Heretiq Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I like time saving tools too! But not if they hinder my game experience. You're only looking at the one aspect of it. That's the problem. Not that you want it or think it will be a good thing, there's nothing wrong with that. It's more the saying just about anything against it is wrong that is the problem. Again, i'm not for or against. But my opinions don't blind me to what will happen if it comes. Ok - listen, friend. I'm just going to quote myself here because I don't feel like typing it again and again and again. I know both and every side of the medal. And I still want a Cross-Server LFG-Tool. I did all that - I used the LFG-channel, the /who-list, I sent whispers to people. I did all that back in the day when I played Classic and TBC WoW. And, to be honest, it was nothing but a pain in the a*s, eventhough I had a raiding guild and a full friends list. I don't ever want to have to do that again in order to find a group. I'm sick and tired of it. It's an outdated way of doing things. It was not fun, it did not give me the feeling of being a part of a community or a sense of accomplishment. The only thing it did is waste my time. I won't walk to work for 3 hours instead of driving for 45 minutes. Like I said. Go ahead and live in the stone age if you want - I don't care. I will just use my convenient quality of life tool in order to save time. I was there - before and after the tool was implemented. The community stayed the same. The tool just made it a bit harder to gain an individual reputation on your specific server. It didn't touch guild reputations however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Are you really suggesting it's peoples faults for being on a low pop server, is that really what your argument has come to? Btw I'm on harbinger probably the highest pop server. And the majority don't use it just like if the majority don't want a cross server tool they wont use it, thank you for agreeing with me? Who's fault is it if you choose to stay on a low pop server? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 What does it tell you that you can't sell LFD on its benefits and instead have to go full inquisitor mode to route out heresy and force a consensus? You cannot sell someone on something they've had to deal with before, and didn't like the results the first time. Besides, there's no point in trying to sell anyone on anything with regards to what the devs decide to implement because they will implement whatever they want regardless. It should be fairly obvious to anyone with a functioning brain that LFD is a breeding ground for griefers and ninjas since they depend on being grouped with random people. Shhh, don't tell them, they don't want to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkcerb Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Seems to me the only ones who can claim the title of victim are the ones who do not want cross server lfg because its you who are trying to impose your wants over theirs. "Sadly you can't see it" Our completely optional wants, yes. I feel like we've had this talk before...oh that's right you just keep coming back with the exact same argument to every single post. Is there some compelling reason I should continue to respond? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ispanolfw Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Ok - listen, friend. I'm just going to quote myself here because I don't feel like typing it again and again and again. I know both and every side of the medal. And I still want a Cross-Server LFG-Tool. I was there - before and after the tool was implemented. The community stayed the same. The tool just made it a bit harder to gain an individual reputation on your specific server. It didn't touch guild reputations however. I was there before and after, I saw the community plummet on both servers I played on. You wanting is fine. Claiming majority without proof, saying the cons are miniscule(someone else said this, not you afaik), is however, not fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deewe Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) 1006 ibl. Edited February 14, 2012 by Deewe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heretiq Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Who's fault is it if you choose to stay on a low pop server? He just said that he's playing on a high population server but whatever ... So people who play on lowly populated servers are just sh*t out of luck? Because that's not an answer I'm going to take or accept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ispanolfw Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 "Sadly you can't see it" Our completely optional wants, yes. I feel like we've had this talk before...oh that's right you just keep coming back with the exact same argument to every single post. Is there some compelling reason I should continue to respond? And you STILL use optional to rationalize it. Yes it's optional, that still doesn't change that it will affect some people negatively, just like it will affect others positively. Being optional doesn't change that. In fact if it WAS mandatory, that would likely help you more, since the people who refuse to use it would likely leave the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 1006 ibl. That's rather.....random. