Melnibonean Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Hey guys. I am a guardian specced into the Vigilence tree and had fun all the way up to lv50. Its the hard modes that have me pulling my hair. Ive talked to alot of peeps and they are refering to spec into focus. Focus for single target damage output? Im very confused and would love some feedback on this. Last boss on HM Directive 7 enraged on us multiple times and the fingers were pointing at my dps. I honestly thought I was doing good but whatever. Should I respec into Focus for hardmodes at lv50? This is ultimately my question and those that like a good spec please link yours so I can do some testing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonlo Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Hey guys. I am a guardian specced into the Vigilence tree and had fun all the way up to lv50. Its the hard modes that have me pulling my hair. Ive talked to alot of peeps and they are refering to spec into focus. Focus for single target damage output? Im very confused and would love some feedback on this. Last boss on HM Directive 7 enraged on us multiple times and the fingers were pointing at my dps. I honestly thought I was doing good but whatever. Should I respec into Focus for hardmodes at lv50? This is ultimately my question and those that like a good spec please link yours so I can do some testing. We use a Vig Guardian. And he does fine. Focus is really a more PvP spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minderbinder Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) There's no combat log, you're grouped with idiots who think Guardians are tanks, therefore can't DPS. Any talk of DPS is pointless and retarded without some kind of Log. Now, if you're not executing mechanics properly, poor time on target, things of that nature, then it's a different story. people are pointing at Focus because you can generate a big sweep crit every so often, which must mean it's better DPS. Edited February 4, 2012 by Minderbinder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 There's no combat log, you're grouped with idiots who think Guardians are tanks, therefore can't DPS. Any talk of DPS is pointless and retarded without some kind of Log. Now, if you're not executing mechanics properly, poor time on target, things of that nature, then it's a different story. people are pointing at Focus because you can generate a big sweep crit every so often, which must mean it's better DPS. Guardians are tanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minderbinder Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Guardians are tanks... See?? Guardians CAN tank, there's a pretty big difference. Edited February 4, 2012 by Minderbinder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zanders Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Guardians are tanks... Or atleast they pretend to be! I play a 50 guardian and im not happy at all with it.... Edited February 4, 2012 by Zanders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melnibonean Posted February 4, 2012 Author Share Posted February 4, 2012 It was stated back during beta that single saber wielders will be as viable as dual saber wielders when it comes to dps. Without a log I agree there is no concrete evidence of what is going on. Its good to see a hardmode group using a Guardian. There were probably other factors besides myself as to why the last boss in Directive 7 would not go down before enrage. Question: does it matter how many stacks of sundering armor you have on the target before using Plasma Brand to be more effective or is sundering armor just the catalyst for it to work. Thanks for the responses guys and to everybody else that wants to let me know that a Guardian is a tank: I know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 See?? Guardians CAN tank, there's a pretty big difference. Just because they can spec into dps doesnt mean they should dps in end game. They are meant to be tanks. It sucks right now because there is no dual spec, but if he wanted to be raw dps he should of gone sentinel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aodhan Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Guardians are tanks... You joke, but a lot of people are stuck on this idea. I guess folks hear heavy armor and think tank. It's like being stuck on stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonlo Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Just because they can spec into dps doesnt mean they should dps in end game. They are meant to be tanks. It sucks right now because there is no dual spec, but if he wanted to be raw dps he should of gone sentinel. Says you, maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 You joke, but a lot of people are stuck on this idea. I guess folks hear heavy armor and think tank. It's like being stuck on stupid. Nah, they just call them guardians, give them heavy armor and a tank spec tree for ***** and giggles... Guardians are tanks who "can" spec into dps. If their dps was meant to be on par with a sentinel then there would be no point in rolling a sentinel. Whether you like it or not, they were designed with the intention of being tanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee-Jay Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Just because they can spec into dps doesnt mean they should dps in end game. They are meant to be tanks. It sucks right now because there is no dual spec, but if he wanted to be raw dps he should of gone sentinel. 2006 called, they want their attitude back. I'm going to claim that Guardian DPS is one of the best in game. Possibly even better than Sentinels. Edited February 4, 2012 by Dee-Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benificus Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Just because they can spec into dps doesnt mean they should dps in end game. They are meant to be tanks. It sucks right now because there is no dual spec, but if he wanted to be raw dps he should of gone sentinel. What you're saying goes against what we've been told, though. There were assurances from the Devs that any DPS spec would be equally viable. Given that, do you have any proof that Guardians shouldn't be endgame DPS? Or are you simply assuming, in the absence of any combat log or numerical evidence, that Guardians are going to be worse DPS simply because they -have- a tank tree, whether or not they spec into it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derliam Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I'm specced into vigilance as well and have no noticeable issues with my dps. As long as you figure out a good rotation that works for you you'll be on par with a sentinel - at least my output is about as high as my guildmate's sentinel (based on the time it takes to down the same type of mob). I can't understand why so many people have such a limited horizon of the guardian as dps as opposed to the tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I'm specced into vigilance as well and have no noticeable issues with my dps. As long as you figure out a good rotation that works for you you'll be on par with a sentinel - at least my output is about as high as my guildmate's sentinel (based on the time it takes to down the same type of mob). I can't understand why so many people have such a limited horizon of the guardian as