Lazorous Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 If a mod breaks it's more of an issue of having to set up the default UI and all your keybinds that's the hassle. Not that people can't cope. How about you get over yourself pro? Most healer "mods" are UI customiztion. Raid Frame Mods like Grid allow a player to get info in a more effcient way than the stock UI Unit Frame Mods like Pitbull do the same for individual Unit frames. Mouseover targeting is built into WOW and doesn't require addons at all. Clique. Just allows for the use of Mouse clicks in the place of Keyboard Hot Keys. None of them play the game for you. They are simply alternatives to the stock setup. Uh no again. Perhaps you're not aware of all the heal mods. A lot of people use mods that assist with healing in an almost braindead manner. For example, if this target already has x buffs/Hots, then buff something else or heal with something else when I click this button. There are a lot of condition based mods. There's a lot of combinations of such mods that makes it incredibly simple to click one or two buttons and manage all the heals and buffs or cleanse they have. You don't seem to be highly aware of all the mods out there. Please don't assume you have details on what mods are used if you lack that knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrifKaylon Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) The game needs limited macro support at the very least. It would help a lot with CCing and a TON with companion management, as well as for activated abilities and self-buffs. It also needs a target of target panel built into the UI. And a focus target. Just quality of life things. There are plenty of ways to prevent people from using it to seriously automate their gameplay. I think it should support a customizable UI as well - at the very least, a UI scaler. Right now that thing is so big that it hurts my eyes. Edited January 4, 2012 by TrifKaylon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazorous Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) What drawbacks? Fact: Anyone can use mods. Hence: If the game changes to accomodate mods, anyone can use those mods, so the playing field remains equal. You may choose not to use mods, that's your choice, but your choice to handicap yourself is just that, handicapping yourself. You are making a personal choice to play without mods. So there are no drawbacks unless you personally create the drawbacks. You're missing a crucial point. By adding mods, to a game that didn't have it, you are in fact adding a handicap to those who don't wish to participate. As it stands, no one has that handicap, but you are proposing to add it, get it? And you just contradicted yourself by saying there are no drawbacks, but specifically said it is a handicap to those not using it. Really? Edited January 4, 2012 by Lazorous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Uh no again. Perhaps you're not aware of all the heal mods. A lot of people use mods that assist with healing in an almost braindead manner. For example, if this target already has x buffs/Hots, then buff something else or heal with something else when I click this button. There are a lot of condition based mods. There's a lot of combinations of such mods that makes it incredibly simple to click one or two buttons and manage all the heals and buffs or cleanse they have. You don't seem to be highly aware of all the mods out there. Please don't assume you have details on what mods are used if you lack that knowledge. Condition based mods are broken by game companies on purpose when they pop up. People like to forget that when a mod does come out that allows one button player, the game companies go out of their way to break the code that allowed that mod to function. Remember when Blizzard broke Decursive, and one button tanking, and all those other mods that did the same thing? One button "think for you" mods have been dead for half a decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidence Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Done. Spin it anyway you want, it is still backpedalling. Have a nice day. Sorry thats not attacking you, I didnt say I was better or you were bad. What I said was if you need Add-ons then your not as good as you think, Simple as that. Did I say you were bad? No. Did I say I was better then you with or without add-ons? No. Sorry bub but saying you might not be as good as you think is not a attack, its the truth. You saying your better then me and more or less I suck is an attack. P.S. Have a nice day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phadian_gess Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Funny, no one forces you to use macros and addons. Perhaps you should enjoy playing the way you like to play, and have the respect for others to allow them to do the same. Stop worrying about how other people play. well the problem arises when the elitest players begin to spawn and start booting people because they might not have the exact same dps numbers as the other guy or with gearscore they wont let a person join who may have a main that might be equipped to solo almost everything but wont let the guy in because his gearscore isnt high enough. addon's like these bring the elitest group to an mmo and its that group that killed most of WoW's player base and FFXI's player base. both of which were 2 really good MMO's INB4 not good enough &/or carrying you through excuses Edited January 4, 2012 by Phadian_gess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazorous Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Condition based mods are broken by game companies on purpose when they pop up. People like to forget that when a mod does come out that allows one button player, the game companies go out of their way to