Same gender relationships clarifications?

[Callio_Nyx]

I see a few comments going back and forth here. Some want it, some will leave if it is implemented.

 

There are a few ways to handle it, and the way I read between the lines I believe I know what the plan is - namely, new companions that prefer to .. eh... play on the same team.

 

While the Star Wars setting seems fairly free-spirited, another BioWare game went a little too far, in my opinion; while it makes some sense to have some bi/lez/gay people, it gets a little strange if everyone is bi. Also, there is the question of wether species is a problem or not.

 

Honestly, getting across the species barrier would be just as drastic as gender, I believe, and I don't think that is addressed all that much here. (I liked how they handled it in ME2, rather maturely, I thought.).

 

However, they've allready included some romance options and that's a first for MMO's. Expanding on it would be good, it's one of many things that set SWTOR apart.

[Teraphin]

I think that in the larger scheme of things, with a society that is advanced both technically a socially, That sentient beings would not fall in love or want to become romantic with a gender or species/race but would go far some one they think they understand and admire. Its becomes not so much about procreation and more about caring. (or in some cases bedpost notches).

[Innocentone]

I could care less about romancing new companions. I'd rather focus on the ones that we currently have. I've decided not to use any companion gifts until this gets added. I don't want to miss anything .

 

On another note. Would be fun to flirt with quests npcs regardless of gender. I've noticed some do give funny replies. But guessing that would require alot more maybe.

[Wittand]

@Everybody

It is rather important that the thread remains a positive and polite request for further information and does not go down the road thread related to this topic often take. Therefore I ask anybody to be careful when posting. So no discussion about real life sexuality or real life politics, keep all discussion game related.

 

 

On topic:

I really hope that we will hear something soon. Even if it is a disappointing "You have to wait for update 2.0 when we add the next chapter".

 

Though I do not think that adding SGRAs for characters that you meet post level 50 would be an ideal solution (not to mention that you would need to NPCs for every class). Because it would feel unfair having to wait so long and a romance would feel rather rushed if you only meet the love interest five minutes before you run out of game content.

Adding new NPCs before a new chapter gets added seems unlikely, since there is no way you can write them into the story and make it feel not tacked on.

So the only decent solution seems to be to make at least some of the existing options bisexual and also add some new romance options and flirts.

Edited January 24, 2012 by Wittand

[gekko_s]

Everyone understands that when they talk about posts that are "sexual in nature", they mean posts that are explicit or harassing in any way. We're discussing romance options. You're just trying to twist it into being against the rules to... well, I don't know why you try to do that...

 

There seems to also be a few people who get uncomfortable by encountering same gender romance options in dialogues in game. That's a shame. Too bad for them that it can't be turned off in real life. I think and hope those who consider it a problem are much fewer than those who would like the option. However, there might be a solution to make the game better for more gamers. Make a setting or a character option that toggles which options you'll get. It could customize "pheromone level" or something, and decide if male, females or both males and females will find you attractive.

Edited January 24, 2012 by gekko_s

[Atandras]

@Everybody

It is rather important that the thread remains a positive and polite request for further information and does not go down the road thread related to this topic often take. Therefore I ask anybody to be careful when posting. So no discussion about real life sexuality or real life politics, keep all discussion game related.

 

 

On topic:

I really hope that we will hear something soon. Even if it is a disappointing "You have to wait for update 2.0 when we add the next chapter".

 

Though I do not think that adding SGRAs for characters that you meet post level 50 would be an ideal solution (not to mention that you would need to NPCs for every class). Because it would feel unfair having to wait so long and a romance would feel rather rushed if you only meet the love interest five minutes before you run out of game content.

Adding new NPCs before a new chapter gets added seems unlikely, since there is no way you can write them into the story and make it feel not tacked on.

So the only decent solution seems to be to make at least some of the existing options bisexual and also add some new romance options and flirts.

 

Agreed entirely, have the same companion go both ways, that's many would ask. There is no need to re-script everything.

[MoogleNut]

As I said in a previous post, I'm for the all-bi option when it comes to companions - Anders intense neediness aside (funny how the 'straight-male-gamer' demographic who kicked up such a fuss completely disregarded the fact that the crazy mage hit on ANYONE who was nice to him regardless of gender, but that's a dead topic for a bygone day ), I actually loved the Dragon Age 2 way of doing things.

 

What it boils down to is this - we play video games to feel like "...big g*****n heroes" (thankyou Zaeed). When we do this, we're the one to save the world/galaxy, we're the one the princess/prince falls madly in love with - regardless of how we look, our species, even in some cases our actions.

