Sith Warrior PVP - Is it really as bad as I'm hearing?

[Dracosz]

I play an advanced prototype BH, which means that I am more melee centered than my alternative specs. Repeatedly in fights I need to walk close to get retractable blade up, rocket punches, shoulder slam, flame burst, and flamethrower. Most of my fighting is done from about 10 meters or less with the exception of a couple abilities which I dont gain a whole lot of damage with due to my spec.

 

My friend is playing a Sith Warrior and we have been doing some warzones. He is the straight DPS spec with dual wielding (I dont know names, sorry) and has been complaining about feeling useless when it comes to doing just about anything in PVP. From my experiences as AP BH, there are tons of utilities and such to make everything manageable whether it be kiting, escaping, CC removal, CC immunity, CCing players, etc. I have a set of abilities that allow me to, when used properly, play very efficiently with little to handicap my play. Do Sith Warriors lack abilities like these? Or do you get them from going down the PVP focused DPS spec? My friend tells me that it "wouldnt make a difference" but to me, there is a difference between a spec that was built around PVP versus one that wasnt, and I think he's wrong.

 

Anyways, is the above true? Is the Sith Warrior PVP spec as useless as it sounds? Because it seems very similar to the Warrior class on WoW which was a great PVP class if you knew how to use it properly.

 

It's all in the gear, once you have it it'll feel much better.

[Mmathaiss]

Marauders take awhile to come into their own. Until you get your top level talents you are pretty gimped. The big defensive cooldowns you also get in the later levels. But once you have all your tools you can really become a pain to kill. I play carnage spec and really enjoy it. It is more like a dance than the typical button mashing.

[Aragorrius]

Playing well and Timing well are really a must...

 

For example Undying Rage.. Timing this right is essential to fights with multiple adversaries..

 

Same goes for Camouflage usage, but sinple things like Deadly Saber and Rotation are extremely important for a Marauder...

 

You can't just bash some buttons and hope it works out..

 

[Xblackheart]

There is an issue with melee in general, and perhaps with Juggernaut in particular, I don't know. Facing and targeting seem very slow versus ranged classes, and I'm calling anything over 4m ranged.

 

Maybe it's just my system (or your friends) but half the time you think you are hitting a target they aren't where the client says they are and you aren't doing any damage. The other half of the time you get a "you are not facing the target message" when you are looking at right where the client says the target is.

 

They are supposedly working on fixes for this problem, which affects different people to varying degrees.

 

Until then I shelved my juggernaut and rolled an operative. That way the up close lag won't affect me as badly.

 

Maybe your friend has the same problem, maybe he doesn't.

[kirorx]

Sith Warrior is Awesome in pvp. I have juggy rage he is fun to play as.

[TheNightmare]

Think warrior in WoW but simple enough that it's learnable without macros. Warrior in WoW without macros was 10x harder to do well on than Marauder Imo. As long as you mouse turn, are good with keybinds, and have decent reflexes you can be extremely successful as a Marauder. I can't speak much for Jugg, I actually heard their dps specs were squishier. Less defensive cds for sure.

 

Warrior in WoW was far more simple... No matter which spec you chose in WoW as a warrior you only really had maybe 4 primary attacks, two gap closers, an interrupt, and maybe 3 situational abilities. Hot keys for consumables and cooldowns to be done with a macro. At level 30 killing mobs questing or pvping I already have twice the hot keys I did while doing end game heroic raids in WoW.

[Traxiss]

i am not sure when other marauder say they are on the top 3 on the leader boards on my server marauders are high on the boards but rarely make the top 3 spots.as a rank 57 in full champ gear i rarely get within the top 5 spots.i can take most classes 1vs1 but i despise troopers and smugglers and i rarely beat those.my main complaint are those classes that have 2-3 Cc abilities to my 1 break free,another thing i hate is huttball,marauders have no skills to use the hazzards to thier advantange.what i really hate tho is when you get chain knocked off the platforms,kocked off 1 time,sure i can live with that.i run around force charge up again only to be knocked down again. to counter knock backs and yanks i can think of 2 things

1) when you get knocked back or yanked it lowers the cooldown on force charge with an upgrade in a skill tree that knock back or yank instantly refreshes force charge

2) when you get knocked back or yank you are immune to knock back or yank for 15 seconds.this immunity also effects the friendly yanks

[Xargyn]

This is a rather depressing thread. A whole bunch of people saying "Wait until you're geared, then it gets fun." WoW. I thought bolstering was supposed to counter that sort of thing. But instead, the consensus seems to be that you have to grind up a bunch of PvP "levels" before it becomes fun. This is giving me WoW flashbacks. Edited February 29, 2012 by Xargyn

[jhnnybgood]

Do you expect to take down Battlemasters once you hit 50? There has to be a gap, otherwise where's the sense of accomplishment?

