Daeborn Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Why do people consider TOR a single player experience? I don't understand. They don't have anyone to play with is why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightblaster Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 The LFD is exactly as "multiplayer" as your companion is. Also, was WoW single player back when grinding was the best method of leveling? WoW driven MMO ADHD...sad. I'm not condoning it, I am describing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeborn Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 ^ This People who are in the higher lvls are still few. When on higher lvl planets there isn't too many people. That's to do with your game play and not the fact you can't group. Start a new toon and you'll find plenty to group with. Takes some initiative and makes some friends. You people are lazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manakar Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I am lvl 34 and I have not seen or needed anyone to help me for days.. I always see 20 to 60 people on my map as far as the number in the UI but I never run into them or ever need them to do anything.. its like a SP game with a chat room Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudanie Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 People who are in the higher lvls are still few. When on higher lvl planets there isn't too many people. That's to do with your game play and not the fact you can't group. Start a new toon and you'll find plenty to group with. Takes some initiative and makes some friends. You people are lazy. You don't get it. Of course you can find a group, sometimes quickly, sometimes it takes a while. Massive (part of MMO) isn't just being able to get 3 people together for a flashpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vydor_HC Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Here is my question: why does it have to be ''required'' to group to feel like a multiplayer game? What is this ''requirement'' crap anyway? I plan this game to have fun, it's not a job, I don't try to get to 50 in the quickest way possible. If people want to get to 50 solo, good luck, it's possible I guess. But the game is clearly meant to be played with others. The conversation system, heroics, everything points to that. That's kinda the issue, with how an MMO has gone from a grouping shared experience that was predominate in older games, to the now solo type games that are popping up. Games in the past that required grouping were not JOBs, they were fun, tremendously fun, but you needed to group with others to accomplish the important parts of the game. The games were built around the concept of many players playing many roles needed to get to the end game and succeed. No longer that way...and this one is much further on the solo-first metric than any other I've played. Thus it fosters the feeling that the other players around you are nothing more than NPCs with their own dialog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfsauce Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) 3. No attempt what-so-ever from BW to encourage community building. No server forums, no guild functions, instancing/sharding, no chat bubbles, list goes on and on. Those are the reasons why this game feels mostly single-player TO ME. I feel we need server forums too, but the fact of the matter is, they're not really a priority in the attempt of making a community. Remember, there are more people that don't look at the forums than people that do. Community building is encouraged by constant in-game interaction on a server; nothing more nothing less. The discouragement in that realm is that there are phases everywhere, so you don't see people as often as you should be. Chat bubbles are a personal matter, not a community one. Edited January 7, 2012 by Smurfsauce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teakbois Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 You don't get it. Of course you can find a group, sometimes quickly, sometimes it takes a while. Massive (part of MMO) isn't just being able to get 3 people together for a flashpoint. Then why not get people together to take down a world boss? What other MMO had low level world bosses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiyoshie Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 in that case, wow is a single player game to. As are Aion, AoC, EQ2, Rift...etc. It's a dumb argument and anyone who makes it is trolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vydor_HC Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) No you missed what i said. it is faster to level in a group, you can still access story quests, there are social points and teirs to encourage groups, and there is heroic content and flashpoints. I have not had an issue finding a group either. So for me i have had zero issues with this being too much like a single player game. For me it has been very group friendly. The fact that others enjoy it as a more solo experience is fine because i am still having a great group experience. I do not need the game to force everyone into my category, even if i think it is superior. Nah, over the long haul, it's more beneficial, faster and easier to do things solo. The grouping mechanism is really a side bar aspect. I'm not saying you can't group or that grouping doesn't provide certain benefits...but those do not override the greater and easier and more convent method of going it alone. Edited January 7, 2012 by Vydor_HC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinze Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 It's not hate, it's called opinion. Don't be a saddam hussain and dictate the public's decision to like this game. You have to be a blind goat to not see this game is a single player game that offers literally nothing. I'm level 36 and hating my life. If I wanted to play an RPG, I would go play skyrim. Because of Star Wars and me loving the history, I'm stuck playing htis piece of crap. But your not stuck at all. *Points to the door* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KippTabor Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 @OP: People want to hate so they come up with anything they can to hate with. Yep, pretending to be a disaffected hater earns you street cred with other haters. You don't have to say anything with even a grain of truth to it - the other trolls will suck it up no matter what was actually said, because you see, it's not about the actual truth - it's about impressing other pasty, scrawny kids who also don't get outside enough. I blame the parents. So I'll chalk it up to youth and peer pressure, not that all youth are mindless trollkins looking for lulz and validation as a human being from other trollkins - who likely also haven't left mom and dad's house yet. They feel lost and powerless, so they must seek out pats on the back from other people pretending to be l33t and cynical. What a craven existence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teakbois Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Nah, over the long haul, it's more beneficial, faster and easier to do things solo. The grouping mechanism is really a side bar aspect. I'm not saying you can't group or that grouping doesn't provide certain benefits...but those do not override the greater and easier and more convent method of going it alone. A constant 2 hour group questing will earn more experience than a constant two hour solo questing session. The only drawbak, and this has existed in just about every MMO known to man including groupcentric ones like EQ1, is that your wealth and tradeskills will suffer a little. Credits come easily enough though that it shouldnt be an issue, and you can tradeskill while you group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lycrates Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Because compared to every other MMO they have ever played, this game is far more invested in the single player experience. /agree, and here is why; 1) in SWTOR you are worse off if other players are also questing in the same area: The quest mechanics are such that other players can steal your kill or delay you from reaching your objective; 2) to solve this problem, Bioware has implemented Sharding, which makes it so that there is never a decent amount of people around; 3) furthermore, the gameworld is designed as a series of corridors that segregates people; 4) and finally the game works against you if you would like to find groups. Also, there are no tools to help you in creating a group. Spamming chat is the only way to find other people. I think i might create a thread on this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vydor_HC Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) A constant 2 hour group questing will earn more experience than a constant two hour solo questing session. The only drawbak, and this has existed in just about every MMO known to man including groupcentric ones like EQ1, is that your wealth and tradeskills will suffer a little. Credits come easily enough though that it shouldnt be an issue, and you can tradeskill while you group. It's always been that way....sustained exp vs short bursts. The need to group fosters making players choose that method. This game doesn't. The sustained faster exp comes from soloing, plus the game encourages soloing with it's design. Grouping over the long haul here is less productive. But to your point about the exp here in groups. From what I've seen the group bonuses here simply make up for the lack of exp due to sharing kills. I've have not yet seen the benefit in groups, quite the opposite actually. It's far more effective for me to jump in the game, do the daily pvps, space missions and jump into questing which requires no grouping at all and I can still do what's needed, then to gather players, sync up our quests, time lines and play while we are all online. Over the course of playtime, I will be way more efficient and easier doing it solo. Plus given that the game puts people in a solo first mentality, it adds to the effort of grouping. Edited January 7, 2012 by Vydor_HC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feskitt Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Because some players get all warm and fuzzy inside when they see other players in their questing areas. They especially like it when everyone has to camp around some NPC or node respawn point and ninja-gank the thing. BW did the right thing in allowing one to experience a heroic story leveling experience solo if one so chooses, and people who use MMOs to compensate for having no social lives are angry because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattdontbeahero Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I think a single player experience is needed for this kind game. It's an mmo in the sense of teaming up with others on certain objectives, flash point missions, etc, as well as the pvp and end-game experience, but the story itself is supposed to center around the exploits of your character, not the collective of those around you. Sure, there are some moment where you can or want to share the glory, but for the most part the story focuses around you. WoW never made you feel that way because any game changing moment was accompanied by tons of other people, only for the main boss to be killed off by someone else, or other people constantly sharing the credit with you. I prefer to be a bad *** on my own and have my own story, and not share it with others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teakbois Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 /agree, and here is why; 1) in SWTOR you are worse off if other players are also questing in the same area: The quest mechanics are such that other players can steal your kill or delay you from reaching your objective; 2) to solve this problem, Bioware has implemented Sharding, which makes it so that there is never a decent amount of people around; 3) furthermore, the gameworld is designed as a series of corridors that segregates people; 4) and finally the game works against you if you would like to find groups. Also, there are no tools to help you in creating a group. Spamming chat is the only way to find other people. I think i