Democratus Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Where I come from, "grinding" means killing mobs for XP with no quest involved at all. SWTOR is certainly free of any need to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genpion Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) Where I come from, "grinding" means killing mobs for XP with no quest involved at all. SWTOR is certainly free of any need to do that. Are you fine with running for your life and under attack from A to B ? And typically the enemies follow you and you can not enter story sections while being under attack. I typically die with 2 or 3 mobs attacking me. So you have to fight unrelated to your quest. Besides: I have done "quests" just for the purpose of leveling up for story sections. Why would a Sith Lord help random people and for a tiny budget ? Edited January 9, 2012 by genpion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redshirtricky Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Tired of all the "Grinding" you have to do in the game itself? Then feel free to participate in "Forum Wars, The Old Debates!" FWTOD will have all the name-calling, strawman arguments, rudeness, vitriol, and open ended Person Versus Person battles that leave both parties raging and feeling unsatisfied! Tired of killing womprats and shooting TIE fighters aboard your ship? Look no further than FWTOD! Oh look! Instead of pressing keys on your keyboard to defeat pixelated NPCs, you can now press keys on your keyboard to insult another forum poster because you didn't agree with his definition of "grind!" So much fun! So much abuse! It hurts so gooooooood, master! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthKhaos Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 The main reason why I would agree with the OP is because most of these "side quests" (Not class quest) can be completed in passing. you don't even have to think about it unless there's a lot of people in the area killing EVERYTHING. You need to get A drop or B drop, kill X or Y amount of mobs that you happen to be running past that will agro you anyway and you end up killing em just to get to your class quest objective. The only quests I really have to go out of my way to do are the Heroic Quests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democratus Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Are you fine with running for your life and under attack from A to B ? And typically the enemies follow you and you can not enter story sections while being under attack. I typically die with 2 or 3 mobs attacking me. So you have to fight unrelated to your quest. This has never happened to me in SWTOR. Not even on Nar Shadda, which requires a great deal of running around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riotus Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 The grind is still there, just the people who cant read not need to read the quests any more. Voice over does not remove the grind, you still have to go kill x rats, y snakes, and z bears, they are just named rakghoul, rakghoul, and rakgoul now ugh... damn taris.... i swear that place is the 9th circle of hell..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norumaniac Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I agree that having a "class quest" is really cool and a great concept. But every other quest in the game requires LOTS of patience to kill so many mobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reecelol Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkimor Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 5/5 Flesh Raiders killed. Updating... 5...4...3...2...1.. BONUS QUEST! 0/45 Flesh Raiders killed Welcome to your grind-free experience. Boom. Headshot. This thing is grindtastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genpion Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) This has never happened to me in SWTOR. Not even on Nar Shadda, which requires a great deal of running around. I am surprised because I stumble over enemies every 20 meters since the start of the game. Dromund Kaas and Korriban are ok. But Nar Shadda and also Coruscant (smuggler, trooper) are good examples of things being wrong. I guess the mobs are statically placed. So it might be that other players have killed the mobs already when you were there. Since many players would whine about empty areas, I would suggest a PVE ON and OFF switch, like for PVP. This would solve the fighting problems while running. But finally, I whish to have teleporters to already discovered locations and (group) missions. Edited January 9, 2012 by genpion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthFreki Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 in today's MMO everyone whines about a grind. I have not seen a grind since Everquest 1. Grind in mmo now is hey you want exp? I'll give you a mission/quest give you coin, and experience oh hey i might throw in some gear. and i want you to do X, kill Y and come back to me for your reward. Grind in Everquest 1 was much different. you had your quest like the above but then there were times when you didn't have a quest and needed to level to get another, so you just went into the wild and killed things for just the loot they dropped