and who is still the most fruitful theorist of dramatic effect) said that it is action which drives the compelling drama, not dialogue.

 

people want to PLAY the game, not watch it. That is the intrinsic difference between film and video games. Anyone else remember Xenosaga? 24 hours of video, 3 hours of play time?

 

i am also particularly fond of how blatant the carbon copy of classes is between factions is. At least you guys changed the names of the abilities.

Edited March 3, 2012 by nakoda

[KalTorrak]

Game is going down hill, more and more people leaving, know it from the forums, the numbers on my 3 servers I play on even my brother (his real life friends he plays with across the other side of the world) and my real life ones have all stopped, I'm the only one still playing, I've been through 3 guilds since release cause they all just stopped logging on, didn't leave just stopped (I still speak to some on skype and just say its boring or bugs or well you know the rest)

 

I wanted this game to be so damn good and sucessful, can I see that happening? No not really, they chose the game to run on a ****** engine since EA rushed them they couldn't make it themselves (not really an excuse after 10 years making it though) the game is client side (really *** were you thinking, any coder knows this is a huge mistake and just bad) so hakes are all out and working (invisible people planting bombs on doors in voidstar, speed hacks etc) the engine cant even deal with the game thats why so many people have FPS issues (if you are reading this and do not good for you, most people still do and its not a case of old computers or underpowered ones) no end gameplay, terrible balance the list goes on.

 

And yeah all this you can sum on to a "new mmo" but really? They have had longer than ANY MMO in development stages so they should NOT be having this many issues, I almost play every mmo out there seriously and have not run into such a BUGGY MMO on launch, WoW (and I hate wow FYI) had SOME server issues and were fixed within TWO weeks, AND refunded anyone having issues with free game time (something Bioware needs to learn, CUSTOMER SERVICE also) so many write up's here saying the same thing , different forums, or in game or out it doesn't matter, most people that cannot see this do not do the game justice, Bioware needs to realise these issues to fix them, the fan boys that think the game is perfect are just shooting themselves in the foot turning a blind eye to all these obvious problems.

 

At the end of the day I'm extremely sad, I don't wanna rag on BW for making such a failure of a game (there are extremely good points about the game like its awesome storyline) but once you have got past that, why would u want to repeat the same stuff over and over? The unique storyline of each character is about 5% of the rest of the 95% repeatable quest boring bs. I hope they catch on soon cause after I bought my collectors edition (yes I was looking forward to it that much) and paid for the 2nd month I'm already over it and wanted this to be the LAST thing, was hoping to play this for a longggg time just do not see it happening in its current form.

[Nazguapo]

of course not.

 

that is why it was more important for BW to get that JINX! apparel ready for sale than to add in a functional combat log.

 

or macros.

 

or a moveable ui.

 

or a consistent tab target.

 

or any other of the minor implements that EVERY MMO HAS HAD SINCE EQ.

 

One of the major problems here is that SWTOR seems to be a developmental REGRESSION rather than a progression.

 

Right, because the guys that work on code all day were even remotely involved in THAT. In fact, it's highly unlikely that ANYONE on the development team was involved.

 

Obvious troll is obvious.

[Dawginole]

this.

 

this. is dumb. EA has $3.8 billion sitting in their bank and employs 7,800 people. Those are not the marks of a company that screws up. A company as good as EA, that has been around as long as them, and who has seen the repeated success they have seen is going to now and then have a major hick up. And I'm sure there's some random product that you two would point to that sucked and then you'd want to tell us that the company and everything they do is a failure because of it. That's just not accurate.

[Dawginole]

Over the last week I've noticed Rep Fleet numbers have doubled in prime time.

 

Due to the fact that so many in this thread determined the game was dying because of reduced fleet numbers, I will now determine the game is growing because of increased fleet numbers. I have just as much evidence.