might create a thread on this 1) So you invite them to your group, same as other games 2) There are still more people in an average swtor than you find in other games. These zones have over 100 people in them before they open a second. If there are only 60 people in your zone its likely not due to sharding. but go find one level 1-49 zone in any other MMO on the market that has 100 people in it. 3) Huh? Are you referring to quest hubs? Or the occasional group areas? I dont get this point at all, but then I have never seen a lack of socializing or people in my gameplay experience (Lord Ardraas server, both factions) 4) The game works against the lazy. LFG toggle with comment is really sufficient for grou forming, if people would actually use it. The tool is there. I certainly have no issue forming groups, but maybe thats because I form them instead of just wait for it to happen. Something I learned back in 2000: easiest way to get groups is to make one yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigtimm Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Say what you want, I know I'm going to: Star Wars to me feels like a Single player game with some multiplayer content, rather than an MMO. 1. The Planets feel emp[ty, mostly due to sharding, the instanced nature of most quests, and the seperation between the factions. On most of the low planets you won't ever encounter the other faction. On some others you can invade their questing zones, but the game never gives you a good reason to do so. This gets better at higher levels, but at higher levels you run into the no one else is your level problem. Also BW has said they will eventually fix/get rid of/do something with sharding, but for now it makes some people feel isolated. 2. The de-emphasis on what some people consider traditional MMO staples. Bio-ware has emphasized story. Story is a staple of single player games. Bioware has de-emphasized commerce, raiding, competative pvp, which are what keep some people paying monthly subscriptions to a game. Note, I am not saying story is bad, I think some of the voice acting drags on way to long, and is poorly directed but that's a different complaint for a different thread. 3. The lack of tools to customize the game. The MMO that I have played have over time made a lot of the way that the players interact with the game, able to be changed to one extent or another. That is totally absent in this game, apparently by design. You may like the interface, you may like me hate it. I would hope that we could however agree that the interface is very static. 4.Tone, and this is the hardest one to define. I have played MMOs, and I have played a bunch of single player games from Bioware. This feels very much like a single player Bioware game. Its not something that I at least can quantify. Hell if this game had been sold as a single player game, I would have bought and been happy with it. But I was sold a Star Wars MMORPG, and for me it feels like the MMO aspects are not done nearly as well as the RPG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teakbois Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 2. The de-emphasis on what some people consider traditional MMO staples. Bio-ware has emphasized story. Story is a staple of single player games. Bioware has de-emphasized commerce, raiding, competative pvp, which are what keep some people paying monthly subscriptions to a game. Note, I am not saying story is bad, I think some of the voice acting drags on way to long, and is poorly directed but that's a different complaint for a different thread. See I 100% disagree with there being a de-emphasis. They de-emphasize raiding yet the first patch is adding 4 new raid bosses? I do think the high level crew skills need some work but i dont think there is an overall de-emphasis on commerce. Just some poor balance. And I think more people want something like (a much better functioning) Illum than some kind of PvP epeen ranking system (that is far from an MMO staple). I think Bioware's inexperience in a few areas shows, but to me the intent was clearly take a tradtional MMO experience (WoW) and add story to it, which is exactly what they did. they didnt take anything away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobaTed Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 The only way I could justify buying this game is by treating it like eight RPGs in one. Ironically, however, I've grouped more in this game than I did the entire time I played WoW... The MMO portion is there if you want it, to about the same degree as BC WoW - maybe even a little more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teakbois Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 The MMO portion is there if you want it, to about the same degree as BC WoW - maybe even a little more. this^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 As the title suggests, I don't really understand. I'm a little new to MMOs, but certainly not single players. Am I missing something? A lof of people are finding that when you have to socialize to get into social groups, it's much harder than pushing a few buttons. Since those buttons don't exist in this game, it's now on the player to find groups. For a lot of cagey MMO vets, or just you know, nice people looking to play a game with other people, it's not much of an issue. For some folks used to a certain amount of anti-social behavior mixed with buttons that spoon feed the mutliplayer interface to them, this is "unacceptable" and so they're bashing the game for forcing them to talk to people to find a group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juntts Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) Mainly because people are having trouble finding groups due to sharding, and the planets feels empty to some people. Edited January 7, 2012 by Juntts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nomagon Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 the giant red cavern you see is where all the action is going and just like high priced clubs you're not invited. Epic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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