Are Sith really evil?

[SNCommand]

After having read Book of the Sith I can safely say that by the standards of human society they are evil, so evil it's probably no surprise it literally seeps out of their bodies

[RemyDMartin]

You are on your way young apprentice.

 

Now let me explain a few things to you.

 

1. Jedi choose to give up love when they join the order. They accept the monk lifestyle. The celibacy is a part. It is not a matter of they HAVE TO. There is a choice, many jedi leave the order "retire" if you will and create a family. In fact Luke did this. Leia is an example of a person who never even trained in the order but in fact had children

one which actually saves the entire galaxy and another which almost destroys it by following in his uncles foot steps and joining the dark side in attempt to use the power to save a loved one

so in fact be careful as to not fall for your own propaganda leaving all sexual desires (which often manifests in the guise of "love") is in fact a choice you must make in order to become a jedi.

 

2. An evil the jedi have that is not needed in the sith empire is brain washing. The reason Anikin was so easily converted was in fact due to Yoda and Mace Wendu initial concern when speaking with Qui-Gon Jinn about th reason they voted against training anikin. "he is too old". The Jedi find young-lings around the galaxy usually from Coruscant and then immediately send them to the academy to be trained taking them away from everything including their own parents Bastilia from KOTOR comes to mind. I mean, this is a seriously cult type thing...however we must understand why they do this. It is also the best/only way to guarantee purity. There was a philosopher plato who wrote many things but one thing he wrote about was the "pure democracy" in which you take a child from birth and lock them in a room so that all they know is the room and then you teach them logic and rationalism. This child will be the TRUTH. This in fact is how I can see the jedi counsel defending their "ways".

 

3. The Sith Code says it all. "Peace is a lie there is only passion".

 

4. For there is nothing either good nor bad but thinking has made it so. Hamlet Scene 2 Act 2.

 

The reason I dispise the jedi is they hoard their knowledge as opposed to sharing it. They know the true secrets of the force but they hide it from us. Why? Because they are afraid of it's power...

 

just saying...

 

Then again, I am sith. And I am fully aware of my intentions and ability to manipulate. I am also fully aware of this thing my mentor once told me "Manipulations got a bad wrap;what's wrong with getting what you want?"

 

Jedi vs. Sith is kind of like Gang Wars in a way...nobody remembers exactly how it stared but they sure as hell have their reasons for continuing the battle.

 

Always remember Palpatines rule number 2,

 

"destroy after reading"

 

-Remy D

[Darth_Eminok]

See. This is why I always like how everyone was portrayed in Kotor 2. The fact that there wasn't really any "Good guys" made the story much more interesting. Granted, the sith were pretty evil, besides Darth Traya, but the jedi were depicted as castrating and dogmatic. Basically how an actual society with power would act. Clinging to their codes even as the galaxy died around them.

 

Maybe it's just me, but as far as i'm concerned the whole black/white thing makes for entertaining sunday cartoons, but not for well thought out, introspective story-telling.

 

Just my two cents. And for the record, I don't care what g-canon is, I will continue to RP my sith in shades of grey, just like Keira would've wanted.

 

You seem to forget that Kreia was really making you follow a dark path, not a grey path.

 

So I did what she said.... and everyone died.

[owenthorn]

sith and jedi are the same, two sides of the same coin, they are no better than each other

[Nordicmania]

Yes they are. Sith are sadistic and show no mercy. They feed their anger to gain power and attempt using shortcuts, no matter what will be destroyed while using it.

 

They also use the force for selfish acts and are reaching for world domination. They dont care about peace, they are not afraid to destroy someone to gain what they want. They love war.

 

And you all know the sith code.

[masterkoto]

Without reading the whole thread, I just give you my thoughts:

 

Sith are not evil, they just follow the dark side, which is the path of self-destruction, while gaining lots of power in a short time.

They use strong emotions like fear, anger and hate to make themselves stronger but these emotions need to be feet permanently to stay strong. Because of this, they will destroy themselves in sooner or later because it costs more and more energy.

Yes Sith know love, but as best example Anakin: they fear for the loss, they make themselves depended to the person they love and if they lose that person they can't deal with all the frustration leading to more fear, anger and hate.

