krameriffic Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 This is a non issue if the loot rules are set up correctly and still has nothing to so with the LFD. My post has less to do with the loot problem and more with the notion of accountability and social responsibility associated with existing on the same persistent game server as the other people you are grouping with. That's where the vaunted sense of "community" supposedly arises from according to the anti-LFD people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakamp Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 If Bioware released the game with less servers, an improved method of finding groups in the server and an increase in group size to 6 with 4 dps this game would be really great atm. Instead, we have to spend our time trying to figure out what's really best for the community when the metrics we have for discussion are limited at best. On one side we have the anti-LFD who get yelled at for wanting to defend our communities and on the other side we have people who are being told "It's your fault for getting *****, you shouldn't of rolled on that server" EDIT: couldn't of Bioware foreseen these issues and done something better in advance instead of having us yelling at each other? This entire issue has divided the community and put serious damage to it u forget how much time PCs queued in 1st launch week? because too few server, so BW/EA increase servers, now another serious problem comes out with that action, why? because the basic game design is wrong, BW should put different zones into diff servers, not like now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyDale Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) All I gotta say is thanks, back to needing on everything. I can't wait to see all the people who are happy about this come cry that someone needed on something they wanted. Ans that whole thread those folks wasted hashing out this needing stuff, now I can agree to their rules and still need what I want. Not likely to see them again ever. What could be better. I have a guild and now I can treat PUGS anyway I like. Chton, I frequently see posts on these forums complaining about people needing on gear they shoudn't have right now. I've even seen posters justifying it. One even said he feels he can need on any orange he wants because it is "modded gear" and the mods can be removed so the stats dont' matter lol... Point being this happens anyway. Greedy players are not created by LFG tools. That's the bottom line. Dealing with rude/selfish people is just a fact of life when dealing with other people. But anyways...this avoids the main point. And that is if you feel groups formed through a LFG tool is too risky, then simply don't use it. Problem solved. But players like me who don't mind the risks and prefer it to sitting on the fleet bored out of minds shouldn't be denied the option. Edited February 13, 2012 by JeremyDale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krameriffic Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) Also the reason why they expanded the tool to raids and are allowing cross server friend grouping. The tool is just amazing for what it does. People standing in /fleet just yell at each other, it's causing more problems then building of said community Ultimately, what all of these features are moving towards in WoW is the dissolution of server lines dividing players. The game is getting closer and closer to the point that anybody on the NA server cluster can play significant content with anybody else. But we wouldn't want the anti-LFD people to realize that these innovations actually have the potential to vastly EXPAND the community of an MMO, not destroy it. They want to keep living in a fantasy world where Bioware isn't constantly missepping and they aren't willfully ignoring it. Edited February 13, 2012 by krameriffic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyDale Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) People standing in /fleet just yell at each other, it's causing more problems then building of said community Exactly this. If anything is bad for this so-called "community" it's having a bunch of bored and frustrated players all in one place venting their annoyance and taking it out on each other lol Edited February 13, 2012 by JeremyDale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyDale Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Ultimately, what all of these features are moving towards in WoW is the dissolution of server lines dividing players. The game is getting closer and closer to the point that anybody on the NA server cluster can play significant content with anybody else. But we wouldn't want the anti-LFD people to realize that these innovations actually have the potential to vastly EXPAND the community of an MMO, not destroy it. They want to keep living in a fantasy world where Bioware isn't constantly missepping and they aren't willfully ignoring it. Nice post Krammeriffic. I never thought of it like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reevax Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Ultimately, what all of these features are moving towards in WoW is the dissolution of server lines dividing players. The game is getting closer and closer to the point that anybody on the NA server cluster can play significant content with anybody else. But we wouldn't want the anti-LFD people to realize that these innovations actually have the potential to vastly EXPAND the community of an MMO, not destroy it. Anti-LFD = Anti-WoW and thats all it comes down to. People