People who ninja for their companions

[Errathe]

Ok and for the last time why so sore about being called selfish when you are being selfish?

 

The (assumed) soreness occurs when you place a label on someone without any factual evidence to back up the claim.

 

I could simply label you 'purple' because you think purple is better than orange. I have no way of knowing if you are purple though, unless I see you.

 

In a similar way, people are reading opposing opinions, and then bandying around the selfish label without any proof, or any effort to understand the opposing point of view.

 

With that explained, let me return the question to you:

 

Why so sore about a virtual lighsaber?

[VizMagc]

The (assumed) soreness occurs when you place a label on someone without any factual evidence to back up the claim.

 

I could simply label you 'purple' because you think purple is better than orange. I have no way of knowing if you are purple though, unless I see you.

 

In a similar way, people are reading opposing opinions, and then bandying around the selfish label without any proof, or any effort to understand the opposing point of view.

 

With that explained, let me return the question to you:

 

Why so sore about a virtual lighsaber?

 

Facts to back it up? I feel that he is being selfish. F - E - E - L. Another new word for you to enter into your data bank.

[Gwal]

Don't forget about alts as well. A companion is barely a step away from an alt.

 

My alts companions need gear too!

 

*Gwal the Jedi rolls need on Purple Assault Cannon when in group with 3 commandos.*

[Setanian]

Facts to back it up? I feel that he is being selfish. F - E - E - L. Another new word for you to enter into your data bank.

 

Oh how easy the mistaken forget what they posted.

 

You posted "Because you're selfish" That's an insult

If you posted "I feel you're selfish" That's a feeling. What can I say? Want a hug?

[Errathe]

Originally Posted by Errathe

If either no rules have been established, or it has been stated to be acceptable, I will roll Need for a companion item, if it is an upgrade.

Quite often, if the item is of no real interest to me, I will Pass. Even if the item is worth credits.

 

I think you can agree that this is quite an agreeable form of behaviour, yes?

 

NO. Finally you've said it. The thing people are getting upset about. Someone needing a companion item without asking if it's ok to do so. That's why people are mad. So. Simple.

 

 

Also when you claim to speak without emotion, purely basing every conclusion on logic and then proceed to categorize the different types of people who post in this thread, well... that's condescending http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/condescend here is a link for you brobot

 

We're obviously having misunderstandings. I'll try again:

 

1. I communicate with group.

2. No loot rules were established (regrettable if a misunderstanding occurs, but the entire group's fault); OR..

3. The group agrees it is acceptable to Need for companions.

 

I this situation, I may roll Need.

 

Please, tell me why this behaviour is unacceptable?

 

I have communicated, agreed to rules based on my desire as a decent human being to have a good time and work as a team, have put in the same effort, and then proceeded to select the roll as agreed (or forfeited) by the group, the 'popular consensus'.

 

Are you being purposefully beligerant, or am I not making my view-point clear?

 

I am not going to debate dictionary definitions, even though I disagree. It serves no purpose here, other than to score imaginary points.

[VizMagc]

Oh how easy the mistaken forget what they posted.

 

You posted "Because you're selfish" That's an insult

If you posted "I feel you're selfish" That's a feeling. What can I say? Want a hug?

 

Yes, rather than being objectively selfish I just felt you were being selfish. Which I could only have known if I knew everything about you and if I were an omniscient being made of pure LOGIC. You really nailed me there

[Setanian]

NO. Finally you've said it. The thing people are getting upset about. Someone needing a companion item without asking if it's ok to do so.

 

Why should I ask someone's permission to do something which s already within my rights to do?

[Errathe]

Facts to back it up? I feel that he is being selfish. F - E - E - L. Another new word for you to enter into your data bank.

 

Ok and for the last time why so sore about being called selfish when you are being selfish?

 

Is the above not what you wrote?

 

Look, if you intended to write 'feel you are being selfish', that's all well and good. This is getting us nowhere, and continued personal attacks, and debating people's posts and not the thread topic itself, have been often stated as unacceptable by Bioware staff.

 

So let's drop it, and either get back to discussing the topic, or offer each other a forum beer, and get back to playing the game we both obviously enjoy passionately?