 

 

Jedi follow the light side, the path of strength, courage, peace. If they understand what makes a Jedi a Jedi, then they don't try to hold their feelings back, but deal with it in a way that is not self destructing, like i.e. Yoga exercises do as well. A true Jedi knows fear, anger and hate but has known to handle it and still do the right thing.

Jedi Masters often try their Padawans to not to get in contact with love because this feeling is most difficult to handle and there is a great danger that they give themselves in a dependency like I mentioned above. It's that kind of dependency the Jedi don't want, so love at all isn't bad, but only very hard to handle so most Jedi try not to get in contact with it at all.

[JediElf]

The Jedi find young-lings around the galaxy usually from Coruscant and then immediately send them to the academy to be trained taking them away from everything including their own parents Bastilia from KOTOR comes to mind. I mean, this is a seriously cult type thing...however we must understand why they do this. It is also the best/only way to guarantee purity.

 

 

Oh wow...that just made the Jedi sound super creepy now.

 

Like really, super creepy.

 

*shudders*

 

Yea umm, the Sith. They make a lot more sense in the long run. For all the faults, backstabbing, and deception I'd rather know that I could at least 'know' what love is, and decide how to deal with it's effects... than now know what love really is, and be denied it through a cult-like brainwashing.

 

I'd much rather be Sith, than Jedi.

Edited February 29, 2012 by JediElf

[mecher]

Oh wow...that just made the Jedi sound super creepy now.

 

Like really, super creepy.

 

*shudders*

 

Yea umm, the Sith. They make a lot more sense in the long run. For all the faults, backstabbing, and deception I'd rather know that I could at least 'know' what love is, and decide how to deal with it's effects... than now know what love really is, and be denied it through a cult-like brainwashing.

 

I'd much rather be Sith, than Jedi.

 

 

Would help if you weren't clueless about Jedi. Hint, Jedi can leave the order at will and have.

[JediElf]

Would help if you weren't clueless about Jedi. Hint, Jedi can leave the order at will and have.

 

Yes but what mental shape are they in, when they leave? With little exposure to the outside world, and no real way to handle their emotions. It can't make for a nice life....and it would make them more dangerous, than a crazy Sith.

[DaWaffle]

Parents have complete control over whether or not their children are given to the order.

 

Just felt like throwing that out there.

[LyriaFrost]

Yes but what mental shape are they in, when they leave? With little exposure to the outside world, and no real way to handle their emotions. It can't make for a nice life....and it would make them more dangerous, than a crazy Sith.

 

Why would jedi have "no way to handle their emotions?"

 

If anything, jedi would be BETTER at handling their emotions than anyone else. It's not like they flip a switch in their head that says "you will never feel any emotion while you're here" during training. They're taught to CONTROL their emotions, and not let their emotions dictate their actions -- the exact opposite of the sith, who are taught to give in to their slightest emotional whim.

 

They'll run into lots of odd experiences that they're not familiar with, to be sure. But it's not going to make them flip out and run around screaming.

[DarthBloodloss]

If you dont think Sith are evil, you must have not played a game called SWTOR, and played through any Sith story arc.

[disinformatique]

so the Jedis coined the term "dark" side and stamped "light" side to the aspect of the force they use, have you guys ever thought that the so-called "dark" side is the natural nature of the force?

 

I say Jedis have done an excellent PR job.

[LyriaFrost]

so the Jedis coined the term "dark" side and stamped "light" side to the aspect of the force they use, have you guys ever thought that the so-called "dark" side is the natural nature of the force?

 

I say Jedis have done an excellent PR job.

 

Yeah, it has absolutely nothing to do with the corruption that comes with the dark side or how its users end up murderous psychopaths or anything.

 

It's all just PR, I tell you!

[Velaran]

Hmm... I'm not really sure the Sith as a whole can be considered evil.

 

This is the Sith code:

 

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.

Through passion, I gain strength.

Through strength, I gain power.

Through power, I gain victory.

Through victory, my chains are broken.

The Force shall free me.

 

In my view, if you follow the Sith code, (using emotions in conjunction with the Force to improve yourself, gain victory, and find freedom.) you're Sith.

