Why Not Do This Instead of Screwing Grinders For Their Hard Work?

[Nostiator]

I'm a little upset about what I'm hearing about these new 50's that they wanna make it even. My point of view............I'm kinda upset that I have spent countless hours grinding away at 60 Valor mind you I'm 61 Valor and I don't even have a main hand weapon. I'm a Battlemaster and I put the hours in to get my gear / ranks and now you wanna slap us grinders in the face for it?

 

How about this idea? Why don't you make a 10-50 bracket if you have lets say '4' or more Cent gear then you are moved to the bigger 50 bracket. If you have 3 or more Champ gear then you more the the bigger 50 pvp bracket? Instead of changing it for the newbies and for the people who should not have to grind and get stuff handed to them why not do a system like this?

 

Anyone who has 3 or what even number of Champ gear plays in the top dog bracket?

 

 

You already changed the system to 10-49

 

10-50 Less then 3 Champ pieces

50 with everyone that has 4 or more Champ pieces

Edited February 2, 2012 by Nostiator

[Krionic]

I'm a little upset about what I'm hearing about these new 50's that they wanna make it even. My point of view............I'm kinda upset that I have spent countless hours grinding away at 60 Valor mind you I'm 61 Valor and I don't even have a main hand weapon. I'm a Battlemaster and I put the hours in to get my gear / ranks and now you wanna slap us grinders in the face for it?

 

How about this idea? Why don't you make a 1-50 bracket if you have lets say '4' or more Cent gear then you are moved to the bigger 50 bracket. If you have 3 or more Champ gear then you more the the bigger 50 pvp bracket? Instead of changing it for the newbies and for the people who should not have to grind and get stuff handed to them why not do a system like this?

 

Anyone who has 3 or what even number of Champ gear plays in the top dog bracket?

 

I guess that would work, however, I don't know about on your server but on my server the queue times for 50 bracket as it is only pops during prime time. I've had 90 min queues only to join a game that had 4 other republics on my team. This game is broken beyond expertise stats. The faction imbalance should be priority 1

[Kai-Eurah-Tird]

70% of the problem would be solved if they let people save up champion bags before hitting 50s. Like wise for people to save up BM bags before hitting 60. Edited February 2, 2012 by Kai-Eurah-Tird

[belialle]

You like long queue times then?

 

How about this instead? Introduce a low-tier PvP set that can be purchased with commendations. Or give it to crafters and let people buy it on the GTN. Or put in on some other vendor and let us buy it with credits.

Edited February 2, 2012 by belialle

[Celebrus]

I guess that would work, however, I don't know about on your server but on my server the queue times for 50 bracket as it is only pops during prime time. I've had 90 min queues only to join a game that had 4 other republics on my team. This game is broken beyond expertise stats. The faction imbalance should be priority 1

 

I have never seen a Q time like that, but I wouldn't be shocked if it was out there. I normally get my Q within 10 minutes during off-peak times. During peak times my Q has already popped by the time the load screen after the WZ has finished.

 

That said. I wouldn't like this. And before you get too upset OP, read the dev tracker. There are no planned nerfs at this time to existing pvp gear.

[Thuull]

I guess that would work, however, I don't know about on your server but on my server the queue times for 50 bracket as it is only pops during prime time. I've had 90 min queues only to join a game that had 4 other republics on my team. This game is broken beyond expertise stats. The faction imbalance should be priority 1

 

Valid point, but goes away with cross-server queues.

 

I actually kind of like this idea.

 

They couldn't do it by what was actually being worn at the time that the player joined the queue, cuz they could just take pieces off to get into the lower queue then put them on when the WZ pops. However, they could add a flag to the player...player has 3 pieces of gear, flag=1...player does not have three pieces, flag=0. Flag=1 goes to 50 only WZ, flag=0 goes to 10-50.

 

Could work, and would ease the transition, and wouldn't hurt the players who have already spent the time to get the gear.

[Torcer]

Hard work? Working in a coal mine is hard work. Rushing to 50, rolling sub 50s for a month and exploiting Ilum for a day is not hard work.

[Noollig]

Hard work? Working in a coal mine is hard work. Rushing to 50, rolling sub 50s for a month and exploiting Ilum for a day is not hard work.

 

doesn't sound like fun either.

 

Who says the grind has to suck? Isn't it supposed to be fun to progress?

[Torcer]

doesn't sound like fun either.

 

Who says the grind has to suck? Isn't it supposed to be fun to progress?