dps as opposed to the tank. Because everyone and their mom dps's and seeing ppl pick a class designed to be a tanking class and then going dps with them when there is a dps designed AC available and then wondering why others are pointing fingers at you is both hilarious and sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derliam Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Because everyone and their mom dps's and seeing ppl pick a class designed to be a tanking class and then going dps with them when there is a dps designed AC available and then wondering why others are pointing fingers at you is both hilarious and sad. Oh man, your ignorance is off the scales (and yes it is both hilarious and sad ) Tell me, if there are two DPS trees and one defence tree, is a class "designed" to be anything? I specced into DPS because the guild needed it and there are no issues. At the end if you're having fun, your DPS is roughly equal with the other classes, why get stuck in narrow single-minded gameplay and be unable to help the guild because you have too many tanks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melnibonean Posted February 4, 2012 Author Share Posted February 4, 2012 Guys, the devs said that a single saber wielder would be just as viable as a dual wielder when it comes to damage output. This is why I went Guardian...not becuase of the heavy armor. If the devs changed thier mind prior to launch I didnt get the memo or see anything that would state such a dramatic change. Please stay off this thread if all you have to say is "a Guardian was meant to tank...shoulda gone Sentinel". I am asking for Guardians that are dpsing hardmodes to speak up and help us out with thier successful tactics. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seismax Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Because everyone and their mom dps's and seeing ppl pick a class designed to be a tanking class and then going dps with them when there is a dps designed AC available and then wondering why others are pointing fingers at you is both hilarious and sad. What's hilarious and sad is that you seem to believe this nonsense. Guardian DPS is competitive with any other melee, Sentinel's only advantage is the group buffs they bring. I've never had issues with hardmode enrages due to a lack of dps. Since you're so hard up on being a tool though let me ask you this: Do you think Sentinels and Gunslingers are the only viable DPS classes? Didn't think so, don't bring that ignorant trash here please. On topic, Focus is terrible in PvE due to both the ramp up time it has and it's burst nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melnibonean Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 Thank you Seismax. Some peeps were talking about focus being better in hardmodes and I just dont see how it is possible on single targets. I may have my rotation outta whack due to pvping alot as Vigilence. I try to get a plasma brand as soon as possible but in pve it may not be the right rotation to start off with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melnibonean Posted February 6, 2012 Author Share Posted February 6, 2012 I believe the way I was specced was key to why I thought my dps was too low for hardmodes. I did have points in in boosted endurance and talents that give focus for getting stunned. Im so far happy with the results of a Vigilence specced Guardian and hope everyone else finds that a single saber wielder is viable and fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystry Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 Nah, they just call them guardians, give them heavy armor and a tank spec tree for ***** and giggles... Guardians are tanks who "can" spec into dps. If their dps was meant to be on par with a sentinel then there would be no point in rolling a sentinel. Whether you like it or not, they were designed with the intention of being tanks. Anyone who thinks like you needs to be strapped to a chair and beaten repeatedly with a golf iron. The majority of us guardian DPS rolled this because we prefer single saber over dual sabers. There is absolutely no excuse for any spec to lag just because they are able to tank. That's like me saying that sages shouldn't be able to DPS. You are a completely ignorant fool who needs to get their head out of the 'Vanilla WoW' stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerion Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) yeah, this is why I don't like grouping....I built a character the way I want, and play it the way I want...but suddenly he doesn't fit the 'correct' build that some other arsehat thinks he should. screw that. I don't play single-saber Guardian to tank NOR to dps. I built him because I wanted to play a classic Jedi I've come to love from the movies. Period. But some of you aren't satisfied with that because he doesn't fit some gamey role invented by the industry. Too bad. Edited February 7, 2012 by Cerion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endilix Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) I played a guardian tank and I hit like a wet sponge. I switched to guardian dps and HOLY **** things blew up faster than they did on my Merc BH. So far I love both. I wish there was dual spec. But anyone that tells me that I can't dps as a guardian can shove it. Anywho, for HM I don't know too much about, but in regards to rotation, I usually put on plasma brand last, and by the time I do that, all the other stuff is off CD, and I can build my focus and rotate through my CDs without ever having too much focus buildup or having to burn focus on slash or cyclone slash. I hit sweep whenever it's up and I have no other big CDs hits to pop. Defensive CDs when I'm dying, etc. If you can, try to hover at around 5-7 focus. It seems to work best for me in making sure I have enough to hit my focus using skills. I don't honestly think there's a set rotation. More of a priority rotation and hitting whatever is up at a time depending on your focus levels. EDIT: I spent too much time tanking and forgot about Master Strike. On enemies that are elite or higher I tend to use it on CD. Which with the overhead strike instant refresh talent for master strike, it can be up a lot. Edited February 6, 2012 by Endilix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpaw- Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 See?? Guardians CAN tank, there's a pretty big difference. ^ well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chokechainn Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 Both specs are viable just be careful what you put your points into. I prefer Focus for PvP but Vigilance for PvE. Focus has great burst but once that is done you have to wait for CDs as Vigilance you are constantly re-applying you DoTs. A few things i suggest are keeping you DoTs up as much as possible is the most important. Make sure you sunder whenever it is up and also something that not many people think about is Guardian leap. If you Guardian Leap to a ranged then saber throw(if you need focus) and Force Leaping back in will give you the free blade storm. Also one last thing Make sure you overhead slash before casting blade storm and dispatch as it will give you a short buff for 100% crit chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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