break the code that allowed that mod to function. Remember when Blizzard broke Decursive, and one button tanking, and all those other mods that did the same thing? One button "think for you" mods have been dead for half a decade. And mod creators always come up with new ways. Yes it's not "One button" anymore. It's "Two to Three" buttons. Gratz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savagepotato Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Oh, so something is stopping some players from using addons? It is an equal playing field is addons, as anyone can use them. You may choose to handicap yourself, but that's your choice. Prohibition logic doesn't work no matter what angle you try to come at it. Perhaps the Olympics should allow the use of performance enhancing drugs. Then the argument could be used, well no one is forcing you to use steroids. But if you want to win you can. No, I agree with the level playing field. Edited January 4, 2012 by savagepotato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lormif Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Sorry thats not attacking you, I didnt say I was better or you were bad. What I said was if you need Add-ons then your not as good as you think, Simple as that. Did I say you were bad? No. Did I say I was better then you with or without add-ons? No. Sorry bub but saying you might not be as good as you think is not a attack, its the truth. You saying your better then me and more or less I suck is an attack. P.S. Have a nice day You said he was not good, if you are not good you are bad. Just because you implying is the same as saying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomag Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Title says it all. I like the game without macro's and add-on's that allow you to spam one button for everything. I currently play a level 40 combat medic and enjoy the thought process that goes through when playing. Please don't cave in to the lazy. You do realise lots of people have G15 keyboards and simple programs that they use to make external macros and make 1 button activate multiple abilities... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightblaster Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Perhaps the Olympics should allow the use of performance enhancing drugs. Then the argument could be used, well no one is forcing you to use steroids. But if you want to win you can. No, I agree with the level playing field. Exactly -- precisely why this "reasoning" is spurious. Add-ons create an unlevel playing field, period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Perhaps the Olympics should allow the use of performance enhancing drugs. Then the argument could be used, well no one is forcing you to use steroids. But if you want to win you can. No, I agree with the level playing field. If all competitors in the Olympics were allowed to use performance enhancing drugs, then yes, it would be a level playing field. Some athletes may choose to handicap themselves, but if they were legal, then it's part of the sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lormif Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Exactly -- precisely why this "reasoning" is spurious. Add-ons create an unlevel playing field, period. Actually add-ons create just a level a playing field as the game itself does. Your argument is flawed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kantoro Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Sorry thats not attacking you, I didnt say I was better or you were bad. What I said was if you need Add-ons then your not as good as you think, Simple as that. Did I say you were bad? No. Did I say I was better then you with or without add-ons? No. Sorry bub but saying you might not be as good as you think is not a attack, its the truth. You saying your better then me and more or less I suck is an attack. P.S. Have a nice day Feel free to quote where I said you suck. And I can DIRECTLY quote where you said I was not that good. In fact, I have. Not that good is synonymous with saying I am bad. And me saying I am better than you is not an attack, it is just stating the obvious, I choose to play efficiently, you do not. You really need to brush up on how to use forums. When you say something, you can't just say "I didn't say that" and hope people can't scroll up. Would you like to me quote you again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lormif Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 If all competitors in the Olympics were allowed to use performance enhancing drugs, then yes, it would be a level playing field. Some athletes may choose to handicap themselves, but if they were legal, then it's part of the sport. Agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savagepotato Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) If all competitors in the Olympics were allowed to use performance enhancing drugs, then yes, it would be a level playing field. Some athletes may choose to handicap themselves, but if they were legal, then it's part of the sport. And that's why it isn't, because that is rather stupid. Sort of like the argument for mods. Edited January 4, 2012 by savagepotato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahlin Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 By the logic that anyone can use them, Bioware could implement a $100 one-shot skill. Anyone *can* buy it, so the playing ground remains equal! Unless, of course, you remember that not everyone has $100, just like how many people lack the know-how to implement macros. Maybe most healers are too slow or stupid to select their twenty-odd skills with at least one second in between each skill. I've never found it that difficult, especially while playing a class which use a lot of inductions. I