 

Another poster in another thread (can't remeber which, was locked methinks), commented that he had no problem with the s/s flirt option so long as 'we' - ie the non hetero player - didn't moan that we get rejected everytime we use it, as in 'real-life' (his terminology/sentiments not mine obviously) - completely forgetting that in 'real-life' not every woman would instantly fall into his bed just because he's a man flirting with her.

 

So why should it not be the same for ALL players - the objects of our affections don't always feel the same way in real-life, regardless of sexuality, but that level of realism is happily thrown aside when we play the hero - if the hot jedi/sith/slicer/whatever can get over the fact you're blue/red/green/have tentacles for hair, look like you've been sleeping with a barbed-wire pillow and slaughtered your way across the galaxy, why would they care what bunmpy bits you have/don't have?

 

Also, if all companions are bi, or rather hero-sexual (in that they are interested in the hero not the gender), it saves us furtheer moaning if the gay (I use the term for both you guys and us girls) option is not the option we want. Every one of my gay male friends were smitten by Alistair in DAO instantly, I just laughed smugly while melting over Leliana, but you get the idea (I will so be replaying a single FemShep through ME1 and 2 if Ash becomes available in 3 )

 

(I use the term 'hero' as gender neutral, one of my favourite parts of Bioware games of late is this neutrality 'Ser' sounds so much better than 'Ma'am' to me- but then I am anything but girly )

 

I do apologise for the wordy post, but I hope my point got across.

[flyersfan]

Also they do not mention when you create your character that a certain gender is required to be able to get the FULL story available for that class.

 

You chose the gender that you chose. I feel like there should be differences regardless. Just like in the real world, not every companion should be playing for both teams. In your Jedi Knight example, I don't think that Kira should even be romanceable at all. I don't think that any Jedi should be able to be romanced. It's just not the way that things should be, in my opinion. In addition, you should just live with the gender that you picked. If not, then make a male Guardian and female Sentinel or the other way around. That way you'll get the different story and companion experience as well as a different playthrough.

 

In references to your solutions, I'd prefer option 2b. Going with some of my characters or at least by the time that same gender romances are added, I've already completed my story and my companions' stories as well. I don't want my companions to just become a different person at the flip of a switch. I'd like them to add new companions with these options instead except for Kaliyo who definitely looks like she'd be interested in my Agent.

 

I would also like to see more variability in the romance options. I mean, this isn't 1952 anymore. If it chaps someone who cares? It would greatly benefit RP aspects as well.

 

Who cares are the people that are affected, the people that don't want to see that or the people who don't want their kids to see that. The game isn't meant to be as mature as Mass Effect or Dragon Age. It's a game generally suitable for all ages. I also don't see how it would really affect RP at all. I completely understand BioWare's original stance on not adding these options in, especially due to George Lucas' typical (arguably homophobic) stance on homosexuality in the Star Wars universe. However, there are plenty of us that would like to see these things added regardless.

[gekko_s]

Maybe they could make it an add on you could purchase, like those WoW pets or the special stuff you get with that deluxe digital edition?

 

An extended companion pack with more romance and social options, including same gender stuff. Maybe even rate it Mature and not just Teen to alert worried parents. Or would that be too unfair?

Edited January 24, 2012 by gekko_s

[Teraphin]

Maybe they could make it an add on you could purchase, like those WoW pets or the special stuff you get with that deluxe digital edition?

 

An extended companion pack with more romance and social options, including same gender stuff. Maybe even rate it Mature and not just Teen to alert worried parents. Or would that be too unfair?

 

I so hate when I have to pay monthly for a game then have to pay for add ons. That kinda thing ruins a game imho

[gekko_s]

I so hate when I have to pay monthly for a game then have to pay for add ons. That kinda thing ruins a game imho

 

Not as much as not having the option there at all...

[MoogleNut]

Maybe they could make it an add on you could purchase, like those WoW pets or the special stuff you get with that deluxe digital edition?

 

An extended companion pack with more romance and social options, including same gender stuff. Maybe even rate it Mature and not just Teen to alert worried parents. Or would that be too unfair?

 

The fact that it's not been included so far and that we don't have any more details on when/how other than "post-launch" is verging on insulting enough coming from Bioware who pride themselves on their inclusivity when it comes to its player base.

 

Having to pay extra for it would be even worse - as stated before, the s/s romances are as much a part of the Bioware identity as their storytelling - it would almost be like selling the story part of the game separate from the combat.

[Nozybidaj]

@Everybody

So the only decent solution seems to be to make at least some of the existing options bisexual and also add some new romance options and flirts.

 

Completely agree. The sooner the better.