 

By almost all accounts, the RNG grind combined with turning 50 and getting stomped sucked. BW's changes to how we gear still makes a grind, but it makes that grind suck less.

[jdnyc]

hard work? Working in a coal mine is hard work. Rushing to 50, rolling sub 50s for a month and exploiting ilum for a day is not hard work.

 

omg thank you so much for this.

+1

[blackadda]

DEV Post on the subject:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...81#edit2428381

 

Public Test Server -> Crafting Profession Changes in patch 1.1.2

 

 

Fair concerns... but nobody said anything about nerfs for PvP gear just yet.

 

There are many ways of achieving our intended goal, from stabilizing early gear acquisition through diminishing/removal of the random factor to the introduction of new gear over time... and a dozen other methods in-between.

 

To spell it out: We currently have no intention to modify the stats on existing PvP gear downwards (which I assume you mean by 'nerf'). Nobody has talked about eliminating the gap between old level 50s and new level 50s either.

 

-- George

[cycao]

look as far as im concerned im in this game for the long hall i may play GW2 but thats still months out. i never expected to be fully decked out in pvp gear within the first month.

 

Dont get me wrong i hate the RNG im over 60+ maybe even 70 and im still missing all of my armor and main hand weapon. Im not going anywhere, the games not going anywhere unless you believe all the whiners on these forums.

 

i can still bring it against fully geared players in warzones and open world because i understand the concept of teamwork and this isnt a 1v1 game. I will get there when i get there

[DarthOvertone]

I'm a little upset about what I'm hearing about these new 50's that they wanna make it even. My point of view............I'm kinda upset that I have spent countless hours grinding away at 60 Valor mind you I'm 61 Valor and I don't even have a main hand weapon. I'm a Battlemaster and I put the hours in to get my gear / ranks and now you wanna slap us grinders in the face for it?

 

While I don't want to diminish your grind, let's be frank. You "grinded" your gear without doing any real PvP. You undoubtedly powerleveled to 50, farmed lowbies in WZs, traded dailies on Ilum, and potentially may have participated in Kill Trading. So save your grind sob story. If anything the 50s post-1.1 will have earned their Battlemaster title far and above existing BMs because they actually have to PvP to get it.

 

Next, if you are a real PvPer, and not a Carebear, then you would recognize and admit that skill, not gear, should be the deciding factor in PvP. So any change which improves a gear disparity that creates an artificial barrier in a skill-based combat system should be welcome.

 

Expertise is a broken stat. It is stupid and unnecessary. I PvP for good fights, not for gear. While my toon has a full Champ set and is sitting pretty, I welcome a change that would encourage a more competitive and challenging playing field.

 

At the same time, this is an MMO, and progression is a factor. The inherent stats themselves on your BM gear is still better than the stats on other items. Your "grind" was still worth the effort because you will still have the best gear in the game.

 

Btw, the grind for BM is pathetically easy. My toon turned 50 the day before 1.1. He is about two weeks away from BM. That means Battlemaster in about two months time without farming lowbies in WZs, Ilum trading, valor exploiting or kill trading. Hardly countless hours and ridiculously easy compared to other games where it took me years to get a toon to a high enough rank to equip a full set of PvP gear.

[Qilz]

 

Next, if you are a real PvPer, and not a Carebear, then you would recognize and admit that skill, not gear, should be the deciding factor in PvP. So any change which improves a gear disparity that creates an artificial barrier in a skill-based combat system should be welcome.

 

Expertise is a broken stat. It is stupid and unnecessary. I PvP for good fights, not for gear. While my toon has a full Champ set and is sitting pretty, I welcome a change that would encourage a more competitive and challenging playing field.

 

.

 

The only people making gear threads are the ones that suck at PvP and need the advantage. Anyone that is actually any good, doesn't need the expertise advantage.

 

2 examples:

 

The quoted one - probably good at PvP

The original post - most likely terrible.

[Nostiator]

While I don't want to diminish your grind, let's be frank. You "grinded" your gear without doing any real PvP. You undoubtedly powerleveled to 50, farmed lowbies in WZs, traded dailies on Ilum, and potentially may have participated in Kill Trading. So save your grind sob story. If anything the 50s post-1.1 will have earned their Battlemaster title far and above existing BMs because they actually have to PvP to get it.

 

Next, if you are a real PvPer, and not a Carebear, then you would recognize and admit that skill, not gear, should be the deciding factor in PvP. So any change which improves a gear disparity that creates an artificial barrier in a skill-based combat system should be welcome.