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) "Sadly you can't see it" Our completely optional wants, yes. I feel like we've had this talk before...oh that's right you just keep coming back with the exact same argument to every single post. Is there some compelling reason I should continue to respond? This game doesn't have a cross server lfg and people don't want it. You want it. Why is your want more important than theirs. You have never answered that....yes you did. You want it and that all you care about. You said it a few pages back. Edited February 14, 2012 by Amiracle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uruare Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Then you obviously haven't read my posts. I'm not even here arguing against the tool. I'm arguing against people who don't look at things from all sides. Refusing to accept real cons because they disagree with them. Claiming majority without anything to back it up. And then claiming due to majority the minority can just shut up and go away and deal with it. This can apply to both sides of the LFG "debate" I just see more Pro behaving this way than the other side. How many times shall I pretend this debate doesn't have a foregone conclusion, garson? Do you honestly believe there is any purpose to pretending that the stated interest of the devs in implementing some kind of PVE LFG tool isn't going to lead to such a thing existing? That they're not going to follow the popular and successful trend in the industry? That this debate hasn't already raged across half a dozen different game forums with the same outcome every single time? No, I'm not going to pretend this is a new debate like there's any new and game-changing information on the table; there isn't. It's the same tired hash from the last pile of times it happened. And yet, those of us that have seen it come and go, come and go, come and go, come and go, come and go and then come and go with the same blah dee blah followed by the same conclusion in the end are supposed to ...what? How many times shall we look at all sides of this and hrm-hrgh very gravely amongst ourselves before we finally accept the simple fact that there's no particularly good reason for Bioware to -avoid- implementing a cross-server tool. Is there some hilarious belief somewhere 'round here that Bioware and EA's stock index value will increase if they -don't- cater to the time and time again proven majorities? Do ya think every single MMO house that's put such a tool forth did -less- research and put -less- thought into the matter than CrumBum the Third on a forum that doesn't like it because he -thinks it will be bad-? So, no, I can't definitively prove with a magic number that we're the majority. Similarly, I can't definitively prove gravity either. However, please, look for your proof in what a growing number of popular MMO titles have done and are doing or have stated plans to do. Then throw an orange off a balcony. You'll have all the proof we're ever going to get of those numbers and of gravity in one fell swoop. On second thought, keep the orange. No sense wasting a good snack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkcerb Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Shhh, don't tell them, they don't want to know. According to you, my own experiences have always been far more positive then negative. As I've said countless times I must be the luckiest person on the planet judging from this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ispanolfw Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 That's rather.....random. Think he means the thread is about to hit the cap and get remade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
souloferdrick Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 You cannot sell someone on something they've had to deal with before, and didn't like the results the first time. Besides, there's no point in trying to sell anyone on anything with regards to what the devs decide to implement because they will implement whatever they want regardless. Agreed, the argument is moot since we all know its coming but Im just using the opportunity to show how the lames operate. Anyone truly interested in building a real community or communities would understand that an LFD tool works directly counter to those interests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 "Sadly you can't see it" Our completely optional wants, yes. I feel like we've had this talk before...oh that's right you just keep coming back with the exact same argument to every single post. Is there some compelling reason I should continue to respond? LFD tools end up not being optional because people using the tool will not want to lose their place in the queue to get into a group you are trying to put together manually. Especially DPS who tend to have really long queues due to a low number of tanks and healers, mostly tanks though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkcerb Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 This game doesn't have a cross server lfg and people don't want it. You want it. Why is your want more important than theirs. You have never answered that....yes you did. You want it and that all you care about. You said it a few pages back. According to you. I disagree I say people do want it. And even if they don't, I do and so I ask for it, I've never hidden the fact that I want the lfg tool to make my own gaming experience better that it'll help low pop servers and those with different times to the servers prime time is just icing on the cake. It is on bioware whether to make the tool cross server or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heretiq Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 How many times shall I pretend this debate doesn't have a foregone conclusion, garson? Do you honestly believe there is any purpose to pretending that the stated interest of the devs in implementing some kind of PVE LFG tool isn't going to lead to such a thing existing? That they're not going to follow the popular and successful trend in the industry? That this debate hasn't already raged across half a dozen different game forums with the same outcome every single time? No, I'm not going to pretend this is a new debate like there's any new and game-changing information on the table; there isn't. It's the same tired hash from the last pile of times it happened. And yet, those of us that have seen it come and go, come and go, come and go, come and go, come and go and then come and go with the same blah dee blah followed by the same conclusion in the end are supposed