Ethern Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Or the other option: keep the game in production until it's finished.This but apparently EA and shareholders disagreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brokentelevision Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 yeah....this game is gonna go F2P in about 6 months. There is no end game here, and it won't get changed ever. If they didn't fix it from beta till now, they'll never fix it. They don't care about fixing issues with PvP. Bioware doesn't understand MMO's at all. Like period. They don't know the first things about MMO design. Hell, this game is screwed up even for a single player game. Oh well. Waiting on first real patch to see what they change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Don't worry so much about the general population. Bioware themselves say the majority of people are in their late 20's early 30's and will never see many of these bugs you mention. Honestly, a couple un-named mobs and bosses that spawn in the wrong place is pretty damn good for polish on an end game 11 days after release. Our expectations might be a little high, especially those of us that rushed to 50. Of much larger concern is the state of the interface. This impacts players from the very beginning, is universally panned for being terrible, and has much more influence on a persons general game impression than some trash they forgot to name and a boss that likes to spawn where a raid enters a room to a dungeon many of the players wont see for at least another month or two. These players are are already at end game stage, or even the hardcores, they just don't understand that the vast majority of MMO players are not end gamers, but are casual players that enjoy playing multiple characters. That these casual players really don't get to play as much as these people already 50 or the hardcores, so it will take them a long time to reach end game. I have been playnig the game since dec 15th, only playing one character and I just hit level 22 a few days ago, with 1 day 15 hours of game time into it so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YooYooMa Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 This game has great end-game. 10/10 LOVE THIS GAME BIOWARE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 These problems trickle down because it gives the game terrible word of mouth. That is what I'm saying. Please read at least the TL;DR part of my post. Also, the endgame mobs are not the entire problem. They are only the tip of the iceberg. They represent the lack of serious testing endgame got. The majority of the player base don't even know who these premier end game guilds are. I even question the importance of end game to the majority of the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrelosDarksky Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 ROFLMAO The game is a couple of weeks old and he is already talking about ENDGAME? Just quit now please. Come back when you've designed your game that STARTS with endgame content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 WoW had server crashes for the first 9 months and it wasn't uncommon for Blizz to credit free days because of it. Because some of these crashes were for the entire day. So far I have had not one crash, Only seen one bug where my daily didn't update when I did the heroic. My experience so far has been great. Other than it feeling more like a coop rpg than a MMORPG, but thats for another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bollah Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 A little reality check for MMO players. MMOs will never be 100% polished and bug free there will always be bugs. Recently, in WoW the biggest guilds were banned for exploiting which was missed by Blizzard after several months of testing. There are many times where the BG queues don't work and you are stuck in queue forever. These things happen all the time. Why did I bring up WoW? because it is the other big MMO and a good comparison. There will be bugs and we should expect it. But just like the OP we should demand they fix these bugs which i think BioWare is actively doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkZenith Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 ROFLMAO The game is a couple of weeks old and he is already talking about ENDGAME? Just quit now please. Come back when you've designed your game that STARTS with endgame content. This. End-game two weeks after release? Seriously? Get a life please, and a job, then maybe stop playing 15 hours a day, every day, and you will not have to worry about running out of things to do! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 A little reality check for MMO players. MMOs will never be 100% polished and bug free there will always be bugs. Recently, in WoW the biggest guilds were banned for exploiting which was missed by Blizzard after several months of testing. There are many times where the BG queues don't work and you are stuck in queue forever. These things happen all the time. Why did I bring up WoW? because it is the other big MMO and a good comparison. There will be bugs and we should expect it. But just like the OP we should demand they fix these bugs which i think BioWare is actively doing. Please name these 'biggest guilds' that were 'banned'? There were some issues in LK but no major guild was banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bollah Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a Wow expansions usually launch with two battle grounds about half dozen end game five persons, a 10 person, and a raid. And they're all pretty much polished? Does a single wow expansion have more end game then this game? This whole "WoW didn't launch with it, it will get better soon." thing is going to kill this game. WoW didn't have to compete with WoW when it launched, and what recent history has show is if your competing in the WoW space you need to have a balanced and finished end game or you will quickly disappear.. What are you talking about? What do players do in WoW when they kill Deathwing, which all players have in LFR? Where is the endgame content then? What do WoW players do for the next 8-12 months? WoW's "content" is overblown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bollah Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Please name these 'biggest guilds' that were 'banned'? There were some issues in LK but no major guild was banned. Where have you been? Many players in top guilds banned, including Paragon, Method, Envy and Ensidia a couple of weeks ago. http://manaflask.com/en/article/1415/bans-for-many-players-in-top-guilds-for-lfr-exploit For the Horde in fact left WoW for SWTOR after the ban. Edited January 2, 2012 by Bollah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swifta Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I don't think Bioware really expected people to be doing Hard Mode Ops already. TBH if you're already 50 it's likely that you space bar'd through every cut scene which is the real selling point of this game. I agree that there are bugs and glitches galore that are very frustrating but I'd also say that's the case for almost every new MMO (WOW for example) until the first major patch. Maybe if players had actually enjoyed the best part of this game (the story and VO) they would have a better perspective on things. If the VO is the best part of the game the buh bye and I'm not looking back. I'm sorry, I came here for an MMO not to sit through 200 hours (or whatever they're claiming) of VOs. At first yes, I too was WoW'd with the voice over work. But Now in my lvl 30s I simply am skipping every VO except the story ones because they're all the same go kill x @ y but bundled in to OMG SPACESHIP CRASHED GO KILL X OVER ON THAT HILL... Plus there are prbly only a few different responces ur character can say... u start to notice these things as you progress higher and higher and it becomes more and more unbearable. Every planet you go to it's the same 10 or so voices giving you more quests.... This is the highlight of this game??? This is what you guys are all excited about? Count me out. As much as the whole VO work was touted I really came looking for an MMO experience, didn't get it, don't get it and therefore will unsub till many of these things are fixed. Don't get me wrong, I love the universe of star wars and like the classes but it does just feel like a free to play MMO atm with a crap load of useless VO. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeppelin Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 There was that one door in Naxx that had the same name, "do-hicky door 1" for like years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rumpleseq Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 The OP makes me Laugh! Its Launch! GET OVER IT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finaly Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I used to "hardcore" raid on and off in EQ1. I did my early game 48h raids in PoF with short breaks for bathroom and food, back when i was in my early 20s. i remember that good old times.... plane of fear and plane of hate... nowadays you would not be able to coordinate 35+ people to do something like that - gamers got lazy and want everything without effort.... - but the immersion was great and the lore too.... just waiting for EQ Next... if SoE can be trusted it will be very close to vanilla EQ1 without that portal everywhere thingy...(hated PoP expansion) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farabee Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Some of the apologists in this thread make me vomit. None of the endgame problems in this game are defensible. Least of all is the complete lack of communication from the devs acknowledging these issues. There's an endboss in a HM flashpoint right now who hits you with an ability for 70k, without enrage up. How does this stuff get past beta? The point is, we realize very little of endgame was tested. We know. We'd be willing to forgive if one of the devs actually bothered to come on forums and say something about these bugs and that they KNOW they exist and are being fixed. Instead, we get silence and patch notes announcing things like slicing nerfs and emotes on speeders. The way I see it, the devs have a month to get this stuff fixed before the majority of the player base hits 50. Then the poop will hit the fan and people WILL start going back to WoW or whatever if endgame continues to be the bug-ridden mess it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
va_wanderer Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 TL;DR: I'm here for the long haul, Bioware, but at this rate I can't guarantee even my guilds or friends will be. If these bugs in every aspect of endgame aren't fixed before the end of the month I don't see the top guilds renewing, and that bad publicty can trickle down to the masses. And amusing enough to me is that people didn't realize that SWTOR wasn't released with enough time to polish everything. Not even close. People who looked at KOTOR 2 and went "Hey, this feels rushed"? This game ate up even more dev time and effort, but going into an even larger-scale game. Early stuff is going to be decently polished. Midgame stuff will have visible rough spots. Endgame stuff is going to be REALLY rough...because the only true way to get things fixed is to toss tons of players into the game and see what they smash into, break open, and leave smoking junk for the coders to pick through. And we're talking about "endgame"...oh, what. Less than a month into actual release? ROFL! No MMO manages a polished product in a month of full-on server load. "Beta" was the alpha, this is the real beta, a truly polished end result will only come from plentiful sweat from the devs and we players rubbing against all the rough spots, so our cries of pain will (hopefully) guide them to where things needs smoothing most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stelakh Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Or the other option: keep the game in production until it's finished. THAT is the correct answer to the $64,000.00 question. Don't pretend the game is Ready-to-Market (RTM) when it's not. Polish it, finish it, make it glow, then send it to the stores. Otherwise you wind up with games like... Well, like "Star Trek Online" and "Star Wars The Old Republic." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
va_wanderer Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 .. with "h" ... you mean hours?? YOU DID A 48 HOUR RAID!!?? *faint* If you never did oldschool EQ (or possibly FFXI) you will never know the true meaning of "endurance run". That such things were literally harmful to their players is why we'll never see the like again, but until all of us PoH vets are gone, nothing will seem all that stressful by comparison... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
va_wanderer Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 THAT is the correct answer to the $64,000.00 question. Don't pretend the game is Ready-to-Market (RTM) when it's not. Polish it, finish it, make it glow, then send it to the stores. Otherwise you wind up with games like... Well, like "Star Trek Online" and "Star Wars The Old Republic." Actually, this was the $300 million question- and BioWare should already know the answer. The more money that goes into the dev cycle, the greater the pressure to produce when the marketing people want it out, vs. when the game is actually as ready as the dev team wants. Thus the Christmas release and this entire topic. Anyone who whines about the results hasn't played enough MMO's to begin with and didn't see this coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeLopez Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 The OP makes me Laugh! Its Launch! GET OVER IT! I am over it. I don't think most top players will be though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharagonIGN Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) There's really no place for top notch players in this game. The design just isn't there. Until they tighten up mechanics (GCD delay) and provide a basic toolset (combat log, mods) this isn't going to have a serious endgame. Right now it's just KOTOR with other people running around. Which is fine for now, but one can only make so many alts. Edited January 2, 2012 by CharagonIGN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeLopez Posted January 3, 2012 Author Share Posted January 3, 2012 The PVP is actually really well balanced and polished. I'm not very worried about the PVP. It only has slight bugs that are usually quality-of-life issues. The only major oversight is that Ilum is essentially worthless. Engame PVE needs some serious love though. I suspect it will be getting some love now that Bioware employees are coming back from holiday break, but I figured it's good to give some feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeLopez Posted January 3, 2012 Author Share Posted January 3, 2012 I forgot to add that this week normal Eternity Vault didn't even reset for my guild. We were stuck with bosses cleared and missed loot. Pretty horrific bug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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