The good old days when people had to work for gear

[Twor]

If you have been part of the insane rank grind in the early WoW days, you surely would not ever want that back. 14 hours a day of Premade grinding for R14 over 2 weeks. And than you had to hope that no other Premade was pushing someone...

 

Brrrrr....

Edited February 7, 2012 by Twor

[Tharrn]

Not to play whose got it harder, but na I didn't play blade, I played EVE Online, where you lose everything you own in one death.I go running missions an ratting for 2 weeks to afford 3 Carriers for our next OP. Then I lose them an have to do it again unless I qualify for ship replacement.

UO was about speed hack an warp hack, nothing more, great game without those two idiotic things.

 

Reminds me of our little group right after EVE launched. There was no insurance back then and we had mined for weeks to get our little group from frigs via cruisers into battleships. And then on our first 0.0 roam we got creamed by a gang of pirates. Well, at least we still had the cruisers to start mining again

 

Gear is actually all MMOs have to offer at endgame these days. It's really mindnumbing and boring. Wish some AAA developer would dare to go sandbox with a proper economy, territorial warfare and politics in a 3rd person game.

[JediDuckling]

Remember the good old days of Vanilla Wow and EQ when you actually had to work for the gear you earned. And you were HAPPY to do so!

 

Remember farming countless hours of Alterac Valley turning in Wolf Pelts for reputation so you could, hopefully, a few weeks or a month or 2 down the road have a cool epic weapon!

LOBO!

 

And the gear meant something!

 

It wasn't something that people complained about and demanded.

 

Remember the good old days when you first reached max level in your class, you got roflstomped in PVP by players that rightfully outgeared you.

 

And you wouldnt complain once. It was understood. You were a newb and needed to get gear. MMO's aren't fair. And thats why you play them. to gear up and be better than those around you.

 

Where did all this sense of entitlement come into play?

 

Its ridiculous guys.

 

Everyone expects free handouts these days.

 

the people that already have there battlemaster gear are the ones that got it before they nerfed the bags and was getting 3 peices out of each bag. now they have their full battlemaster egar they dont want other getting there gear just as easy, this is because they want to be ubber while everyone else has to grind there gear out to get to there lvl.

 

 

the upcoming change with the bag system is needed as bioware clearly stated in swtor gear will not be a grind fest to aquire.

[BegaTasty]

Reminds me of our little group right after EVE launched. There was no insurance back then and we had mined for weeks to get our little group from frigs via cruisers into battleships. And then on our first 0.0 roam we got creamed by a gang of pirates. Well, at least we still had the cruisers to start mining again

 

Gear is actually all MMOs have to offer at endgame these days. It's really mindnumbing and boring. Wish some AAA developer would dare to go sandbox with a proper economy, territorial warfare and politics in a 3rd person game.

 

yer mate I agree, Vanguard was last one to bring back the good old days, sadly the devs were just out of their league, or it would have been an amazing game.I loved the inter clan rivalry in VG. Hell in rift an tor games people report you for spying an selling out their guild. Can you imagine what tor players would do if they were subject to EVE's political system. LOL

 

I generally tell my IMP mates where the reps are in tor an the IMP's dont care... they just ignore it because world pvp doesn't give shinys so they say it isnt worth it.

[Mrs_Murder]

This is why I quit WoW during TBC; getting items/purples was just too easy -- catered to the crying kids.

 

/ex-rank 13 druid with AQ40 mace (exalted before we even started raiding) and exalted with AV for the healing offhand..

[Khri]

This one actually makes me raise an eyebrow because those games didn't have large amounts of CC because they didn't have the tech or code to even do most of what we take for granted in MMOs these days.

 

And I remember those days it wasn't knocks that were the issue in those games, it was perma stun locks. UO days you had mages that would paralyze and explode people necessitating overly complex macro loops to just keep from being perma locked. Or in the Ren era the spear users that just chain paralyzed you or any dexer really, especially axers.

 

I mean really, rose tinted glasses are fine and all, but reality CC has been apart of MMOs since the beginning. Technology has advanced and new forms of CC have now entered the arena that those games were just incapable of handling.

 

 

I never had a macro loop. Just a macro to pop a pouch any time I was paralyzed from a mage. Bound to a key. Whether I was on my mage or my melee. Anyone with bags, which was every decent pvper, didn't get paralyzed any longer then it took to hit their macro.