 

Expertise is a broken stat. It is stupid and unnecessary. I PvP for good fights, not for gear. While my toon has a full Champ set and is sitting pretty, I welcome a change that would encourage a more competitive and challenging playing field.

 

At the same time, this is an MMO, and progression is a factor. The inherent stats themselves on your BM gear is still better than the stats on other items. Your "grind" was still worth the effort because you will still have the best gear in the game.

 

Btw, the grind for BM is pathetically easy. My toon turned 50 the day before 1.1. He is about two weeks away from BM. That means Battlemaster in about two months time without farming lowbies in WZs, Ilum trading, valor exploiting or kill trading. Hardly countless hours and ridiculously easy compared to other games where it took me years to get a toon to a high enough rank to equip a full set of PvP gear.

 

 

I would have to disagree with you there was no power leveling for me. I play on the Republic side and I leveled all by myself and LFG for my Heroics on each planet I went too nobody power leveled me and I didn't even join a guild that's right I grinding my way to 50 even fighting the Empire once I hit Tat and Hoth dealth with it and moved on. So what are you talking about power leveling I been playing since launch.

 

As for PvP No I didn't exploit any system mind you I play Republic I don't think I even need to go down that road. I went out to Ilum and did my daily's and weekly by saying in /G inv to ops group. I did my War zones alone and at times with the three real life friends that I have so I have no sob story for you. So I don't know what you mean I did no war zones so you need a reality check and you need to stop living the the world of "Assume". I sat there day by day getting my butt handed to me with the other side Empire on my server is decked out in gear. I grinded took my butt wopping and grinded it out nobody gave me anything so don't sit there as if you know what's going on on my end.

 

I would have to disagree with you evey MMO is gear dependant and the skill the more you play adds to it. Skill comes with playing not getting stuff handed to you, thus why I feel very good playing my class against others why because of the hours I put into playing PvP and knowing what class can do against me.

 

By the way Republic on my server are miles behind the Empire curve when it comes to gear and ranks.

 

You are the definition of people talking outta their a s s.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Nostiator

[Jestunhi]

While I don't want to diminish your grind, let's be frank. You "grinded" your gear without doing any real PvP. You undoubtedly powerleveled to 50, farmed lowbies in WZs, traded dailies on Ilum, and potentially may have participated in Kill Trading. So save your grind sob story.

 

my toon has a full Champ set and is sitting pretty

 

Irony, thy name is DarthOvertone.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Jestunhi

[Lokai]

I'm a little upset about what I'm hearing about these new 50's that they wanna make it even. My point of view............I'm kinda upset that I have spent countless hours grinding away at 60 Valor mind you I'm 61 Valor and I don't even have a main hand weapon. I'm a Battlemaster and I put the hours in to get my gear / ranks and now you wanna slap us grinders in the face for it?

 

How about this idea? Why don't you make a 10-50 bracket if you have lets say '4' or more Cent gear then you are moved to the bigger 50 bracket. If you have 3 or more Champ gear then you more the the bigger 50 pvp bracket? Instead of changing it for the newbies and for the people who should not have to grind and get stuff handed to them why not do a system like this?

 

Anyone who has 3 or what even number of Champ gear plays in the top dog bracket?

 

 

You already changed the system to 10-49

 

10-50 Less then 3 Champ pieces

50 with everyone that has 4 or more Champ pieces

 

so you have uber gear and wanna crush anyone looks at you funny because you put countless hours into grinding?

 

Your whats wrong with general mmo pvpers... you don't hear guys play street fighter say " i want an unfair advantage vs everyone else because i play more then they do..." seriously... if you have that gear then you will still win vs new players however changes are most likly going to be an accessible pvp set, or alterations to expertise...

 

If your a good pvper then nothing will change...other then the fact it may take you more then 2-3attacks to slaughter someone.

[McVade]

Eh.

 

Grinding, I think, has a very appropriate level of diminishing returns in this game. I feel like if I do my PvP dailies in 2-3 hours and then don't play for the rest of the day unless I'm just having fun/rolling with friends, I'm doing it right. I spend my Warzone Commendations on Adrenals and Medpaks. Why? Because saving up for bags feels like grinding. If I happen to have 10 of each and 800 WZ commendations, I'll buy one, but I'm not shooting for it.

 

I don't want this to change, as I feel I will HAVE to invest 4-8 hours a day in order to compete and I'll probably burn out or stop trying.

 

Grinders get accelerated benefits if they grind hard enough and really want them, but there's plenty of MMOs out there that reward this style of play lavishly. Aion is their game. This doesn't have to be one of them.