to ...what? How many times shall we look at all sides of this and hrm-hrgh very gravely amongst ourselves before we finally accept the simple fact that there's no particularly good reason for Bioware to -avoid- implementing a cross-server tool. Is there some hilarious belief somewhere 'round here that Bioware and EA's stock index value will increase if they -don't- cater to the time and time again proven majorities? Do ya think every single MMO house that's put such a tool forth did -less- research and put -less- thought into the matter than CrumBum the Third on a forum that doesn't like it because he -thinks it will be bad-? So, no, I can't definitively prove with a magic number that we're the majority. Similarly, I can't definitively prove gravity either. However, please, look for your proof in what a growing number of popular MMO titles have done and are doing or have stated plans to do. Then throw an orange off a balcony. You'll have all the proof we're ever going to get of those numbers and of gravity in one fell swoop. On second thought, keep the orange. No sense wasting a good snack. +1 for the Shae avatar and a good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 According to you, my own experiences have always been far more positive then negative. As I've said countless times I must be the luckiest person on the planet judging from this thread. You're quoting the wrong person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ispanolfw Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 How many times shall I pretend this debate doesn't have a foregone conclusion, garson? Do you honestly believe there is any purpose to pretending that the stated interest of the devs in implementing some kind of PVE LFG tool isn't going to lead to such a thing existing? That they're not going to follow the popular and successful trend in the industry? That this debate hasn't already raged across half a dozen different game forums with the same outcome every single time? No, I'm not going to pretend this is a new debate like there's any new and game-changing information on the table; there isn't. It's the same tired hash from the last pile of times it happened. And yet, those of us that have seen it come and go, come and go, come and go, come and go, come and go and then come and go with the same blah dee blah followed by the same conclusion in the end are supposed to ...what? How many times shall we look at all sides of this and hrm-hrgh very gravely amongst ourselves before we finally accept the simple fact that there's no particularly good reason for Bioware to -avoid- implementing a cross-server tool. Is there some hilarious belief somewhere 'round here that Bioware and EA's stock index value will increase if they -don't- cater to the time and time again proven majorities? Do ya think every single MMO house that's put such a tool forth did -less- research and put -less- thought into the matter than CrumBum the Third on a forum that doesn't like it because he -thinks it will be bad-? So, no, I can't definitively prove with a magic number that we're the majority. Similarly, I can't definitively prove gravity either. However, please, look for your proof in what a growing number of popular MMO titles have done and are doing or have stated plans to do. Then throw an orange off a balcony. You'll have all the proof we're ever going to get of those numbers and of gravity in one fell swoop. On second thought, keep the orange. No sense wasting a good snack. See that's the thing, they haven't said cross server is coming for a fact, only that it's being considered. If they put it in, fine, if they don't, fine. I'm just sick of people thinking their opinion is the correct one and that opposing it, especially because it's optional and the Devs are going to do it "anyways". My problem isn't with when it comes, if at all. My problem is with fanatics(Yes fanatics, because religious groups do this too) that push away any opinion contrary to theirs because they're "miniscule" or "you're the minority" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkcerb Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 You're quoting the wrong person. You're agreeing with him correct? then no I'm not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Think he means the thread is about to hit the cap and get remade. That would be such a shame considering no one's actually said anything new in the last 100 pages of this thread + the other countless threads on the subject. I guess will get to rehash the same points in another 100+ page thread where no one listens to anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umbral Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 People will start skipping content more and more, and soon, devs won't care that much about content anymore.People are skipping content now. As in cancelling their subscriptions because of the pain getting a group is. A cross-server LFG tool will actually allow players to see more content, because people will be able to que while questing, gathering, etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Agreed, the argument is moot since we all know its coming but Im just using the opportunity to show how the lames operate. Anyone truly interested in building a real community or communities would understand that an LFD tool works directly counter to those interests. This is just not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 You're agreeing with him correct? then no I'm not. I was making a humorous statement, and you should be quoting him, not me. As I said, you quoted the wrong person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
souloferdrick Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 that it'll help low pop servers and those with different times to the servers prime time is just icing on the cake. Thats the theory. Too bad theory and practice are miles apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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