have this irrational hate for another video game and if that game has it they don't want it here. People will quit over lack of access to the game content but no one quits over too much access. LK to Cata is a perfect example of this. No one quit WoW because they could get groups, they quit because raiding got too hard core and they could not join. The LFR is proof of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) Ultimately, what all of these features are moving towards in WoW is the dissolution of server lines dividing players. The game is getting closer and closer to the point that anybody on the NA server cluster can play significant content with anybody else. But we wouldn't want the anti-LFD people to realize that these innovations actually have the potential to vastly EXPAND the community of an MMO, not destroy it. They want to keep living in a fantasy world where Bioware isn't constantly missepping and they aren't willfully ignoring it. I have friends in WoW who I group with on different servers, It's amazing cause I don't have the time to level alts on 3-5 servers. Helps me socalize EDIT: I sometimes think of the issue as people trying to prevent woman from booking learning and being able to vote. Looking at the bigger issue really helps uncloud issues. Edited February 13, 2012 by Touchbass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I have friends in WoW who I group with on different servers, It's amazing cause I don't have the time to level alts on 3-5 servers. Helps me socalize Fan of WoW or not, you can't deny Blizzard is truly innovative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Fan of WoW or not, you can't deny Blizzard is truly innovative. I don't get why people harp on WoW, it's like shooting yourself in the foot. Without WoW you wouldn't of had the big influx of money into this game and it wouldn't be as good as it was at launch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MalignX Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I don't get why people harp on WoW, it's like shooting yourself in the foot. Without WoW you wouldn't of had the big influx of money into this game and it wouldn't be as good as it was at launch. I've moved well passed awe and irritation, and now I am just baffled by some of these Anti-LFG/Cross-Server arguments. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpuax Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Fan of WoW or not, you can't deny Blizzard is truly innovative. For coming up with a que system? Like tons of lobby style games haven't done that before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyDale Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) I'm one of the biggest boosters for a X-LFD but we need to admit the tool isn't as optional as we let us think it is. The tool is so good and effective that 90% of players will use it leaving almost no one outside of guilds to form pick up groups manually. What usually happens is the people who get groups quickly on high population servers have to spam as if they are on a low population server and freak out. It'll be ironic when we tell the high population server people to use the /who function, travel to planets or get a guild if they want a server group. I get what you are saying but not sure I agree. It still seems completely optional to me. Players who want to stick to only grouping with players on their own server are still free to do so - and I don't see why the presence of a cross-server LFG system would cause players to turn down party invites from people just because they happen to be on their server. For example: just because I was in a queue for a flashpoint using the LFG system if someone from my server was to ask me if I wanted to join their group I would most likely leave my queue and go join them. I don't see why I wouldn't, unless I knew them and hated them or something lol Edited February 13, 2012 by JeremyDale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFirewind Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) I'm honestly not sure why they don't just merge servers really. The only thing I have against Cross Server PvP/LFG tools is it makes reputations meaningless really. Build up a reputation as being great at your class on your server? Expect that to go away. In server only you can have great Guild vs Guild fights in Warzones but without it there's really no point in trying to make a name for yourself as you're just going to be "just another [class]" to the people you group with. This is most notable in WoW reallyin both PvP and PvE. Then there's also all the the loot ninja and people trying to enforce their own looting rules on others. This was rampant in Rift where it was very likely that you would have three people from the same guild need on every item and then trade them among themselves to guarantee that they the gear they want while you are left with nothing. The one biggest issue however is that it just turns the game world into one big over glorified lobby really. WoW ended up that way and Rift is quickly on it's way to end up like that. I really don't want to see another MMO I enjoy got the same way. Edited February 13, 2012 by IronFirewind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) For coming up with a que system? Like tons of lobby style games haven't done that before. You're 2 years behind what Blizzard's doing. Go catch up and see what features they've added for grouping. Here's a hint: You can now manually invite ANYONE from ANY server to your dungeon group or raid. Edited February 13, 2012 by Caelrie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpuax Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 You're 2 years behind what Blizzard's doing. Go catch up and see what features they've added for grouping. Here's a hint: You can now manually invite ANYONE from ANY server to your dungeon group or raid. Oh wow! you can invite people manually? amazing innovation, I have never been able to invite people manually before. No different than say, every FPS game out there. Except instead of sitting outside the game in que you can sit inside the game in que. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 You're 2 years behind what Blizzard's doing. Go catch up and see what features they've added for grouping. Here's a hint: You can now manually invite ANYONE from ANY server to your dungeon group or raid. Honestly if Blizzard released this stuff 5 years ago, the game would be much better shape now (not that the 10 ton gorilla is in bad shape) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamok Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) I say no to LFG Cross Server pvp whise, and pve whise. There are enough people that are complete tools on my own server, I don't need some other servers garbage dumped on my game time. If you want to add this horrible, horrible thing on to the game, the I suggest you make it 1-49 only, 1. No Ops 2. No Hard Modes 3. No lvl 50 stuff The Cross Server system help wow in one big way, old instances became available to more people, but at 80, most times you get two people spamming each other on how their mom looks like a tauran, and how each others epeen is greater then theres. which kills my gamming also, what didn't help matters was gear score, but thats another issue. Edited February 13, 2012 by Yamok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkcerb Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Oh wow! you can invite people manually? amazing innovation, I have never been able to invite people manually before. No different than say, every FPS game out there. Except instead of sitting outside the game in que you can sit inside the game in que. Did you read that or just the first few words? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyDale Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) opposition to LFG tool is basically PvE heroes who are afraid the scrubs will have the phat lewts. It is a primal human emotion. People who attain some kind of "status" want to preserve it at the expense of others. Small-minded *********** with a napoleon complex. A LFD tool will make "server community" even more important...you can be uber pro and run Hardmode Raids with your uber pro friends. The scrubs will run the "EZ mode" endgame and get a sense of progression....whats wrong with that? Small ***** syndrome is a real scourge in gaming, specifically MMOs. lol I agree with your assessment. I think that's a lot of what is going on here too, and I love your vulgar in-your-face kind way of putting it too Quite effective ^^ Hopefully it won't get deleted. The moderators on this forum are prudish sometimes. Anyways I better get to bed.... Edited February 13, 2012 by JeremyDale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Oh wow! you can invite people manually? amazing innovation, I have never been able to invite people manually before. No different than say, every FPS game out there. Except instead of sitting outside the game in que you can sit inside the game in que. Can't have a conversation if you can't understand what we're all talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I get what you are saying but not sure I agree. It still seems completely optional to me. Players who want to stick to only grouping with players on their own server are still free to do so - and I don't see why the presence of a cross-server LFG system would cause players to turn down party invites from people just because they happen to be on their server. For example: just because I was in a queue for a flashpoint using the LFG system if someone from my server was to ask me if I wanted to join their group I would most likely leave my queue and go join them. I don't see why I wouldn't, unless I knew them and hated them or something lol It just makes it more difficult, I'm trying to be more understanding of the other side as it promotes dialogue. People can still get groups manually, just more difficult is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpuax Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Can't have a conversation if you can't understand what we're all talking about. We are talking about a LFG tool, then you said blizzard was innovative. Which leads a logical person to believe the blizzard is innovative for their LFG tool. What are you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romiz Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I am disappointed to see the cross realm LFG tool being talked about as a future addition to the game. I was really hoping to keep that out of TOR just because of it's ability to destroy community in a game. I would be all for LFG server wide but cross realm is a no go for me. Sorry OP but read the answers of the week. It is coming in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 We are talking about a LFG tool, then you said blizzard was innovative. Which leads a logical person to believe the blizzard is innovative for their LFG tool. What are you talking about? My ability to group with my friends on Mal'ganis from my home server isn't innovative? Semantics aside of course ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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