[Rami__]

As a jugg SW I'm quite happy with my PVP abilities (class wise, shan't judge my own).

 

If any of the PVP areas show a jugg's potential it's Huttball. You should not be carrying in most cases but support the carrier instead. A lot hinges on knowing when to use abilities and obviously cooldowns. You have a force push, 2 individual stuns and an AOE stun, 2 taunts, guard, a health boost and 2 CD damage reductions. On attack you can pave the way and interrupt oncoming players/interrupt casts. Inexperienced players waste their abilities on the first few hostiles they see, target the appropriate ones and you help the carrier to the line. Especially before burners the opposing team tries to rush the carrier and dps them down, I've lost count how many times I've gotten 2/3 medals through guard/intercede/mass taunt combinations and finish with intimidating roar just before the burner turns off as it will give some time to your carrier.

 

In other areas, such as civil war you're more of a damage soak. On voidstar I will generally hang a little back at first, see who the opposing team primaries and guard/intercede as needed. It's satisfying when the enemy team has to swap targets and wasted 10 seconds of DPS. Medals are a no-brainer in this role, granted I don't get the 150k medal a lot but what do you expect.

[lolcthulhu]

Marauder is all about how you play it in my opinion. Its about juggling cooldowns, being aware of EVERYONE engaging you (especially those pesky sorcs and snipers whom you should always be ready to line of sight if you need to) and picking targets. You have to manage cooldowns, buffs, and most importantly your position in combat. I think marauder, when played properly and with a healer, can be the most effective classes in this game. You ARE a tank in pvp so remember that you will be focused as such. I dont know how many people look at their "Damage taken" stat, but mine is usually the highest on the team unless we have a tank spec assassin or jugg.

 

Heres a look at some numbers marauder CAN do when played properly with some help from your team.

 

http://i44.tinypic.com/mixsi.jpg

 

Marauders may not get as many medals as juggernauts but they can definitely be a helpful part of any team on any warzone map!

 

p.s. There was a post somewhere in here saying that marauder was bad at huttball? 2 charges, 20% damage reduction, 50% defense chance increase, 25% force damage taken reduction, 50% movement speed boost(with +10% defense on top of that), invincibility for 5 seconds, and an AoE stun to boot. Not to mention stealth for your getaway after you score. Don't waste your cooldowns and you are one hell of a ball handler.

[miliways]

OP, you're talking about Marauder.

 

And yes, Marauder is super weak in PvP pre level 50.

 

Up until level 40, you simply do not have the abilities you need to stay alive and remain viable. PvP as a Mara pre 40 is an exercise in patience and frustration. You'll never come close to topping the charts.

 

Up to 50, it gets better. Then in the 50 bracket, you're back to the bottom, until you really master your class and get geared.

 

When you get really geared, Marauder becomes pretty amazing in pvp if you play it REALLY well.

 

But its the hardest class to play right, and isn't very viable until totally endgame.

[HBninjaX]

I agree that gear shouldn't give that big of an advantage, a game should be skill based. Some extra perks are nice but it shouldn't be like squashing a bug when you face an undergeared person. Anyway, I realize how the game is and I am making due within its parameters.

 

Your friend plays a marauder no doubt. If you guys pvp a lot tell him to spec annihilation with 2/2 in phantom 2/2 in ferocity and he'll feel way more useful in say huttball for example.

[Jeriodus]

It's tough. I've seen awsome Marauders (the class I play), but it takes a lot of skill compared to a Merc or Sorcerer. I'm not at that level.

 

The main problem in my mind is Ranged classes are always > than Melee in most MMOs. The ability to to gain distance with the number of CCs and Knockbacks ranged classes get in this game gives them a greater advantage over melee.

 

But you have to know your class. As a marauder I have to hunt with a group, or a healer. We are too weak for the amount of damage we put out... Sorcs are always tough to fight seeing as they two CCs, a root, and that 4k shield, plus the ability to DPS like crazy. Overload, the instant knockback doesn't help either. Each CC has at least a 1 min CD, were the SW CC break has a two minute CD. If you spec Anni. you can have two CC breaks through the use of Force Cloak. Personally I believe that force cloak should have a base CC break, but have a 1 min. CD instead of a 45 sec. one.