Edited March 3, 2012 by Dawginole

[nakoda]

this. is dumb. EA has $3.8 billion sitting in their bank and employs 7,800 people. Those are not the marks of a company that screws up. A company as good as EA, that has been around as long as them, and who has seen the repeated success they have seen is going to now and then have a major hick up. And I'm sure there's some random product that you two would point to that sucked and then you'd want to tell us that the company and everything they do is a failure because of it. That's just not accurate.

 

I never said they screwed up. What I was "thissing" was that EA does have a history of dipping their fingers into the work of their subsidiaries (pulling the strings, as it were, from the post I quoted) so as to "make them more profitable" so to speak. From EA's perspective, everything is running according to plan, I was not disputing this. But thank you for your repetition.

 

Perhaps EA/BW intended for everyone to just level up 8 or more level 50 toons while they tried to make more content, hoping that this might keep people's interest long enough to release an expansion.

 

EA does not "release" products that suck. It does not mean they do not have companies making games that suck. EA simply has money, game designers they are not. You are confusing their role in this little drama.

[Ignitous]

some things can bleed a long time without dying...

[nakoda]

Right, because the guys that work on code all day were even remotely involved in THAT. In fact, it's highly unlikely that ANYONE on the development team was involved.

 

Obvious troll is obvious.

 

right, because the parallels between WOW at the end of its life and TOR at the beginning of its life are actually just made up by myself.

 

my point was that bioware has tried all too hard to pull in as many wow fans as they could, and have obviously sunk resources (money and programmers are resources, remember, and can be looked at like numbers on a balance sheet) into promotion that could have gone in to adding in BASIC MMO FEATURES like a combat log, macros, etc etc.

 

I apologize that my lack of paragraph structure led you to think I was trolling, I can see where the meaning of my message may have been misconstrued

 

Furthermore, the comment that mmo development is regressive perhaps ought to be clarified.

 

The current cultural conception of the MMO is the EQ template. There are obviously many different styles of MMO out there, but within this template staple features like those mentioned above are were ignored or forgotten about in favor of special features like dialogue systems.

 

It is clear that more resources went in to making the dialogue system than went in to the actual foundational structures of the MMO which is clearly a reskinning of vanilla wow, indicated by the carbon copy of classes across factions. (I do not agree with the counter arguments that this carbon copy is intended to produce balanced pvp. it is either laziness or lack of resources that led to such an alarming uniformity of the classes in this game).

 

edit: the point here, for clarity, is that these features are in wow, and every eq template before it, but not this one. since technology improves over time (the gaming industry being a major impetus for the rapid development of increasingly powerful technologies), it seems odd that as time goes on, these games which are essentially the same as one another, are losing features rather than gaining them

 

for my part, i am not suggesting that tor is dying, but that tor has certainly dropped the ball in numerous ways.

Edited March 4, 2012 by nakoda

[Winteria]

See you online tomorrow bro ...

 

Nah sry.. uninstalled many weeks ago ... I wasnt trolling.. just that I paid for 3 months awww... what a mistake

[hurriedcorgi]

I've already begun applying for other beta's and considering other available options to spend my time on. I can't quantitatively support this argument but I would say it would be hard to claim that the server I play on is any where near as full as it was. I would argue that it is "practically" empty now.

[Winteria]

I dont think this game deserve a monthly fee. I will pay, if the gameplay is great, the pvp is real fun and the support, development and updates deserve 15$ from my wallet each and every months !

 

Do you guys knew the monthly fee was implanted to cover the servers and bandwidth upkeep at first ?

The cost of internet connection for large servers base was huge many years ago...

Now its a habit to pay for mmos, no one ask if its right or not...

 

The good old FREE gameplay is coming back soon !

 

And btw, give 200 millions budget to other gamings developers... They would create something 100 times better than Bioware did with swtor, for sure )

[nakoda]

And btw, give 200 millions budget to other gamings developers... They would create something 100 times better than Bioware did with swtor, for sure )

 

i dunno... tor has some purdy textures...

[Seanimus]

free to play in 1 year tops

 

 

lol

[Panzerbase]

200 million dollars and an IP made of legends and the best we can get is a WoW clone, and not a good one at that? Come one man, we all know the ball was dropped here.