 

At one point my melee was a spear user. It didn't proc 100%, It has been a long time, but I don't think it was even 50% proc rate. My melee toon was every type of weapon user at one point or another, other then an axer. Axer's didn't do a paralyze, but they were certainly OP for a while.

 

TSL hosted a tournament at one point. On my melee character, I made it to the final round. At the time I used a sword, and a shield. He got lucky and procced on his axe twice in a row, while I failed to proc my shield twice in a row.. I lost. If that hadn''t of happened, I would of won otherwise. It was a very good tournament, everyone had fun. Pretty sure their was a lot less QQ in pvp back then. Of course it was great you could constantly change your skills to meet changes in skills.

 

Their was definitely a community to the game. You knew your opponents, people had reputations. Even guilds had history. When I feel nostalgic, it's UO I feel the most for. Not that I would ever go back and play it, other then on a private shard. Which isn't all that much fun...since their usually seems to be a core group of people that gets free goodies from the admins.

[JediDuckling]

i strongly reccomend BIOWARE not to make easier the gearing up.

 

let them go to WOW.

 

ppl all round the world are looking for some challenge..and not some WOWish crap.

 

i realy dont want to spend a a week just to get 1 peice of gear. the players that only play about 2 hours if that per day are gonna be put off by the people grinding the hell out of warzones spending 24/7 on the game. not everyone can sit there doing that all day.

 

also bioware specificly said swtor will not be a gear grind fest and opens up for the casual players.

 

the challenge here is beating the players to win to gte more comms and valor that is the

is the challenge and you cant do that without gear.

[Asnine]

The thing is, the general player base for MMO's have changed.

 

Whereas before you had people who could play for 5,6 hours every day, you now have people who have jobs and healthy social lives that also happen to play MMO's. I would wager a large amount of money that there are more people who play 1-2 hours a day (or less) rather than the people that play for more than that. Thus, for a company's own self-interest, they *should* be catering to the larger population.

 

TL;DR, Get a life, step outside and enjoy it instead of sitting in front of a computer screen thinking you "earned" something when you pay as much as everyone else.

[Cridhe]

The good old days when you have to have skill, not just gear to win at PvP.

 

RIP pre-Atlantis DAoC

[Carthoo]

Not to play whose got it harder, but na I didn't play blade, I played EVE Online, where you lose everything you own in one death.I go running missions an ratting for 2 weeks to afford 3 Carriers for our next OP. Then I lose them an have to do it again unless I qualify for ship replacement.

UO was about speed hack an warp hack, nothing more, great game without those two idiotic things.

 

Yeah - but i played coz of roleplay (never came back and never will, new game simply doesnt help it) and of PvP on servers where warphack, speedhack and even injection were restricted - full ban when we (i was a gm later) found it - and we had our ways to find out.

 

And EVE too is great game, but you never loose everything, if youre not dumb enough to put all money into one ship or fly without a clone.

 

I wonder why devs forget how it all started and do not encourage players to focus on adrenalin, skill dependant game where you got not much to earn and much to loose in few seconds.

 

 

M&B: Warband is a middleage sandbox simulator (strategy/ rpg/ action) where you fight with middleage weps, shield, ranged weps, horses etc - and its the moment you unleash the attack, in which direction and when you hold it and attack from other side...; if you have the highground or not; if you have the fast horse or armoured one....all PvP ********es here should watch it and learn what skill means...

[theskydiver]

Remember in darkfall when...wait doubt anyone does because no one wanted to play an amazing full loot game. *sigh*

[Silverspar]

I never had a macro loop. Just a macro to pop a pouch any time I was paralyzed from a mage. Bound to a key. Whether I was on my mage or my melee. Anyone with bags, which was every decent pvper, didn't get paralyzed any longer then it took to hit their macro.

Yes, and when you ran out of bags, which was easy to do if the mage was smart, you were hosed. Really, the only people capable of permanently avoiding that were other mages that made a macro loop to pop a pouch and recast trap.

 

At one point my melee was a spear user. It didn't proc 100%, It has been a long time, but I don't think it was even 50% proc rate. My melee toon was every type of weapon user at one point or another, other then an axer. Axer's didn't do a paralyze, but they were certainly OP for a while.