Edited February 2, 2012 by McVade

[Noollig]

I would have to disagree with you there was no power leveling for me. I play on the Republic side and I leveled all by myself and LFG for my Heroics on each planet I went too nobody power leveled me and I didn't even join a guild that's right I grinding my way to 50 even fighting the Empire once I hit Tat and Hoth dealth with it and moved on. So what are you talking about power leveling I been playing since launch.

 

As for PvP No I didn't exploit any system mind you I play Republic I don't think I even need to go down that road. I went out to Ilum and did my daily's and weekly by saying in /G inv to ops group. I did my War zones alone and at times with the three real life friends that I have so I have no sob story for you. So I don't know what you mean I did no war zones so you need a reality check and you need to stop living the the world of "Assume". I sat there day by day getting my butt handed to me with the other side Empire on my server is decked out in gear. I grinded took my butt wopping and grinded it out nobody gave me anything so don't sit there as if you know what's going on on my end.

 

I would have to disagree with you evey MMO is gear dependant and the skill the more you play adds to it. Skill comes with playing not getting stuff handed to you, thus why I feel very good playing my class against others why because of the hours I put into playing PvP and knowing what class can do against me.

 

You are the definition of people talking outta their a s s.

 

Skill based combat is what people want. Rewards from playing shouldn't give you a massive advantage. The main rewards should be vanity type stuff like achievements and titles. If the Modern Warfare series had made it so everyone started off with a spoon, while the higher level guys get auto-aiming insta-kill laser guns and body armor, who would play it? The first few guys to cap out would be unstoppable, and anyone who played later on would just give up.

 

MW3 sold over 6.5 million boxes by the end of the first day of release. It may be a FPS why not try to learn from it?

[DarthOvertone]

So what are you talking about power leveling I been playing since launch.

 

Very simple. When did you hit 50? If you hit 50 in 2-3 weeks, you power-leveled.

 

As for PvP No I didn't exploit any system mind you I play Republic I don't think I even need to go down that road. I went out to Ilum and did my daily's and weekly by saying in /G inv to ops group. I did my War zones alone and at times with the three real life friends that I have so I have no sob story for you.

 

Faction is irrelevant. Did you not farm lowbies in WZs pre-1.1? Did you not trade dailies in Ilum pre-1.1? If you were 50 pre-1.1, then you did those things, neither of which were "PvP" in any proper sense.

 

You are the definition of people talking outta their a s s.

 

No. You sound like the definition of a carebear that is afraid to lose their gear advantage which was a pittance to obtain. And while you may claim to have earned your BM title in a legit way, (who wouldn't lulz), the title is still tarnished because the majority of players with it did not. Sorry. Even more reason for you to promote a more even playing field so you can actually prove you are worthy of the title you have.

 

Irony, thy name is DarthOvertone.

 

What is the irony? Faction is irrelevant to the issue at hand, aside from the 1.1 patch day Valor exploiting which only Imps were able to participate in.

 

I chose my Forum name in beta prior to release of the game. I originally had planned to roll Imp. But when I saw the faction population imbalance happening pre-launch I decided to roll Pub instead. Personally, I prefer a challenge to a faceroll. But that's just me. Thank the maker I did it because I can't stand Huttball.

[Nostiator]

so you have uber gear and wanna crush anyone looks at you funny because you put countless hours into grinding?

 

Your whats wrong with general mmo pvpers... you don't hear guys play street fighter say " i want an unfair advantage vs everyone else because i play more then they do..." seriously... if you have that gear then you will still win vs new players however changes are most likly going to be an accessible pvp set, or alterations to expertise...

 

If your a good pvper then nothing will change...other then the fact it may take you more then 2-3attacks to slaughter someone.

 

 

No I don't have uber gear people can have the same gear that I have putting hours in and opening 100's of Champion lotto bags.

[Rogmar]

OP is a baddie. I have 4 pieces of BM not including the purchasable pieces, and I'd give it up for a skill-based system. Too bad it will never happen.

[Dogfatherxx]

I thought that everyone was keeping their gear, but future people are just going to have a more predictable way of getting started. I think that you will keep what you have.

[Calei]

Grinders, I like that. I think that's what we should call these people. Grinders.

 

"I grinded a whole lot and now the numbers are higher so I win yay!"

Joey the Grinder

[ExpectWar]

The sad thing is that most people valor 60+ farmed lowbies in the 10-50 bracket.. and most likely in premades so its not really a grind.