[PluckyDog]

There seems to also be a few people who get uncomfortable by encountering same gender romance options in dialogues in game. That's a shame. Too bad for them that it can't be turned off in real life. I think and hope those who consider it a problem are much fewer than those who would like the option. However, there might be a solution to make the game better for more gamers. Make a setting or a character option that toggles which options you'll get. It could customize "pheromone level" or something, and decide if male, females or both males and females will find you attractive.

 

I completely agree. That would be a great option ...well said .

[Raiellyn]

As was stated earlier, this is not a debate topic of whether the feature should be implemented, or whether it is right to implement it.

 

It is a request for information on a confirmed, upcoming feature, and a poll to determine *how* it might be implemented.

 

So please, try to stay on topic. It would be a shame for a positive thread to be closed due to animosity (on both sides, mind you), which is a certainty when one opens that can of worms.

 

The feature is confirmed; end of story. Any moral qualms you have must be left at the door.

Edited January 24, 2012 by Raiellyn

[Moitteva]

Hey everyone,

 

We have now reopened this thread.

 

While we do value everyone's opinions and your feedback is tremendously important, we ask that it is given in a constructive and respectful manner.

 

We would like to remind everyone that this discussion is centered around gameplay aspects involving same-gender romance in Star Wars™: The Old Republic™, and we ask that you keep your comments here constructive and on-topic. Real-world politics and morality are often volatile issues and as such discussion of them is not permitted on forums. Posts involving such have been removed from this thread.

 

Here are a couple things to keep in mind while you're participating in the discussion:

 

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We thank you for your effort in keeping this discussion constructive and respectful.

Edited January 25, 2012 by Moitteva
reopening thread

[DarthEpitaph]

OK, I have been lurking this thread for a while and I thought I'd put in my two cents.

 

First, in terms of the thread vote, I really believe 2A is the only fair option. 2B is almost certainly easier to implement, but I don't think it would be fair to new players or alts.

 

In terms of fairness, I think that any romance option should be available to any gender, much like Dragon Age 2. As MoogleNut put it (in one of my new favorite terms) make them "Hero-sexual". There does not need to be any indication prior to romancing them that they have any inclination one way or another, but in any single person's individual story, they can be same gender romances.

 

Which leads me to what I believe would be (in my humble opinion) an elegant solution to the issue of how to retroactively add this feature. Add two new gifts to the game, of the Courting type (or of a special alternate type). The gifts should be easily available to all players, just as regular gifts are in the fleet.

 

The first gift (let's call it "Romantic Dinner for Two"), when presented to a companion who has a romance arc, opens up the same gender romance option with that companion only. This solves the issue of how to retcon a single companion to be interested in the same gender without changing all of the romance companions. It also eliminates the "I don't want to see it at all" crowd by requiring an action by the player before the options exist (instead of, for example, a configuration setting as some people have suggested).

 

The second gift (let's call it "A New Hope"), when presented to a companion, will reset their romance and possibly quest conversation options. This might be best coupled with a corresponding reduction in affection, as a semi-artificial way to control the pacing of the conversations and romance. This would allow those who have progressed in the story the chance to play these romance options without having to re-roll.

 

As for me, I also hope to have some official clarification soon, as I have recently decided that I will be shelving my female bounty hunter pre-Nar Shaddaa, until I have an idea if my rapidly growing love for Mako will remain forever unrequited.

 

Thanks all for a great thread!

Edited January 25, 2012 by DarthEpitaph

[Uluain]

That is a remarkably generous - and ingenious - concession to have an item unlock same-gender romance options, but I find it unsatisfactory on two counts.

 

One, it is not equitable that opposite gender flirt options should be visible by default, while same gender flirt options would need unlocking so that some people would not need to see them. I see options that I don't care to follow through on all the time. And seeing those, but not ones which would interest me, is in fact dispiriting. I personally feel the reminder that others feel differently is no great burden to place on those uninterested in same-gender romantic options, particularly as options they would prefer are also available.

 

Second, I ought not to have to spend credits to buy an item to unlock options which others enjoy by default. I feel the option for flirts should itself be gender-blind. Any NPC offering an option to [Flirt] should offer it to all characters.

 

I imagine we have not seen any kind of clarification as to when these options will be implemented because Bioware doesn't have that answer to offer yet. There is doubtless a large number of bug fixes to be implemented first, and any amount of new content waiting in the wings. It may depend on when they are done putting out fires.

 

But how they intend to do it ought to be easier to answer, if they are putting in any work on it at all. They must have a game plan. If they don't, then I personally am not sanguine about the likelihood of it being implemented any time soon, which is a shame.

[Lady_Alyria]

That is a remarkably generous - and ingenious - concession to have an item unlock same-gender romance options, but I find it unsatisfactory on two counts.