and or exp they offered. that's it. I laugh at everyone that says the former is a grind because there is a reward to do it, nothing says you have to do it over and over and over and over. that is a personal choice and one YOU make not one that is forced upon you. i have found no quest so far in SWTOR that makes you come back and do another copy of the same quest in order to progress your story line at all. now if you want to do something over and over then you are the one choosing to and you whine because of a personal choice... but yet you forget the days when mmo's actually made you WORK and understand. now I mean this: before eq2/wow/coh you had no quest tracker, you had no flag over an npc's head, you had no mission tab where items for your quests would go. you had to make space in your bank or personal inventory and remember what quests you were on with nothing to remind you but your own notes outside the game, and what is in your inventory. you actually had to "hail" the npc not just right click the npc to get your quest and to get the quest you had to trigger it by a key word or phrase. and you had to read and interact. The meaning of Role Playing Games are numerous but mmo's have gone from true role playing to basic story line with a chance to role play with other humans only. matter of a fact rpg computer games have never been about role playing but story playing... should be called SPG's not RPG's. Give me paper, pencil and dice any day Darth Freki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntellect Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I dunno, I play RPGs *FOR* the grind. But the key to me is all in the execution. I dont mind killing 'things' over and over to level as long as the combat engine is decent and there is an eventual point/goal to reach afterwards. One of my favorite grinding RPGs was Dragon quest. Walking from the castle to a dungeon usually resulted in hundreds of 'repeatable' and often classified 'boring' fights. But that was the challenge, how far could you go towards the dungeon before your resources were depleted and you were forced to go back somewhere and heal. I think this aspect of RPGs (grinding or however you want define it) has been missing recently. Most of the console RPGs have really turned into FPS with story, which while fun really take away from the role playing element (namely, managing gear, resources, etc). To me the draw has always been the quest. Seeing new 'stuff' be it a new world, new lore, etc. And working (i.e. grinding) to get to the next point. What draws me to TOR are 3 things. Star Wars Lore (as Im a fan), incredibly fun combat, and decent exploration (would like the worlds to be a bit more open). Where I detract is my assumption that I will be bored after level 50. What do I do after I finish my Jedi Sentinel story?? Being new to MMOs in general Im not to keen on doing flashpoints or raids over and over again. To me that would get boring. What can I quest for next? Im hoping BioWare has the ability to add new (quality) features and content on a consistent basis to support my justification for subscription. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadSquabbles Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 i haven't seen a grind either. grinding is when you spend days in an area grinding away on mobs. play any of the "hard core" mmorpgs and you'll see a grind, esp in them korean ones. i did grind for a while because i got bored of doing missions, so spend a few days just killing mobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
someotherguyy Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 IMO the story line quests are great i really like the cinematics (if i wanted to watch a movie though i would watch one). the side quests ... I play mmos to pvp so leveling is just a grind to me no matter how im leveling (questing being the hardest to get through) that being said i also dont like how long it takes to level (keep in mind i do every warzone i possibly can not very good xp compared to quests but WAAAAAAAY MORE FUN!!!) it seemed like it took forever to get to the level 40 pvp armor which i really like and felt tougher when i achieved i also feel like i accomplished something because it took me a month to achieve, story line quests are amazing but not enough of them to level on by themselves. Doesn't look so good for an alt. I like the game just would like to see faster leveling maybe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warultima Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) Ok enough talk now guys. Lets take to this pretty NPC right here that actually talks!!! And she vividly told me that I need to go kill 15 boars then collect 10 wolf pelts. Yea I am sure the grind is dead because the NPCs make human noise. Edited March 30, 2012 by warultima Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjmc Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) 5/5 Flesh Raiders killed. Updating... 5...4...3...2...1.. BONUS QUEST! 