 

Right now SW have a tough time closing distance, but do decent in PvP. They seem to be more geared to be PvE characters with the amount of damage they put out.

[lolcthulhu]

We are too weak for the amount of damage we put out... Sorcs are always tough to fight

 

this made me lol

 

if theres any class SW is a hard counter for its sorc

[Vepyr]

OP, you're talking about Marauder.

 

And yes, Marauder is super weak in PvP pre level 50.

 

Up until level 40, you simply do not have the abilities you need to stay alive and remain viable. PvP as a Mara pre 40 is an exercise in patience and frustration. You'll never come close to topping the charts.

 

Up to 50, it gets better. Then in the 50 bracket, you're back to the bottom, until you really master your class and get geared.

 

When you get really geared, Marauder becomes pretty amazing in pvp if you play it REALLY well.

 

But its the hardest class to play right, and isn't very viable until totally endgame.

 

Rofl, my level 35 Anni Spec'd Mara who hit 200K on 4 straight WZ's and topped the dmg for all players in same WZ's last night would like to contend your statement. Rage and Carnage might have problems, Anni does not.

 

Edit: And i've been pulling numbers with him like that since lvl 25.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Vepyr

[Furyofwar]

I have broken 600k damage done on Voidstar with both Rage spec Marauder and Annihilation Marauder. Both are good specs. Annihilation is a little bit harder to kill easier to be kited an has better group buffs. Rage is more aoe damage more slows an really hard to kite.

 

Both have a different play style. Warriors are not weak but if you plan on being a very good pvper you will need to keybind 37 buttons.

 

Keep in mind I have 5 pieces of centurion gear an rest is champion gear on this alt.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Furyofwar

[Furyofwar]

Rofl, my level 35 Anni Spec'd Mara who hit 200K on 4 straight WZ's and topped the dmg for all players in same WZ's last night would like to contend your statement. Rage and Carnage might have problems, Anni does not.

 

Edit: And i've been pulling numbers with him like that since lvl 25.

 

You should be using rage pre 50 if you want to do more damage. While leveling I was averaging per war zone 300-500dmg done. I only leveled with war zones and class quest.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Furyofwar

[Jeriodus]

this made me lol

 

if theres any class SW is a hard counter for its sorc

 

The thing that makes sorcs tough is that 4k shield... I don't know how many times I popped a 3k+ smash on one and it was all absorbed. Then add the multiple CCs, plus ranged DPS and a bit of healing.

[devyne]

Lol ok i had to reply because it was getting sad what was going on here.

 

For your information warriors and assasins are easily the most useful in huttbal(assasins/ops are prime in voidstar also) and juggernauts,(cant speak for mara's) can basiclly win a game singlehandedly with a pocket healer.

 

i have a 50 juggernaut 50 bountyhunter and 23 or 24 assains, lol forgot what level he is. but anyway im in full champion gear on my juggernaut and as regspec i can pretty much win any huttbal with a good healer UNLESS the other team has a tank with 2-3 pocket healers like a guild run. i beileve juggs are a bit more burstier but in 1v1 maras are definatly better and maras tear through healers like butter.

 

Also jugg pve dps is pretty much useless. mara on the other hand is like 3rd best dps. but thats offtopic.

 

Summary: Juggernauts probably more useful then maras in most warzones although maras have there strengths and do a TON more pve damage. No there not useless ur friend just fails at playing a mara there not that difficult to play but they are more difficult then some other classes.

 

just remembered to put this up if u have a pocket healer as a jug grab the ball pop saberward jump DOWN to the enemy floor thing under the fire and force jump up/aoe cc for an easy cap. Please dont nerf juggernauts because of this =(

[Tattum]

Something is seriously wrong with all of you that say SW suck at pvp..

 

i`m Juggernaut and there are only like 1-2 classes i have problem to kill on 1v1... (i`m Rage spec, if I were immortal, those would get down easily but some others would cause troubles)...

 

I have no idea what are you talking about when you say its useless for pvp . i`m usually 1st/2nd in objectives AND medals in every warzone I play.

 

You just SUCK, thats the answer you are looking for .. most of you complaining about classes (not just SW) are in disadvantage, you all start with debuff you cannot get rid of - its called stupidity.. and for those of you that have it , i`m really sorry...

 

/vinddex out ..