 

One, it is not equitable that opposite gender flirt options should be visible by default, while same gender flirt options would need unlocking so that some people would not need to see them. I see options that I don't care to follow through on all the time. And seeing those, but not ones which would interest me, is in fact dispiriting. I personally feel the reminder that others feel differently is no great burden to place on those uninterested in same-gender romantic options, particularly as options they would prefer are also available.

 

Second, I ought not to have to spend credits to buy an item to unlock options which others enjoy by default. I feel the option for flirts should itself be gender-blind. Any NPC offering an option to [Flirt] should offer it to all characters.

 

I imagine we have not seen any kind of clarification as to when these options will be implemented because Bioware doesn't have that answer to offer yet. There is doubtless a large number of bug fixes to be implemented first, and any amount of new content waiting in the wings. It may depend on when they are done putting out fires.

 

But how they intend to do it ought to be easier to answer, if they are putting in any work on it at all. They must have a game plan. If they don't, then I personally am not sanguine about the likelihood of it being implemented any time soon, which is a shame.

 

How about a setting in preferences?

 

Flirt Options Active For:

Male Characters

Female Characters

Both

[Zin-Zin]

How about same-species romance? I'm a little peeved that my female twi'lek consular doesn't have a romance option with the male twi'lek companion character!

[Uluain]

How about a setting in preferences?

 

Flirt Options Active For:

Male Characters

Female Characters

Both

That seems equitable. No one is put to any extra expense. No one sees what they don't care to see. I have no problem with that arrangement at all.

[thegrognard]

How about same-species romance? I'm a little peeved that my female twi'lek consular doesn't have a romance option with the male twi'lek companion character!

 

That doesn't make sense...surely they should be able to.

[thegrognard]

OK, I have been lurking this thread for a while and I thought I'd put in my two cents.

 

First, in terms of the thread vote, I really believe 2A is the only fair option. 2B is almost certainly easier to implement, but I don't think it would be fair to new players or alts.

 

In terms of fairness, I think that any romance option should be available to any gender, much like Dragon Age 2. As MoogleNut put it (in one of my new favorite terms) make them "Hero-sexual". There does not need to be any indication prior to romancing them that they have any inclination one way or another, but in any single person's individual story, they can be same gender romances.

 

Which leads me to what I believe would be (in my humble opinion) an elegant solution to the issue of how to retroactively add this feature. Add two new gifts to the game, of the Courting type (or of a special alternate type). The gifts should be easily available to all players, just as regular gifts are in the fleet.

 

The first gift (let's call it "Romantic Dinner for Two"), when presented to a companion who has a romance arc, opens up the same gender romance option with that companion only. This solves the issue of how to retcon a single companion to be interested in the same gender without changing all of the romance companions. It also eliminates the "I don't want to see it at all" crowd by requiring an action by the player before the options exist (instead of, for example, a configuration setting as some people have suggested).

 

The second gift (let's call it "A New Hope"), when presented to a companion, will reset their romance and possibly quest conversation options. This might be best coupled with a corresponding reduction in affection, as a semi-artificial way to control the pacing of the conversations and romance. This would allow those who have progressed in the story the chance to play these romance options without having to re-roll.

 

As for me, I also hope to have some official clarification soon, as I have recently decided that I will be shelving my female bounty hunter pre-Nar Shaddaa, until I have an idea if my rapidly growing love for Mako will remain forever unrequited.

 

Thanks all for a great thread!

 

I love the idea of a gift callled "A New Hope" and especially love the name as a nice throwback to the movie that helped us all first discover Star Wars. I would love the idea to do that as it would reset the companions missions so you can re-do them. Sure it might be a pain and if you're level 50 it'll be tedious but still, it's for the companion to start a romance.

 

I too have sheelved my bounty hunter pre-Nar Shaddaa because I have grown rarther fond of her and I felt quite annoyed that my bounty hunter couldn't romance her just because I happened to choose a female and not a male. Really bites.

[Doel]

I have to agree, I really like the idea of these two gift options.

 

Especially the "new hope" gift would offer all players an option to replay their romances etc with their favourite companions. Many players could benefit from this actually. Just my thinking

[elexier]

It seem's that all things are not created equal.

 

Just for a bit of fun I made a female Imperial assassin. And umm yeah lets just say I did not even get to level 4 before I bribed some poor sap with my femininity.

 

My female Jedi Knight on the other hand is level 35 and the best I get is the walking hormone known as Doc, Who is a little up himself.

 

Bioware be warned at this rate my Knights gonna end up killing some poor sap that don't deserve it due to tension.