0/45 Flesh Raiders killed Welcome to your grind-free experience. The great thing about bonus quests is that you can choose not to do them. If seeing 0/45 makes you want to not bother, then don't. However, if it isn't going to take too much work, you do get a good reward for finishing them. Most non-bonus quests do not require a large number of kills. Kill 10 enemies isn't a grind if the enemies are easy to find and there are lots of them. Grind is when you have to kill 10 enemy mobs and there are only 4 of them in the world and they respawn every 20 minutes (or longer). Grind is when those 4 mobs are camped by 30 people. SWTOR doesn't have this problem. There are lots of mobs and they respawn quickly. You can choose to just kill the first mob repeatedly. Grind is when you need to kill wolves endless to get enough xp to get to level 16. You are too weak to kill level 17 mobs and level 15 mobs hardly give xp. The only mobs in the world that are level 16 are wolves. Grind is when there are not enough quests to get to the next tier of quests. Most quests in SWTOR can be completed in 10-15 minutes, which means that don't in any way feel "daunting". The exceptions are generally the major planet quests, and each planet only has one major planet quest line (and you don't have to do it) Grind was eliminated by providing plenty of ways to get xp (pvp warzones, heroic quests, side quests, flashpoints), each of which can be done alone or in combination with others. The only thing you have to do is your class quest -- and it doesn't usually involve extremely long individual segments. If there are non-class quests you don't want to do, don't do them. Edited March 30, 2012 by sjmc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaiahsdad Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 The great thing about bonus quests is that you can choose not to do them. If seeing 0/45 makes you want to not bother, then don't. However, if it isn't going to take too much work, you do get a good reward for finishing them. Most non-bonus quests do not require a large number of kills. Kill 10 enemies isn't a grind if the enemies are easy to find and there are lots of them. Grind is when you have to kill 10 enemy mobs and there are only 4 of them in the world and they respawn every 20 minutes (or longer). Grind is when those 4 mobs are camped by 30 people. SWTOR doesn't have this problem. There are lots of mobs and they respawn quickly. You can choose to just kill the first mob repeatedly. Grind is when you need to kill wolves endless to get enough xp to get to level 16. You are too weak to kill level 17 mobs and level 15 mobs hardly give xp. The only mobs in the world that are level 16 are wolves. Grind is when there are not enough quests to get to the next tier of quests. Most quests in SWTOR can be completed in 10-15 minutes, which means that don't in any way feel "daunting". The exceptions are generally the major planet quests, and each planet only has one major planet quest line (and you don't have to do it) Grind was eliminated by providing plenty of ways to get xp (pvp warzones, heroic quests, side quests, flashpoints), each of which can be done alone or in combination with others. The only thing you have to do is your class quest -- and it doesn't usually involve extremely long individual segments. If there are non-class quests you don't want to do, don't do them. lol holy necro batman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aethusa Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Grind and quest objectives are two different things ! Quest objective: Go kill 20 mobs for reward.Grind: Go find best spot and kill 500 mobs for level up. This is my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gokkus Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Aargh undead thread! Begone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notebene Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Aargh undead thread! Begone! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalissimo_Francisco_Franco_is_still_dead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goladsu Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 The great thing about bonus quests is that you can choose not to do them. If seeing 0/45 makes you want to not bother, then don't. However, if it isn't going to take too much work, you do get a good reward for finishing them. QUOTE] Agreed you can choose to not do the bonus quest but the grinding forced grinding is still there - For all the pluses this game has - and there are a lot - they thing that is seriously making me doubt whether I'll bother staying subscribed is the ridiculous amount of trash you have to pass through to get a quest done. There is very little finese involved in this game. Trash is situated so you can't circumvent and must go through. Granted I will say not in all cases but more times than not you have to fight everything in your path. Seldom are they single trash as well. A group of 4 or so spread out across the entrance or hallway seems to be the norm. Lacking any true AoD in melee range it's a painful process fighting over and over and over and over and over and over groups of 3-4 whateevers - one at a time. Maybe as you level (currently mid 30's you gain abilities. 