Edited January 14, 2012 by Errathe

[Ghaiana]

Just decide beforehand about how you roll in a group. If no one minds about rolling for their companions, there is no problem. If someone in the group does not follow the rules, just be sure not to invite that person another time in your group.

 

Rolling need is not against the gamerules. In fact, rolling need to sell the item is not against the gamerules either, so it all burns down to what you decide in a group about looting.

[Setanian]

Yes, rather than being objectively selfish I just felt you were being selfish. Which I could only have known if I knew everything about you and if I were an omniscient being made of pure LOGIC. You really nailed me there

 

I glad you're beginning to understand how facts work. Maybe we can continue debate, using them now that you understand them.

[BurnedRemains]

This is how it works with anyone that plays with me.

 

If you can use it and want it roll need. If you can't use it, pass. If you want it for the sake of selling it roll greed. If no one wants it/no one can use everyone rolls greed for their companions. If no one besides you wants it, everyone but you passes. Simple.

[Errathe]

Just decide beforehand about how you roll in a group. If no one minds about rolling for their companions, there is no problem. If someone in the group does not follow the rules, just be sure not to invite that person another time in your group.

 

Rolling need is not against the gamerules. In fact, rolling need to sell the item is not against the gamerules either, so it all burns down to what you decide in a group about looting.

 

Agreed. Communication is the key to all group activities.

[Setanian]

Just decide beforehand about how you roll in a group. If no one minds about rolling for their companions, there is no problem. If someone in the group does not follow the rules, just be sure not to invite that person another time in your group.

 

Rolling need is not against the gamerules. In fact, rolling need to sell the item is not against the gamerules either, so it all burns down to what you decide in a group about looting.

 

I agree. And if the group decide nothing. It's a free for all.

[Setanian]

This is how it works with anyone that plays with me.

 

If you can use it and want it roll need. If you can't use it, pass. If you want it for the sake of selling it roll greed. If no one wants it/no one can use everyone rolls greed for their companions. If no one besides you wants it, everyone but you passes. Simple.

 

Do you state this before you start every group?

[Gwal]

This is how it works with anyone that plays with me.

 

If you can use it and want it roll need. If you can't use it, pass. If you want it for the sake of selling it roll greed. If no one wants it/no one can use everyone rolls greed for their companions. If no one besides you wants it, everyone but you passes. Simple.

 

Pretty much the same with me.

 

When people group with randoms that's a roll of the die itself.

[Alcarinn]

As stated before, you are entitled to your considerations, I am entitled to roll whatever I wish, if I helped you. You have no right to begrudge me that right.

 

yes at workplace you have a right to spit in your bosses face aswell however many will consider it atleast unfriendly and will think of you as uncivilised and probably even mark you as ''that idiot''

 

I hope community is mature enough to do the same.

 

Entitlement is not same as what you are supposed to do. Its the law of community that you will eventually have to bend or be outcasted by majority of those better players.

 

its as simple as that

[Alcarinn]

This is how it works with anyone that plays with me.

 

If you can use it and want it roll need. If you can't use it, pass. If you want it for the sake of selling it roll greed. If no one wants it/no one can use everyone rolls greed for their companions. If no one besides you wants it, everyone but you passes. Simple.

 

Why the guy cannot click greed even if you roll need?

 

You will still outroll them

 

Its more simple.

 

All who will equip it on their character roll need everyone else rolls greed.

 

If its offspecc as your 2nd specc once it comes you ask.

 

companion = no roll! = greed!

[Asavar]

ITT: Idiots saying companions matter as much as PCs.

[Setanian]

yes at workplace you have a right to spit in your bosses face aswell however many will consider it atleast unfriendly and will think of you as uncivilised and probably even mark you as ''that idiot''

 

I hope community is mature enough to do the same.

 

Irrelevant to the issue.

 

 

Entitlement is not same as what you are supposed to do.

 

You are claiming that is what I am supposed to do, how-ever your claim does not make it fact. I do not play a game to play it your way, no more than you play it my way.

 

Its the law of community

 

Please point me to these laws? I am unaware of any laid down laws, legal or otherwise to which you refer. Oh, you can't? So just more supposition on your part?

 

that you will eventually have to bend or be outcasted by majority

 

Do you have facts or figures to back up this 'majority' count?

 

of those better players.

 

More supposition. Where is it stated they are better players? Is there a text book definition that describes the difference between and the rules to which they regulate themselves?

 

 

its as simple as that

 

This is your opinion, nothing more.

[Marmerus]

It's not a ninja if he can use it including the companion. Companions are part of the game so you might want to just get used to that fact. I know I won't hesitate even for a second to need on a item for my companions.

You get 6 companions so in other words BW should remove the greed button from the game. Hell they should remove rolling for items since everyone needs everything for their character, companion or for some extra credits.

[Setanian]

ITT: Idiots saying companions matter as much as PCs.

 

I don't know what ITT means so I'll skip that.

 

It's acceptable practice to label everyone that does not agree with you as being idiots? I'm pretty sure you get warnings for tossing blanket insults around.

[hushia]

If a nice item drops that both you *and* your companion can use, will you wear it on your character or on your companion?

 

If the answer is that it won't matter, you can roll need for companions in instances. Allthough I'd call you a liar

Edited January 14, 2012 by hushia

[xhaiquan]

On Tarris group of 16 level 32-37 take down ancient one world boss.

 

3 agents in group. A nice purple protype drops clearly meant for agents. All roll need.

 

A sith assasin also rolls need and wins, saying he needed it for his companion.

 

 

***

 

 

Wow, I had no idea this thread would cause such a debate.

[BlueRahja]

Read a lot of posts, by a lot of people justifying their actions because there is nothing in place to stop them, or because loot isn't that important, or because companions are an extension of themselves, regardless of the fact that companions are nowhere near as effective as a player.

 

But what people fail to realize is that this isn't really an argument about who needs what, or if companions deserve a shot at player loot. The core of this argument is how we treat each other as anonymous avatars. Regardless of which side of the the companion need debate are right, the fact is we need to respect each other enough to communicate. So if you join a group, and you plan to roll need for your companion, you don't wait for the loot to hit the ground before you let your party know that's going to be the way things are. Obviously, there are enough threads about the subject, and you have had enough encounters to know, that people caught off guard by this specific behavior tend to get pissed off.

 

So, if you don't let people know ahead of time that you intend to roll need for any reason other then the conventional reasons, then you were masking your intentions, which is at its core, dishonest. If you think you are so right about it, then say it up front. If you are kicked from groups for your beliefs, stand strong by them, or learn from other peoples reactions.

 

There are a lot of arguments in favor of rolling need for your companions. I don't agree with them, but I support them. But these people need to realize, their actions are the ones that make people unhappy. Nobody is ever going to be angry because someone only rolled need for themselves. So, if you want to roll need on every little thing you see, simply own up to your habit before looting begins, so that nobody has to feel like they were deceived, or disrespected.

[Setanian]

So, if you don't let people know ahead of time that you intend to roll need for any reason other then the conventional reasons, then you were masking your intentions, which is at its core, dishonest.

 

In what way is it dishonest for me to roll how I like? I helped, I am entitled to roll how I like, I do not need to inform anyone or gain their approval.

 

If you think you are so right about it, then say it up front. If you are kicked from groups for your beliefs, stand strong by them, or learn from other peoples reactions.

 

I do think I am right, and I don't have to tell anyone anything before nor after. It is my business how I roll not your or anyone else's. I don't see why I have to conform to some made up request you decide to drop on me.

 

There are a lot of arguments in favor of rolling need for your companions. I don't agree with them, but I support them. But these people need to realize, their actions are the ones that make people unhappy. Nobody is ever going to be angry because someone only rolled need for themselves. So, if you want to roll need on every little thing you see, simply own up to your habit before looting begins, so that nobody has to feel like they were deceived, or disrespected.

 

And people need to realize, that just because they feel unhappy because I roll whatever way I want does not give them any rights. Players in a group all have the same equal rights regardless of origin, color or player class.

 

I don't have to tell you anything before or during the group about my roll habits. Frankly, it is none of your business.

 

If you feel that I should in some way offer you more benefit because of your class, you are mistaken. We all helped to kill the mob, we all get the right to roll for loot. Why should it be any different?