Darth_Sookie Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 One of the best classes in the game, just a l2p issue id say Yep. We are definately at the top. Best sustained mobility, great burst and tanky if we switch to soresu even in dps spec. Overall a great class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omninull Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 The class is flawed, It's like the people defending the Juggernaut in its current state are cult fanatics trying to defend the character of their beloved cult leader who's been accused of pedophilia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobaFurz Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) Not playing any Juggernaut or Marauder in higher levels, I wonder myself why you read so many different statements. Most comments you read about the juggernaut is about his awefull dmg output and weakness in pve and pvp, wheras on the other hand you rad that this class is like godlike and does even more dps than a marauder and other dps classes....somehow strange Or you read something like this here: plaing jugg in rage tree is almost as playing mara in same tree with comparable burst, mobility and aoe. So whats really going on, there should be already lvl 50ies out there with gear to comment on this ? Edited January 9, 2012 by BobaFurz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorkvid Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 The geared level 50s ARE commenting on this, and are saying how godlike the class is. Note how nearly all the people QQing about juggernauts start off by saying something like "I'm a lvl 28 jugg and..." or "I just hit 40 and this sucks!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beyondpower Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) Please keep on whining so I can own even more on my fully pvp geared rage specced jugg whenever they decide to "buff" us. Edited January 9, 2012 by Beyondpower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omninull Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 wheras on the other hand you rad that this class is like godlike and does even more dps than a marauder and other dps classes....somehow strange Because, they desire to be superior so badly, their judgement is clouded by the Derp side of the force. I've never been bothered by minor class inadequacies in any mmo to date, until I got my hands on a Juggernaut. The Juggernaut's name can only be revealed as some ironic twist to his actual ability. The discrepancy between being a fearsome warrior in the cutscenes to having to trigger all of his cds to barely come out on top against one of the tough elite storyline characters or when he has his hands full with npcs named "jedi apprentice" (or whatever) is huge. I don't feel like a ****** outside of his dialogue/cinematics. When the juggernaut has to time things enough to take out a group of normals +1 silver mob and come out with half hp, and two silver mobs are a gamble the Juggernaut. The big problem is that the juggernaut HAS to melee, but he's just about as tough as a bounty hunter who can easily kite with range, has massive aoe, and has multiple ccs, while the juggernaut chokes on pretzels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Areoss Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Those who think tanking is easy should quit comparing to WoW, or compare it when the game was actually challenging (remember your first Shattered Halls HM, then quit qqing). I was a Prot Warrior back in TBC. Shattered halls took about an hour. You needed 3 CC to be successful. You needed Rogues or hunters to go ahead and bring out the stealthers so they don't jump you and kill your healer. Most hunters were complete idiots though so that wasn't really that much of an option. I miss the game play back then, the level of difficulty definitely was brilliant. You also felt accomplished when you do it successfully. This is the closest to it. It requires more level of thought than "lolchargenuke". I enjoy difficult Tanking. I don't see other classes and think, damn they look so much easier... I want mine to be easier. Id prefer the challenge. Make their tanking harder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helagoth Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 So whats really going on, there should be already lvl 50ies out there with gear to comment on this ? There are. Several of them in this thread, saying that Juggs are fine for end game. Not one of the people saying they're broken have also said "and I'm doing end game content so I know". I was a member of the "wow somethings wrong here" club for my Jugg until I got to lvl 50 and got some remotely decent gear. Now I'm a member of the "OMG I'm an unstoppable killing machine" club. I was doing the assault the bridge warzone, and me and a healer guarded one door while the rest of the team guarded the other. We stopped them cold. Doing the Alderaan turret one, I guarded a turret by myself, and whenever they tried to attack it with 4+ guys, I was able to live until help arrived every time. 2 on 1 I'd just kill them. The hardest thing was to get out of the WoW mindset of "everything MUST be attacking me". I only need to hold the couple strongest mobs in a pack, and assign a kill order for the 2-3 weaker ones. Let the DPS chain wreck them rather than worry about holding them. My main concern is that without