10-15 minutes per quest - lololololol - sorry maybe in the early levels. it is taking all night to level one level in this game, but not surprising it is a game that makes money by the month. I would rather have more quests and less trash - (there is an abundance of quests - a definite plus) but I seldom do the all because I out level them to make them worth while. This game is in it's infancy I understand this, but i will restate it - such an interesting storyline destroyed by the boredom of the forced grind. and ADD a random Flashpoint finder! I have invited friends to play and they wont join - they've tried the 7 day, so I am told because of the trash numbers. and then when you goto leave - you get to do it all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogozhi Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Play an alt of the same faction where 85%+ of the quests are the same and you'll rediscover the grind. I'm finding it very hard to finish any of the planets 100% and have started to leave chunks of them for my alts. I find with the exp from PvP and the occasional space mission, I'm over leveled pretty quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaymanus Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 I'm finding it very hard to finish any of the planets 100% and have started to leave chunks of them for my alts. I find with the exp from PvP and the occasional space mission, I'm over leveled pretty quick. ^ This. I don't get how people can do ALL of the quests on a planet. On my Smuggler alt by the time I got to Nar Shaddaa I was able to ONLY do my story missions and skip EVERY other quest because of the level I was from the previous planet quests. Also it has been said but I will back it up again. People are miss using the term grind, doing quests to kill x or go to y or find Paul and give him a trumpet is NOT grinding. If that was grinding then every game ever created would be a grind, seriously what other types of quests are there in ANY GAME that do not adhere to the above? Grinding is when there are not enough quests to keep up with the leveling curve so you are forced to stand in an area and kill the same mobs over and over again for XP (or this simply provides more XP that questing therefor being a quicker method of leveling). I have NEVER had to do this in TOR and it simply would not give you the same experience as just questing, so grinding is not really present in TOR as it has been in other MMO's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 (edited) the great thing about bonus quests is that you can choose not to do them. If seeing 0/45 makes you want to not bother, then don't. However, if it isn't going to take too much work, you do get a good reward for finishing them. agreed you can choose to not do the bonus quest but the grinding forced grinding is still there - for all the pluses this game has - and there are a lot - they thing that is seriously making me doubt whether i'll bother staying subscribed is the ridiculous amount of trash you have to pass through to get a quest done. There is very little finese involved in this game. Trash is situated so you can't circumvent and must go through. Granted i will say not in all cases but more times than not you have to fight everything in your path. Seldom are they single trash as well. A group of 4 or so spread out across the entrance or hallway seems to be the norm. Lacking any true aod in melee range it's a painful process fighting over and over and over and over and over and over groups of 3-4 whateevers - one at a time. Maybe as you level (currently mid 30's you gain abilities). I've been able to circumvent many mobs on the trip from 1-50 and as you get higher in level, there is space around the roads. In fact, I have not seen these tightly packed trash mobs that are so completely in the way everywhere that I cannot get around them. Sometimes a straight line isn't the fastest line of travel. In fact, there is a lot of finesse involved in this game. 10-15 minutes per quest - lololololol - sorry maybe in the early levels. I'm sure I finished a few quests at level 50 on Belsavis in 15ish minutes each. It's hard to say since I take 5 quests, and then go do them all before turning them in. It is taking all night to level one level in this game, but not surprising it is a game that makes money by the month. I would rather have more quests and less trash - (there is an abundance of quests - a definite plus) but i seldom do the all because i out level them to make them worth while. This game is in it's infancy i understand this, but i will restate it - such an interesting storyline destroyed by the boredom of the forced grind. There is no forced grind: it's in your mind because you want it to be there, but it isn't. And add a random flashpoint finder! I have invited friends to play and they wont join - they've tried the 7 day, so i am told because of the trash numbers. And then when you goto leave - you get to do it all over again. There's this thing called quick travel...I've stopped myself a couple times remembering...I don't have to...I can quick travel back the quest NPCs...silly me. Edited March 31, 2012 by terminova Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikalonius Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 It was awesome mccool the first time i did it, but since there is nothing much to do, and I've done it for two other characters, and working on a fourth, it's not so much not a grind anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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