The proc rate was 80% until they made it based off anatomy for a while, then it ranged but since most dexers had anatomy this became a moot issue as well.

 

TSL hosted a tournament at one point. On my melee character, I made it to the final round. At the time I used a sword, and a shield. He got lucky and procced on his axe twice in a row, while I failed to proc my shield twice in a row.. I lost. If that hadn''t of happened, I would of won otherwise. It was a very good tournament, everyone had fun. Pretty sure their was a lot less QQ in pvp back then. Of course it was great you could constantly change your skills to meet changes in skills.

QQ was thick even back then. Again, rose tinted glasses.

 

Their was definitely a community to the game. You knew your opponents, people had reputations. Even guilds had history. When I feel nostalgic, it's UO I feel the most for. Not that I would ever go back and play it, other then on a private shard. Which isn't all that much fun...since their usually seems to be a core group of people that gets free goodies from the admins.

 

Yes, UO had a community. It was nice, but the community revolved around cliquish areas. The only ones that were actually in the breath and width were the crafters. I know I was a blacksmith that hung out at the brit forge to repair broken gear when I wasn't out hunting reds. Don't get me wrong, I still miss the old UO community feel, though what it's become now makes me cringe anytime I pop over to the stratics forums.

Edited February 7, 2012 by Silverspar

[BegaTasty]

Remember in darkfall when...wait doubt anyone does because no one wanted to play an amazing full loot game. *sigh*

 

LOl I played Darkfall, your so called "pvp game where everyone ran round naked in groups an killed solo's for their crappy newbe weapons then spammed race hate an death threats because that low level was unable to kill 20 naked idiots. Not to mention they all used speed hack.

 

What I think is missing now, is not only community (there is no community anymore, at least not one you'd ever want your kids near)...... Also the fact there's no more PK/Anti wars.

 

Remember when the PK's an Anti's hated each other with a real passion ?. We killed each other on sight (I was a PK). The playerbase today have no idea of what a true community is, an sadly never will. You cant have a community that isn't feral angst hate an filth based when you mix teens an older players together. We have a couple of "Aryan warriors" on Swiftsure.... real teen wakamoles but they spew so much hate you have to turn off the chat. an Bioware are too afraid to ban anyone it seems.

Edited February 7, 2012 by BegaTasty

[Aragiel]

Remember in AC where gear meant very little.

 

When a skilled player could take on multiple, better geared, and high level players and win.

 

Remember when PVP didn't consist of endless CC spam, and when you actually had control of your character the majority of the time? (best way to remove player skill from PVP - remove the players ability to do anything).

 

And when PVP wasn't in some never ending shoebox sized minigame grind, but in the MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER world. Back when guild politics meant something. When guilds would fight over for control of towns and leveling spots. Back when PVP had meaning. When your actions had consequences.

 

Back when the skill ceiling was high, when you could dodge projectiles, spells, etc... none of this autohoming crap we have today.

 

You know, does anyone remember back in the days when PVP was actually good?

 

 

I SUPPORT THIS !! strongly.. good old times

[BegaTasty]

I SUPPORT THIS !! strongly.. good old times

 

"Blood, now there's a person with a burning need for a lobotomy" heh

[Silverspar]

Remember in darkfall when...wait doubt anyone does because no one wanted to play an amazing full loot game. *sigh*

 

Darkfall, the incredibly sucky PvP game that tried to emulate classic UO but failed on so many levels that everyone lambasted the incompetence of its developers, especially given the fact the game was tooting how it was going to be the next UO and UO killer back since 2000 and it took the game over 8 years to even get to a beta and delivered a product that was barely above Shadowbane?

Edited February 7, 2012 by Silverspar

[BegaTasty]

Darkfall, the incredibly sucky PvP game that tried to emulate classic UO but failed on so many levels that everyone lambasted the incompetence of its developers, especially given the fact the game was tooting how it was going to be the next UO and UO killer back since 2000 and it took the game over 8 years to even get to a beta and delivered a product that was barely above Shadowbane?

 

yer, that darkfall....

[griiphon]

MMO's aren't fair. And thats why you play them.