think a customizable UI would be more than enough. DPS and heal meters appeal to a very small, very vocal demographic and nobody else. Mods which highlight healers and other classes present a VERY unfair advantage. What I hear being argued is the hope that Bioware allows players to automate as many skills and talents as possible, making the game easy mode for those players who wish to install mods and twice as hard for those who don't (at least in pvp). If addons and macros cost money to the player this might be a good analogy. But they do not so it's not. Most healers don't select heals. I know I don't. My heals are bound to GTF+any extra needed keys in every single MMO I've played since I was able to bind keys. I dont' make a conscious choice when I heal someone. I see how much health they're missing and my reflexes automatically remember which key heals that much missing health. Hell, for all of WOTLK I played with my hotkey bars hidden (besides long cooldowns) so I could see more of the screen. DPS and heal meters certainly do not appeal to a 'very small, very vocal demographic and nobody else' Did nobody actually play WoW? People love DPS meters and heal meters. I certainly did not know a single person in the game that didn't. I like to see if I'm performing at the level that I think I should be. DPS meters help confirm that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 And that's why it isn't, because that is rather stupid. Sort of like the argument for mods. No, it's not allowed because performance enhancing drugs are generally dangerous to the athlete and the rule is in place to ensure the safety of the athlete. There are all kinds of drugs and supplements that athletes take all the time because they're legal and safe. A body builder gets to use creatine and other protein supplements to increase his mass over what regular food could do and because all members of the sport may do this, it's level. If everyone is on steroids, it's just as level as if everyone isn't on steroids. That's not an opinion, it's a statement of logical fact. If everyone is allowed to use mods, the playing field remains level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightblaster Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Actually add-ons create just a level a playing field as the game itself does. Your argument is flawed. No -- what it does is make optional player-created add-ons mandatory in order to maintain a level playing field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lormif Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 And that's why it isn't, because that is rather stupid. Sort of like the argument for mods. Having a job is unfair to those that dont, therefore no one should be allowed to have jobs.. That is the same argument you are making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidence Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Exactly -- precisely why this "reasoning" is spurious. Add-ons create an unlevel playing field, period. Don't tell them that, If you disagree with add-ons your a bad. Then again I know people who will say if you want add-ons then you must be elite. And neither are true. However what is true(And we have proof look at WoW)if add-ons come into the game and make things easier(which they will)then the developers have to make the fights harder, which in turns means everyone has to have them to do the content. Thats taking a choice away from those of us who don't want add-ons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomag Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Someone is using macros to enhance their play. This makes me soooooo mad!!!!!!!!!!! I'm so mad right now, brother!!!! Edited January 4, 2012 by Chomag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazorous Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) **Dbl Post Edited January 4, 2012 by Lazorous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicain Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Funny, no one forces you to use macros and addons. Perhaps you should enjoy playing the way you like to play, and have the respect for others to allow them to do the same. Stop worrying about how other people play. Sometimes when you add certain features, other players then have to adopt those features in order to maintain par. Especially on PVP servers, so yeah keep the game add on and macro free. I don't mind pressing buttons and it's not overly complex I need macro's. Sorry if some people resist making the game easier than it already is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotgunmaniac Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 The truth is far simpler than most "no addons no macros or else" arguments boil down to. You go into your first MMO a keyboard turner, addons/macros can teach you how horribly inefficient it is faster than any in-depth article, and you learn that sweet, sweet, golden mouse turn. It's up to you whether or not you come out from it still using macros, addons, keyboard turning, or any combination of the three. Any decisive advantage you get from there on out is a combination of your skill, your enemy's skill, the developers' skill, and luck. If you fail, learn to macro/use addons, blame the enemy's use of them, blame the developers, blame lady luck, whine. If your enemy fails, praise the sun, become indifferent to addons/macros, praise the developers, thank lady luck, /dance. If the developers fail, suggest a change to addons/macros, argue with your enemy, threaten to quit the game, blame someone else's luck for screwing everybody over, sell off all your ingame assets if next patch is unsatisfactory. If you're unlucky, do all three failure procedures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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