damage meters, I don't know how I rank against other tanks with damage done, which is a problem considering some of the tight enrage timers. We were doing heroic Black Talon, and got to the enrage on 2 bosses (still downed them though by popping CD's). Was it because of me or because of the dps or a bit of both? I think that powertechs and assassins do more PvE dps as tanks, but of course I don't know for sure. The equivalently geared/skilled powertech in my guild is on a ski trip, when he gets back, we're gonna go time how long it takes us to get a low level world boss to ~25% and we'll see who does it faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Areoss Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Because, they desire to be superior so badly, their judgement is clouded by the Derp side of the force. I've never been bothered by minor class inadequacies in any mmo to date, until I got my hands on a Juggernaut. The Juggernaut's name can only be revealed as some ironic twist to his actual ability. The discrepancy between being a fearsome warrior in the cutscenes to having to trigger all of his cds to barely come out on top against one of the tough elite storyline characters or when he has his hands full with npcs named "jedi apprentice" (or whatever) is huge. I don't feel like a ****** outside of his dialogue/cinematics. When the juggernaut has to time things enough to take out a group of normals +1 silver mob and come out with half hp, and two silver mobs are a gamble the Juggernaut. The big problem is that the juggernaut HAS to melee, but he's just about as tough as a bounty hunter who can easily kite with range, has massive aoe, and has multiple ccs, while the juggernaut chokes on pretzels. I'm struggling to understand this? You like pretzels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealityShow Posted January 10, 2012 Author Share Posted January 10, 2012 Yep. We are definately at the top. Best sustained mobility, great burst and tanky if we switch to soresu even in dps spec. Overall a great class. So please tell us or me how do you play this char. The most answers are like : "oh you cant play" or "this class is sooooo imba, highest dps output ever!" so please tell me how to play this class, because I didnt get it. My dmg output is just a joke, and if I come in range to hit an enemy they will knockback me. or just stun me till death. an imperial soldier make a backstep on me with 3900 crit then he stuns me and beat the **** out of me (most of his hits were over 2000), I had no chance to react to this attack. and my unleash was on cd. @the skilled players out there, please tell me how to play the juggernaut. how to make the epic dps output or his epic tank skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhyle Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) I love my Vengeance Jugg, at 34 now. I don't see the issue that other people are having with this tree, unless 40-50 is where the issues come in. I sometimes wonder if people are actually using the abilities they have or what, but people my level I've seen complain about not being able to kill elites; I kill them in front of them all the time and they are jaw dropped amazed. It's pretty easy, use your abilities and cool downs. It's really not hard. Maybe my perception will change when I'm in the 40-50 range, but right now, the only way I die is if the elite I'm fighting has a super ability, or I'm not paying attention to my health because I ran through 3 other groups and forgot to channel hatred. Other than that, I've seen no other issues. I've probably only died 5 times from 1-34, and those 5 times were to Vessex Ulgo on Alderaan, who for some reason used 5 abilities and killed me. I had to get help from our 50 sorc healer to kill him, and I was using all my cool downs and abilities on him and still got owned by him, and I was 3 levels above him. Anyway, the class and tree don't seem to be the issue, as one of the previous posters stated, it has to be something between the chair and the keyboard. Also, I've noticed using orange gear and making sure the mods are up to date in everything seriously helps. I don't understand why people wouldn't be using orange gear with mods. Just hampering yourself in my opinion. If there are bugs with the class, they will get fixed later on, they don't even remotely bother me. I love this class, and I always feel like a walking death machine, at all times. Edited January 10, 2012 by Vhyle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TehPenGu Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Hey guys! Mind if i lean in? Good! Use that rage I've rolled a jugg, on The Shadow Runner. My "Main" is a 44 merc (bounty hunter), which I have spent many hrs on in both PvP and PvE. What I want to do is share my impressions with these two classes. Tho they can hardly be compared, their experience is very different. As a Merc, I have played both healer and dps at lvl>40. Meaning I have acceses the top tier skills from the respective specs. Both of them I tested in PvP and PvE, and I was amazed how far from my expections I was taken. Arsenal (Dps) spec is much the same in PvE and PvP. You will do Tracer - Tracer - unload - tracer - missiles - tracer - rail and within this rotation you use unload whenever it gets reset from talents. The damage on this rotation is, ridicolous at best. Tracer hits for 1.6k - 1.8k, crits for 2.1k - 2.6k. Unload