 

actually, i play them, cause i enjoy playing them, not cause i think they aint fair

[Roak]

lmao

 

the good old days where when people pvp'd in crafted gear, or gear looted off the corpse of another player

 

the good old days, you young 'uns.

[Tic-]

Are you asking me if i enjoyed the "good 'ol days" when to have good PvP gear i had to raid?

 

errr, no.

 

Go back a bit farther when i could craft my own valorite gear, and stomp you with it.. those were the "good ol days".

[WaywardOne]

First - the valor grind to get BM in this game is not a joke (on a server with an inactive or pointless Ilum, that is). You have to play for a long time. Many of us have been conditioned/trained by other games to play for a long time so it may not seem that long but... it is.

 

AC1's Darktide server was an experience and a half. I liked the pvp:

Spend 6 min buffing (at any given time you would need 20-50 spells on and many of the spells cost half your mana or something like that), fight for 8 min, spend the next 6 min buffing - if you get jumped in town without buffs you're dead since no guards anywhere. So most ran around town with buffs up... But those buffs cost a lot and you had to spend a lot of time in a town somewhere just buying components.

 

And while AC1 was all about mastering godmode movement exploits and speed hacks (devs were too slow to fix them - godmode was in there for at least 3 months without a public word from them - I had to leave), I do miss the lack of CCs. CC-spam in Wow is bad enough but SWTOR's is at least 3x worse. I can't imagine who it's "fun" for except those on the outside looking at everyone getting knocked around, stunned, mezzed, flailing on the ground, choked and chain-snared. When I walk away from this game, remembering the CC nightmare will remind me not to look back.

Edited February 7, 2012 by WaywardOne

[Silverspar]

Are you asking me if i enjoyed the "good 'ol days" when to have good PvP gear i had to raid?

 

errr, no.

 

Go back a bit farther when i could craft my own valorite gear, and stomp you with it.. those were the "good ol days".

 

Umm, you must be referring to a much later date, because if you were wearing valorite you were just a fun target to kill with an overly expensive piece of useless armor. I don't know how many valorite sets I collected off nubs who ran into PvP expecting it to be better than standard armor. Metals didn't get an improvement till around, what was it, Update 16 or was it 18? So long ago.

[Silverspar]

First - the valor grind to get BM in this game is not a joke (on a server with an inactive or pointless Ilum, that is). You have to play for a long time. Many of us have been conditioned/trained by other games to play for a long time so it may not seem that long but... it is.

 

AC1's Darktide server was an experience and a half. I liked the pvp:

Spend 6 min buffing (at any given time you would need 20-50 spells on and many of the spells cost half your mana or something like that), fight for 8 min, spend the next 6 min buffing - if you get jumped in town without buffs you're dead since no guards anywhere. So most ran around town with buffs up... But those buffs cost a lot and you had to spend a lot of time in a town somewhere just buying components.

 

And while AC1 was all about mastering godmode movement exploits and speed hacks (devs were too slow to fix them - godmode was in there for at least 3 months without a public word from them - I had to leave), I do miss the lack of CCs. CC-spam in Wow is bad enough but SWTOR's is at least 3x worse. I can't imagine who it's "fun" for except those on the outside looking at everyone getting knocked around, stunned, mezzed, flailing on the ground, choked and chain-snared. When I walk away from this game, remembering the CC nightmare will remind me not to look back.

 

CC nightmare isn't as bad as people make it out to be. In fact it's not much worse than WoW's is.

[TheGremli]

the good old days when you have to have skill, not just gear to win at pvp.

 

Rip pre-atlantis daoc

 

 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

!!!this!!!

 

Nothing like ripping into a furby, good times.

Edited February 7, 2012 by TheGremli

[Tic-]

Umm, you must be referring to a much later date, because if you were wearing valorite you were just a fun target to kill with an overly expensive piece of useless armor. I don't know how many valorite sets I collected off nubs who ran into PvP expecting it to be better than standard armor. Metals didn't get an improvement till around, what was it, Update 16 or was it 18? So long ago.

 

Valorite was just a color, stats didnt mean much on crafted gear. So if i had regular iron ingots, valorite ingots, or the black ingots, when i crafted, and wore it, i still had the same armor on.

 

Colored ore came in a bit later, yes, but it was just a color

Edited February 7, 2012 by Tic-