 

Sure, many, many Sith are evil as hell (like, killing and eating puppies evil) but there's no reason for a Sith to actually be that way.

 

Also, notice that you don't get Dark Side points in-game by actually using Dark Side powers. You get them (and the associated corruption) by consciously making evil decisions yourself. There's little to no reason why a Light Sided (or at least "good") Sith can't exist.

 

As for George Lucas' stance on the matter? Ignore him. The same way he ignores the EU.

[youwillburn]

Sith is evolution, survival of the fittest. Jedi are hippies

[VanorDM]

Sith is evolution, survival of the fittest.

 

And yet survival is the one thing that the Sith have the most problems with. In fact it gets so bad that they actually limit themselves to no more then 2 at a time, because if there's more then 2 then they spend so much time trying to kill each other that they accomplish nothing lasting.

 

I don't know if I'd say the Sith are Evil, but they are clearly self destructive by their very nature.

[disinformatique]

Yeah, it has absolutely nothing to do with the corruption that comes with the dark side or how its users end up murderous psychopaths or anything.

 

It's all just PR, I tell you!

 

It shows the true nature of all beings natural, survival of the fittest.

[LyriaFrost]

It shows the true nature of all beings natural, survival of the fittest.

 

Actually, no.

 

The sith are taught that being a psychotic monster is the only way to survive. That the only way to get ahead is to kill your competition, and the overseers assist their "favorite" students to do just that by giving them advantages over other students (both the sith inquisitor and sith warrior stories point this out quite a bit while you're on korriban).

 

There are sith who are on korriban who show glimmers of NOT being a psychopath. This is strongly discouraged. It's beaten out of them. "Kill or die" is the motto there. And when you can't beat your superior in a fair fight? Cheat. And your overseer may well help you, if he doesn't like your competitor.

 

The sith are definitely NOT "survival of the fittest". It's essentially anarchy, but with a few minor rules to keep it from degenerating into open warfare.

[Ravshar]

Why would jedi have "no way to handle their emotions?"

 

If anything, jedi would be BETTER at handling their emotions than anyone else. It's not like they flip a switch in their head that says "you will never feel any emotion while you're here" during training. They're taught to CONTROL their emotions, and not let their emotions dictate their actions -- the exact opposite of the sith, who are taught to give in to their slightest emotional whim.

 

 

They are tought to control *weak* emotions. They are tought to avoid attachments so they never feel *strong* emotions in the first place.

 

Many, taken for training as children, never know their mothers, or fathers, or any other family. The temple makes sure they never get to close to other students or teachers. These jedi don't know what its like to love someone more than themselves. Or have someone you love die. Or how to feel if the loved one is in danger. Or the anger you feel when you see someone destroy something or someone you care about. Or jealousy.

 

Their training only teaches them to avoid situations leading to those emotions, not control them. Spending their life avoiding those situations means they are ill-prepared to handle them -if- they occur.

[owenthorn]

 

As for George Lucas' stance on the matter? Ignore him. The same way he ignores the EU.

 

 

because the people writing those stories, only do so because George gets paid for it, they, the people who write this EU, you speak of, have no authority over what George wants or sees for HIS star wars stories or future stories, they do not create star Wars that anyone, especially George Lucas has to abide by, only what George says matters

 

and what kinds of things does George say?? read my sig for one.....

[WhiskeyGrin]

You would have to literally travel to the depths of Hell to find a better example of evil than the Sith. Torture, murder, slavery, genocide, racism, selfishness, rage, hate, fear, yada, yada, yada are literally the calling cards of the Sith.

 

Are you people for real when you ask this question?

[WhiskeyGrin]

I guess when Darth Malak turned Taris into what it is today, that was a neutral alignment action?

[Qixel]

I guess when Darth Malak turned Taris into what it is today, that was a neutral alignment action?

 

Considering that Taris was a greater hive of scum and villainy than Mos Eisley could ever dream of being, yes. I think it was.

[WhiskeyGrin]

Than by your logic if the U.S. Government shelled Washington D.C. metro, Watts Los Angelas, Little Haiti Miami, Rochester New York, and the list goes on indiscriminately, it wouldn't be evil?