is a steady 2-3k dmg in total, and missies hits for roughly the same as tracer, with no cast time, and crits for over 3.5k. Great! You'd say. A ton of dmg! How fun! ****, I thought. I'm gonna get bored soon. I did, quickly. The rotations are, lacking. Not any room for smart thinking and making interesting rotations at all. Pyro seems more compelling in PvP. Now as a medic, the PvE was more interesting. Lvling was crap, as you'd expect, but PvP became a ton of fun! I could hold stay alive against 2-3 opponents when I popped my cooldowns! No dmg what so ever, but that matters little in PvP with a co-ordinated team Okay, wall of text there, and I'm not done. The jugg I'm lvling is getting a tank spec for now. I'm looking forwards to trying a different spec in PvP laters, but for lvling tanking works, and gives acces to grps. The PvE part is good, having some aggro issues in grps, but that is mostly caused by morons focusing fire on the wrong targets. I know that I'll get more helpfull skills to make it easier later, so I'm not to concerned. In PvP its godly. I freaking LOVE jumping around in Hutball, which was a true pain on my merc. I could push ppl around, sure, but with smart play a warrior can save his CD and jump right back in there The jumping is one thing, but utilising chilling scream, intercept and your full arsenal of skills give you more utility than just beeing a turret or a dagger. The jugg part is a bit short, mainly because I have not gotten that far on him, but I expect I'll max him before I revisit my merc. Conclution: Jugg takes more play to handle, you can't just do a rotation and think that will save you. Gotta prepare for anything, and bring your skills into play. There is a wast amount of abilities to utilise to your advantage, and if played right, I deem the jugg to be the true king of PvP. Possibly if Bio gets their **** together and does something with the simoultanious 2.5k heals and deals of the current sorc, but I'll save that rant for some other day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uvirith Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The class is flawed, It's like the people defending the Juggernaut in its current state are cult fanatics trying to defend the character of their beloved cult leader who's been accused of pedophilia. Youre a douchebag, I´m considering nominating you to the title most douchy douchebag of the year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumsfeld Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I play a level 50 Immortal Juggernaut and I'm an experienced tank. There are serious flaws with the Juggernaut advanced class as a tank. Specifically, the threat generation is extremely poor. If you are interested in tanking hardmodes, you should consider rolling a Powertech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonoftw Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I think that powertechs and assassins do more PvE dps as tanks, but of course I don't know for sure. The equivalently geared/skilled powertech in my guild is on a ski trip, when he gets back, we're gonna go time how long it takes us to get a low level world boss to ~25% and we'll see who does it faster. Who says you have to be in immortal spec to tank? Rage or even vengence are fine tanks for hardmode FPs.. Just because a tree says its for tanking doesnt mean you have to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anatlos Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 It's pretty easy, use your abilities and cool downs. It's really not hard. 'Nuff said, right there. I have 24 abilities mapped to hotkeys, and use all of them quite often depending on the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthHarlem Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Well, my juggernaut is level 44 now and I love the class. Every time I play, I learn a bit more but personally, I'm still trying to play the class better. I'm getting my groove more and move and in pve and pvp, I do well. I'm actually vengenance specced and like it so far. I can say that I have been in the same area as juggs that were higher level than me dying to mobs that I could flatten. Skill? Gear? Who knows. Either way, I'm sure that playstyle comes into affect and I do not think the class is a joke. If anything, lot of the other classes are just easier. My jugg can hit pretty hard so it makes me wonder if I'm just doing something right compared to the ones posting in this thread saying the class sucks. Who knows, there are no experts yet, so time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muldias Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 This ^. I just made a Operative (i wanna know the story of the Imperial Agent) and i just noticed on Warzones that i can make 6 medals easy as hell at lvl11. I was able to kill two times the most strongest SI Assasin i've seen on my server (Hex Droid) with a little help. Its just to damn stupid. An operative can heal 3k crit since lvl11 (i DID it), can dps crit as melee for 3k (against non pvp-geared people) and can easily beat anyone at higher levels). Juggernauts are supposed to be the Sith Warriors, like Darth Vader, unbeateables, but they are more like Kit Fisto, just die in a pathetic way against a melee inquisitor :/.... melee crit for 3k at lvl 11? no. i'm a 50 op, and that doesn't happen at level 11. sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts